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Cavs Writer Disses Knicks
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knicks1248
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8/12/2007  12:53 PM
Every basketball fan knows that the playoffs sucked last year, nobody predicted the cavs to win the east. Anybody with any
basketball knowledge knows that theres no clear cut dominate teams in the east, and basically a serious injury or two can ruin any teams playoff hopes.

I agree that the guy never took our injuries into prospective like the bucks and nets. Q, lee, steph,Jc, and even though he didn't do much, Jeff miss all of training camp and something like the first 6 to 7 weeks of the season. Then there's the me first attidude that eveyone seems to think our players have. I'm baffled by that every time I read it.

Steph has become the ultimate team player, and Curry has every right to demand the ball down low because he was having an enormous amount of success. No one knows how Zach and Curry will adjust. How they think the two play similar is beyound me. Curry has nothing close to a jump shot, and zach is not as effective in the paint as Curry. It's easy for me to believe that they would captalize on each other rather than to believe that they hurt each others game. Most players get me attitudes when the team consistaly loses and the player is doing every thing the coaching staff ask of him.

Our staters( on the offesive side) are as balance as any in the league. And with artest ( trade is a no brainer for both squads) we get better defensively and even more balance off the bench.

That trio sh... with no depth hasn't work for any one for as long as i could remember. I keep wondering how You put two veterens( pual and ray) together after both of them coming off an injury riddle sesaon for the last two seasons for the matter, and call that them the team to be reckon with or taking serious. When the NETS went to the finals that year they were relatively injury free 2 straight seasons, plus that trio was pretty young as well.

If the top 8 teams( with the most talant) in the east all stay healthy none of them will win more then 48 games because none of them are much better then the other.

ES
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Bobby
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8/12/2007  1:19 PM
Posted by tkf:

This is not suprising, not at all. These writers have no integrity anyway. if the knicks win 50 games and the other teams like bobcats suck, they will spin it and say, well the knicks have the highest payroll, so they should be the better team. Or they will just ignore the shyt they wrote earlier hoping people forget the crap they wrote. Either way, they don't care, it is easy to be an irresponsible jackass when it comes to writing. I am Ok with it, all the knicks have to do is win and the crap these asswipes write will remain meaningless..

the writer is ashamed to admit the cavs could make the next 4 finals only to produce the lowest watched series in nba history......and probably all sports

"Like they always say, New York is the Mecca of basketball,"I read that in Michael Jordan books my whole life and I played here in the Big East tournament, so it's always fun to play in the Mecca of basketball."---Rip Hamilton
Nalod
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8/12/2007  1:26 PM

Offended by a cavs writer?

The guy is dead on correct in his assessment. What chemistry can he possibly go on other than what our players have done in the past?

Does that mean he will be correct?

Who corrects him? The players result this upcoming season.

Do fans expect better or just hope for better?

I don't think he dissed us, he was calling it the way he sees it, not as a bona fide knick expert.

Nix, until we improve our record we suck! 33 game wins is lousy!!!!
EnySpree
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8/12/2007  1:48 PM
I been trying to tell you about that channing factor. Zach will play his role. Zach can knock down the jumper just as good as Frye. Thing is if he had to, and he will, he can put the rock on the floor and get all the way to the rack and make a play. Aside from that, isiah has tried to post channing. You don't try to post zach. Zach dominates whoever guards him and you will never see him butt bump a brick wall like channing does.

That alone makes the knicks way better. How much? We will find out, but this channing factor is major. It has nothing do do with game plan cuz zach pretty much plays perfect in channings role. Oh yeah, no more swiping at rebounds. Zach doesn't jump, so he will be manning up on the boards meaning for a tougher inside presence.

Its exciting.

Fuck this clevland writer. The cavs suck. Period. The made it to the finals cuz they did. Can't explain how. Had nothing to do with skill. Their cards fell right. Fuck this idiot. And **** the whole state of Ohio!
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knicks1248
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8/12/2007  4:44 PM
Posted by Nalod:


Offended by a cavs writer?

The guy is dead on correct in his assessment. What chemistry can he possibly go on other than what our players have done in the past?

Does that mean he will be correct?

Who corrects him? The players result this upcoming season.

