The last time the Knicks traded away their heart and soul (Starks and Oakley), they went to the finals. I hated that Oakley was traded and at the time thought that acquiring a guy with Spree's past was a big mistake. However, it is a different, much more conservative guy making the moves this time. I actually am less upset than when Oak and Starks left, but I think it is because that team had such a long run and played so hard.

I notice that nobody has responded with any logic. It has been all emotional. "Spree made us watch the Knicks...The Knicks are now soft and white..." The fact is the Knicks will have a better record than they did last year, something that would not have happened by keeping Spree at small forward. The love affair with Spree is simply based on emotion. His play over the last couple of years clearly indicated that it was time to move on.

Knicks were 1-7 without Spree & 37-37 (500.) with Spree I guess his 16pts did more than u think.

Van Horn doesn't make us any more of a championship team. 12pts in the playoffs compared to 19.7pts by Spree. And doesn't get us any closer to flexibility with his extra 15.7mil. So even if Van Horn works out what have we won????

I think that guys are just supporting the fact that Sprewell is gone rather than the fact that Van Horn is coming in.

I've been watchin the boards for the past few months, but just joined. I'm a newbie to the forums, but a Knick for 30 years. I'm always amazed at these times, the window of opportunity closing on the Knicks and fans desperately wanting to hold it open. The Knicks have been brewing this trouble for years. Extravagant contracts, suspect drafts/trades, all had to come to a head at some point. And we ain't exactly got there yet. We've moved some probs for other probs. Deal with it. Even in the depleted East, we in trouble. I've seen some projected "dream lineups" that weren't all that bad--I don't have a clue as to how this is going to actually work well. We gotta give them a shot. Whether we like it or not. When have they EVER listened to us??? Let's hope Chaney has some magic from SOMEwhere! We ALL need him to. We can stand a bad team (to a point), but at least be TRYIN to compete!!! That is just my How yall doin rant. With the changes of the past week, limbo is where we live. And about the most overrated Knick of all time...Can anybody remember Trent Tucker?

Posted by ICEMAN:

lemme step back then, the talent has gone from the bad teams to mos of the Good teams. and most of those good teams play out west.
Miller,spree,payton ,malone,Cassell,kandi,mourning , and probably more were on mediocre to good teams and they all left for greener pastures,

one more illustration, the three best teams in the east got better, nets,philly,detroit, but with the exception of cleveland and maybe orlando did any team in the east improve?? it seems they regressed a bit to me,

As of now it may seemed so but the season hasn't started yet. Teams are still looking to improve especially the Knicks. I would think we're going to see a few more deals out east before the start of training camp. Let's say McDyess does come back avg 17 to 19pts and 9 to 10 reb per game, would you include the knicks as one of the teams in the eastern conference that got better????

No doubt, Ice... No Doubt.

We need a top 5 type guy for sure. I think that can only happen soon if

A. we suck really bad and get a top 3 pick
B. we clear up cap space and make a run for a FA (which is very difficult with H20, Shandon & Eisley on the payroll)

So of course everybody knows that, so the question is, will Chaney tank a season? Will Scott trade away H20 & Shandon for expiring junk, in order to get more flexibility? Will Dolan wake up and say: "Screw the luxury tax! I'm gettin' KG anyway, and we'll just deal with the 140 mil payroll!"

Even though I'm an optimist, I personally think that none of these three things will happen. I'm more of a long-range optimist. Even when you burn a forest down, it does eventually grow back (despite our stupidity)...

I think the knicks are going to try to overachieve this season. They have no other choice. The must build up that intangible 'streed cred' within the league. Everyone expects them to fail. If Chaney's smart, he'll pull the old Riley/JVG psychological play and get the team to buy into 'US VS. THE WORLD', and play over their weaknesses. Of course this will mean stingy defense, if they can do it (I know, Spree's gone, I know...)

If they can get some respect within the league, I think it will help them go after some FA's in the next two seasons. They're not gonna tank. Dolan will not tank. So they have to stay as competitive as they can until H20 comes off...Then a LeBron or Iverson or whoever could be lured to what he believes to be a contender-in-waiting...

I think right now it's gonna be all about saving the rep, and overachieving.

And thanks for the shout out - Cause I bleed serious Orange & Blue. I cried in 94, man. Like a little girl.


Peace-

Playa your a Spree hater there for your opinion will not be respected. If u didn't just flat out hate Sprewell and just bring up every negative u could possible find and ignore any positive then maybe people would listen your opinions more. Though im sure u don't care im just saying. This is a board to express your opinions and be herd. But your mind is so clouded with hate that I can't here what your saying.

When u write all I read is i hate spree i hate spree i hate spree.

As the old saying goes, figures don't lie,liars figure. There are two many people in love with Spree for no real reason. He was not the Knicks best player last year. If you look at the statistics of those he guarded you will see that many of them had career games against him. Tracy McGrady did, Kobe did, Paul Piece did as well. He shut nobody down and did not come close to containing anyone. Those are the FACTS as opposed to the perception that fans have of Spree being a defensive stopper. Who did he stop last season? Produce some facts if you can to support his defensive image.

As far as this often used statistic that that they were 1 and 7 without him and 36 and 38 with him, that was at the start f the season. The Knicks were in the middle of trying to adjust to the loss of McDyess after working all training camp with an offensive scheme designed to feed off of McDyess. It just so happened that Spree was out during that adjustment period which admittedly made matters worse. When the Knicks finally adjusted, Spree returned, giving them one more weapon on the floor, thus leading to a few more wins. Looking at his several 3 for 15 games it should be clear that he was not the main reason for their wins. As I said at the start, figures don't lie,liars figure.

Calipari quote on Keith:


"He's a great teammate, he's not a killer," Calipari told The Post. "He's not going to take another guy's heart and throw it on the floor. If you expect him to be that way, you're going to be disappointed. But if his guy gets 30, he'll get 32 and outscore the son of a gun."

New York, let's just see if the change of systems and scenary are better for both players.