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Im officially a little giddy about my Knicks
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BlueSeats
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2/1/2009  2:33 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by BlueSeats:

Briggs, stop flip flopping. You ride every little streak, up or down, for all its worth.

We are a very weak team that is overachieving for a very good coach. Its tenuous at best. We need a lot of work yet.

What flip flop. You call it as you see it. Not many opportunities in the last 7 years to be reasonably happy as a fan. The team is to good with too much firepower to tank. Too many guys have the ability to score 20 for us to be bad enough to make it count. We face 3 tough teams but most of them are on long road trips--injured and back to back for them. I think the Knicks can get can get atleast one of them

But you see it differently every week. Wasn't it just a couple of weeks ago that you were bitter that Walsh didn't go far enough in dissembling the team?

I don't mind, its fine that you're talking doomsday one week and high as a kite the next. But I disagree about us being really close to very good. We're still a weak team that's overachieving for a very good coach. But fortunately this time around we have a GM who's not gonna go all-in just to make the playoffs and destroy our future for a run at mediocrity.

AUTOADVERT
BRIGGS
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2/1/2009  2:46 PM

So, you know what, BRIGGS has flip flopped a little bit, but I empathize. Bottomline is he wants to believe this team is headed in the right direction, this season and long term.


Absolutely--I'm tired of wanting to lose to get a better pick. We get what we get this year and we don't have one next year--so where is the logic at this point to tank-especially when we have been playing very well? I would like to be a buyer or atleast opportunistic at the trade deadline to help that Jefferies spot.
RIP Crushalot😞
EnySpree
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2/1/2009  2:52 PM
Numbers: 9-7 in January...7-3 in the last 10 games

Knicks are 21-25...

Now I can count at least 4-5 games that the Knicks lost because of the trade and the lack or depth at one point....to me the Knicks are really 25-21...as the title of this thread suggests...thats pretty much what they are...

Still plenty of season left and a trade deadline on its way...but yo...we can be proud of our Knicks again bros!!!
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tkf
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2/1/2009  3:22 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by tkf:
Posted by BlueSeats:

Briggs, stop flip flopping. You ride every little streak, up or down, for all its worth.

We are a very weak team that is overachieving for a very good coach. Its tenuous at best. We need a lot of work yet.





so are you happy with what we are doing so far blue seats? just curious.. we know how briggs flip flops, so just forget that for a minute. Tell me. do you like what you see so far? And who you would like to keep going forward... Also what do you think of gallanari? sorry for all the questions, but it has been a while since I have picked your brain...

Heck, I don't know. I like Walsh and D'. The Marbury situation got off to an awkward start but the right decision was made. I like D's intensity. He's not a defensive stalwart, but some games we've played our best defense since 2003. That's not saying a lot, but still. Walsh stated a plan to be flexible for the 2010 sweepstakes, which I totally support, and dumping Zach and Crawford proved his intent. Unfortunately Eddy is becoming seriously untradable, which is really sad for a guy with his potential only making 10M.

Lee has been our "best" player in my eyes for years now and I'm pleased with his increasing offensive confidence. The other night he got a pass on the low block that he caught and spun under his defender so fast it was unstoppable. Its not like mega powerful, or super athletic, but his instincts are really good, and he plays within himself. He's trying to stretch his range, and he's not a good shooter yet, but nor does he force a lot of shots. A very efficient player. But you can't go all that far with Lee as your best player.

Nate is starting to remind me of Starks. A crazy, sometimes out of control, emotional guy who wins your heart. He needs to up his D to be as valuable as Starks was, and like Johnny, he could be replaced by an Alan Houston caliber player, but I can't hate on the Nate.

Chandler is still iffy. I wonder about his intensity. There's a bit of Tim Thomas to him: incredible physical attributes, bursts of brilliance, but is he hungry enough? Could be a confidence thing, but it looks like hunger.

Duhon has been an incredible surprise, especially as a playmaker. I like him. If we had a shooter it would really open things up. His defense isn't lockdown, but its there, especially when things are slowed down. He's not big or fast enough to contain, but he moves his feet and hands. He tries. Coach D' has been very, very good for him, and vice versa.

Harrington is weird. He's got skills but he's awkward in many ways. His interior moves are so gangly he always looks close to a walk or turnover, but I'd prefer him inside than out. However, he's certainly capable of getting hot out there. He's a bit streaky and seems to play on emotion that sometimes isn't there. For all his athleticism he should be blocking more shots. He's okay, probably a rental.

