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What can we learn from Toney Douglas’ game the other night?
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Ira
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10/25/2009  1:47 PM
Hill will take time. Douglas will have the better rookie season. He picks things up quickly and plays with a lot of intensity. But he needs to be able to make his shot at this level and he needs to improve as a finisher.
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arkrud
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10/25/2009  9:44 PM
True
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
orangeblobman
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Nauru
10/25/2009  9:51 PM
douglas will be in the rotation at the start of the season and grow into a bigger role as the season progresses.
WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
BasketballJones
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10/25/2009  10:20 PM
orangeblobman wrote:douglas will be in the rotation at the start of the season and grow into a bigger role as the season progresses.

It wouldn't be the first time that happened. Gaining weight has been a problem with many Knick players over the years.

https:// It's not so hard.
franco12
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10/26/2009  8:46 AM
Frank Williams anyone?
TheGame
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10/26/2009  11:17 AM
franco12 wrote:Frank Williams anyone?

Frank Williams last year at Illinois, 16.2 pts, 4.4 apg, 4.7 rpg on 39.3% FG

Toney Douglas last year at FSU, 21.5 pts, 2.9 apg, 3.9 rpg on 44.6% FG (with 1.8 spg).

Toney Douglas had a far more successful college career in terms of individual stats than Williams. While that does not mean he will have NBA success, Douglas is a guy that is a proven prime-time player, which he showed in the last preseason game.

Trust the Process
Bippity10
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10/26/2009  3:23 PM
There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD. Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.

I just hope that people will like me
coolbeans
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10/26/2009  3:26 PM
@bip if (if) the rigged refs let douglas get away with his hustle defense then douglas will be the knicks bruce bowen without the karate.

coolbeans@in.com
Bippity10
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10/26/2009  3:32 PM
coolbeans wrote:@bip if (if) the rigged refs let douglas get away with his hustle defense then douglas will be the knicks bruce bowen without the karate.

Good call. I think rookie year he will struggle with it. As he gains a reputation as a defender he will be allowed to get away with a lot more

I just hope that people will like me
fishmike
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10/26/2009  3:32 PM
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD.Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.


right out of the fishmike school of spelling. Good points though... retard
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bippity10
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10/26/2009  3:34 PM
fishmike wrote:
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD.Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.


right out of the fishmike school of spelling. Good points though... retard

Thanks!!!!....I think

I just hope that people will like me
JohnWallace44
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10/26/2009  4:57 PM
I think TD will be a decent 10-15 minute player off the bench. Maybe he'll be a disruptive type with his defense.

Don't judge me if I hold off on buying any hype that goes above "rotation player" for the moment.

Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
earthmansurfer
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10/26/2009  5:49 PM
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD. Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.

Great points. Frank Williams was a talent. Boy, it goes to show you how laziness will destroy even the best among us. Remember that stretch when he was tearing it up and we were winning? Think he got hurt or traded, forget, but what could have been...

Douglas has desire and heart and talent. He doesn't the talent of a Derrick Rose, but he has all the other intangibles and is incredibly fast. Speaking of which:

How fast is Douglas compared to the other fast guards in the league, both from watching his play and his combine numbers (he led in a few areas)?

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
orangeblobman
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Nauru
10/26/2009  6:04 PM
ems, i think t. douglas is as fast as the fastest almost. he looks plenty fast when you watch him, if you're good at eyeballing it. he's all over the place.
WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
Bippity10
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10/26/2009  8:20 PM
JohnWallace44 wrote:I think TD will be a decent 10-15 minute player off the bench. Maybe he'll be a disruptive type with his defense.

Don't judge me if I hold off on buying any hype that goes above "rotation player" for the moment.

Who's hyping Douglas??? I think everyone has accepted he's going to be a role player off the bench. Is it that people are saying nice things about him?

I just hope that people will like me
franco12
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10/26/2009  11:11 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD. Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.

Great points. Frank Williams was a talent. Boy, it goes to show you how laziness will destroy even the best among us. Remember that stretch when he was tearing it up and we were winning? Think he got hurt or traded, forget, but what could have been...

Douglas has desire and heart and talent. He doesn't the talent of a Derrick Rose, but he has all the other intangibles and is incredibly fast. Speaking of which:

How fast is Douglas compared to the other fast guards in the league, both from watching his play and his combine numbers (he led in a few areas)?

Just to play on this further - I seem to recall, and I was one, many here were thinking Frank Williams was the answer and needed more playing time. He didn't fall out of the league until he left us. He was the one player who stood up to Kidd.

Then puff, out of the league. Mike Sweetney disease

I'm not saying TD won't make it, just that we have seen a small body of work, and we've seen other guys we though would make it who didn't.
knicks1248
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10/27/2009  12:21 AM
JohnWallace44 wrote:I think TD will be a decent 10-15 minute player off the bench. Maybe he'll be a disruptive type with his defense.