Do fans expect better or just hope for better?

I don't think he dissed us, he was calling it the way he sees it, not as a bona fide knick expert.

Nix, until we improve our record we suck! 33 game wins is lousy!!!!


Yeah to some degree you right, but his disreguard for our injuries doesn't put much merit in his assesment of the knicks.
Especially since he pointed it out about other teams.
ES
arkrud
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8/12/2007  5:24 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by NYK3:

Until we start winning we will get no respect, and why should we get any respect WE'VE BEEN PATHETIC THESE PAST FEW YEARS

And the Bobcats have been winning? Why should we have so much faith in their addition working out great and none in ours? Orlando was fortunate that we had the injuries when we did, cuz I was very unimpressed with them. We beat them head to head and I think we may have been able to match their record.

My reasons for why I think this team is finally going to win this year are simple. As I stated in my last post. This team had a major overhaul in LB's year and unfortunately we didn't really gain much in terms of establishing a base to build on. Last year Isiah was successful in doing that. It wasn't a very consistently good team, but the team was getting better. I think now the team is in a good position to make a move up. This team has been together now for 2 full seasons. Our young players have grown and will be much more productive from day one. The chemistry should be better from day one as well. I don't expect a horrible Nov. again this year. I don't expect a Lastly the talent has improved over what we had last year and we got rid of Francis, who I feel was in the way. Frye who was ineffective. If Q can be healthier than he's been the last 2 years that will help a good deal.
Which fraction of the payroll of the Knicks Bobcats have?
Does anybody expected Bobcats to win a lot of games?
They overachieve and gain respect.
Knicks… well... Everybody knows the story.
This is not about abilities; this is about the value the teams, players, and GM/Coach have in the league. Respect is the thing which is easy to lose but not easy to get back
I don't care about payroll. I don't care about what the Bobcats are expected to do or not do. My point is that this writer gave them and Milwaukee every benefit of the doubt and yet his spit on the knicks. For no good reason except that it's the popular thing to do.
Bobcats add Richardson and they'll jump over the Knicks. Knicks add Zach and we'll struggle to win 42 games according to him. That's some garbage!

There's a good chance that this team would've won as many games as the Magic last year with a bit of better health at the end. Even still I think that there's ample reason to believe that the Knicks will indeed be better. I'll use one more example of this writers hypocrisy. He used this to argue that the Cavs would have a good chance to repeat what they did last year:

"YOUNG PLAYERS WHO WILL GET BETTER:

Daniel Gibson, Sasha Pavlovic, Shannon Brown, and Anderson Varejao are just scratching the surface. People forget that the late 80's Bulls passed the late 80's Cavaliers simply by improving from within - Scottie Pippen and Horace Grant developed into All-Stars (Pippen into one of the top players in the league), whereas the Cavaliers young talent like Danny Ferry and Hot Rod Williams maxed out at a lower level.

Now, none of these players are Scottie Pippen, but all should improve. All except Brown have shown they belong in the league and will probably have ten year careers at minimnum. I'm not totally sold on Brown, but I'd like to see him get more minutes. He's not a true point guard though, so I'm not sure where he fits.

Varejao got the most burn of all these players last year. Even if he never gets much better than he is now, he's still an extremely valuable role player, and he has the kinds of skills that don't really diminish.

The two guys with the most upside are Gibson and Pavlovic. It's true that Pavlovic is in his 4th season, but fans should remember that he barely played until the second half of last year. He is really an "x" factor for the Cavaliers at this point. He could feed off of James and develop into an All-Star or he could stagnate and never get much better than he is now. Of all of the players who are still developing, Pavlovic may be the most important one, due to his size, shooting ability, and overall skill level.

Gibson will be a fan favorite for years just from his playoff performance last year, no matter what else he ever does. The challenge for him will be doing what he did in that short time frame over a full season. He seems to have extreme confidence in his abilites and a great rapport with LeBron James, so I expect that he will add a lot this year."

So basically we can't imagine our many young players improving or the chemistry getting better for this team in it's 2nd year under Isiah, but the Cav's and other teams will improve? I'm arguing the complete opposite. I think that this team will show a marked improvement in this 2nd year together under Isiah. Adding Zach is a good thing not a bad thing. He replaces Frye at a critical position and gives us another STUD in the SL. Then he makes guys like Lee and Balkman more potent cuz he's able to draw the attention of defenders away from them so they're free to do what they do best.

