[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Fred Jones is a keeper? Dickau pack your bags!
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 2 of 3 ‹ Previous 1  2  3 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
8/22/2007  9:39 PM
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?
AUTOADVERT
BigC
Posts: 22672
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/14/2004
Member: #829
8/22/2007  10:09 PM
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?

So we should keep Dick who can't play defense at all? Nate can't play defense.As a matter of Fact Nate is no where to be found on the defensive end. Fred can play defense. If you have to choose between Dick and Fred I would rather go with Fred Jones.



[Edited by - BigC on 08-23-2007 09:26 AM]
BigC's Knick blogs and Knicks highlights after every Knicks game http://fromthebaseline.com/
Ira
Posts: 24695
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 8/14/2001
Member: #91
8/23/2007  5:27 AM
They need to do what's necessary to sign Nichols. As I understand it, that means cutting Jones, too.
MS
Posts: 27065
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/28/2004
Member: #724
8/23/2007  9:36 AM
This is why isiah can't ever take this team where it needs to go.

Why is Jones on the roster? Because Isiah loves him and loved him since he was drafted. But we have Nate, Q, Marbury, Collins, Crawford, Nicholas etc. the man has no vision.

It's nice that isiah can make trades and then just buy guys out in order to make up for his mistake midlevel signing that take up roster space.
nixluva
Posts: 56258
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/5/2004
Member: #758
USA
8/23/2007  10:06 AM
Posted by MS:

This is why isiah can't ever take this team where it needs to go.

Why is Jones on the roster? Because Isiah loves him and loved him since he was drafted. But we have Nate, Q, Marbury, Collins, Crawford, Nicholas etc. the man has no vision.

It's nice that isiah can make trades and then just buy guys out in order to make up for his mistake midlevel signing that take up roster space.
If Isiah was in another city and with a different owner, i'm sure he wouldn't use these tactics. It's part of the way teams in NY do things. We have the money so many of our teams use that as a tool.

Jones is an expiring deal. It's not like Isiah took on huge and long contract. He does know what he's doing and I think you need to be more patient before you rip him on this one. I think he believed he had a deal which would allow him to keep DNic and at the same time hold on to his trading chips this year. He may have made a mistake with James, but overall this roster is pretty good. He just has to make a decision as to who's more important to keep. He didn't want to have to make this call, but DNic is forcing his hand, which is his right to do. In the end I think he'll cut Jones. He probably feels Jones is a better defender right now and has Pro experience, plus he likely has a soft spot for the kid, but when push comes to shove, he'll do the right thing.
buddapaw
Posts: 23225
Alba Posts: 51
Joined: 2/22/2006
Member: #1101
8/23/2007  11:09 AM
Lose Dick and Jones enough said
"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
Bippity10
Posts: 13999
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #574
8/23/2007  12:02 PM
We are hanging onto defensive specialists and thirdstring back up post defenders as if we are going to be competting for a title and may need them in the fourth quarter of a crucial game 5 showdown where all the starters have fouled out and we can't afford to rely on a rookie.

We are not in that position. We are trying to build a team. So who cares if we don't have that defensive specialist. Who cares if we don't have the lazy back-up center. We should be giving on court experience to guys that have the possibility to develop into long-term all-around players instead of investing in guys that are better suited for other teams. I don't get this fear to let go of guys that don't produce even when we do call on them. Oh yeah I do, money. The only reason Jerome James is on this roster is because we are paying him a billion dollars
I just hope that people will like me
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
8/23/2007  12:18 PM
Posted by BigC:
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?

So we should keep Dick who can't play defense at all? Nate can't play defense.As a matter of Fact Nate is no where to be found on the defensive end. Fred can play defense. If you have to choose between Dick and Fred I would rather go with Fred Jones.



[Edited by - BigC on 08-23-2007 09:26 AM]

Dickau is one of two pure PGs on this team (collins)

My hope would be that he can help Nate develop as a PG-

That is a stretch.
Bippity10
Posts: 13999
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #574
8/23/2007  12:27 PM
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?

So we should keep Dick who can't play defense at all? Nate can't play defense.As a matter of Fact Nate is no where to be found on the defensive end. Fred can play defense. If you have to choose between Dick and Fred I would rather go with Fred Jones.



[Edited by - BigC on 08-23-2007 09:26 AM]

Dickau is one of two pure PGs on this team (collins)

My hope would be that he can help Nate develop as a PG-

That is a stretch.

I get where you are going, but I would prefer one of those cagey veteran types.
I just hope that people will like me
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
8/23/2007  1:12 PM
Posted by Bippity10:
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?

So we should keep Dick who can't play defense at all? Nate can't play defense.As a matter of Fact Nate is no where to be found on the defensive end. Fred can play defense. If you have to choose between Dick and Fred I would rather go with Fred Jones.



[Edited by - BigC on 08-23-2007 09:26 AM]

Dickau is one of two pure PGs on this team (collins)

My hope would be that he can help Nate develop as a PG-

That is a stretch.

I get where you are going, but I would prefer one of those cagey veteran types.

Here is the other thing with Dickau- this guy could be a total dud- but, what if he takes off a la nash- not saying HOF or MVP- just real solid PG that makes a team better.

What are the chances of that? 1%, 2%?

I'd like to gamble on that upside- because what is Fred Jones? Undersized 2 who used to be athletic and has slowed down.

