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Mitchell Report set to be made public today at 2 PM
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VDesai
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12/13/2007  3:42 PM
Posted by TMS:

ah, thanks for clearing that up... how did all those other names get leaked then if they're not in the report?

They were from an early leak this morning that was picked up by NBC and Deadspin.com- I dont know who the source was.
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TMS
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12/13/2007  3:43 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Damn Yankee Cheaters. The Mets look down on your franchise

i just saw a little blurb on the ESPN ticker that says Paul LoDuca got roids from the Mets clubhouse attendant... so now i guess it's gonna be "well less Mets cheat than Yankees, so we still look down on your franchise"
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TMS
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12/13/2007  3:45 PM
Posted by VDesai:
Posted by TMS:

ah, thanks for clearing that up... how did all those other names get leaked then if they're not in the report?

They were from an early leak this morning that was picked up by NBC and Deadspin.com- I dont know who the source was.

weird... i wonder who this mystery source is & why it hasn't been mentioned yet on ESPN.
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TMS
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12/13/2007  3:52 PM
There are some baseball people who've questioned Mitchell's credentials from the start, pointing to his affiliation with the Red Sox. As one of the team's directors, Mitchell insists he had no equity stake in the Sox, although he was being paid by the team before the investigation and will resume drawing checks upon its conclusion. There's also clear evidence Mitchell is a Red Sox fan: he was caught by a Newsday reporter this spring at Fenway wearing a Sox jacket and hat, obtaining autographs for his son.

Of course, Mitchell, a former Senator from Maine, had an impeccable reputation in Congress before his retirement. Selig appointed him with the belief that a Mitchell-led investigation would convince lawmakers that baseball is finally operating with transparency on the steroids issue. But executives never completely got over Mitchell's ties to Fenway. As one official said on Wednesday, "For everyone's sake, there [had] better be some Red Sox players on that list."

so u told me Varitek's name wasn't on the list... were there any prominent Red Sox players that were then? this is BS if they think this report isn't tainted by his affiliation w/the Red Sox.
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VDesai
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12/13/2007  3:59 PM
TMS- Gagne, Mo Vaughn, Damon and Clemens were the biggest sox names assoicated with the report.
VDesai
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12/13/2007  4:00 PM
This is the best list of I've seen so far:

Marvin Bernard
Barry Bonds
Bobby Estalella
Jason Giambi
Jeremy Giambi
Benito Santiago
Gary Sheffield
Randy Verlarde
Lenny Dykstrka
David Segui
Larry Bigbie
Brian Roberts
Jack Cust
Tim Laker
Todd Hundley
Hal Morris
Mark Carreon
Matt Franco
Rondell White
Roger Clemens
Andy Pettitte
Chuck Knoblauch
Jason Grimsley
Greg Zaunn
David Justice
F.P. Santangelo
Glenallen Hill
Mo Vaughn
Denny Neagle
Ron Villone
Ryan Franklin
Chris Donnels
Todd Williams
Phil Hiatt
Todd Pratt
Kevin Young
Mike Lansing
Cody McKay
Kent Merker
Adam Piatt
Miguel Tejada
Jason Christansen
Mike Stanton
Stephen Randolph
Jerry Hariston Jr.
Paul Lo Duca
Adam Riggs
Bart Miadich
Fernando Vina
Kevin Brown
Eric Gagne
Mike Bell
Matt Herges
Gary Bennett Jr.
Jim Parque
Brendan Donnelly
Chad Allen
Jeff Williams
Howie Clark
Nook Logan
Rick Ankiel
Paul Byrd
Jay Gibbons
Troy Glaus
Jose Guillen
Gary Matthews, Jr.
Scott Schoeneweis
Jose Canseco
Jason Grimsley
Darren Holmes
John Rocker
Ismael Valdez
Matt Williams
Steve Woodard
David Bell


So add

Marvin Bernard
Barry Bonds
Bobby Estalella
Jason Giambi
Jeremy Giambi
Benito Santiago
Gary Sheffield
Randy Velarde
TMS
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12/13/2007  4:15 PM
here's the officiall list according to the NY Times:

As we review the report, names may be added to this list.

