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If Lebron comes to NY he will expose himself as a
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martin
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7/20/2009  3:04 PM
Posted by bitty41:

If NY market is a big enough reason for players to come here why aren't more elite players demanding trades to NY? If market is truly that big of a factor then why haven't the Knicks been able to allure more bigger name players?

the NBA trade world is reality based, right?

I mean, KG just can't say he wants to be in NY and demand that the Wolves trade him for Anderson, Eisley, and Witherspoon, right?

Probably the same reason Walsh is moving the Knicks towards cap flexibility so that they CAN either sign or trade for better players.
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kam77
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7/20/2009  3:18 PM
Posted by bitty41:

If NY market is a big enough reason for players to come here why aren't more elite players demanding trades to NY? If market is truly that big of a factor then why haven't the Knicks been able to allure more bigger name players?

Those other players don't have the marketing footprint of a LeBron James.

If LBJ comes to Madison Ave you're talking match made in heaven.

LBJ wants to be a billionaire. You don't get that operating out of Cleveland.

Why are movie deals made in either LA or NYC? Why are international marketing deals made in NYC and not Cleveland?
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  3:39 PM
Posted by BigC:
Posted by EwingsGlass:

I am with Martin on this. There are too many die hard fans of the NY teams with disposable income to think that there will not be a positive impact on his income through marketing deals, shoe sales, jersey sales and simple publicity. NY is the world capital. You are delusional if you think there is no effect. Is Nate Robinson, a sixth man on the Knicks, the 10th highest selling jersey if he isn't in NY? I don't think it is likely.
Nate winning the slam dunk contest at his height is the reason why his jersey sells. If Nate did not win that slam dunk contest I doubt that he would be number 10 in sales. Nate has personality plus game. Nate also knows how to market himself. If it was just about playing in New York then Charlie Ward jerseys would have been selling through the roof.

I don't agree that winning the dunk contest is the sole reason. There is still a NY element to his sales. Why is David Lee 14th overall then, if not for a single feat? What has he done this year and explain that without resorting to NY market demographics. He is "white" and averages a double-double? Troy Murphy is white and did that too.

http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2009/01/kobe-tops-nba-jersey-sales-again/

Click the link and scroll down... the Knicks as a team overall are 3rd in jersey sales, next to the Lakers and Celtics. The Cleveland Lebrons are 4th. You are telling me that the NY Lebrons don't jump to first?

The Lakers, Celtics and Knicks each have at least two players in the top 15, but every player other than the Knicks players are all-stars. Explain that. In fact every player other than Derrick Rose that is in the top 15 are All-stars-- that is, except for the Knicks' players.

I think you are wrong.

NY has far more purchasing power than Cleveland. It is a fact. Lebron is still the 3rd most bought jersey, but if he were in NY he would sell more jerseys. He would sell more shoes. He would sell more tv ads. Its that simple.
You know I gonna spin wit it
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  3:41 PM
Posted by DrAlphaeus:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by EwingsGlass:

I am with Martin on this. There are too many die hard fans of the NY teams with disposable income to think that there will not be a positive impact on his income through marketing deals, shoe sales, jersey sales and simple publicity. NY is the world capital. You are delusional if you think there is no effect. Is Nate Robinson, a sixth man on the Knicks, the 10th highest selling jersey if he isn't in NY? I don't think it is likely.
Nate winning the slam dunk contest at his height is the reason why his jersey sells. If Nate did not win that slam dunk contest I doubt that he would be number 10 in sales. Nate has personality plus game. Nate also knows how to market himself. If it was just about playing in New York then Charlie Ward jerseys would have been selling through the roof.

New York jersey's are going to be in the top 10 because most folks love the name on the front, not the back. Lee's jersey is also in the top 10 too, and that's because to me he's the easiest to root for these last four years. I'll make an argument that it also helps that the last names "Robinson" and "Lee" rank as some of the most common surnames in the US.

