Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by djsunyc:

he could even move zach in the summer of 2010 like denver did with camby if the opportunity presents itself. but in the meantime, hope d'antoni is a miracle worker to get zach + curry to work this season.

That's fine. I don't want Zach here at all, but I also realize that he can be here UNTIL 2010. As Zach's contract becomes shorter, his value won't go down.

as long as zach + eddy are on the same team, someone's value (if not both) will take a hit. this isn't a bosh + o'neal situation where they can always fall back on defense or where o'neal is at a place in his career where he can call up chris bosh and say "this is your team." this is about two guys that want the ball.

Posted by djsunyc:

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by djsunyc:

he could even move zach in the summer of 2010 like denver did with camby if the opportunity presents itself. but in the meantime, hope d'antoni is a miracle worker to get zach + curry to work this season.

That's fine. I don't want Zach here at all, but I also realize that he can be here UNTIL 2010. As Zach's contract becomes shorter, his value won't go down.

as long as zach + eddy are on the same team, someone's value (if not both) will take a hit. this isn't a bosh + o'neal situation where they can always fall back on defense or where o'neal is at a place in his career where he can call up chris bosh and say "this is your team." this is about two guys that want the ball.

I think it's pretty safe to say that Eddy is the one that will suffer, since he doesn't have the balls to standup to Zach.

zach puts up the emptiest, most selfish, least productive (towards winning) 20 & 10 I've ever seen

Posted by purple012870:

zach puts up the emptiest, most selfish, least productive (towards winning) 20 & 10 I've ever seen

wait till next year when he's playing center and we are winning games. Clearly you were not looking close enough!

Fish...clearly I am not looking close enough? Zach is a career loser. That doesn't just mean he's had the misfortune of being on a losing team. That means he plays a pivotal role in his teams losing. He is the PF version of Marbury. Dumb. Selfish. Immature. Won't defend.

Zach for KMart

With Curry coming back from Knee surgery there is going to be 95% chance that Curry will not be very good or he will be in and out of the lineup. You might want to keep Zach around for a couple of years and trade him away. I personally think that Zach will thrive in the D'Antoni system.

Posted by Bonn1997:

Wasn't it just arthroscopic surgery?

Yeah it was. Look for Curry to make it into something more than just arthroscopic surgery. You have to remember he is carrying what 300-330 lbs on those knees. I doubt he plays in 60 games next year. Forget 60 games if he comes to camp like fat bastard. Sometimes I think he might eat Nate. Babies I like Babies.

let's see who we could possibly trade Zach to:

CHI? they have Larry Hughes contract that runs a year less & but adding another contract to their books in 2010 hampers their ability somewhat to target a max FA

DET for Sheed & Maxiell? i doubt it.

IND for T Murph & Jarret Jack w/Mardy thrown in as filler? i'd make that trade but i doubt Larry Bird is interested in taking on another headcase at this point.

CHA for Ray Felton, Nazr & May? we'd have to throw D Lee into that one probably but again, it severely hampers their cap flexibility longterm

WAS for Etan & Antonio Daniels? they're in great shape capwise in 2010 even if they take on Zach's contract so there's a possibility... Etan's got some heart issues so they might be a willing trade partner here... maybe we can milk a pick outta the deal if they're desperate enough.

MEM for Antoine Walker & Marko Jaric w/Mardy thrown in as filler to match up the dollars? Walker's team option after this season would mean good cap relief for us.

SEA for Collison, Watson & a future pick? SEA's in great shape capwise so there's a possibility.

GS for Stephen Jackson, Brandon Wright & Marco Bellinelli w/Nate thrown in as filler? Jax is another headcase but at least he's got a more manageable contract... but GS needs to re-sign Biedrins so i doubt they'd handicap themselves by taking on another big contract right now.