He might become a Bruce Bowen type defensive specialist- say equal chance as Dicakau- 1-2%

But, the fact remains that a 6'2" defensive specialist isn't really that great, not compared to a Dickau who could turn into a true PG off the bench, able to set up our 2nd string guys that know how to move with out the ball- Lee, Balkman.

And, worse case, maybe Nate learns something from watching Dickau in practice- develops some court vision.
BigC
Posts: 22672
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/14/2004
Member: #829
8/23/2007  1:20 PM
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by franco12:
Posted by BigC:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:

we have a .750 winning percentage with jerome as a starter. the numbers don't lie.

fred jones is not a good jumpshooter. defense is ok but he's undersized and in the open jumper offense of toronto, he struggled. but isiah likes him so he's a strong candidate to stay.

dickau could work but the writing is already on the wall (maybe pheonix or boston should pick him up on the cheap).

I think you are unfair in your assessment of Jones defense. It's better than ok.

not for us. he's 6'2 which means if he's playing he has to guard either the pg or sg. considering our other guards are steph at 6'3 and jamal (who doesn't play any defense), which position is fred jones going to guard?

in toronto, he had to play with tj ford, who's tiny...which meant he was guarding shooting guards. he didn't do a great job b/c of his height disdvantage. he KNOWS how to play defense, but he's not that great, and for us, he's too short to make a difference.

Fred can defend 2 guards and 3's. He has already done it. He is stronger than the average 2 guard and strong enough to guard 3's. He does not have to guard point guards because whoever is running the point at the time that Fred is on the court will guard the point guard. Height at times does not matter. Look at how Barkley and LJ played against their man at the pf. And both of them were around 6'4. Look at John Starks. He really is about 6'3 and was guarding guys like Reggie Miller who were 6'7.

Marbury's guarded larger players, so has Nate- but how many undersized midgets are we going to carry in the back court?

So we should keep Dick who can't play defense at all? Nate can't play defense.As a matter of Fact Nate is no where to be found on the defensive end. Fred can play defense. If you have to choose between Dick and Fred I would rather go with Fred Jones.



[Edited by - BigC on 08-23-2007 09:26 AM]

Dickau is one of two pure PGs on this team (collins)

My hope would be that he can help Nate develop as a PG-

That is a stretch.


Dickau can not shoot. After his injury he is also a step slow trying to drive to the hole. His main focus before was getting to the lane and dishing to a shooter for the open shot. Dickau in recent years is not doing that. He not only is not hitting the shot, but his drive to the hole is weak.
Plus his defense is nowhere to be found. So again what would he bring to the table that Nate can't? At least Jones plays defense, rebounding and create his own shot. With Mardy coming off an injury this summer there probably will only be Marbury, Jamal, Nate, and Jones in the backcourt.
BigC's Knick blogs and Knicks highlights after every Knicks game http://fromthebaseline.com/
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
8/23/2007  1:22 PM
franco - having watched Dickau up close in Atlanta the most glaring in-efficiency in his game is his field goal percentage.

Nash? Let's not get crazy.

Of course he could mature into a better ballplayer, but 36% last season and a career 39% from the field ain't gunna get it

Mardy Collins is already a better basketballer

once a knick always a knick
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
8/23/2007  1:23 PM
how does a little white boy point guard not know how to shoot?
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
8/23/2007  1:28 PM
the guard rotation is up for grabs

Marbury has a ton of mileage on his knees

Jamal is coming back from injury

Dickau can't shoot a lick

Nate is trying to re-invent himself as a 5'7 point guard

Fred Jones can't shoot a lick

Quentin's back is one awkward step away from the disabled list

Mardy is coming back from injury

Nichols isn't even on the roster

sheesh

once a knick always a knick
BigC
Posts: 22672
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/14/2004
Member: #829
8/23/2007  1:36 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

how does a little white boy point guard not know how to shoot?



Well, Mason and Oakley could barely dunk. lol
BigC's Knick blogs and Knicks highlights after every Knicks game http://fromthebaseline.com/
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
8/23/2007  1:42 PM
The Answer Man Makes His Free Throws

Q. djsu - how does a little white boy point guard not know how to shoot?

A. He must not be working on his game in the offseason or he simply sucks at shooting

"Hey, life ain't fair, yo"
once a knick always a knick
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
8/23/2007  1:43 PM
Posted by misterearl:

The Answer Man Makes His Free Throws

Q. djsu - how does a little white boy point guard not know how to shoot?

A. He must not be working on his game in the offseason or he simply sucks at shooting

"Hey, life ain't fair, yo"

i just thought it was genetically pre-determined that all 6' white point guards must know how to shoot.
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
8/23/2007  1:45 PM
djsu - nah homes, they always make their FREE THROWS.

Shooting with a hand in your face is another matter entirely
once a knick always a knick
Bippity10
Posts: 13999
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #574
8/23/2007  2:40 PM
I think our next target in the backcourt should be someone that dribbles real fancy. And then after that we can target someone that jumps really high.
I just hope that people will like me
martin
Posts: 81033
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
8/23/2007  2:42 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

I think our next target in the backcourt should be someone that dribbles real fancy. And then after that we can target someone that jumps really high.

dude, Isiah did that years ago: Crawford.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
Page 2 of 3 ‹ Previous 1  2  3 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Fred Jones is a keeper? Dickau pack your bags!
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy