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Will Marbury return?
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4949
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12/14/2007  11:29 PM
Posted by holfresh:


I can't even defend myself anymore with this team...I'm a beaten man...


Sorry you finally caved in. Welcome to 'The Twilight Zone'! Do-Da Do-Da Do-Da..................




[Edited by - 4949 on 12-14-2007 11:30 PM]
I'll never trust this' team again.
AUTOADVERT
BigC
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12/14/2007  11:34 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by BigC:

Most likely he will take a month off. If not, he will not return to the Knicks. I would not be surprised if Isiah is encouraging him to stay home. Not to mention the Knicks are losing and may not win another game until Febuary. Why would he want to come back? Hell, even players on this team don't even want to be here.

[Edited by - BigC on 12-14-2007 10:28 PM]

This team is' bizaar, isn't it? Nothing makes sense. Stephon is away and they get worse?! It makes it look like he wasn't the problem. But no one can nail the problem with this bunch. No one ever pin points what the problem with this team is. It's one of the most baffling things I have ever seen in my life, in sports. There have been worse. But this is just bad. This is definately the fault of Isiah Thomas. There is absolutely no question about that.
Coach Eyebrows lost the team after the Heat's game. Now you have players just waiting until they get traded. From a teams prospective things can't get any worse.


[Edited by - BigC on 12-14-2007 11:36 PM]
BigC's Knick blogs and Knicks highlights after every Knicks game http://fromthebaseline.com/
4949
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12/14/2007  11:36 PM
I keep forgetting about the 'coach eyebrows' thing.
I'll never trust this' team again.
SlimPack
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12/14/2007  11:38 PM
I think this team actually does play better with marbury. without marbury we're a no. 1 pick team. with hime we're a no. 8 pick team. because of that I hope he takes his time coming back.
oohah
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12/14/2007  11:57 PM
I want Marbury back. Anything is better than watching Crawford be the world's most inefficient guard.

Start Marbury and Jones, let Crawford come off the bench. I'm sick of his game.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
holfresh
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12/15/2007  12:40 AM

Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...
djsunyc
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12/15/2007  12:42 AM
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...

i don't think anybody believes this.

putting the ball in crawford's hands does not make for a good team.

but i think to maximize crawford's contributions, he needs to be used like rip. come off of screens and take elbow jumpers.
holfresh
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12/15/2007  12:47 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...

i don't think anybody believes this.

putting the ball in crawford's hands does not make for a good team.

but i think to maximize crawford's contributions, he needs to be used like rip. come off of screens and take elbow jumpers.

man...from your lips to god's ears....I have been begging for that for the last two years...No reason he can't do what Rip does...
BlueSeats
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12/15/2007  12:52 AM
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.
TMS
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12/15/2007  12:52 AM
John Stockton couldn't run this team... they're missing too many pieces... i said Jamal is our best playmaker on offense & i much prefer him running the point than Steph & still do... i can't believe you even think Marbury is the guy to pull this team out of this mess.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
TMS
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12/15/2007  12:53 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

thank you.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
holfresh
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12/15/2007  12:59 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...
BlueSeats
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12/15/2007  1:07 AM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...

i don't think anybody believes this.

putting the ball in crawford's hands does not make for a good team.

but i think to maximize crawford's contributions, he needs to be used like rip. come off of screens and take elbow jumpers.

man...from your lips to god's ears....I have been begging for that for the last two years...No reason he can't do what Rip does...


I'm not so sure about that. First of all, there is a certain offensive structure required in that offense, with lots of screens being set along the box, that is probably too physical and complicated for our bigs to handle. Our offense is run like a dance studio where players need foot prints on the floor to know where to stand. I'm not sure Eddy and Zach are ready to be pirouetting left and right while avoiding each other and still have the presence of mind to receive passes and score. Anyone who thinks I'm selling them short need only watch them attempt to defend the pick and role to know how little it takes to confound them. It also takes a shrewder PG than Marbury to read such a complicated and dynamic offense.

