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Zach for Marko and Darko?
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Paladin55
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8/27/2008  4:18 PM
I liked the trade when it was suggested a short time ago, and assuming that Milicic, who did with the Serbian team what Gallinari did with the Italians- sat out their qualifying tournament, is not really injured, I would still make this trade.

The biggest reason why people are always down on Darko is not his fault- it has to do with the fact teams rated him so highly, and Detroit was dumb enough to take him over Anthony and Wade.

Knicks fans should suspend their reason, close their eyes, and make believe that Darko was drafted as the 2nd pick of the 2nd round, not # 2 in the entire draft. You might be more accepting of him and the back-up quality numbers he has only been able to put up so far.

We really need a shot blocker, and Milicic can be a 20+MPG rotational player who can block shots for us and run the floor. I don't expect offense from him, but hope that D'Antoni can get something more than other teams got from him. 8-10 PPG, 6-8 RPG, and 2 BPG would be within his reach as a player based on what he has done in the last few years, and these would be pretty good reserve player #'s. He is also young still, and if he is not worth resigning in 2 years, you can let him run back to Serbia.

Don't like Jaric's contract length, but even though he is not a star or even a starter, the guy is not a stiff, and he has put up decent assist and steals numbers for a reserve swingman. (And with him comes his woman)

I would do it, and if you could get anything else from them, that would just be icing on the cake.
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sebstar
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8/27/2008  4:29 PM
We should hold out for Critterton, or however you spell his damn name, at least. No give-a-ways. Believe it or not there is a market for a 20-10 power forward in his prime. Head case? Yes. But GM's love reclamation projects and this is definitely a chance to buy low.

We need not buckle to the anti-Zach hype. Donnie is doing his due diligence and showing patience.
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King1
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8/27/2008  5:39 PM
I would trade Zach for a reach around, a naked picture of Bitty, and a picture of DJ in a thong driving a ricksha. We have to get rid of this guy by any means necessary.
sebstar
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8/27/2008  5:43 PM
Posted by King1:

I would trade Zach for a reach around, a naked picture of Bitty, and a picture of DJ in a thong driving a ricksha. We have to get rid of this guy by any means necessary.

See I think this thinking is flawed. You have to maximize not only your assets, but your perceived liabilities.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
TheGame
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8/27/2008  7:42 PM
Posted by sebstar:

We should hold out for Critterton, or however you spell his damn name, at least. No give-a-ways. Believe it or not there is a market for a 20-10 power forward in his prime. Head case? Yes. But GM's love reclamation projects and this is definitely a chance to buy low.

We need not buckle to the anti-Zach hype. Donnie is doing his due diligence and showing patience.


I definitely like Critteton. He can play the 1 or 2 and has solid skills. If we can get him, I would ship out Zach and play Lee and DG at PF.
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EnySpree
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8/27/2008  8:17 PM
Rotation wise, getting darko is better than having Zach.

David lee, darko, gallo.....kind of the best of all worlds with them as a group. We got a rebounder hustle guy, a shot blocker, and a finesse guy. I think the Knicks get better as a team.

The more I think of it too.......those Memphis point guards are not better than Nate. Knicks need a dynamic passer. Those guys are all shoot first guards. I mean ok if one can come over cool....but not sure if any of them are better than Nate.

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Markji
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8/28/2008  10:14 AM
Here is an interesting review Of Darko - the bad and the good. He is a gamble to trade for....but he is young and a new coach may help. However, they say that he is more suited for a slowed-down game and we will now have a fast moving transition game.

http://3shadesofblue.blogspot.com/2008/05/season-in-review-darko-milicic.html


[Edited by - markji on 08-28-2008 12:32 PM]
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Cartman718
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8/28/2008  10:44 AM
Posted by Markji:

Here is an interesting review Of Darko - the bad and the good. He is a gamble to trade for....but he is young and a new coach may help. However, they say that he is more suited for a slowed-down game and we will now have a fast moving transition game.

http://3shadesofblue.blogspot.com/2008/05/season-in-review-darko-milicic.html

and you are saying that zach can run better?
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Markji
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8/28/2008  1:36 PM
Posted by Cartman718:
Posted by Markji:

Here is an interesting review Of Darko - the bad and the good. He is a gamble to trade for....but he is young and a new coach may help. However, they say that he is more suited for a slowed-down game and we will now have a fast moving transition game.

[url][/http://3shadesofblue.blogspot.com/2008/05/season-in-review-darko-milicic.htmlurl]

and you are saying that zach can run better?
Zach can......Eddy can't.
Darko was also injured a lot last year ankle, thumb.... so hopefully he has fully recovered from that.
Darko Milicic finally got his shot at starting in the NBA. It wasn't pretty. Sure Darko had moments of brilliance but he sandwiched those around nights of complete ineptitude. Injuries played a huge roll in Darko's inconsistency but it doesn't explain everything. Darko shot 43.8% from the field, 55.4% from the line and grabbed only 6.1 rebounds per game. When you are talking about a 7-0, 275 pound center those are not good numbers.