SAC for Brad Miller & Spencer Hawes? Miller's drug suspension probably makes him someone they might wanna unload & he'd provide a little shotblocking & frontcourt passing for us, but he's not all that great a fit for a run & gun style either... still his contract does come off the books a year sooner than Zach... i just put Hawes in there cuz Eny brought up his name earlier today... not sure how much they value the kid.

DEN for KMart & LA's 2nd round pick... no cap benefit there, but u may get something useful outta the 2nd rounder & KMart does at least fit a run & gun style better than Zach... or try & work a trade for Nene & filler if they would throw in a future 1st round pick, but that only nets us very minimal cap benefits in 2010 & adds another salary for 2011, which doesn't make much sense to begin with.

teams like MIL & PHI are already pretty much ruled out at this point after their management denied any supposed interest in Zach already.

do u guys think there are any other realistic trade partners for us at this point other than those? i mean really think about what teams would wanna take on that contract & who are in real need of a low post scorer at this point.

[Edited by - TMS on 07-17-2008 04:35 AM]

Walsh does right by being patient
Ken Berger
July 17, 2008

If you heard what the Clippers gave up for Marcus Camby, you were thinking the same thing I was: Why couldn't Donnie Walsh get the same, or better, for Zach Randolph?

Well, he couldn't get better and wasn't willing to take nothing, which is essentially what the Clippers dealt to the Nuggets for an All-Star caliber defender and athletic rebounder. So the Knicks remain where they are, trudging dutifully on the long, lonely road back to financial sanity and - dare we say - competitiveness.

There's a lot of road kill along the way, the decaying carcasses of GMs Gone Wild. The fact that Stephon Marbury and Randolph are still Knicks tells me that Walsh is doing this the right way, even if it's going to be a slow, sputtering often frustrating process.

Such is life when you have Jerome James, who'd be a longshot to pass the physical to work at the Food Network, occupying $6.2 million of cap space and hoarding all the snacks.

Walsh talked with the Clippers about Randolph but wasn't willing to take last night's leftovers in return. The Nuggets have talent on their roster, which means a straight salary dump is potentially more valuable to them than it is for the Knicks.

When it comes to unloading an obscene NBA contract, beggars must be choosers.

Denver GM Mark Warkentien could afford to unload Camby and his $17.65 million remaining over two years and take back a conditional swap of second-round picks and a $10- million trade exception. It gives him flexibility to do more deals, and it makes his boss do jumping jacks because the savings doubles with the dollar-for-dollar luxury tax.

Walsh could've relented and taken back the salary-dump, bargain-basement value for Randolph. He could've made a serious play for Camby, too. Neither would've been the right move for the future.

If Walsh can't get an unconditional draft pick and/or young asset for Randolph now, then he should do exactly what he's doing. Wait it out. The buyers will come to him.

There's no urgency to trade Randolph this summer, because Mike D'Antoni is convinced he can be productive in his offensive system. Yes, Randolph is bad defensively, but he can't be as bad as some of the players D'Antoni averaged 58 wins a year with the past four seasons in Phoenix.

Either way, Randolph knows he's not long for the Knicks. So he should proceed as though this is a contract year for him. Put up his usual 20-10, play with the ferocity that showed up only in brief flashes last season, and raise his value. It helps him, and it helps Walsh's long-range strategy immeasurably.

Walsh was dealt mostly a bogus hand when he came to New York, but Randolph is one of the few good cards he's holding. Keeping it tucked away a little longer doesn't hurt anything, and it almost certainly will result in getting more for him down the road than he can get now.

Walsh was brought here to get maximum value and better players for the unwanted players he inherited. He wasn't hired to do it in eight weeks. D'Antoni was hired to get maximum production from whatever players he's ultimately given. There's no hurry for either guy.

Walsh is honorable enough to know that this is not about getting another notch on his belt before he retires. D'Antoni looks as if he could be happy coaching the Knicks for a long time. If you look at how many games he won his first year in Phoenix - it's ugly, it's the same number Wilson Chandler wears, and it's the legal drinking age in most states - then you have to believe he knows how to endure some short-term pain for long-term gain.

