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Knicks have really backed themselves into a corner
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Elite
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3/25/2009  3:55 PM
i actually think Lee can develop and improve his Defense
AUTOADVERT
King1
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3/25/2009  4:03 PM
I think Lee on ball defense isnt bad in the post. What kills him is he isnt big enough and when you play Shaq, Howard, Yao, Gasol you cant leave them and let them get the momentum anymore. If you arent leaning on them then it is a dunk or they repost and kill you. We have no guards that keep anyone in front and if you had a big that blocked shots he would foul out in the first half. This team is better than last year and they will be about 8 games better which is about 35% mo0re wins is that because of the players or coaches?
King1
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3/25/2009  4:08 PM
Why does everyone only talk about Lee defense Nate is the worst defender in the league and duhon isnt much better? Why does every guard in the league light us up?
GKFv2
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3/25/2009  4:11 PM
Why do you bash other players and not Lee? That's a better question. Of course the answer is obvious to us all.

I've made my case on Lee numerous times. So have others. Nobody is going to change your opinion so why bother? Lee is nicknamed "Free Layups" by me for a reason. If he wasn't such a soft pansy too afraid to pick up a foul so he can stay in the game and pick up his precious double double stat-padding numbers, then I'd be a little more easy on him. But no, he isn't. Chris Wilcox has shown more on D in a few games than Lee has his whole career. Lee is the same crap defender he's been since his rookie year. Scoring a few more points off pick and rolls is not going to change my opinion on him as a player.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
Panos
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3/25/2009  4:12 PM
Posted by GKFv2:

Whoever give Lee $10 million a year is the worst GM in the NBA, bar none.

Bar none? How about the guy that gave MoT $10M?
Or Jalen Rose $16M? (HAHA was that Walsh?)
Or Dudley $4M?
Panos
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3/25/2009  4:13 PM
Posted by GKFv2:
Posted by EnySpree:

Knicks need toughness...David Lee is our "best" big man and he gets boards and at times can make some spectacular plays...but the Knicks either need to get this man help or trade him. He has no pride out there on defense or inside in general. Thats soooo retarded to say about a guy that is averaging what he does but David Lee has got to be one of the softest double double guy in league history.

This is what separates Troy Murphy from David Lee - 3 point shooting.

Other than that, they are the same player and not because they're both white either. It's really coincidental.


How many freakin times are we going to make this comparison?
GKFv2
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3/25/2009  4:13 PM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by GKFv2:

Whoever give Lee $10 million a year is the worst GM in the NBA, bar none.

Bar none? How about the guy that gave MoT $10M?
Or Jalen Rose $16M? (HAHA was that Walsh?)
Or Dudley $4M?

I'm talking current NBA GM's, not past. There is nobody worse than Isiah so it is kinda obvious I'm referring to the current crop of GM's.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
GKFv2
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3/25/2009  4:14 PM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by GKFv2:
Posted by EnySpree:

Knicks need toughness...David Lee is our "best" big man and he gets boards and at times can make some spectacular plays...but the Knicks either need to get this man help or trade him. He has no pride out there on defense or inside in general. Thats soooo retarded to say about a guy that is averaging what he does but David Lee has got to be one of the softest double double guy in league history.

This is what separates Troy Murphy from David Lee - 3 point shooting.

Other than that, they are the same player and not because they're both white either. It's really coincidental.


How many freakin times are we going to make this comparison?

Till people believe it.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
King1
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3/25/2009  4:15 PM
I say that Lee defense sucks also. Chris Wilcox is a scrub and if scoring off pick and rolls were so easy why doesnt Wilcox do it. GF cant wait to see your new Slogan. "President of the David Lee I make 10 million a year club."
King1
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3/25/2009  4:17 PM
If Lee is so worried about stat why is he even playing right now. The guy has serious legs problems and he still wants to play. Against Sacramento he couldnt even dunk. If he was selfish he would not be playing these last 10 games and watch.
GKFv2
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3/25/2009  4:18 PM
Posted by King1:

If Lee is so worried about stat why is he even playing right now. The guy has serious legs problems and he still wants to play. Against Sacramento he couldnt even dunk. If he was selfish he would not be playing these last 10 games and watch.

Yes he would. to prove he's healthy so he can get the contact you say he deserves.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
Allanfan20
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3/25/2009  4:24 PM
GKF, not trying to be offensive here, but letting you know something. It's almost impossible to take YOUR personal opinion on Lee seriously at all b/c you claim to hate him. Meaning you show bias. When you hate (Just like love) everything becomes clouded. You may want to consider looking at Lee more objectively. I hope you don't take that personal.

