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Kevin Martin?
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tkf
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2/18/2009  11:51 AM
Posted by martin:
Posted by tkf:

kevin martin is a beast.. a top 4 SG in the league....

how is his D?

not a great defender, but capable and willing. can get better tho.. very smart player
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
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tkf
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2/18/2009  11:52 AM
Posted by firefly:
Posted by tkf:

kevin martin is a beast.. a top 4 SG in the league....

Cosign.

Crawford is nothing compared to Martin. Martin has a better stroke, better shot selection, better rebounding, better everything except passing.

Martin is averaging about 23 ppg this year on one leg. The guy is a flat-out offensive stud. He's no Artest on defense, but at least he puts his hands up (1spg).

[Edited by - firefly on 02-18-2009 11:01 AM]


for real.. in this offense, he can have one of those games where he will make a run at kobe's 61.. he is that efficient... and good.. he had 48 on a kings team with really no other weapons... he moves so well without the ball he has defenses scrambling...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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2/18/2009  11:56 AM
Posted by firefly:

Just found this....

http://nba.fanhouse.com/2008/09/16/nba-top-50-kevin-martin-no-23/

NBA Top 50: Kevin Martin (No. 23)
Posted Sep 16th 2008 10:30AM by Tom Ziller (author feed)



FanHouse's Tom Ziller argues his ranking of the top 50 players in the NBA.

Kevin Martin is unique, most will agree. His funky wind-up, his throwback hairstyle, his extensively modest persona, his assortment of runners, floaters, jukes, jives, step-backs and cross-overs. But in a much more basic sense, his combination of slashing and shooting prowess is absolutely unmatched in the NBA.

Only two players in the history of the NBA have been potent enough off the dribble and from behind the arc to average eight FTs a game and shoot 40% from three: Michael Jordan and Kevin Martin. The purple #23 even went one better last season, averaging nine FTs a game while nailing 40% of his bombs.

Guys like LeBron James and Dwyane Wade are extremely good off the dribble. They finish a lot, they find teammates, they draw fouls. But neither can shoot reliably from behind the arc. In this aspect of versatility, only Manu Ginobili and Kobe Bryant can offer the same sort of flexible potency ... and even then, Martin's more efficient in both sectors than both guys.

Scoff if you will, but this cat is clearly one of the best offensive weapons in the NBA.

For the past three years, Martin has seen his offensive role expand. In 2005-06, as a part-time starter in place of Bonzi Wells, Martin served an "energy" role extremely well: on the floor with Mike Bibby and Brad Miller, Martin got clean for the backdoor pass frequently, and worked as a one-man fast break (aka "cherry picker") occasionally. In '06-07, Martin took a featured role despite the best intentions of Bibby, Ron Artest and Eric Musselman, who at times seemed to shut him out. Due to his unnerving efficiency, Martin became the team's leading scorer despite taking less shots than Bibby or Artest.

Last season ... well, before a rough groin injury in December, Martin sat in the top-5 in the league in scoring ... despite coming behind Artest on the pecking order (still). Reggie Theus limited Martin's minutes quite a bit late in the season, understandable amid a losing season. Martin slipped under the 24-ppg mark for the season ... which still left him No. 7 in the league in scoring, despite the lower minutes. Only one guard (Kobe) scored more per-minute.

So Martin uses a bunch of offense (finally) and scores a lot. So do a lot of guys, what's the big deal?

In each of those seasons -- the "energy guy" season, the starter season, the focal point season -- Martin had a True Shooting percentage over 60%. For perspective: Tracy McGrady has never had a TS% higher than 56.4%. Allen Iverson's peak was 56.7%. Kobe's high: 58%. Wade's high: 58.3%. LeBron: 56.8%.

Almost no high volume scorers (especially perimeter players) shoot this efficiently so much as once in their career. Martin has done it three straight seasons. Amare Stoudemire has joined Martin in the "20/60 club" the last two seasons: 20 points a game, 60% True shooting. The last player to do it two straight seasons? Reggie Miller, 1995-97. This is a rare feat, left to only to most potent, efficient scorers in the land.

