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How concerned are you with Gallo's recurrent back issue?


Author Poll
orangeblobman
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Nauru
Are you very concerned, not at all? Did you expect this all along?

I kind of wanted to keep mum and wish it away, and the start to the season was strong. But some of us noticed unnatural motion control on his part when picking up loose balls. This was exasperated against the Pacers where several forum members noticed unusual behavior and lethargy on the part of Gallo. I understand that the AI news is pretty big right now, but we're not signing him; this is our future. And it seems grave to me.

as a reference: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/gallinari_back_starts_to_act_up_5Igg8xRCCXc1biraQlmDuM

Very, this is unexpected
Somewhat, let's see how it plays out
Not at all, the young buck will recover fully
Very, but I expected it all along
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Author Thread
orangeblobman
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Nauru
11/20/2009  11:13 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/21/2009  10:47 AM
it's telling that no one voted for 'full recovery'. we're cooked. kemp was good but he got fat.

edit: whoever voted for 'full recovery' after reading this post, you're a spiteful person.

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
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Cosmic
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11/21/2009  2:19 PM
Marv Albert and Mike Fratello discussed Gallo early in the game (I'm watching the NETS broadcast just for a change of pace).

They said he is suffering from continuing back spasms.

Sad...that as a fan I have to get the update on Gallo's problems from the Nets announcers because our own franchise is trying to hide Gallo's situation (for whatever silly reason) from us.

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orangeblobman
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11/21/2009  2:20 PM
Cosmic wrote:Marv Albert and Mike Fratello discussed Gallo early in the game (I'm watching the NETS broadcast just for a change of pace).

They said he is suffering from continuing back spasms.

Sad...that as a fan I have to get the update on Gallo's problems from the Nets announcers because our own franchise is trying to hide Gallo's situation (for whatever silly reason) from us.

while i see why they're hiding it, i don't think it's silly reasons.

this is a disaster. imagine if they came out and admitted they messed up?

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
Paladin55
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11/22/2009  2:46 AM
...But some of us noticed unnatural motion control on his part when picking up loose balls. This was exasperated against the Pacers where several forum members noticed unusual behavior and lethargy on the part of Gallo....this is our future. And it seems grave to me.

Where do you come up with these lines, my friend. I marvel at your sometimes tortured use of the English language.

Did you notice any "unnatural motion control, or unusual behavior and lethargy" against the Nets, by the way?

... and did you start another thread using your most recent observations of his play?

Just wondering.

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orangeblobman
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11/22/2009  7:13 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/22/2009  11:52 AM
Paladin55 wrote:
...But some of us noticed unnatural motion control on his part when picking up loose balls. This was exasperated against the Pacers where several forum members noticed unusual behavior and lethargy on the part of Gallo....this is our future. And it seems grave to me.

Where do you come up with these lines, my friend. I marvel at your sometimes tortured use of the English language.

Did you notice any "unnatural motion control, or unusual behavior and lethargy" against the Nets, by the way?

... and did you start another thread using your most recent observations of his play?

Just wondering.

english is my second language and i drink a lot. (how many languages can you read and write in?)

but, yea, i did. and unnatural motion control is when a guy consciously restrains himself when going for loose balls or tying his shoes.

the lethargy creeps in later in the game when his back tightens up and he can't do anything.

i pray for the kid, but i have to pray a lot.

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
Cosmic
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11/22/2009  8:43 AM
Paladin55 wrote:
...But some of us noticed unnatural motion control on his part when picking up loose balls. This was exasperated against the Pacers where several forum members noticed unusual behavior and lethargy on the part of Gallo....this is our future. And it seems grave to me.

Where do you come up with these lines, my friend. I marvel at your sometimes tortured use of the English language.

Did you notice any "unnatural motion control, or unusual behavior and lethargy" against the Nets, by the way?

... and did you start another thread using your most recent observations of his play?

Just wondering.

I did. His legs weren't under him later in the game. He threw up an airball and a bad brick. This goes to the stiff lower back muscles.

In the Indy game there was a loose ball in front of him and he couldn't speed up nor reach down to get to the ball. Again, this goes to stiff lower back muscles.

When he runs he takes a moment to get going. When he walks he walks very upright and stiff from the mid back to his upper thighs.

He's constantly on the sideline tending to the problem.

These are all indications of stiff lower back muscles and spasms. The reactions are involuntary. When your lower back tightens up you have little to no strength and little to no movement - especially when dealing with reaction time - your reaction time is slowed because you try to move, your back tightens up like a charley horse, and it takes a moment for that initial tightness to subside, so you can do what you want to do.

And, finally, we know the problem, thanks to Marv Albert and Mike Fratello: He is suffering from back spasms. Q, Duhon, TMac....suffer the same problems and it limits them. Pippen had the problems later in his career and it slowed him down a lot.

Look, we all want Gallo to be healthy and excel as a player but purposely pretending there's nothing wrong with him doesn't help a thing.