This is not about your opinion Nix. Everybody on the board knows it.
We are talking about how other people who are not Knicks fans look at our team.
In their eyes we are garbage for multiple reasons including mentioned above.
Their opinion will not change until we will start winning and go deep into playoffs.




"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
nixluva
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8/12/2007  5:41 PM
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by NYK3:

Until we start winning we will get no respect, and why should we get any respect WE'VE BEEN PATHETIC THESE PAST FEW YEARS

And the Bobcats have been winning? Why should we have so much faith in their addition working out great and none in ours? Orlando was fortunate that we had the injuries when we did, cuz I was very unimpressed with them. We beat them head to head and I think we may have been able to match their record.

My reasons for why I think this team is finally going to win this year are simple. As I stated in my last post. This team had a major overhaul in LB's year and unfortunately we didn't really gain much in terms of establishing a base to build on. Last year Isiah was successful in doing that. It wasn't a very consistently good team, but the team was getting better. I think now the team is in a good position to make a move up. This team has been together now for 2 full seasons. Our young players have grown and will be much more productive from day one. The chemistry should be better from day one as well. I don't expect a horrible Nov. again this year. I don't expect a Lastly the talent has improved over what we had last year and we got rid of Francis, who I feel was in the way. Frye who was ineffective. If Q can be healthier than he's been the last 2 years that will help a good deal.
Which fraction of the payroll of the Knicks Bobcats have?
Does anybody expected Bobcats to win a lot of games?
They overachieve and gain respect.
Knicks… well... Everybody knows the story.
This is not about abilities; this is about the value the teams, players, and GM/Coach have in the league. Respect is the thing which is easy to lose but not easy to get back
I don't care about payroll. I don't care about what the Bobcats are expected to do or not do. My point is that this writer gave them and Milwaukee every benefit of the doubt and yet his spit on the knicks. For no good reason except that it's the popular thing to do.
Bobcats add Richardson and they'll jump over the Knicks. Knicks add Zach and we'll struggle to win 42 games according to him. That's some garbage!

There's a good chance that this team would've won as many games as the Magic last year with a bit of better health at the end. Even still I think that there's ample reason to believe that the Knicks will indeed be better. I'll use one more example of this writers hypocrisy. He used this to argue that the Cavs would have a good chance to repeat what they did last year:

"YOUNG PLAYERS WHO WILL GET BETTER:

Daniel Gibson, Sasha Pavlovic, Shannon Brown, and Anderson Varejao are just scratching the surface. People forget that the late 80's Bulls passed the late 80's Cavaliers simply by improving from within - Scottie Pippen and Horace Grant developed into All-Stars (Pippen into one of the top players in the league), whereas the Cavaliers young talent like Danny Ferry and Hot Rod Williams maxed out at a lower level.

Now, none of these players are Scottie Pippen, but all should improve. All except Brown have shown they belong in the league and will probably have ten year careers at minimnum. I'm not totally sold on Brown, but I'd like to see him get more minutes. He's not a true point guard though, so I'm not sure where he fits.

Varejao got the most burn of all these players last year. Even if he never gets much better than he is now, he's still an extremely valuable role player, and he has the kinds of skills that don't really diminish.

The two guys with the most upside are Gibson and Pavlovic. It's true that Pavlovic is in his 4th season, but fans should remember that he barely played until the second half of last year. He is really an "x" factor for the Cavaliers at this point. He could feed off of James and develop into an All-Star or he could stagnate and never get much better than he is now. Of all of the players who are still developing, Pavlovic may be the most important one, due to his size, shooting ability, and overall skill level.

Gibson will be a fan favorite for years just from his playoff performance last year, no matter what else he ever does. The challenge for him will be doing what he did in that short time frame over a full season. He seems to have extreme confidence in his abilites and a great rapport with LeBron James, so I expect that he will add a lot this year."