Not to diminish Amare's achievement -- you'll see him higher on this list -- but Martin didn't have a Nash setting the table, or a deathcab offense keeping the opposing defense off-kilter, or a creative genius manning the controls (sorry, Reggie). Martin did this with a point guard (Beno Udrih) who hadn't played in two years or started an alley-oop in 13 years (estimate), a frontcourt that wouldn't scare a marshmallow and a "sidekick" (Artest) who thinks he belongs in the MVP race and shoots, dribbles and leads as such.

Kevin Martin has done all the things I wrote above in really anti-optimal conditions. Imagine how could he'll be if the roster around him develops?


The guy is a flat-out unbelievable shooter. If he came here, in this offense, he would best Houston, Ray Ray(pre buy-a-ring Celts), Peja, Redd, Gordon etc. Crawford isnt even a comparison.

[Edited by - firefly on 02-18-2009 11:07 AM]

fantastic article!!!! I am going to borrow this.. good find..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
s3231
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2/18/2009  11:56 AM
I've wanted this guy for awhile now. He would be absolutely perfect for this offense.

This looks like our opportunity because the Maloofs need to cut salary (as a result of the Madoff Ponzi scheme). If we have a shot at getting him, we need to take it despite any 2010 salary concerns. We still have another season to get rid of contracts.
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
franco12
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2/18/2009  12:36 PM
Basically, the Kings want to save money next year, and we want money off in 2010 and beyond.

Mega unrealistic trade

Marbury, Curry, Jefferies & Roberson for

Miller, Kenny Thomas, Shareef & Kevin Martin.

This saves them about $15mm next year, but clears us of JJ & Curry in 2010 and beyond. The Kings can take JJ & Curry in 2010 and beyond, because they need to spend a min.

Maybe we swap in Nate for Roberson to help them sell some Jerseys.

We get instantly better, we do pay the tax big next year, but in 2010 we ditch JJ & upgrade Curry into Kevin Martin, who fits much better in this system.
Panos
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2/18/2009  12:38 PM
Posted by franco12:

Basically, the Kings want to save money next year, and we want money off in 2010 and beyond.

Mega unrealistic trade

Marbury, Curry, Jefferies & Roberson for

Miller, Kenny Thomas, Shareef & Kevin Martin.

This saves them about $15mm next year, but clears us of JJ & Curry in 2010 and beyond. The Kings can take JJ & Curry in 2010 and beyond, because they need to spend a min.

Maybe we swap in Nate for Roberson to help them sell some Jerseys.

We get instantly better, we do pay the tax big next year, but in 2010 we ditch JJ & upgrade Curry into Kevin Martin, who fits much better in this system.


Step away from the bong.
newyorknewyork
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2/18/2009  12:54 PM
If Kevin Martin is available for our draft pick and cap space we have to do it.

Rose, Nate, 2009 draft pick for Kevin Martin = No brainer!
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Allanfan20
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2/18/2009  12:56 PM
I'd cry to see Nate go, but you have to do that. Maybe you can find a third partner and try and get them to take Curry or Jefferies.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
newyorknewyork
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2/18/2009  1:01 PM
Imagine

Shaq
Lee/Harrington
Chander/Gallo
Martin/Richardson
Duhon

Martin on the perimeter with a guy like Shaq in the paint would kill opponents inside and out. Its a pipe dream but a real nice one.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Allanfan20
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2/18/2009  1:06 PM
That's also a HORRIBLE bench.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
buddapaw
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2/18/2009  1:21 PM
No to Crawford redux
"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
crzymdups
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2/18/2009  1:57 PM
i can't believe there's any way the Kings trade Kevin Martin.
¿ △ ?
s3231
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2/18/2009  2:24 PM
LMAO, Martin is no Crawford redux at all.

He is a much, much, much, better player.
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
sebstar
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2/18/2009  4:34 PM
As much as I would love for this to work, this is definitely a pipe dream. KMart is a legit scorer in his prime. At the very least, The Kings are going to want expirings, draft picks, or a young player or two. A strong combination of the two, or a decent combination of the three.

Lee/Nate are pretty much out, becuase they would have to re-sign them which would obviously defeat the purpose for Sac if they are having financial trouble. We can't trade them our pick. We could hit them with a assload of expirings, but that would be a tough sell for their already dwindling fanbase to trade their star for just contracts.

