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purple012870
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10/2/2008  3:28 PM
Nixluva - I don't disagree with you. It takes a team. But its possible for guys like Rip to be part of a winner, a big part. But if Marbury/Zach are on your team, especially if they're playing significant roles....well by definition you signed up for not only a losing season, but one filled with chaos & lack of growth for your organization.
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Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  3:50 PM
Posted by purple012870:

Pharzone - yes, I understand. The were on losing teams. My point about those guys is that they could all be nice pieces with the right central players. Obviously, we lack stars at this point, but that doesn't take away from the fact that those guys can play nice supporting roles at some point. And while we won't get those stars now, maybe we win 30 games, but pass, hustle, work & don't field a roster that the fan base hates. I can deal with losing in 08. Its virtually guaranteed. I just don't want see the worst example of unprofessionalism in sports again.

But Zach & Marbury cannot bring anything positive from a team aspect. Both are team killers, team cancers, both are too dumb, too volatile, too selfish to ever do anything but destroy every team they'll ever be on.

The 1st move this organization needs to make is to send a message that these types are no longer welcome.

My point is what makes Crawford different then Marbury or Zack. I pointed out the fact that Bulls actually got better after Crawford left the team which included Curry, who played some of his best ball that year. Marbury has already led his team to the playoffs in Phoenix and was the major reason the Knicks turned around their season after he was traded. Over the summer Isiah brought in Crawford and the Knicks went backwards. To make my point more, Marbury was out of the lineup the Knicks struggled, when Crawford went out they actually played better ball. I'm not trying to debate whose the bigger loser, they both seem to make that case well for themselves. From what I can tell all these guys have a problem with playing winning basketball on a consistent basis.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
purple012870
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10/2/2008  4:13 PM
Pharzeone - fair enough, good points
tkf
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10/2/2008  4:31 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by purple012870:

Pharzone - yes, I understand. The were on losing teams. My point about those guys is that they could all be nice pieces with the right central players. Obviously, we lack stars at this point, but that doesn't take away from the fact that those guys can play nice supporting roles at some point. And while we won't get those stars now, maybe we win 30 games, but pass, hustle, work & don't field a roster that the fan base hates. I can deal with losing in 08. Its virtually guaranteed. I just don't want see the worst example of unprofessionalism in sports again.

But Zach & Marbury cannot bring anything positive from a team aspect. Both are team killers, team cancers, both are too dumb, too volatile, too selfish to ever do anything but destroy every team they'll ever be on.

The 1st move this organization needs to make is to send a message that these types are no longer welcome.

My point is what makes Crawford different then Marbury or Zack. I pointed out the fact that Bulls actually got better after Crawford left the team which included Curry, who played some of his best ball that year. Marbury has already led his team to the playoffs in Phoenix and was the major reason the Knicks turned around their season after he was traded. Over the summer Isiah brought in Crawford and the Knicks went backwards. To make my point more, Marbury was out of the lineup the Knicks struggled, when Crawford went out they actually played better ball. I'm not trying to debate whose the bigger loser, they both seem to make that case well for themselves. From what I can tell all these guys have a problem with playing winning basketball on a consistent basis.


well did the bulls get any better last year? It is hard to make that correlation unless the only move the bulls made was getting rid of jamal and not adding 1 player, but since then the bulls have had about 2 good seasons and last year they were back in the lottery. But with marbs, the suns got better and stayed good, but again, they also added players, so to be fair to both guys, there were other circumstances involved other than both guys leaving... But if you want to nit pick, the nets and suns got much better by removing marbury and replacing them with better PG's..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  5:19 PM
Fair enough, tkf. Let me know how many winning teams has Crawford, EVER played on? How many times has he sniff the playoffs. Marbury has destroyed teams but Crawford has never had any impact on any either. Not nit picking, just stating the facts. Still waiting on the breakout season for a eight year veteran.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Bonn1997
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10/2/2008  6:33 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:

Fair enough, tkf. Let me know how many winning teams has Crawford, EVER played on? How many times has he sniff the playoffs. Marbury has destroyed teams but Crawford has never had any impact on any either. Not nit picking, just stating the facts. Still waiting on the breakout season for a eight year veteran.

I think I read that no current NBA player has played more seasons than Jamal without making the playoffs.
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  6:38 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Pharzeone:

Fair enough, tkf. Let me know how many winning teams has Crawford, EVER played on? How many times has he sniff the playoffs. Marbury has destroyed teams but Crawford has never had any impact on any either. Not nit picking, just stating the facts. Still waiting on the breakout season for a eight year veteran.

I think I read that no current NBA player has played more seasons than Jamal without making the playoffs.

Yeah, I think that stat was in the newspapers when the Knicks were eliminated. I also remember TNT running that stat at the beginning of the playoffs this past year. It was like an old ****, did they have to say that moment. I know people like to floss over Jamal but his record his horrible. People talk like this guy is so rookie or third year player. This guy is about to entered his third NBA contract. I remember when people used to kill Marbury for not being able to win a playoff series, how about never playing in a playoff game.

[Edited by - Pharzeone on 10-02-2008 6:40 PM]
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
nixluva
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10/2/2008  6:42 PM
The only thing that matters now is getting the most out of the players we have. If Steph and Zach are here then we need to get them playing at their highest level and within the team concept. If they do that, we'll have a good year and it will make moving any player on this team much easier. We need to win and then assess who needs to go and what we need to bring in.