I like Gallo's skillset. I'd be pretty high on the kid if it weren't for his back. He does vacillate between nice aggression and a deer in the headlights. Can't tell if its because he's young or if the back is tender. I wont hate on the pick because if healthy he deos seem like a prototypical D'Antoi player: Can shoot, pass, put it on the floor, etc. He's a bit of a cross between Dirk and Diaw, and his talent level will fall somewhere between them (a wide range, I know) if he can get and stay healthy.

So I think its a really nice first year fr Walsh and D'. They're both showing the ability to make big changes quickly, and I think for the better. I still see us as a talent poor team, but we're overachieving and setting ourselves up with the possibility to add major talent down the road. I still think its really hard to win big in this league without scoring franchise caliber talent in the draft (yeah, there's Detroit, but even Shaq and LA had Kobe, KG/Ray and Boston had Pierce) so we better get busy there soon. But all in all I've got to give the coach and front office pretty high marks so far.

I think it'll be pretty difficult for anyone to say the culture hasn't changed for the positive in a pretty big way, though I'm sure many will try - and not just the UK mafia. D'Antoni has a whole crew of haters all to himself.

What do you think?

Very fair analysis. Very fair and very good.

I loved the mike D signing from the start and people can go back and look, I was 100% for it from the start. I know we needed a system that was proven and he has brought that here... The marbury situation was awkward, but necessary, and for all of those who were looking to bash walsh, saying that this would be a distraction were wrong.... the only thing distracted are those looking to find fault with walsh... the team has moved on..
Walsh has been great, so far, he has kept to his plan of cap flexibilty in 2010 and didn't rush to go out and sign players when we were shorthanded. The funny thing is, most fans were killing him because he didn't do so... Having a GM with patience and a plan is great.

As far as the players:

Duhon, I wasn't a big fan of in chicago, but I could understand why Mike wanted him. Endless motor, smart, will run the offense, will defend. All the other stuff, his scoring, passing and leadership has been a big bonus.

Lee: he is our best player, and as you said, we can only go so far with lee as our best player, and he has been for years. I know you and I were always high on lee, but I think he may be better than we anticipated and it almost makes you aprehensive to actually say, maybe he can be an allstar type player, especially in this offense. Either way, lee is proving that he can be a great support player to any franchise type talent..

Al harrington: I think he feels he is a start type player. At least he shoots that way... LOL.. But in reality, he is good scorer and an underrated defender. Al is the type of guy you can keep on your bench, he will be better than most of the second unit players in the NBA, can give you spot starters minutes and a lot of scoring... A rental at his salary now, a bench keeper if you can get him for much less..

Chandler: As you said, his demeanor screams laid back, his skills scream, AllStar. It is tough, a game like last night in which he filled the stat sheet, we should see every game. He needs to get nastier... if that is possible for him. I think he has the ability to be a heck of a player if he can figure it all out..

Gallo: Great size, shot and skillset, I wonder about his back, but if healthy, as you said, he can be a player between the Dirk and diaw talent level. Actually, I think he an give us the best of what both have. Gallo will take it to the rim, has a sweet shot, a handle and he is a good passer. That is what makes him different from dirk if you ask me, but more similar to diaw, but he is taller and also a better, much better shooter than diaw, so while I will temper my excitement simply because he is a rookie and the back injury still is a slight issue, I have high hopes for the kid, but am cautious not to get too excited here... Even when healthy, there are never guarantees in this league..

overall, as you said, we still need some more talent.I like nate, would like to keep him off our bench, because he still is a high skill level player and for a reasonable price can be great off the bench. I really feel we need to address the SG position. Q is a nice guy, but I would prefer a guy like kevin Martin would be killer on this team, in this offense...

We need a good draft this year and we can hope to get a franchise type player in 2010, with that, I think we an catpult into serious contender status with Dantoni having established his offense here, and walsh adding smaller key pieces... we have work to do, but it has been a nice year so far.. we are playing better than many(including myself) would have thought..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
BlueSeats
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2/1/2009  4:15 PM
Good stuff TKF.
Knicksfan
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2/1/2009  4:27 PM
I think its fair to feel "a little giddy" about the Knicks right now, but with NY you always have to be careful. As mentioned before, they could be a losing streak away from doom, and the next three games are as difficult as they can be.

This speaks well of the coach we have and of many of the players that could easily stay here after 2010 and be part of a solid team. But remember, some of this players are just spare parts, which means be careful not to fall in love with them because they won't stay.