Hope I'm wrong, because that is exactly the type of cat we need right now. Our only hope would be to really sell them on Gallo and Chandler: Would you guys be willing to trade them : Chandler/Gallo/Nate/Malik for Martin/Miller?


If the Thunder are smart, they are burning up the phone to Sacramento right now. They have a ton of picks.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Bonn1997
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2/18/2009  4:35 PM
Posted by firefly:
Posted by Bonn1997:

Kenyon Martin is a good player who you could build with or use in a sign and trade in 2010. Everyone on the Knicks should be available for him.

Kevin? Because if we traded for Kenyon, I would join DJ in Canada.

HILARIOUS! Yeah, I meant Kevin!
Finestrg
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2/18/2009  6:43 PM
Posted by jazz74:
Posted by Finestrg:

Here's how I view anything with Sacramento -- First and foremost, I want their 1st round pick. After that, maybe I could be convinced to take on a guy like Francisco Garcia who they just extended but at decent/fair money - I've always liked Garcia anyway, he's still young, a hometown kid & very skilled. Even though he cuts into the 2010 plan a little, he's good value at about $5-5.5 mil. per in my estimation. Or I'd take Brad Miller off their hands provided they want to make a fair deal - I'd have to get their 1st rounder bach though or no deal - we'll see how badly they want to save money. Miller comes off the books by 2010. But why on Earth would I take on Kevin Martin? We made a trade to unload Crawford's longterm deal now you guys want to basically take on the same guy with an even worse contract???? Man, stay the course fellas. Jesus! He's a nice player but he doesn't get us over any kind of hump. He's a "let's try and win now guy" which is not the player we should be interested in anyway - WE AE NOT 1 PIECE AWAY FROM DOING ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!! Phoenix is a team that was possibly one guy away and they went out and got Jason Richardson. We're not in the same boat. Our plan is different here. Martin's contract interfers with the 2010 plan - taking on this guy's contract turns the 2010 plan to mud. I'm not worried about this one - with his contract, he's not a guy Walsh is probably interested in anyway.

keep dreaming. if the maloofs approve that, they should take that franchise away from them and give it to seattle. they most likely will get the first pick which they will need to rebuild this franchise. i don't understand the cap room for them either. i can't envision free agents going to sac town.

My bad - I was referring to their lower 1st rounder, right now hovering in the low 20s. Yeah of course we're not getting their top 1st rounder... And to clear something else up - yes, I understand Kevin Martin's a better player than Jamal Crawford but the contract is a complete killer for us. And as good as he is, he doesn't improve us all that much right now and more importantly taking on that contract severely hinders what we're looking to do longterm. That's my view on going after this kid. Nice player with a contract we want no part of. In fact, I don't care at all about adding to this current squad anyway - it's not in our best interest. But if they insist on trying to win this year, stick to the gameplan - only go after quick fix-types that expire by 2010.

Interesting article in today's Daily News about the Knicks by Filip Bondy - "Knicks & lottery: That's the ticket!" It's only in the paper, not on the web site. I'll post it as soon as it becomes available. Bondy saying it's time to tank the rest of the season to maximize our draft position - I couldn't agree more. He discusses how teams like Houston (Olajuwon) & Chicago (Jordan) went this route and used this strategy to great effect - both of those teams were desperate and got fortunate enough to turn their franchises around quickly by drafting a star player. Now I don't think we'll win the rights to the 1st pick this summer (although you never know) but there are some damn good players available throughout the lottery that could help us and odds are players going 5-10 will be better than someone available at 15. I'd hate to lose out on that just because we had to make some half-assed attempt at the playoffs with zero chance of going anywhere even if we did get in. Bravo Mr. Bondy, you tell 'em! Couldn't agree more man - shut it down now, tank these last 29 games, get as high as possible in the lottery & draft an impact player, gather as many additional draft picks as possible, and clear room for 2010. Stick to that plan and we'll have a good team, one that we'll be proud to go to the playoffs with, in a couple of years...


[Edited by - finestrg on 02-18-2009 11:25 PM]
Kevin Martin?

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