Then there is Jamal himself. He needs to be willing to be in constant motion scraping his way across bodies all night long. Then he needs to catch the ball at unaccustomed angles and quickly square up and shoot a midrange jumper. the brunt of Jamal's scores are leaning back 3's, or some dipsey doo mid-range pull-up or runner. He seems to like to put the ball on the floor before shooting from mid-range. It's very rare that he curls and shoots, so there's little evidence he's comfortable with those movements. He might be, but how do we know?
TMS
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12/15/2007  1:10 AM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...


neither is Marbs & neither is anyone else on this roster... what's the difference? Marbs running the point hasn't gotten this team anywhere... anyone who thinks he's our best bet to right this situation needs to get their heads examined
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nixluva
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12/15/2007  1:10 AM
This team has to find a new direction and obviously an actual leader. Steph coming back would help the team a bit, but in the end it wouldn't be enough to do anything meaningful and he's not the future answer for this team anyway.

I've read some comments about getting rid of all the players and that's a bit strong. Every team has a bunch of role players, that wouldn't win much without the stars. We don't have a PG or leader and without that to start with you can't expect the role players to all of a sudden be more than what they are.

Curry's meltdown has been a huge hit for this team, but even right now, if we had a floor general this team could win some games. Just look at what we're getting at the point right now and it's clear this team's biggest need is a PG. After that you can look at a shotblocker/defender/ rebounder and a SG. I think we have enough role players to make it work after that.

I say let Chan play and leave Q on the bench. Let Morris play and leave malik on the bench. If Curry is going to be this player I have no use for him. The only thing he gave us was post offense and I was happy to accept that, but if he isn't doing that then he's useless and we'd be better off with a Defensive presence. The thing is that I don't believe we can trade Curry. Not with him playing like he is right now. We have to get him playing well again to have any hope of trading him and even then for what? It would be for someone elses problem and maybe a pick.
But to match the salary seems difficult. It's a difficult situation no matter what we do. Once Isiah and DOlan went down this road it had to succeed or face a long process to rebuild, which we know Dolan won't want to do. sigh
BlueSeats
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12/15/2007  1:12 AM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...



He may not b,e and he may never be, but we can be almost certain he wont be with Marbury here clogging the leadership spot like a full roll of toilet paper shoved halfway down the toilet.
TMS
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12/15/2007  1:14 AM
Posted by nixluva:

This team has to find a new direction and obviously an actual leader. Steph coming back would help the team a bit, but in the end it wouldn't be enough to do anything meaningful and he's not the future answer for this team anyway.

I've read some comments about getting rid of all the players and that's a bit strong. Every team has a bunch of role players, that wouldn't win much without the stars. We don't have a PG or leader and without that to start with you can't expect the role players to all of a sudden be more than what they are.

Curry's meltdown has been a huge hit for this team, but even right now, if we had a floor general this team could win some games. Just look at what we're getting at the point right now and it's clear this team's biggest need is a PG. After that you can look at a shotblocker/defender/ rebounder and a SG. I think we have enough role players to make it work after that.

I say let Chan play and leave Q on the bench. Let Morris play and leave malik on the bench. If Curry is going to be this player I have no use for him. The only thing he gave us was post offense and I was happy to accept that, but if he isn't doing that then he's useless and we'd be better off with a Defensive presence. The thing is that I don't believe we can trade Curry. Not with him playing like he is right now. We have to get him playing well again to have any hope of trading him and even then for what? It would be for someone elses problem and maybe a pick.
But to match the salary seems difficult. It's a difficult situation no matter what we do. Once Isiah and DOlan went down this road it had to succeed or face a long process to rebuild, which we know Dolan won't want to do. sigh

i've been trying to tell u we needed frontcourt defense & shotblocking for the longest & u told me the frontcourt wasn't the problem.

[Edited by - TMS on 12-14-2007 10:16 PM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
holfresh
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12/15/2007  1:31 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...



He may not b,e and he may never be, but we can be almost certain he wont be with Marbury here clogging the leadership spot like a full roll of toilet paper shoved halfway down the toilet.

Honestly, I really don't think Marbs has has place here anymore...I think it's over for him here or anywhere else for that matter...but there is a long season ahead, and no changes in the foreseeable future..i just want to see some competitive games...They aren't competitive without him at the moment until someone else steps in...Who is that person?...Mardy isn't ready or just can't fill that roll...Craw isn't ready for that roll...Jones isn't ready for that roll...No one here is ready...
BlueSeats
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12/15/2007  1:46 AM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...