......Then came the Hornets game and Darko injured his thumb. It was a bad sprain and even Marc Iavaroni said that his was the type of injury that could affect him all season. How prophetic that comment seems now.

Darko rushed his return and in the 2nd game back he landed on the side of Joel Prybilla's foot spraining his ankle and sending him back to the infirmary. Again darko rushed himself
I am for trading zach for him - depends what else is thrown in. We had a whole thread on this 2 weeks ago.



[Edited by - markji on 08-28-2008 12:44 PM]
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Paladin55
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8/28/2008  2:27 PM
Posted by Markji:

Here is an interesting review Of Darko - the bad and the good. He is a gamble to trade for....but he is young and a new coach may help. However, they say that he is more suited for a slowed-down game and we will now have a fast moving transition game.

http://3shadesofblue.blogspot.com/2008/05/season-in-review-darko-milicic.html


[Edited by - markji on 08-28-2008 12:32 PM]

I have supported this trade since it first surfaced as a rumor, but I am scared when I read that Darko may react to outside pressures. This is NYC, man- a lot of guys, in various sports, with good reps, have come here and not been able to perform up to their past standards. How will Darko deal with the NY BB fan?

The good thing is that he would be starting out with all our players in terms of understanding D'Antoni's system, and he will also be playing on a Knicks team that is really not a serious contender, so he can make mistakes and learn from them.

We could really use a shot blocker, though. Playing with injuries just shows me that he wanted to get back to playing- I see that as a good thing. If we could get 9-12 PPG, 7 RPG, and 2 BPG, and 20-25 MPG, he would be a valuable addition to this team.

D'Antoni, not Walsh, should have the final say on this guy, and if he thinks he can play in his system we should make the trade.


Found this when doing a google search for Milicic and D'Antoni

http://74.125.95.104/search?q=cache:ZyF9fk6mv3sJ:www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f7/chad-ford-on-darko-milicic-68411.html+Mike+D%27antoni+milicic&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us

Go past the article and start from the post by "Arizona's Finest" and read down. Seems that the Suns did make a bid for him when Amare was injured in 2006, but if you go by what is here, they did not offer much for him- possibly 2 guys with soon to expire contracts.

Also check out the "elindholm" comment about Jared Jeffries a few posts up!

Maybe the Suns and D'Antoni were trying to pick him up when he was at his lowest value as a player? Would this indicate that D'Antoni may have thought that he could be the one to bring out the best in Milicic??


Add to all of this the fact that the Grizzlies have just signed that big Iranian center.

http://www.insidehoops.com/blog/?p=1642

I think this means that the Darko trade should be happening within the next week or two, subject to an agreement on what other contract the Knicks should take from Memphis.

[Edited by - Paladin55 on 08-28-2008 8:36 PM]
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Markji
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8/29/2008  8:44 AM
Memphis now has 3 European/Iranian 7 foot centers. It's obvious one will go.....probably Darko. So this trade looks like it has possibilities. Who do we get in return for Zach? Darko + a young guard I hope - Maybe Lowry?
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
oohah
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8/29/2008  8:56 AM
Posted by Markji:

Memphis now has 3 European/Iranian 7 foot centers. It's obvious one will go.....probably Darko. So this trade looks like it has possibilities. Who do we get in return for Zach? Darko + a young guard I hope - Maybe Lowry?

I'd rather move Curry. Darko next to Zach is much better and makes more sense than Darko next to Curry.

oohah


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8/29/2008  8:57 AM
Posted by TMS:
Zach for Marko and Darko?

i'd trade Zach for Chico, Harpo, Groucho, Gummo or Zeppo


Is that guy with the hat Larry Brown?
Markji
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8/29/2008  9:02 AM
Posted by oohah:
Posted by Markji:

Memphis now has 3 European/Iranian 7 foot centers. It's obvious one will go.....probably Darko. So this trade looks like it has possibilities. Who do we get in return for Zach? Darko + a young guard I hope - Maybe Lowry?

I'd rather move Curry. Darko next to Zach is much better and makes more sense than Darko next to Curry.

oohah
Trading Curry and having Zach and Darko play for us only makes more sense for us but that would give Memphis four 7 foot centers. Not gonna happen. They need a PF in exchange for a center.

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purple012870
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8/29/2008  11:16 AM
Well....the Antoine Walker substitution for Marco Jaric is not a good one from a Knick persepctive, this is from real GM:


This morning's top NBA story, in case you missed it, was a trade rumor that the New York Knicks and Memphis Grizzlies could be close to a deal that would send Antoine Walker and Darko Milicic to the Knicks for the often-rumored Zach Randolph. No doubt Knicks fans are scratching their heads . . .and maybe Grizzlies fans, too.