Chad Allen
Manny Alexander
Rick Ankiel
Mike Bell
David Bell
Gary Bennett Jr.
Marvin Bernard
Larry Bigbie
Barry Bonds
Kevin Brown
Paul Byrd
Ken Caminiti
Jose Canseco
Mark Carreon
Jason Christiansen
Howie Clark
Roger Clemens
Jack Cust
Brendan Donnelly
Lenny Dykstra
Bobby Estalella
Matt Franco
Ryan Franklin
Eric Gagne
Jason Giambi
Jeremi Giambi
Jay Gibbons
Troy Glaus
Jason Grimsley
Jose Guillen
Jerry Hairston Jr.
Matt Herges
Phil Hiatt
Glenallen Hill
Darren Holmes
Todd Hundley
David Justice
Chuck Knoblauch
Tim Laker
Mike Lansing
Paul Lo Duca
Nook Logan
Josias Manzanillo
Gary Matthews Jr.
Cody McKay
Kent Mercker
Bart Miadich
Hal Morris
David Naulty
Denny Neagle
Jim Parque
Andy Pettitte
Adam Piatt
Todd Pratt
Stephen Randolph
Adam Riggs
Brian Roberts
John Rocker
F.P. Santangelo
Benito Santiago
Gary Sheffield
Scott Schoeneweis
David Segui
Mike Stanton
Miguel Tejada
Ismael Valdez
Mo Vaughn
Randy Velarde
Ron Villone
Fernando Vina
Rondell White
Todd Williams
Jeff Williams
Matt Williams
Steve Woodard
Kevin Young
Gregg Zaun


there's no doubt that this report isn't even sniffing the tip of the iceberg in terms of names that are really involved... what irks me is hypocrites like Vina on ESPN bashing players like Bonds for using roids when he himself used them as a player... this guy should lose his job for that... what kind of journalistic integrity is that? actually considering the network he works for he's a perfect match i suppose.
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Silverfuel
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12/13/2007  9:19 PM
^ is this the latest?
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
TMS
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12/13/2007  9:56 PM
here's what MSNBC is listing:

List of players, ex-players in Mitchell report

The following players were connected to steroids, either use or possession, in the report:
Chad Allen
Mike Bell
Gary Bennett
Larry Bigbie
Ricky Bones
Kevin Brown
Ken Caminiti
Mark Carreon
Jason Christiansen
Howie Clark
Roger Clemens
Paxton Crawford
Jack Cust
Brendan Donnelly
Chris Donnels
Lenny Dykstra
Matt Franco
Ryan Franklin
Eric Gagne
Jason Grimsley
Jerry Hairston
Phil Hiatt
Matt Herges
Glenallen Hill
Todd Hundley
Ryan Jorgensen
Wally Joyner
Mike Judd
David Justice
Chuck Knoblauch
Tim Laker
Mike Lansing
Paul Lo Duca
Exavier “Nook” Logan
Josias Manzanillo
Cody McKay
Kent Mercker
Bart Miadich
Hal Morris
Daniel Naulty
Denny Neagle
Rafael Palmeiro
Jim Parque
Luis Perez
Andy Pettitte
Adam Piatt
Todd Pratt
Stephen Randolph
Adam Riggs
Brian Roberts
F.P. Santangelo
David Segui
Mike Stanton
Ricky Stone
Miguel Tejada
Derrick Turnbow
Mo Vaughn
Ron Villone
Fernando Vina
Rondell White
Jeff Williams
Todd Williams
Kevin Young
Gregg Zaun

The following players were cited under “Alleged Internet Purchases of Performance Enhancing Substances By Players in Major League Baseball” in the report:
Rick Ankiel
David Bell
Paul Byrd
Jose Canseco
Jay Gibbons
Troy Glaus
Jose Guillen
Darren Holmes
Gary Matthews Jr.
John Rocker
Scott Schoeneweis
Ismael Valdez
Matt Williams
Steve Woodard

The following players were linked through BALCO in the report:
Marvin Benard
Barry Bonds
Bobby Estalella
Jason Giambi
Jeremy Giambi
Benito Santiago
Gary Sheffield
Randy Velarde
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TMS
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12/13/2007  10:10 PM
i really don't like the way this report was handled at all... first of all the information is biased to begin with since the informants who provided the information were former Mets & Yankees employees... the way the news media ran with this story, u'd think this was the be all & end all of lists of players that used roids & HGH, & this probably doesn't even touch the tip of the iceberg.

second, the guy conducting the freakin' investigation to begin with is directly employed by a ML franchise... that casts a shadow of suspicion around the results right there, no matter how much of a straight shooter he has a reputation of being... Andy Pettitte has the same reputation & yet his name was conspicuously implemented in this investigation... no one is beyond suspicion in baseball... why an employee of a ML franchise was ever commissioned to conduct this investigation to begin with is yet another irresponsible decision by Bud Selig IMHO.

third, this is almost entirely heresay BS naming players through testimony obtained under pressure of Gov't prosecution, word of mouth, gossip & "alleged" internet purchases? shouldn't all this heresay evidence have been corroborated extensively before including it in this report to be made public this way? Mitchell is ruining the reputations & messing with the livelihoods of all these players... i would have hoped he had recieved evidence beyond a shadow of a doubt before he released this report to the press.
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4949
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12/14/2007  1:39 AM
20 current and former New York Yankees implicated. A good hand full of Mets also. And virtually no Boston Red Sux? And Mitchell is a Red Sux official? Mitchell knows very, very well that, that doesn't look good at all! Bull ****!!!