There's been nothing but a series of short-term fixes with this team for so long that all we have to look back on is a long trail of failure. Such is life on the road back - lonely, and not very satisfying in the beginning. You know what they say about payback

Posted by misterearl:

Walsh does right by being patient
Ken Berger
July 17, 2008

If you heard what the Clippers gave up for Marcus Camby, you were thinking the same thing I was: Why couldn't Donnie Walsh get the same, or better, for Zach Randolph?

Well, he couldn't get better and wasn't willing to take nothing, which is essentially what the Clippers dealt to the Nuggets for an All-Star caliber defender and athletic rebounder. So the Knicks remain where they are, trudging dutifully on the long, lonely road back to financial sanity and - dare we say - competitiveness.

There's a lot of road kill along the way, the decaying carcasses of GMs Gone Wild. The fact that Stephon Marbury and Randolph are still Knicks tells me that Walsh is doing this the right way, even if it's going to be a slow, sputtering often frustrating process.

Such is life when you have Jerome James, who'd be a longshot to pass the physical to work at the Food Network, occupying $6.2 million of cap space and hoarding all the snacks.

Walsh talked with the Clippers about Randolph but wasn't willing to take last night's leftovers in return. The Nuggets have talent on their roster, which means a straight salary dump is potentially more valuable to them than it is for the Knicks.

When it comes to unloading an obscene NBA contract, beggars must be choosers.

Denver GM Mark Warkentien could afford to unload Camby and his $17.65 million remaining over two years and take back a conditional swap of second-round picks and a $10- million trade exception. It gives him flexibility to do more deals, and it makes his boss do jumping jacks because the savings doubles with the dollar-for-dollar luxury tax.

Walsh could've relented and taken back the salary-dump, bargain-basement value for Randolph. He could've made a serious play for Camby, too. Neither would've been the right move for the future.

If Walsh can't get an unconditional draft pick and/or young asset for Randolph now, then he should do exactly what he's doing. Wait it out. The buyers will come to him.

There's no urgency to trade Randolph this summer, because Mike D'Antoni is convinced he can be productive in his offensive system. Yes, Randolph is bad defensively, but he can't be as bad as some of the players D'Antoni averaged 58 wins a year with the past four seasons in Phoenix.

Either way, Randolph knows he's not long for the Knicks. So he should proceed as though this is a contract year for him. Put up his usual 20-10, play with the ferocity that showed up only in brief flashes last season, and raise his value. It helps him, and it helps Walsh's long-range strategy immeasurably.

Walsh was dealt mostly a bogus hand when he came to New York, but Randolph is one of the few good cards he's holding. Keeping it tucked away a little longer doesn't hurt anything, and it almost certainly will result in getting more for him down the road than he can get now.

Walsh was brought here to get maximum value and better players for the unwanted players he inherited. He wasn't hired to do it in eight weeks. D'Antoni was hired to get maximum production from whatever players he's ultimately given. There's no hurry for either guy.

Walsh is honorable enough to know that this is not about getting another notch on his belt before he retires. D'Antoni looks as if he could be happy coaching the Knicks for a long time. If you look at how many games he won his first year in Phoenix - it's ugly, it's the same number Wilson Chandler wears, and it's the legal drinking age in most states - then you have to believe he knows how to endure some short-term pain for long-term gain.

There's been nothing but a series of short-term fixes with this team for so long that all we have to look back on is a long trail of failure. Such is life on the road back - lonely, and not very satisfying in the beginning. You know what they say about payback

We traded him for a back up 4 and Steve Francis[some cap space] after he 23-10. His value likely the same [which was offered cap space and a second rounder] If no one broke the bank for Randolph lat year and he showed to be a terrible team player--who is going to ante up? This was a strange scenario and it may cost us David Lee. How can they sell the same team to the fans?