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Stuck with Zach?
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Travla
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9/22/2008  11:42 AM
To those who want to give Zack the benefit of the doubt, I'm with you. Actually I believe Zach should be the center in D'toni's offense. Curry will slow down the Knicks just as Shaq did when he joined Phoenix. I have to hope for better things from this team, they've been essentially playing street ball for the past few years with no structured offense and players not having specific roles.
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EnySpree
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9/22/2008  11:51 AM
Posted by Travla:

To those who want to give Zack the benefit of the doubt, I'm with you. Actually I believe Zach should be the center in D'toni's offense. Curry will slow down the Knicks just as Shaq did when he joined Phoenix. I have to hope for better things from this team, they've been essentially playing street ball for the past few years with no structured offense and players not having specific roles.

Definately.

To use a Shaq comment......Shaq called himself a shogun or a grand master.....Curry barely has a yellow tip on his white belt. Basically either Eddy Curry is just a dumb mofo, or he doesn't really love the game of basketball.
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K22
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9/22/2008  11:56 AM
Posted by EnySpree:

Basically either Eddy Curry is just a dumb mofo, or he doesn't really love the game of basketball.

All I'll say is he's not dumb.

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TMS
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9/22/2008  3:50 PM
Posted by K22:
Posted by EnySpree:

Basically either Eddy Curry is just a dumb mofo, or he doesn't really love the game of basketball.

All I'll say is he's not dumb.

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Cosmic
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9/22/2008  4:44 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

"Stuck"?

He's a proven 20/10 guy that's 25 years old......he gave us 17/10 on a team that brought him to NY for no apparent reason and tried to make him a bench player? defer to Curry? The dude was still a good player for us.....too bad the Knicks team as a whole sucked.....it wasn't just Zach cuz the Knicks were bad without Zach.

Anyway, **** the media and the rest of the league.....we have offensive genius Mike D'antoni here in NY.....Knicks should be able to function and find a way to win more than lose.

I say we stand behind our players. Zach isn't Marbury. I think the dude, and some of the better guys on the team need to be given a chance. They will be coached this year and the team will have a focus and a game plan. Nobody can say Zach gave up. Zach and Craw....two guys a lot of "fans" bash....both brought it just as much as golden boy David Lee did. Stop living in the past and see the present reality.

Go Knicks!

[Edited by - enyspree on 22-09-2008 12:02 AM]

The only thing Zach is going to prove is he will keep Curry as a fringe NBA talent we will also be stuck with, he will retard the development of Lee and Gallo and also Chandler due to eating up minutes.

He's proven that 20/10 is a useless stat if it does not lead to wins.

Has anyone forgotten what a stupid jackass he is? I mean really, chucking things at teammates? Arguing with the refs while his man is dunking on the other end at least once a game? Crying to the refs on an offensive play leaving us down 4 men to 5 allowing the other team to double our other players and force a turnover?

If you want to repair this team you get rid of Zach Randolph, you re-elevate Curry to that 19/7 allowing you to try to move him next, you develop Chandler, Lee, Gallo and see if they can be a part of the future.

You can't do ANY of this if ZACH RANDOLPH is still here. That guy right now is the biggest wall in the way to us changing for the better.

Stop being in love with 25 y/o and 20/10. What has it proven? It's proven that you can take a bad team and make it even worse, that's what it has proven.
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BigC
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9/22/2008  5:10 PM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by EnySpree:

"Stuck"?

He's a proven 20/10 guy that's 25 years old......he gave us 17/10 on a team that brought him to NY for no apparent reason and tried to make him a bench player? defer to Curry? The dude was still a good player for us.....too bad the Knicks team as a whole sucked.....it wasn't just Zach cuz the Knicks were bad without Zach.

Anyway, **** the media and the rest of the league.....we have offensive genius Mike D'antoni here in NY.....Knicks should be able to function and find a way to win more than lose.

I say we stand behind our players. Zach isn't Marbury. I think the dude, and some of the better guys on the team need to be given a chance. They will be coached this year and the team will have a focus and a game plan. Nobody can say Zach gave up. Zach and Craw....two guys a lot of "fans" bash....both brought it just as much as golden boy David Lee did. Stop living in the past and see the present reality.

Go Knicks!

[Edited by - enyspree on 22-09-2008 12:02 AM]

The only thing Zach is going to prove is he will keep Curry as a fringe NBA talent we will also be stuck with, he will retard the development of Lee and Gallo and also Chandler due to eating up minutes.

He's proven that 20/10 is a useless stat if it does not lead to wins.