So basically we can't imagine our many young players improving or the chemistry getting better for this team in it's 2nd year under Isiah, but the Cav's and other teams will improve? I'm arguing the complete opposite. I think that this team will show a marked improvement in this 2nd year together under Isiah. Adding Zach is a good thing not a bad thing. He replaces Frye at a critical position and gives us another STUD in the SL. Then he makes guys like Lee and Balkman more potent cuz he's able to draw the attention of defenders away from them so they're free to do what they do best.

This is not about your opinion Nix. Everybody on the board knows it.
We are talking about how other people who are not Knicks fans look at our team.
In their eyes we are garbage for multiple reasons including mentioned above.
Their opinion will not change until we will start winning and go deep into playoffs.
Dude did you not read what I wrote? I used this guys OWN LOGIC to refute what he wrote. See you and some others around here seem to think that i'm some stupid, knicks pajamas wearing fan that irrationally loves everything about the Knicks and thus I can't understand why those outside of NY don't like the Knicks. That's not the case. I can assure you that i'm quite intelligent and I fully understand the dynamic of hometown verses those outside of NY.

My point is that he was biased against us for the wrong reasons. Teams like Char and Mil don't deserve anymore benefit of the doubt than we do. Cleveland's young players are gonna improve according to him but yet we can't expect our own considerable young talent to improve? MAN PLEASE! I can't wait for this season to start and I hope we stomp the Cavs everytime we play them. I hope Zach and Curry go for 20 each and Lee and Balkman dunk on LeBron's head, just for this guy talking so much crap. I'm tired of getting crapped on by everyone. I can feel this being the year we put it all together and I would love for nothing more than for this team to prove all of the doubters around the league wrong.
martin
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8/12/2007  5:42 PM
^ you wear Knicks PJs? That's right up there with BRIGGS' Knicks boxers.
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fishmike
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8/13/2007  7:42 AM
nixluva, rvhoss, whoever.. please explain to me what the KNicks have done to earn anything more than what this guy wrote? We have a lot of veteran players who have done very little but lose a lot of games, a GM who is regarded as among the worst and our young guys arent any more talented than the Hawks or Bobcats

When the Knicks start to win, like the Bulls did a couple years ago things will change. Until then we will be regarded as bottom fodder which we are
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
MS
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8/13/2007  9:40 AM
We don't play defense, we don't have any leadership and we have to many players that need minutes which is a tremendous problem.

I think taking out frye who was terrible last year and not having to deal with francis is a major plus. He was by far the worst defender on the team.......

I think it still comes down to the fact that crawford needs to be our big time scorer off the bench. I hate jefferies but if isiah is going to use him he might as well start him because he isn't bringing a lot to the table on the offensive end and he might get a few easy putbacks.

The cavs are terrible i don't care what anyone says we have a better team if we don't take possesions off. AJ is not getting much better, gibson please, pavolivic I would take lee collins and balkman over those guys any day of the week.

Get collins, balkman and lee their minutes we are in business....
babyKnicks
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8/13/2007  9:49 AM
unfortunately, he hit the nail on the head as to how the team is percieved throughout the league.

only time will tell.

One thing for sure, Isiah sure has everyone chugging haterade and it seems like the us against the world mentality could serve them well this year.

Is David Lee's love throughout the league counter productive to our image, or the fact that DLee is a double double work horse actually fuel the fire.

Rodman wasn't evil until he became a spur (after the shotgun in the mouth incident in detroit)
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
misterearl
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8/13/2007  10:17 AM
babyknicks - New York is perceived through the country as the root of all evil. Just look at the images that are propogated in the movies and media. The Yankees are The Evil Empire, Martin Scorcese is the spinmeister for movie imagery, Law and Order represents life on the mean streets and the Knicks are the enemy.

The rest of the country loves to hate New York just because it IS New York. But they can't keep their eyes off New York because New York is the center of the universe. And they hate the fact that New York is where it's all at and where it always will be.

And we're worried about what some writer from (cough) Cleveland thinks?

The punk probably got scared silly by a panhandler in Times Square.