So Lee's jersey is selling in China?
You know I gonna spin wit it
McK1
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7/20/2009  3:45 PM
perhaps Lee's jersey sells because the nba focuses on marketing him. Allstar weekend his rookie and sophomore year...Team USA...The nba overseas program...

and none of these things have anything to do with being a Knick

[Edited by - McK1 on 07-20-2009 3:46 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
subzero0
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7/20/2009  3:58 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:

So basically if we get LeBron we should be mad because he's selfish.

You've missed the point completely. What he is saying is that LeBron would be foolish to come here because if he does everyone will know that he only did it for the attention and the money. If LeBron wants to remain an icon and not look like a sell out he will stick with his city, like Michael Jordan did.
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  4:00 PM
Posted by McK1:

perhaps Lee's jersey sells because the nba focuses on marketing him. Allstar weekend his rookie and sophomore year...Team USA...The nba overseas program...

and none of these things have anything to do with being a Knick

[Edited by - McK1 on 07-20-2009 3:46 PM]

Come on, are you really denying that NY has something to do with it? I bet you can name at least 10 other players without really trying with the same NBA marketing pedigree as Lee (i.e. rookie-sophomore game, team USA alternate, overseas program who don't sell as many jerseys. Where is Paul Millsap? OJ Mayo? David Lee has more marketability than OJ Mayo? Lee and Robinson are the best players on the Knicks, so their jerseys sell better than say Duhon or Chandler. Buy, if Lee and Robinson are gone, you think Knicks fans are going to buy Paul Millsap jerseys? NY has a market that wants to buy jerseys. A superstar can step in and collect that reward solely by playing in NY.
You know I gonna spin wit it
McK1
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7/20/2009  4:15 PM
Posted by EwingsGlass:
Posted by McK1:

perhaps Lee's jersey sells because the nba focuses on marketing him. Allstar weekend his rookie and sophomore year...Team USA...The nba overseas program...

and none of these things have anything to do with being a Knick

[Edited by - McK1 on 07-20-2009 3:46 PM]

Come on, are you really denying that NY has something to do with it? I bet you can name at least 10 other players without really trying with the same NBA marketing pedigree as Lee (i.e. rookie-sophomore game, team USA alternate, overseas program who don't sell as many jerseys. Where is Paul Millsap? OJ Mayo? David Lee has more marketability than OJ Mayo? Lee and Robinson are the best players on the Knicks, so their jerseys sell better than say Duhon or Chandler. Buy, if Lee and Robinson are gone, you think Knicks fans are going to buy Paul Millsap jerseys? NY has a market that wants to buy jerseys. A superstar can step in and collect that reward solely by playing in NY.

are they marketed as much as Lee?

are they a part of the overseas program?

Lee was also on celebrity family fued and celebrity apprentice. the NBA pushes Lee.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  4:27 PM
You think the NBA markets Lee more than, say, Deron Williams? I cannot fathom how you can argue that Lee's top 10 jersey sales are related to him being a practice squad player on Team USA and participating in the overseas program. You don't think it is possible Lee was chosen to be on Family Feud and Celebrity Apprentice because he plays for the Knicks, instead it is some NBA ploy to market David Lee? Would the NBA market David Lee if he weren't a Knick. Why Lee and not Troy Murphy? Be honest with yourself.
You know I gonna spin wit it
McK1
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7/20/2009  4:34 PM
Posted by EwingsGlass:

Why Lee and not Troy Murphy?



the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  4:37 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by EwingsGlass:

Why Lee and not Troy Murphy?




Lol.
You know I gonna spin wit it
kam77
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7/20/2009  4:40 PM
^^ Tony Janiro before and after pics
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
DrAlphaeus
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7/20/2009  4:42 PM
Lee has been arguably the best -- and certainly the most consistent -- player for the New York Knicks the last couple of years. New York obviously gives your pitchman career extra-burn: witness the Starbury line, Harrington's Protege campaign, Lee & Robinson's jersey sales & TV appearances. Both Lee & Nate are likable and good with the media, so they stand out on our squad and get these opportunities they would not have on the Memphis Grizzles.

That said, the topic was regarding an elite player like LeBron. Of course, being in New York would get him more money. But it gets more abstract when on his level. So all I'm saying is he'd be a damned fool if he chose extra millions over rings. Also, let's not forget that LA, Chicago, Boston are pretty big markets too. No one talks about the Nets anymore because they are still mired in the swamp.