It is very obvious, especially to those who suffer from back problems (like myself for example) that he is suffering out there. It shows frequently in his game and his movements or lack there of at times. No one is making this up. No one is hating on Gallo. No one is trolling out of boredom.

Bottom line is that Gallo has back problems and they are inhibiting his play.

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nixluva
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11/22/2009  9:39 AM
What's inhibiting his play the most is his stupid teammates!!! I hate how they don't look to get him ore touches. Duhon especially, but they all refuse to swing the ball back to him. Many have suggested he be more selfish which is true but he's doing the right thing when he keeps the ball moving. The problem is the ball sticks in everyone elses hands too long and they force shots. Al is the #1 culprit.

When this offense is played right you end up with easy shots. Gallo spends so much time open but not getting the ball until someone gets stuck or just happens to notice him. There's no determine effort to look their best shooter. His back looked fine yesterday. He shouldve had over 20 pts easy. We'll see how his back holds up today. This will be a good test for him.

newyorknewyork
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11/22/2009  9:51 AM
Gallo's reaction time does seem real slow. Even if he is in front of the guy, if the guy pulls up for a jump shot Gallo seemed late to put his hand up and challenge the shot. His guys missed more times then made them when he was on them, but he did seem slow to react. So did every player on the Knicks though. There were many loose balls that the Knicks as a whole just seemed slow to react to.

I guess that's why Walsh called them Zombies.

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newyorknewyork
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11/22/2009  9:56 AM
nixluva wrote:What's inhibiting his play the most is his stupid teammates!!! I hate how they don't look to get him ore touches. Duhon especially, but they all refuse to swing the ball back to him. Many have suggested he be more selfish which is true but he's doing the right thing when he keeps the ball moving. The problem is the ball sticks in everyone elses hands too long and they force shots. Al is the #1 culprit.

When this offense is played right you end up with easy shots. Gallo spends so much time open but not getting the ball until someone gets stuck or just happens to notice him. There's no determine effort to look their best shooter. His back looked fine yesterday. He shouldve had over 20 pts easy. We'll see how his back holds up today. This will be a good test for him.

Once Harrington is in the game expect Gallo's touches to completely diminish. In the first quarter he was doing a lot of good thing like floating around the paint area, his teammates found him for 2 make able shots though he missed one. He needs to continue to do those type of things. I don't know if that was MDA or Gallo though.

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nixluva
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11/22/2009  10:16 AM
The thing is I saw Gallo put on a burst of speed getting out on the break later in the game and it was the hardest I've seen him run, so I have to believe he was feeling ok. Jumping to block shots which I saw also doing quite a bit would seem to also suggest that he was feeling pretty good. We have to remember that he's nearly 7ft. He hasn't even filled out yet so he's gonna look a bit funny moving at times.
Paladin55
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11/22/2009  10:18 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/22/2009  11:47 AM
Cosmic wrote:
Paladin55 wrote:
...But some of us noticed unnatural motion control on his part when picking up loose balls. This was exasperated against the Pacers where several forum members noticed unusual behavior and lethargy on the part of Gallo....this is our future. And it seems grave to me.

Where do you come up with these lines, my friend. I marvel at your sometimes tortured use of the English language.

Did you notice any "unnatural motion control, or unusual behavior and lethargy" against the Nets, by the way?

... and did you start another thread using your most recent observations of his play?

Just wondering.

I did. His legs weren't under him later in the game. He threw up an airball and a bad brick. This goes to the stiff lower back muscles.

In the Indy game there was a loose ball in front of him and he couldn't speed up nor reach down to get to the ball. Again, this goes to stiff lower back muscles.

When he runs he takes a moment to get going. When he walks he walks very upright and stiff from the mid back to his upper thighs.

He's constantly on the sideline tending to the problem.

These are all indications of stiff lower back muscles and spasms. The reactions are involuntary. When your lower back tightens up you have little to no strength and little to no movement - especially when dealing with reaction time - your reaction time is slowed because you try to move, your back tightens up like a charley horse, and it takes a moment for that initial tightness to subside, so you can do what you want to do.

And, finally, we know the problem, thanks to Marv Albert and Mike Fratello: He is suffering from back spasms. Q, Duhon, TMac....suffer the same problems and it limits them. Pippen had the problems later in his career and it slowed him down a lot.

Look, we all want Gallo to be healthy and excel as a player but purposely pretending there's nothing wrong with him doesn't help a thing.

It is very obvious, especially to those who suffer from back problems (like myself for example) that he is suffering out there. It shows frequently in his game and his movements or lack there of at times. No one is making this up. No one is hating on Gallo. No one is trolling out of boredom.

Bottom line is that Gallo has back problems and they are inhibiting his play.

Against the Nets, he would have stayed in at the end if he had not been paying too much concern to guarding the middle and not getting back to his man on the wing in time. Do you think that he would have gone to the basket and tried to jam over Lopez if he had concerns about his back?