This team is gonna be all about scoring and we know that Steph and Zach can score. If they're behaving like good teammates and sharing the ball like MDA asks, then there's no problem.
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  6:44 PM
Here you go, Bonn I found one of the articles from the Daily News. The one I read before was from the Post.

Jamal Crawford has longest drought
BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Sunday, March 30th 2008, 4:00 AM


Cataffo/News

Jamal Crawford, who has been in the league for eight years, has the longest streak of any NBA player to not play in a single playoff game.
If Jamal Crawford were a reality show, he'd be The Biggest Loser, NBA Edition.

That label is a bit harsh for someone with Crawford's raw ability, work ethic and ebullient personality. But that regrettable title fits because Crawford has the record to back it up.

"Honestly," he says, "it's tough."

When the Knicks were officially eliminated from playoff contention with Friday's 103-95 loss to the Raptors in Toronto, Crawford extended his streak as the NBA's most tenured active player without a postseason appearance to eight years. That's his entire pro career without a single playoff game.

By comparison, Patrick Ewing appeared in 53 playoff games by his eighth season, Michael Jordan 92 and Stephon Marbury, whose playoff resume has been mocked and criticized, 18. Crawford has zero.

"It is something I obviously want to change and it is not because you hear you are the longest-tenured player without a playoff game," Crawford says. "I want it to change because I want to be in the playoffs. It is the highest level of basketball."

Crawford's playoff drought can be attributed to a number of factors, starting with the dreadful teams he's played for. He was drafted by the rebuilding Chicago Bulls in 2000 and four seasons later he joined the rebuilding Knicks in a sign-and-trade agreement.

His timing has been bad. The year before Crawford arrived in New York, the Knicks reached the playoffs despite having a losing record. Meanwhile, Chicago qualified for the playoffs the next three years once Crawford departed.

He has never played in a stable environment. Crawford has had eight different coaches, including the last two years with Isiah Thomas. It is the first time he's played under the same coach for two consecutive years since high school.

"No excuses," Crawford says. "But when I was drafted by Chicago (out of Michigan), the Bulls were the youngest team in the league. My second year I was hurt and the third year I was sharing time with Jay Williams. In the fourth year we were supposed to be good, but that year it didn't work out. Last year I thought we had a chance until we had all those injuries."

There is no denying that Crawford has ability. He along with Allen Iverson, Dwyane Wade, Baron Davis and Chris Paul are the only players in the league 6-5 or smaller who are averaging at least 20 points per game. There are differences, however. Iverson, Wade and Davis have all led their teams into the playoffs while Paul, an MVP candidate, has New Orleans fighting for the best record in the Western Conference. All but Crawford have been to at least one All-Star Game.



[Edited by - Pharzeone on 10-02-2008 6:48 PM]
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Bonn1997
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10/2/2008  6:55 PM
"No excuses," Crawford says. "But when I was drafted by Chicago (out of Michigan), the Bulls were the youngest team in the league. My second year I was hurt and the third year I was sharing time with Jay Williams. In the fourth year we were supposed to be good, but that year it didn't work out. Last year I thought we had a chance until we had all those injuries."
In other words, "No excuses but here's my five excuses"
4949
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10/2/2008  7:19 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

The guys that they were desperately trying to get rid of Marbury and Randolph are probably the two best players on the team and may help the team more than they relaize and the guys that the new regime went after Duhon Roberson and Gallinari all have been bad or injured so far.

When will you ever learn.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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10/2/2008  7:22 PM
Posted by purple012870:

Marbury/Zach are certainly the 2 most talented players. They're also mental midgets, selfish, don't even pretend to defend & are career losers.

So much for talent.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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10/2/2008  7:24 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by purple012870:

Steph and Zach are proven losers. They can take you to the stat sheet to look at their empty numbers & they can take your team to the basement. Neither is smart enough or unselfish enough to be part of our .

What resurrection? With Duhon Gallinari and Roberson? get it?

These guys are new players. You still expect zach and suckbury to finally get it together? That's a pretty long dream your living.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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10/2/2008  7:32 PM
All I know is stephon suckbury is a complete and total loser and is a cancer, as we seen in the press just a few days ago. Guys an a-hol and causes nothing but destruction in team character. And that's why we have no character.

A refreshing start will not come in what we will acquire or have' acquired already. It will come in the form of who won't be here anymore. Just getting rid of that loser would be a tremendous boost to this teams character. Unfortunately, we'll have to wait until next June for that to finally happen. Sad really.
I'll never trust this' team again.
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  8:02 PM
ROFL. You know posting to yourself is the same as talking to yourself.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
4949
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10/2/2008  8:05 PM
How do you figure? I'm quoting other people.
I'll never trust this' team again.
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  8:05 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:

ROFL. You know posting to yourself is the same as talking to yourself.

That was pretty witty pharzeone. How can a good looking guy be so clever too.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Pharzeone
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10/2/2008  8:05 PM
Posted by 4949:

How do you figure? I'm quoting other people.

just messing with you. I saw the 4 post in a row.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
4949
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10/2/2008  8:48 PM
That's cool. I do that a lot, especially when I come back, after a long absence. Been dong some traveling across country for the last couple of weeks. Need to catch up.
I'll never trust this' team again.
knicks1248
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10/2/2008  9:04 PM
So all of the praise's Mike d as been giving us about how the team is anxious to learn how to win and learn his system, means nothing. You guys are killing me with this zach and Steph BS like we were world beaters with out them...Think again...WE sucked with out them even more.

Can we judge them once we see the new evidence.
ES
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