First of all, Randolph isn't as bad as I've heard people saying. He's an incredibly charismatic guy, even crazy funny at times, but he's really a big kid. He goes with the flow and is very easily influenced. It all comes down to who you want influencing him. In New York he doesn't have much to choose from, but in Memphis he would have some outstanding guidance from the likes of Mike Conley, Rudy Gay, and now OJ Mayo - all of them outstanding citizens as well as being gifted basketball players. Marc Iavaroni, too, is a strong personality who could guide Zach in the right direction. The Grizzlies' run-and-gun style of play would most certainly benefit Randolph, who is a great rebounder and scorer but struggles to commit to the defensive end. In this case a great offense could turn out to be his best defense.

On the Knicks side of the ledger, this would be all about taking $17 million off of their payroll in time for the 2010 NBA free agency period. Milicic's deal ends that summer and Walker's contract has a player option that could take him off the books even a year earlier should he choose to exercise it. Ultimately, the move would be made in order to set up a courtship of the Cleveland Cavaliers' LeBron James.

When you consider that the Grizzlies need another legit seven-footer to play alongside Marc Gasol and the Knicks are all about cap space in 2010, all of a sudden this move makes a lot of sense. As Steve Kyler reported this morning, a source close to the Grizzlies situation is admitting they're considering it, so stay tuned for more on this possible trade.

EnySpree
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8/29/2008  12:04 PM
As I explain in our many debates here.....Antoine Walker fits here. Leadership and skill. Dude can start the break and run the point @ the 4 spot. That's an exciting option he brings to the team. I think he could have a bounce back year within the mix of the Knicks young talent. He's not gonna stop the ball the way Zach did. I he could seriously help guys like Wilson and Gallo get better. Teaching moves and helping to get these guys understand what's going on out there cuz he's done it at a high level playing the 4/3.

I'm salivating.....
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Paladin55
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8/29/2008  12:50 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

As I explain in our many debates here.....Antoine Walker fits here. Leadership and skill. Dude can start the break and run the point @ the 4 spot. That's an exciting option he brings to the team. I think he could have a bounce back year within the mix of the Knicks young talent. He's not gonna stop the ball the way Zach did. I he could seriously help guys like Wilson and Gallo get better. Teaching moves and helping to get these guys understand what's going on out there cuz he's done it at a high level playing the 4/3.

I'm salivating.....
I think that Memphis would probably want to rid itself of Jaric's contract, and that is who they are pushing. If the Knicks want Walker, I think it would be because his contract gives the Knicks more flexibility- I think it is a two year contract with a team option for the second year. (Am I right on this?)

I think that if the Knicks were not "rebuilding" once again, Walker might be a guy they could use, but on this team, he will be taking away time from guys like Gallinari, Chandler, and Lee.

If the Knicks do get him I am not sure what role he will play on this team, but they won't pick up the option on his contract when it comes up.



No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
Markji
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8/29/2008  3:01 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by EnySpree:

As I explain in our many debates here.....Antoine Walker fits here. Leadership and skill. Dude can start the break and run the point @ the 4 spot. That's an exciting option he brings to the team. I think he could have a bounce back year within the mix of the Knicks young talent. He's not gonna stop the ball the way Zach did. I he could seriously help guys like Wilson and Gallo get better. Teaching moves and helping to get these guys understand what's going on out there cuz he's done it at a high level playing the 4/3.

I'm salivating.....
I think that Memphis would probably want to rid itself of Jaric's contract, and that is who they are pushing. If the Knicks want Walker, I think it would be because his contract gives the Knicks more flexibility- I think it is a two year contract with a team option for the second year. (Am I right on this?)

I think that if the Knicks were not "rebuilding" once again, Walker might be a guy they could use, but on this team, he will be taking away time from guys like Gallinari, Chandler, and Lee.

If the Knicks do get him I am not sure what role he will play on this team, but they won't pick up the option on his contract when it comes up.
Antoine Walker has a team option for 2009/10 for $10 million and then a $10.8 million for 2010/11. I am sure the Knicks will reject this so it is having Walker for 1 year and Darko for 2 years +. This is similar to our trade with Portland for Zach - Steve Francis who Portland bought out had 2 yrs at about $13 millioneach ?? and Channing Frye. So I think we have improved overall with this. It would also be nice to get a 2nd round pick thrown in by Memphis.
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purple012870
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8/29/2008  3:14 PM
Does 'Toine have anything left as a pro basketball player (namely a desire to play well, be in shape)? I am afraid that him & QBrick & Curry would attack the buffet table the way Lee hits the boards.
Markji
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8/29/2008  4:59 PM
Posted by purple012870:

Does 'Toine have anything left as a pro basketball player (namely a desire to play well, be in shape)? I am afraid that him & QBrick & Curry would attack the buffet table the way Lee hits the boards.
Antoine is really a throw in so Memphis gets his salary off of the books. The player we are getting is Darko who is 22 yrs old. And we are getting 3 years of Zach's $16 million salary off of our books. I dont mind this trade if Darko can get is game together. He is very intense and could motivate others. Antoine also could if he is wanting to play.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
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