His issue was never back spasms, though, as far as I know- his pain and discomfort was from something more internal.

I actually have some concern about his back- how can you not be concerned after back surgery, but I am not going to look at every single game he plays and micro-analyze. (If you want to micro-analyze his season, by the way, the good moments outweigh the bad by a wide margin.) The guy is recovering from back surgery, and physically he is not yet 100%. Accept it and look at his progress over the entire season, not just one game after an extended period of "rest."

And lets be honest, his back is not paying attention to what any of us are saying or thinking, and nothing said here has any affect on his recovery progress. It will progress or deteriorate regardless of what we believe or post.

What I have trouble with is people who look at one game and generalize without considering everything that has happened over the beginning of this season. Why aren't people commenting on the totality of his season and how he has fared as a player during stretches where the Knicks have played multiple games in short periods of time- exactly the kind of stretches in the season you would think he might rekindle a back injury. People might be surprised if they actually took the time to do so.

And why don't people actually speculate about or consider the process or "mechanism" which might have led to the "stiffness" or spasms he experienced the game after the break. What parts of the body actually experience spasms (This is a rhetorical question, by the way-you answer it in your response.), and what can cause them? I sometimes have had them from my sport, wrestling, and for me it has always come from some form of over-exertion/lifting. I would hypothesize that he was doing some rather significant rehabbing at the Knicks' facility, and had overworked the muscles around his back. I could be wrong, but I am trying to account for the fact that his stiffness occurred AFTER an extended break, not after a 4 game in 5 day stretch.

None of this takes away from the fact that we that should be concerned about his future, but this concern does not mean I am going to be looking at every little play and analyzing his body responses. (So he reacts poorly to a loose ball and that is indicative of a back issue?? If that is true the entire Knicks team has back issues.)

The guy needs an off-season of supervised strength exercises, hopefully with someone not associated with the Knicks, and he could have used another month or two of effective back rehab to strengthen his lower back muscles and legs, just as Wilson could have used another month or two to fully recover from his injury, and Nate could have used some more time to rehab his injury. Unfortunately, though, the season is on, and they don't have the time to rehab as efficiently as they can in the off-season.

We need a permanent "Chicken Little- The Sky is Falling!" thread where we can consolidate all threads relating to Gallinari's back, Hill being a bust, "we should have gotten this or that player-look at what they did in this or that game!" and any knee jerk response threads where people feel the need to make generalizations based on a paucity of evidence.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
orangeblobman
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11/22/2009  10:43 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/22/2009  10:50 AM
some things seem certain here:
1. his back will be an issue for the rest of his career
2. he will have to adjust his game to his injury

how much of an issue? we can't know. maybe it only hampers him a little. but it WILL be there.

also, i understand that torso strengthening exercises for back pain are a myth. well, just one article i read said that. still, the thing about back injuries is that they seem to be something like a medical mystery, you just don't know what's going on. and that's it, no?

you can look at his age and say, 'well he's young, this will fix', or you can look at it and say 'well, he's too young to be having this issue'. how many other players drafted in either 08 or 09 have back problems?

let's see today, let's see how he plays in the second game of a back-to-back.

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
Cosmic
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11/22/2009  1:45 PM
Paladin, do you suffer from lower back problems? Spasms? Slipped disc? Etc? Because I do and I just know the body language. I know how it is to be able to do some things and then unable to do others. I know what he is going through. It's also fact that he is suffering from back spasms.

Let me post something we just saw from today's 1st quarter versus Boston.

He starts slow, bumps into a player, reacts slow (that's lower back spasms, weakness) then he gets going and throws down a monster jam.
Second play: He bobbles the ball and then is just incapable of reaching for it. Incapable of reacting quickly to start moving to chase the ball. He just couldn't do it. This wasn't a mistake play on his part this is his back tightening up - and believe me it's momentarily incapacitating - and being unable to react how he wants to. Watch it several times. I know that feeling and I know that body language.

This really isn't something to debate we know he's having trouble. For those that can't read or understand the body language he is displaying approach it this way: He is far too talented to do such stupid things is he not? Airballs after swishing threes. Unable to pursue a loose ball on multiple occasions. These aren't mistakes or rookie mistakes. He's not stupid. These are a result of his lower back tightening up on him. I call them tweaks.

I can pick up and throw 80lb bags of sacrete from a truck bed to a pile on the ground no problem. I reach down to dust off my boot? MF'ER you don't understand what happens then. Sharp tightening pain in the lower back and I stop dead in my tracks for a moment.

That...is exactly what you are seeing here.

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orangeblobman
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11/22/2009  3:04 PM
^wow. watching that clip, @00:18 or 00:19, that was PAINFUL to even watch, much less experience. i pray for the kid. but it's undeniable.
WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
How concerned are you with Gallo's recurrent back issue?

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