Has anyone forgotten what a stupid jackass he is? I mean really, chucking things at teammates? Arguing with the refs while his man is dunking on the other end at least once a game? Crying to the refs on an offensive play leaving us down 4 men to 5 allowing the other team to double our other players and force a turnover?

If you want to repair this team you get rid of Zach Randolph, you re-elevate Curry to that 19/7 allowing you to try to move him next, you develop Chandler, Lee, Gallo and see if they can be a part of the future.

You can't do ANY of this if ZACH RANDOLPH is still here. That guy right now is the biggest wall in the way to us changing for the better.

Stop being in love with 25 y/o and 20/10. What has it proven? It's proven that you can take a bad team and make it even worse, that's what it has proven.

I hear what you are saying Cosmic, but I don't think Zach will cause problems for Chandler or Gallo. I see Q and Jeffries being more of a problem for Chandler because Chandler should be starting at the sf spot. The fact that the Knicks got rid of Balkman is a sign that they have big plans for Chandler. I expect Chandler to get his this year with Zach on the team or not.


As far as Gallo, I don't think the Knicks had big plans for him this year whether Zach is here or not. The fact that Gallo is rookie might be the reason the Knicks want to work him in this year. Plus he might have health issues. The guy that will be affected is Curry. Not really Lee because he is a hustle guy that will get his regardless. Curry is the player that becomes ineffective if he can not score. To be honest it is time for Curry to hustle on the boards so he will get points from put backs not just when someone is passing him the ball. In other words let Curry find other ways to score. If Lee and Zach can score off the offensive boards so can Curry if he starts putting more effort into his game.






[Edited by - BigC on 09-23-2008 02:07 AM]
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CrushAlot
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9/22/2008  10:40 PM
Nothing signifcant has happened to the roster up to this point. No one has been shipped out or bought out to change the culture of the franchise on and off the court. Isiah and STeve Mills are still employed and Isiah's name continues to come up. Gallanari may not have been the guy for the Knicks at 6. D'Antoni, a laid back guy who expects his guys to play and behave like professionals and has short practices may not be the right guy for the knucklehead parade that runs out of the Knicks locker room every night. Walsh may be a compromise between Dolan and Stern that allows Isiah to continue to have a role in the organization. I am sure that Kiki or Jerry West would not allow Isiah to still have any association with the team/organization.
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TMS
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9/22/2008  10:45 PM
Posted by CrushAlot:

I am sure that Kiki or Jerry West would not allow Isiah to still have any association with the team/organization.

as long as Dolan owns this team it probably means Isiah woulda kept some sorta job in this organization regardless who got hired to be our next Team President.
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K22
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9/23/2008  12:17 AM
Posted by CrushAlot:

Walsh may be a compromise between Dolan and Stern that allows Isiah to continue to have a role in the organization. I am sure that Kiki or Jerry West would not allow Isiah to still have any association with the team/organization.

Little Jimmy doesn't want Isiah completely gone b/c it would make him look REALLY stupid for giving him that extension for being an 8th seed for one day.
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GKFv2
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9/23/2008  12:19 AM
Posted by K22:
Posted by CrushAlot:

Walsh may be a compromise between Dolan and Stern that allows Isiah to continue to have a role in the organization. I am sure that Kiki or Jerry West would not allow Isiah to still have any association with the team/organization.

Little Jimmy doesn't want Isiah completely gone b/c it would make him look REALLY stupid for giving him that extension for being an 8th seed for one day.

Still shake my head in amazement at Dolan's incompetence.
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Pharzeone
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9/23/2008  12:42 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by CrushAlot:

I am sure that Kiki or Jerry West would not allow Isiah to still have any association with the team/organization.

as long as Dolan owns this team it probably means Isiah woulda kept some sorta job in this organization regardless who got hired to be our next Team President.

Donnie ain't fooling me on this one. He wanted to keep Zeke in Indy but Bird went over his head. He gave Isiah a glowing recommendation along with Stern to Dolan. One reason why Marbury is out is not so much D'Antoni as it is Isiah giving his "report" on Marbury per Isola. Zeke got the coach he wanted to play the system he most admire. Zeke has Dolan and Donnie's ear.
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Nalod
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9/23/2008  9:46 AM
I think Zach can be moved and can be had for nothing. I don't think Walsh expects much, but he don't want to give away a No. 1 pick.

We can eat his salary and let him sit.

Someone will need him. He needs to go to a contender who needs a post player.

Or

Zach needs to not hold the ball............
crzymdups
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9/23/2008  10:07 AM
i've somewhat changed my mind on ZBO. i actually think we may see D'Antoni start ZBO and DLee side by side and use Curry off the bench. i think that would be the most productive lineup by FAR for the front court. ZBO and Lee would combine for something like 38pts and 25rebs if they both played starters minutes.