Who would I like to keep:

Lee is the hardworking and talented player a contender needs, and as a starter.
Nate is an amazing player off the bench.
Chandler keeps improving and will make a bench an extremely solid one, both on O and D.
Gallinari has the type of talent and size very difficult or impossible to teach. Who knows if he will ever be a starter, but the guy surely is a great active player to have in your team.
Duhon I really hope we can keep him because the guy is a hardworker and a warrior. Solid pure PG.

The rest? Thanks for playing, and good luck on your next franchise. Nothing personal.


Knicks_Fan
tkf
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2/2/2009  12:54 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Good stuff TKF.

thanks.. enjoyed yours as well...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
TMS
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2/2/2009  5:17 AM
we ain't winning nothing til we get a pair of superstars IMHO
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
franco12
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2/2/2009  8:25 AM
Posted by TMS:

we ain't winning nothing til we get a pair of superstars IMHO

I'd disagree with us needing two superstars- clearly, we do need to find a 'best talent in league' kind of player & while this roster might look like a good supporting cast, I have my doubts...
Vmart
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2/2/2009  9:55 AM
Of course the team is headed in the right direction was there any other way to go but up. The Knicks are playing well right now but we must curb our enthusiasm and see their performance in these three telling games. If they get all three of these games you know there is definitely something there to be excited about. They get 2 of the 3 and you can still be excited knowing they are headed in the right direction. 1 out of 3 the fans can keep their heads up and know that the roster needs work but are headed in the right direction. 0 out of 3 and there is still a lot of work to be done. The season can come tumbling down in front of eyes as we have seen the Knicks do in the past.

Lets get our giddy in control. But if the Knicks knockout these three chumps in a row we can all get our giddy on.
Nalod
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2/2/2009  10:00 AM
The better the play, the more they win.

THe more they win the less we need a high lotto pick.

The less we need a high lotto pick, the more value our players have.

The more value they have they more they perform, and the higher we can trade for if we need.

MDA is a beloved coach by allstars. He adds value to players. Marginal players play better in his system, and all stars get more also.

We play tough teams tough. That is a good sign.

Its a work in progress. We can't see the future, so we can be hopeful for what we see.

franco12
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2/2/2009  12:07 PM
Posted by Nalod:

The better the play, the more they win.

THe more they win the less we need a high lotto pick.

The less we need a high lotto pick, the more value our players have.

The more value they have they more they perform, and the higher we can trade for if we need.

MDA is a beloved coach by allstars. He adds value to players. Marginal players play better in his system, and all stars get more also.

We play tough teams tough. That is a good sign.

Its a work in progress. We can't see the future, so we can be hopeful for what we see.

This is the problem. I worry that we're glossing over the issue of needing more talent on this squad, and while its great to win, all I see is that we're going to be locked into mediocraty for several more years- possibly beyond 2010.

Who is the franchise talent on this squad? And if they don't come in 2010, when & how do they come? And if they don't come in 2010, will this current group be past its prime before that franchise talent arrives?


King1
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2/2/2009  12:27 PM
You have to give the players credit also MDA doesnt have a magic potion the players are also getting it done.
fishmike
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2/2/2009  12:43 PM
Posted by King1:

You have to give the players credit also MDA doesnt have a magic potion the players are also getting it done.
yes and no

Since Ewing retired the biggest thing I have bitched and moaned about is this team has no identity. We added random pieces with no rhyme or reason in regard to what fits our style of play. What kind of team are we? What kind of team are we trying to be?

Well, thanks to the coach and the GM adding the right pieces (and dumping others) we do have an identity. We have a style of play. We have a plan of attack every night. So far its translated into both players exceeding their typical production and most important: wins.

100% agree that its always about the players first and foremost. But they have to be put in a position to suceed and do what they do well. MDA and DW have certainly suceeded in that.

Add to it our bad backed rookie certainly looks like he has an NBA skillset, and NBA heart and NBA athleticism.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
islesfan
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2/2/2009  12:58 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by King1:

You have to give the players credit also MDA doesnt have a magic potion the players are also getting it done.
yes and no

Since Ewing retired the biggest thing I have bitched and moaned about is this team has no identity. We added random pieces with no rhyme or reason in regard to what fits our style of play. What kind of team are we? What kind of team are we trying to be?