He may not b,e and he may never be, but we can be almost certain he wont be with Marbury here clogging the leadership spot like a full roll of toilet paper shoved halfway down the toilet.

Honestly, I really don't think Marbs has has place here anymore...I think it's over for him here or anywhere else for that matter...but there is a long season ahead, and no changes in the foreseeable future..i just want to see some competitive games...They aren't competitive without him at the moment until someone else steps in...Who is that person?...Mardy isn't ready or just can't fill that roll...Craw isn't ready for that roll...Jones isn't ready for that roll...No one here is ready...

If there is no future here for marbury why would you want his continued distractions? That's what I don't get. Lets work towards the future. lets play the guys we think are keepers, from a basketball and leadership perspective, and eliminate as many unsolvable distractions as possible, and start cultivating a culture that serves the development of our future.

And if that involves a high lottery pick, so be it. At least it will be for the right reasons.

The alternative is to perpetuate all the ills that have plagued us for years simply to give you false comfort for some few games this year, at the expense of a high draft pick that could help us.

You still haven't let go. You're not as broken as you think. You still seem to think "when the dust settles" everything is gonna be okay, and we need Steph is part of the solution to get there. Sorry to put words in your mouth but I can't see any other explanation.
holfresh
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12/15/2007  1:57 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by holfresh:


Amazingly...Isiah won't get fired, so we need Marbs to pull us out this mess...just one thing tho...I can't believe the crew on this board think that Craw could run this team at one point...


He only got some consistent time at the point under LB after Steph shut it down. It could have only amounted to a few weeks. But one noticed an increased effort on D, the ability to get the ball inside to Curry, and a curtailment of his own poor shot selection. So it showed promise. The thought was if he showed improvement over such short time, what might happen if he were groomed at the spot for a year or so. But Isiah never continued the development, so naturally when he's thrown into the role for a game or two at a time it's not a fluid transition.

But I firmly believe that if the price to pay to get Marbury off the team is to have Crawford run the point we'd come out far better going that route than keeping Steph to run the show from the truck.

He did show improvement under LB...I was hoping that was something he could build upon...But two years removed and he is considered a vet at this point, yet shows no improvement in his overall game...He still chucks it and take bad shots...now management have him out front pushing him as team leader...A leader is a guy the team don't want to disappoint on the court...It's the guy who gets pissed at you for not being in the right spot at the right time...the guy that gets pissed because you missed a defensive assignment...a guy that gets pissed because the team is not keeping up with his effort...Craw is not that guy...



He may not b,e and he may never be, but we can be almost certain he wont be with Marbury here clogging the leadership spot like a full roll of toilet paper shoved halfway down the toilet.

Honestly, I really don't think Marbs has has place here anymore...I think it's over for him here or anywhere else for that matter...but there is a long season ahead, and no changes in the foreseeable future..i just want to see some competitive games...They aren't competitive without him at the moment until someone else steps in...Who is that person?...Mardy isn't ready or just can't fill that roll...Craw isn't ready for that roll...Jones isn't ready for that roll...No one here is ready...

If there is no future here for marbury why would you want his continued distractions? That's what I don't get. Lets work towards the future. lets play the guys we think are keepers, from a basketball and leadership perspective, and eliminate as many unsolvable distractions as possible, and start cultivating a culture that serves the development of our future.

And if that involves a high lottery pick, so be it. At least it will be for the right reasons.

The alternative is to perpetuate all the ills that have plagued us for years simply to give you false comfort for some few games this year, at the expense of a high draft pick that could help us.

You still haven't let go. You're not as broken as you think. You still seem to think "when the dust settles" everything is gonna be okay, and we need Steph is part of the solution to get there. Sorry to put words in your mouth but I can't see any other explanation.

Thats not it Blue, Dolan won't allow it to happen...I'm with you..lets build from scratch but Dolan won't let this happen...After Isiah there will be another guy Starphucking, trust me...this won't end...It's about the USD with Dolan...The Knicks stink and the Garden is still packed...The best sports talk show in this town won't talk about the Knicks on their show yet the games are still sold out and people want more Knicks...Dolan don't care...
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