Wilson Chandler for Mayor

once a knick always a knick
martin
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8/13/2007  10:31 AM
Posted by misterearl:

Wilson Chandler for Mayor

he needs to add you to his marketing team

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NYKBocker
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8/13/2007  10:37 AM
How many here thinks of Sprewell part deux for Z-Bo? I have a feeling Zach will be playing hard and his intensity will translate to the fans loving him much like our love affair with Spree back in the day. New York fans don't care what you did before and only cares what you are doing for me now. He will do his 20-10 in a Knick uni and all will be forgotten.
knicks1248
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8/13/2007  11:27 AM
Posted by fishmike:

nixluva, rvhoss, whoever.. please explain to me what the KNicks have done to earn anything more than what this guy wrote? We have a lot of veteran players who have done very little but lose a lot of games, a GM who is regarded as among the worst and our young guys arent any more talented than the Hawks or Bobcats

When the Knicks start to win, like the Bulls did a couple years ago things will change. Until then we will be regarded as bottom fodder which we are


but some of the other teams that he put ahead of us, what have they proven
ES
MS
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8/13/2007  11:35 AM
Sprewells career and financial well being was on the line not the case with zach and latrell was widely considered on the best guards in the league had already made the all nba firt team and was a good defender things zach didn't have.....

And people love to hate NY because our owner is an *******, our gm isn't well liked around the league, we have misfits on the roster and the poster image for everything that is wrong with basketball, me first selfish players that don't leave their heart on the floor. Once that changes i don't think you will see the resentment.
nixluva
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8/13/2007  11:56 AM
Posted by MS:

Sprewells career and financial well being was on the line not the case with zach and latrell was widely considered on the best guards in the league had already made the all nba firt team and was a good defender things zach didn't have.....

And people love to hate NY because our owner is an *******, our gm isn't well liked around the league, we have misfits on the roster and the poster image for everything that is wrong with basketball, me first selfish players that don't leave their heart on the floor. Once that changes i don't think you will see the resentment.
Zach is a VERY hard worker, he's just not a great help defender, but he does play D. The way he hustles on the boards NY fans are gonna love that. He's all action on offense so they'll also love that.

People hate NY simply because NY is big, powerful and rich, this leads to hate of our teams. Our Roster is actually a pretty nice group of guys. We don't really have any major issues with any of the guys on this roster. The loser tag is about the only thing anyone could have against us and that doesn't explain everything.

If the media is doing it's job in a professional manner they won't be so biased against us. As you said moving out Frye for a 20/10 payer with guts is a major plus. Simply removing Francis is also a good thing. LIke many other teams we have good young players and Fishmike, NO ONE said that our young players were better than everyone else, but we have some really good young players tho and a good deal of them. ON the whole, this team has plenty of upside for this and coming seasons. Yet this writer dismissed us and didn't really back up his argument with anything except past years.

He would've impressed me if he had really shown some insight by mentioning how our moves should have a positive impact, the possible growth of our impressive youth and the fact that we were likely better than our record last year, due in part to injuries. Instead he did that for all the other teams but not for us. He's predicting Lee may get worse due to the Zach deal, I mean why is that? There are 96 miinutes between the PF/C spot and divided equally that would be 32 minutes for Zach, Curry and Lee. If you take a few minutes from Lee he still get's plenty of minutes.

Steph, Q, Balk, Zach, Curry - Jamal, Lee, Jared, Nate & Mardy is a solid 10 men and we still have some talent in reserve. To me that's not a team that can't win 42 games as the writer is saying.
misterearl
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8/13/2007  12:11 PM
>>And people love to hate NY because our owner is an *******, our gm isn't well liked around the league....

MS - you are talking such biased nonsense that it gets tiring. Do you really care THAT much about who the owner of the LA Lakers... or the Kings for that matter?

C'mon, they are all millionaires who cut the checks. They are not in business to be "liked" around the league. They are in the business of making more money and spending more money.

>>, we have misfits on the roster and the poster image for everything that is wrong with basketball, me first selfish players that don't leave their heart on the floor. Once that changes i don't think you will see the resentment.

MS - the only misfits are the so-called Knicks fans who trash the roster before they get to training camp. "Leave their heart on the floor"?

who don't you show some heart, and stand tall for once, instead of playing Johnny One-negative note day in and day out MS?
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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8/13/2007  12:13 PM
yeah I said it

Wilson Chandler for Mayor
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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8/13/2007  12:17 PM
"me first" selfish players?

name them
once a knick always a knick
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