I love New York and ain't no other place like it. I just believe New York isn't the only city that can get him where he wants to be, and it's ain't necessarily the most livable city either. And I truly believe that it is at least possible to do what he wants to do from Ohio. And all of this is moot if we don't look like a squad & organization he can win with.
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stanleybostitch
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7/20/2009  4:45 PM
lmao, that was good.
Posted by eViL:
Posted by kam77:

Have you even been to Cleveland?




The new new core: Randle, RJ, IQ. Maybe Mitch. Future pick. Future trade. Future FA.
kam77
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7/20/2009  4:45 PM
Posted by DrAlphaeus:

Lee has been arguably the best -- and certainly the most consistent -- player for the New York Knicks the last couple of years. New York obviously gives your pitchman career extra-burn: witness the Starbury line

And STAR on Stars! The greatest show ever.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
EwingsGlass
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7/20/2009  4:54 PM
Posted by DrAlphaeus:

Lee has been arguably the best -- and certainly the most consistent -- player for the New York Knicks the last couple of years. New York obviously gives your pitchman career extra-burn: witness the Starbury line, Harrington's Protege campaign, Lee & Robinson's jersey sales & TV appearances. Both Lee & Nate are likable and good with the media, so they stand out on our squad and get these opportunities they would not have on the Memphis Grizzles.

That said, the topic was regarding an elite player like LeBron. Of course, being in New York would get him more money. But it gets more abstract when on his level. So all I'm saying is he'd be a damned fool if he chose extra millions over rings. Also, let's not forget that LA, Chicago, Boston are pretty big markets too. No one talks about the Nets anymore because they are still mired in the swamp.

I love New York and ain't no other place like it. I just believe New York isn't the only city that can get him where he wants to be, and it's ain't necessarily the most livable city either. And I truly believe that it is at least possible to do what he wants to do from Ohio. And all of this is moot if we don't look like a squad & organization he can win with.

That's arguably true in some sports. Its the "can Lebron transcend the game" on his own? Would Brandon Roy be as big as Kobe if he were in LA? Would Kobe be bigger than Michael if he was in CHI? Would Karl Malone be bigger than Patrick in NY?

I think that Lebron will be alright regardless of whether he stays or goes. He will be a HOFer, health permitting. Can NY take him from hundred millionaire to billionaire? I don't know. I somewhat expect Lebron to re-sign in Cleveland. But I do think he'd be a bigger name in NY.
You know I gonna spin wit it
bitty41
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7/20/2009  4:58 PM
If it was as simple as the Knicks being located in a superior city then half the teams in the NBA would never net a superstar and SA would never win Championships. Guys it's not that simple this is just a lot of hype created by the NY media. And fans have bought into completely. Sure if a free-agents choices were down to Memphis or NY, but if your talking about a player whose looking to a win a title and solidify himself as among the greatest he isn't going to do that by leaving a very good team to goto a team of underdeveloped young players and has-beens.
djsunyc
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7/20/2009  6:49 PM
jason kidd had more of financial incentive to come to ny than dallas. salary was about a $2+ mil difference per season but if ny is supposed to give you some marketing and endorsement dollars, then a future HOF pg could've got some of that coin. and i'm sure the knicks would've pushed him as the current face of the franchise. but that, the idea of playing for d'antoni w/ this roster and walsh was not enough to convince him.
GKFv2
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7/20/2009  6:51 PM
Kidd has made hundreds of millions in his career. He may have used NY for the money but he didn't re-sign in Dallas for it. Dallas has a superior roster and has set themselves up to be a title contender. Considering Kidd is 37, it makes much more sense to remain where he is and try to win a title before he retires.
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djsunyc
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7/20/2009  6:52 PM
Posted by GKFv2:

Kidd has made hundreds of millions in his career. He may have used NY for the money but he didn't re-sign in Dallas for it. Dallas has a superior roster and has set themselves up to be a title contender. Considering Kidd is 37, it makes much more sense to remain where he is and try to win a title before he retires.

i think that's exactly the point bitty is trying to make about lebron coming to ny...
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