D'Antoni is all about getting more shots than the opposition. What's one way to do that? Rebounds. Dlee and ZBO are undersized, but they are two of the best rebounders in the East and they're certainly the best rebounders on our squad.

i think D'Antoni will fall out of love with Curry pretty quickly, if he ever loved him to begin with.

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djsunyc
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9/23/2008  10:19 AM
wouldn't it be funny that all of the sudden the memphis deal is off the table once they saw curry was a tub of lard and gasping for wind in between inhalations of cheese fries?
crzymdups
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9/23/2008  10:41 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

wouldn't it be funny that all of the sudden the memphis deal is off the table once they saw curry was a tub of lard and gasping for wind in between inhalations of cheese fries?

i wouldn't say that was out of the question. really, if given a choice between the two, i think d'antoni would take ZBO over Curry 100 times out of 100.

im not a huge fan of Zach, but i think he was less of a cancer than Marbury last year. ZBO only started freelancing after Marbury and Zeke went officially insane last year. I think D'Antoni will want to hold onto ZBO for at least this year as a transistion guy who will make the year less painful. Maybe next summer after Chandler and Danilo have some more experience they look to move ZBO.

I'd even go so far to say I WANT D'Antoni to start DLee and ZBo at PF and C. Those two were our best tandem there last year and I think it'll be the same story this year.

I also think Danilla Ice's back woes may have factored into Donnie balking on some of the ZBO trades.
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King1
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9/23/2008  10:45 AM
Zach will be useless in this offense. If they truly want to run and pass and cut where do you see Zach fitting in this system?
djsunyc
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9/23/2008  10:47 AM
Posted by King1:

Zach will be useless in this offense. If they truly want to run and pass and cut where do you see Zach fitting in this system?

make zach the point guard and jerome the small forward...
crzymdups
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9/23/2008  10:47 AM
Posted by King1:

Zach will be useless in this offense. If they truly want to run and pass and cut where do you see Zach fitting in this system?

yeah, it's true King. how could the knicks possibly find a way to use a guy who can score 24ppg and grab 10-12rpg? D'Antoni hates guys who score 20+ppg, it's true.

i'm saying they should start LEE AND ZBO, btw. bench Curry until he weighs 260, which means forever.

no one is saying they don't want DLee to start. curry is the problem.
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King1
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9/23/2008  1:23 PM
The best lineup for this offense is Nate, Jamal, Quentin, Jared, and David. If Zach is such a great offensive player why cant we get rid of him and pawn him off on someone else? He is a cancer, selfish, no ball movement, and Portland became a better team without him. The same stuff will happen that happens every year. We will start Curry and Randolph and go about 5-20 and figure out we need a change and by then most everyone has quit or got hurt
Cosmic
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9/23/2008  2:12 PM
Posted by BigC:




I hear what you are saying Cosmic, but I don't think Zach will cause problems for Chandler or Gallo. I see Q and Jeffries being more of a problem for Chandler because Chandler should be starting at the sf spot. The fact that the Knicks got rid of Balkman is a sign that they have big plans for Chandler. I expect Chandler to get his this year with Zach on the team or not.


As far as Gallo, I don't think the Knicks had big plans for him this year whether Zach is here or not. The fact that Gallo is rookie might be the reason the Knicks want to work him in this year. Plus he might have health issues. The guy that will be affected is Curry. Not really Lee because he is a hustle guy that will get his regardless. Curry is the player that becomes ineffective if he can not score. To be honest it is time for Curry to hustle on the boards so he will get points from put backs not just when someone is passing him the ball. In other words let Curry find other ways to score. If Lee and Zach can score off the offensive boards so can Curry if he starts putting more effort into his game.

In regards to Chandler and Gallo I was thinking along the lines of how DAntoni likes to run SFs at PF for some time. Given that Zach will chew up approximately 35 minutes there I think that puts a crimp into Chandler and Gallo's minutes.

You also have to consider that when Zach is on the court with those guys at SF their chances to shine are greatly limited due to Zach's desire to control the ball.

It's just a bad mix and I think moving Zach solves a lot of issues and opens the way for guys like Lee to get his game back together and for Chandler and Gallo to show us what they got.


To me Zach truly is the biggest road block we have to hurdle in order to build for the future.

What some don't understand in the "Well, we're not going to do anything this year anyway, so no need to rush Zach out the door." is that while that might be true you're not figuring in what growth guys like Lee, Chandler, and Gallo could go through during a season such as this one. So it's now a two-fold problem.

Move Zach, Part ways with Marbury, and you instantly allow the other players to shine, and for ones that won't to at least build their value back up to what it should be (ie: Curry, Jeffries).

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