Don't judge me if I hold off on buying any hype that goes above "rotation player" for the moment.


If he can defend and shoot the 3 ball i see no reason why he can't get 20 mins a night. Hughs is out of the rotation( think chicago bulls) for now and i like a unit of..

TD
Chandler
DG
AL
Darko

Thats about the best defensive line up we have.

ES
earthmansurfer
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10/27/2009  2:40 AM
Looks like Toney Douglas has one of the fastest 3/4 sprint times recently.

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=All&sort2=ASC&draft=0&pos=&sort=14

Quicker than Derick Rose's but not our own Nate's. Agility was just very good but not on par with his 3/4. Not a great high jumper which is one of the better measurements of a persons athleticism.

Any of you out there with a good memory regarding the combine care to add here?

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
Bippity10
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10/27/2009  6:43 AM
franco12 wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD. Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.

Great points. Frank Williams was a talent. Boy, it goes to show you how laziness will destroy even the best among us. Remember that stretch when he was tearing it up and we were winning? Think he got hurt or traded, forget, but what could have been...

Douglas has desire and heart and talent. He doesn't the talent of a Derrick Rose, but he has all the other intangibles and is incredibly fast. Speaking of which:

How fast is Douglas compared to the other fast guards in the league, both from watching his play and his combine numbers (he led in a few areas)?

Just to play on this further - I seem to recall, and I was one, many here were thinking Frank Williams was the answer and needed more playing time. He didn't fall out of the league until he left us. He was the one player who stood up to Kidd.

Then puff, out of the league. Mike Sweetney disease

I'm not saying TD won't make it, just that we have seen a small body of work, and we've seen other guys we though would make it who didn't.

If a guy is mentally weak enough that he doesn't work hard and is out of the league a few short years after he starts, what makes you think that he was going to be a regular contributor for us? Becasue he had 5 good games? Was there actually a skill that Frank Williams possessed that made him an NBA player? He needed to have some intangibles(leadership, defense, overwhelming intensity) to stay in the league. He had no intangibles. Hence he was out of the league.

I just hope that people will like me
franco12
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10/27/2009  8:10 AM
Bippity10 wrote:
franco12 wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:
Bippity10 wrote:There is no comparison between frank Williams and Toney Douglas. Frank Williams was a lazy player that was destined to turn his NBA talent into an NBDL career. He was too close to being on the bubble to not work hard. Douglas is on this bubble as well. The difference between Douglas and the rest of his peers in similar situations is he has an unmatched intensity level. Number 2, Tony Douglas IS ALWAYS AROUND THE BALL. He gets diflections, steals, rebounds, loose balls and will dive on the floor like Charlie Ward. No guarantee of success for TD, but there is no comparison between a ball hawking hustle player and a lazy overweight player such as Frank.

By the way Bip predicted that Frank would be out of the league. I am making no such prediction on TD. Peopel are so jaded nowadays. How do they not like this guy??? He's the hustle player we've been begging for.

Great points. Frank Williams was a talent. Boy, it goes to show you how laziness will destroy even the best among us. Remember that stretch when he was tearing it up and we were winning? Think he got hurt or traded, forget, but what could have been...

Douglas has desire and heart and talent. He doesn't the talent of a Derrick Rose, but he has all the other intangibles and is incredibly fast. Speaking of which:

How fast is Douglas compared to the other fast guards in the league, both from watching his play and his combine numbers (he led in a few areas)?

Just to play on this further - I seem to recall, and I was one, many here were thinking Frank Williams was the answer and needed more playing time. He didn't fall out of the league until he left us. He was the one player who stood up to Kidd.

Then puff, out of the league. Mike Sweetney disease

I'm not saying TD won't make it, just that we have seen a small body of work, and we've seen other guys we though would make it who didn't.

If a guy is mentally weak enough that he doesn't work hard and is out of the league a few short years after he starts, what makes you think that he was going to be a regular contributor for us? Becasue he had 5 good games? Was there actually a skill that Frank Williams possessed that made him an NBA player? He needed to have some intangibles(leadership, defense, overwhelming intensity) to stay in the league. He had no intangibles. Hence he was out of the league.

Please dig up the thread of people saying that Frank Williams was mentally weak. I think this is the first time I am seeing the words 'mentally weak' attached to Frank Williams.

Its very easy to say he is mentally weak now that he is out of the league, but who said it during the 03/04 season?

At the time, I thought Frank potentially had the intangibles to stick - again, he was the only one on our squad that showed any kind of pride - was it during the play offs that Frank squared off with Jason Kidd?

Where is Bip01 when you need some logic?
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