On a brighter note, there other on-going investigations that they say will reveal more names, for who knows how long!

I'm seriously thinking of quiting baseball for good. Don't say anything to me about that, because I'm not changing my mind. I'm a fan of the loser Knicks and now my Yankee world is falling apart?! I am truely ashamed to know that a couple of our last few W.S. championships just might be tainted. Selig and all of these players, virtually all of baseball is a disgrace! No more games for me. Fuck'n Pettitte & Clemens. Figures a former Red Sux would come and disgrace us! I'm pissed no Red Sux was put on this list. I don't disbelieve the names on this list, but I do call into question this list, because it looks like it's favoring. Bull**** Mitchell. You didn't look hard enough!!! And FUCK! baseball for first, being so late and second, for not cooperating! And screw the players union to!

When you think of it, this probably explains why Clemens threw the broken bat back at Mike Piazza. And remember the horrible, hateful temper of John Rocker? The guy was a lunatic! Man' oh' man! This sucks and this list is not enough. It has to be much more thourough!
I'll never trust this' team again.
TMS
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12/14/2007  2:31 AM
the reason not many Red Sox players are on the list is because the 2 sources for most of the investigation were the former Met clubhouse attendant & the former Yankee trainer who worked w/Rocket & Andy P... that doesn't mean no Red Sox players used roids or HGH... this is why this report is so flawed... it's not a full sample at all... until a comprehensive list could be obtained listing each team's players who were implicated by various sources & that evidence was corroborrated by MLB, these players' names should not have been made public... it's irresponsible & unfair to everyone involved.
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4949
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12/14/2007  10:21 PM
It's unfair to us fans. Either way, I feel really bad about this whole thing. I think everyone should just come clean and then you can set the whole thing straight. Into prespective and then make judgements. Distinguish yesterdays game vs. today's game. Just come clean and it won't be as bad. I think people would except it, rather than feeling decieved. I certainly do.
I'll never trust this' team again.
TMS
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12/14/2007  11:05 PM
if u took roids in order to get the contract u got & currently enjoying a terrific life doing what you love to do, would u give all that up & garner that public shame & ridicule to clear your conscience for the sake of the game? it does suck for the fans, but cheating in sports has been going on long before this whole steroids trend started... athletes will always seek an edge no matter how u can get it to gain a competitive advantage
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4949
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12/14/2007  11:48 PM
That's very hard for me to imagine. Fortunately, money is one of the least important things to me and not' that I have a lot either, but it just doesn't. Integrity tops money in my book. When I die, I will die a human being and not the guy who had a fame and fortune. That is my philosophy. The very reason why you, me and everyone else comes here to talk baseball. Baseball use to represent integrity (and amongst those who have always tried to cheat). Now it has nothing but excuses and there is no need to excuse this excuse. That will always be my belief and I welcome all to follow that.
I'll never trust this' team again.
TMS
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12/15/2007  12:34 AM
fortunately there are players w/the same integrity that you have 49... don't give up hope on this game... it's still the best game there is IMO, cheaters or no cheaters.
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4949
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12/16/2007  11:40 AM
You been pretty fair to me. I appreciate that. I'll tell you what TMS. If baseball comes clean, so that we can put this whole thing into perspective and give the players of the past, they're true place in the books, then I'd consider following this game again. Baseball gave me a chance, so I suppose I should give baseball a chance in return. I think this should be the general thought with the public to ask baseball to come clean. I can't deal with all of the lying anymore.
I'll never trust this' team again.
TMS
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12/16/2007  11:45 PM
i happen to think there isn't a sport out there outside of Nascar & Golf that doesn't have athletes involved in performance enhancing drugs... i bet if u conducted an indept investigation into Tennis, Hoops, Soccer & Ultimate fighting among others that you'd find a significant amount of cheaters in their respective games.

& i agree w/u on giving the players of old their just due... why a guy like Goose Gossage can't get into the HOF is beyond me... he literally redefined the closer role & was as dominant a reliever as there was in the game for a good amount of years... i personally don't get how baseball can make the distinction between an admitted cheater like Gaylord Perry who got into the HOF by way of his patented vaseline spitballs & a guy like Roger Clemens to be honest... cheating is cheating, whether it involves roids or doctoring the ball to gain a competitive edge.
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