Well, thanks to the coach and the GM adding the right pieces (and dumping others) we do have an identity. We have a style of play. We have a plan of attack every night. So far its translated into both players exceeding their typical production and most important: wins.

100% agree that its always about the players first and foremost. But they have to be put in a position to suceed and do what they do well. MDA and DW have certainly suceeded in that.

Add to it our bad backed rookie certainly looks like he has an NBA skillset, and NBA heart and NBA athleticism.

Do they have an identity yet? At first it was push it up, shoot quickly and shoot a lot of 3's. But they play better when they slow it down. Now they go back and forth each game.

If they have an identity it's that they're so frustratingly inconsistent, with pretty much everything.

Why are people so quick to say that some kind of success has been achieved?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
GallOfFame
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2/2/2009  1:02 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by King1:

You have to give the players credit also MDA doesnt have a magic potion the players are also getting it done.
yes and no

Since Ewing retired the biggest thing I have bitched and moaned about is this team has no identity. We added random pieces with no rhyme or reason in regard to what fits our style of play. What kind of team are we? What kind of team are we trying to be?

Well, thanks to the coach and the GM adding the right pieces (and dumping others) we do have an identity. We have a style of play. We have a plan of attack every night. So far its translated into both players exceeding their typical production and most important: wins.

100% agree that its always about the players first and foremost. But they have to be put in a position to suceed and do what they do well. MDA and DW have certainly suceeded in that.

Add to it our bad backed rookie certainly looks like he has an NBA skillset, and NBA heart and NBA athleticism.

Do they have an identity yet? At first it was push it up, shoot quickly and shoot a lot of 3's. But they play better when they slow it down. Now they go back and forth each game.

If they have an identity it's that they're so frustratingly inconsistent, with pretty much everything.

Why are people so quick to say that some kind of success has been achieved?


3-4 weeks ago it was too quick to criticize the team wasn't worth being coached and now all credit can be given to coach. So if we go on a 5-6gm losing streak then what?
nixluva
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2/2/2009  1:36 PM
Islesfan and Galloffame, The offense was NEVER just as simple as come down court and jack up shots as quick as we can. That's the problem with those who criticize MDA's offense. They just don't get that it's an offense that breeds faster recognition of GOOD shots and quicker passing. Players know how to move on the floor to get to open spots and their teammates know where they're mates should be at all times, so the offense is always ahead of the defense. This is why we score so much even tho we aren't a great shooting team. The pace is high and so is the effort level. We get lots of steals and then convert those into points. We force teams to play faster than they should, which is the trap.

Now we also can play a slower pace, which isn't a negative as you seem to be suggesting. It's always been part of the offense even for PHX. The credit goes to the coach cuz we can CLEARLY see that he did for this team what he did for the Suns and we don't have the same studs they had. Still he's got this team playing at a higher level than any coach has over the last several years. So you have to give him the credit for getting his players to buy in and give the needed effort. He got them to care about winning and giving an effort for 48 mins. It was said that these players couldn't do that. Well MDA was able to get it done.
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2/2/2009  1:39 PM
Aw isn't this cute, Isles and TrueBlue are back tag-teaming.

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
islesfan
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2/2/2009  1:53 PM
Posted by nixluva:

Islesfan and Galloffame, The offense was NEVER just as simple as come down court and jack up shots as quick as we can. That's the problem with those who criticize MDA's offense. They just don't get that it's an offense that breeds faster recognition of GOOD shots and quicker passing. Players know how to move on the floor to get to open spots and their teammates know where they're mates should be at all times, so the offense is always ahead of the defense. This is why we score so much even tho we aren't a great shooting team. The pace is high and so is the effort level. We get lots of steals and then convert those into points. We force teams to play faster than they should, which is the trap.

Now we also can play a slower pace, which isn't a negative as you seem to be suggesting. It's always been part of the offense even for PHX. The credit goes to the coach cuz we can CLEARLY see that he did for this team what he did for the Suns and we don't have the same studs they had. Still he's got this team playing at a higher level than any coach has over the last several years. So you have to give him the credit for getting his players to buy in and give the needed effort. He got them to care about winning and giving an effort for 48 mins. It was said that these players couldn't do that. Well MDA was able to get it done.

I stopped reading at "GOOD shots".
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
islesfan
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2/2/2009  1:54 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:

Aw isn't this cute, Isles and TrueBlue are back tag-teaming.


Stop posting pictures of what you'd like to do with nysportsfan11.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Im officially a little giddy about my Knicks

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