It's the same with the people who LOVE the guy to death and anyone else for that matter.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
King1
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3/25/2009  4:25 PM
I am hoping someone will be dumb enough to get a MLE. Do you think that Kirilenko deserved a 80 million dollar contract or Bobby Simmons got 60 million a year. There are a lot of dumb GM out there my friend.
Allanfan20
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3/25/2009  4:26 PM
As for his defense, I can live with his man to man in the post. However, his help defense is horrific to no end and he still doesn't go out after shooters aggresively. I just don't know why a hard worker like Lee is like this on the defensive end. He can be much better.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Pharzeone
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3/25/2009  4:37 PM
I'm sorry but Lee has always been bad defensively as a Knick. When Brown played him at the 3, he wasn't quick enough to deal with the swingmen and who get burnt on the perimeter. When he was at the 4 under Isiah, he would get posted up to no end. Average post players put up stellar numbers against the Knicks frontline. While Curry took the blunt of blame, Lee was getting big minutes in the post as well. Now this season he is at the center position and while his speed seems to help him on the offense end. He can't stop the average post player if the ball begins to go through that player. He can't stop guards from penetrating and he looks completely lost on the triple threat position. How many illegal defenses has he been called for this season alone. Lee's idea of defense is to rotate off the penetrator to the perimeter or just put up his hands straight up without trying to find the ball. If that all fails just position himself for those rebounds. Fight off Chandler, Harrington and Q for those rebounds. They're on your damn team why fight them for rebounds. Which of course leads to the silly turnover or loose ball outbounds call. IMO, Lee gives you a pretty much lack of effort on the defensive end anyway you want to slice it.

By the way, king before you try to throw Chandler under the bus for his defense. Ask yourself why does Chandler have to constantly rotate or double team Lee's man to just try to bail him out. LOL, Chandler has been picking up fouls early in these games just because of Lee's lack of effort on the defense end. I think that is one of the biggest things that is pissing off D'Antoni concerning Lee.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
TMS
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3/25/2009  4:57 PM
Posted by King1:

with the upcoming contracts of Lee and Nate. Walsh has his hands tied this summer and it will be interesting what they do. I can see a team like Sacramento or someone that needs to energize the fanbase into giving him a full MLE. I can see a team like Portland or OKC giving Lee a 5 yr 50 million dollar offer. Does Walsh match them? Does he let both of these guys walk for nothing? Can anyone name me a center right now that plays defense, block shots, get 15 points and 10 rebounds a game you can get to replace Lee and be effective in this system? This draft doesnt have a big man that can do those things and score. I think the Knicks made a huge mistake not signing Lee before the year. What will Walsh do and I dont think you will get a sign and trade like all stars Lewis and Joe Johnson got.

Jordan Hill can replace David Lee, & he's perfectly suited for this system & he plays defense & blocks shots.

Cole Aldrich can do the same & he's a C... he might not be perfectly suited to this system but he'll get his share of points & rebounds & be the shotblocker that we sorely need.

IMO the mistake we made was not trading Lee & Nate at the trade deadline.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
King1
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3/25/2009  5:01 PM
Now how are you going to get the #3 pick in the draft to get Jordan Hill?
King1
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3/25/2009  5:02 PM
Dont you think if Walsh and MDa werent happy with Lee they wouldnt be playing him and him be a part of every play?
TMS
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3/25/2009  5:10 PM
Posted by King1:

Now how are you going to get the #3 pick in the draft to get Jordan Hill?

right now we can't, i'm just replying to ur assessment that there's no one in this draft that could replace Lee's production... there are, & i told u that a few months ago when we had this same discussion on why it would make sense to trade Lee for a lottery pick at the deadline.

now like u said, we are painted into a corner... Donnie better have a contingency plan in place to deal w/the Lee & Nate contract situations because this offseason is going to determine our future for the next few years IMO.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Pharzeone
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3/25/2009  5:26 PM
Posted by King1:

Dont you think if Walsh and MDa werent happy with Lee they wouldnt be playing him and him be a part of every play?

No. The one thing I seen from these guys is that playing time doesn't have anything to do with their feelings for a player. Harrington only recently has been seeing the bench in the 4th quarter. Lee is starting to frequent the bench (prior to Gallinari's exit) as well. And he is not a part of every play. He's not Ewing, stop it.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
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