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OT: Suns 50-50 On Marion Trade
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djsunyc
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6/8/2007  1:32 PM
sarver on payroll:
A recent ESPN report said Sarver issued a mandate to take $8 million off the payroll. The Suns are facing about that much in a 2008 luxury tax if the payroll doesn't change.

"We don't have a mandate for anything," Sarver said. "Our payroll is going to end up in the upper group of NBA franchises. Exactly where it ends up partly is going to depend on what opportunities exist for us. We're going to be financially prudent, but we've been fortunate with good support from the fans and had good increases in revenue."
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Pharzeone
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6/8/2007  1:38 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TrueBlue:

The Suns want to trade the player that has the highest value around the league while at the same time clearing some money, that player is Marion. Everyone needs to get over the fact the time to trade Marion is now no matter how much of a hard you all have for the guy, he'll be making $16.5mil this coming season and $17.8mil the one after that. Sorry as good as he is he's not worth keeping around when he has high value and he won't get any better than he already is. He's also getting to that stage in his career where an injury is just waiting to happen. It's not like the Suns wouldn't win 50-55gms if the guy sat out every game next yr in street clothes.

Shawn Marion trades I would do if I were the Suns in no particular order

- Marion, Banks 4 Mike Miller, Hakim Warrick, Mighty Mouse
- Marion, Banks, future first 4 Luol Deng, P.J. Brown(S&T 1 yr $6mil), Duhon, Griffin
- Marion, Banks 4 Gerald Wallace(S&T first yr starting salary $9mil), Brevin Knight(ask Bobcats to pick his option up) and Jake Voskuhl
- Marion, Thomas, future first 4 Mickel Pietrus(S&T first yr starting salary $7mil), Foyle, and Biedrins
- Marion, Banks 4 Speedy Claxton, Tyron Lue, Josh Smith or Marvin Williams, Lorenzen Wright
- Marion, 4 Camby, Najera, J.R. Smith

Why turn a 60 win team into a 50 win team just to save money? It's not like they're in a rebuilding situation. They need to maximize wins while Nash has a few years left. I couldn't justify downgrading the roster just to save money in that scenario.

Thank you Daddy Warbucks. Not every owner has Cablevision as a financial backer.
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BlueSeats
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6/8/2007  1:48 PM
Marion only has two more years on his contract, he's never injured, he does all the little things the scorers need him to do to get steals, rebound, initiate the break, spread the defense, etc. He's been the one constant throughout their success, his game seems to mesh with everyone, and he appears to be a good guy too.

Suns ownership is frugal but smart, they'll pay to keep winning. I think they'd trade Marion to upgrade the roster, but not to arbitrarily shave payroll.
tomverve
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6/8/2007  2:00 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Marion only has two more years on his contract, he's never injured, he does all the little things the scorers need him to do to get steals, rebound, initiate the break, spread the defense, etc. He's been the one constant throughout their success, his game seems to mesh with everyone, and he appears to be a good guy too.

Suns ownership is frugal but smart, they'll pay to keep winning. I think they'd trade Marion to upgrade the roster, but not to arbitrarily shave payroll.


Suns fans better hope so.
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tomverve
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6/8/2007  2:02 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:

LOL weren't people saying they downgraded when they traded Joe Johnson for Diaw?


They probably would have won the championship this year if they had Joe Johnson instead of Diaw. LOL!
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Bonn1997
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6/8/2007  2:15 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TrueBlue:

The Suns want to trade the player that has the highest value around the league while at the same time clearing some money, that player is Marion. Everyone needs to get over the fact the time to trade Marion is now no matter how much of a hard you all have for the guy, he'll be making $16.5mil this coming season and $17.8mil the one after that. Sorry as good as he is he's not worth keeping around when he has high value and he won't get any better than he already is. He's also getting to that stage in his career where an injury is just waiting to happen. It's not like the Suns wouldn't win 50-55gms if the guy sat out every game next yr in street clothes.

Shawn Marion trades I would do if I were the Suns in no particular order

- Marion, Banks 4 Mike Miller, Hakim Warrick, Mighty Mouse
- Marion, Banks, future first 4 Luol Deng, P.J. Brown(S&T 1 yr $6mil), Duhon, Griffin
- Marion, Banks 4 Gerald Wallace(S&T first yr starting salary $9mil), Brevin Knight(ask Bobcats to pick his option up) and Jake Voskuhl
- Marion, Thomas, future first 4 Mickel Pietrus(S&T first yr starting salary $7mil), Foyle, and Biedrins
- Marion, Banks 4 Speedy Claxton, Tyron Lue, Josh Smith or Marvin Williams, Lorenzen Wright
- Marion, 4 Camby, Najera, J.R. Smith

Why turn a 60 win team into a 50 win team just to save money? It's not like they're in a rebuilding situation. They need to maximize wins while Nash has a few years left. I couldn't justify downgrading the roster just to save money in that scenario.

Thank you Daddy Warbucks. Not every owner has Cablevision as a financial backer.

We're not talking about a disgraceful organization with a $130 mil payroll and incompetent max contract players. We're talking about a team with a reasonable payroll and all-star/MVP level max contract players.
Bonn1997
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6/8/2007  2:16 PM
Posted by tomverve:
Posted by TrueBlue:

LOL weren't people saying they downgraded when they traded Joe Johnson for Diaw?


They probably would have won the championship this year if they had Joe Johnson instead of Diaw. LOL!
Agreed. The downgrade JJ to Diaw is huge and if their goal is to win now while Nash is in his prime, they'd be making a mistake by making another comparable downgrade with Marion. 22/12 players who don't need one play called for them to get their points don't grow on trees!

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 08-06-2007 2:17 PM]
TMS
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6/8/2007  2:54 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

at the kerr press conference, kerr, sarver, d'antoni, and giffin ALL said they are real close and they are there to take the "final" step. he also said they are planning to use the picks b/c they would like to bring in some youth to play behind the big guys.

they weren't asked nor did they talk about shedding salary or anything like that (something heavily rumored).

if marion goes, it will probably be for another player ready to help them win immediately. it's almost unheard of for a team that close just dumping players for youth and taking some big time steps back.

i would offer up marion for jermaine.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 06-07-2007 7:38 PM]

Marion & Banks for JO would work dollarwise... i agree, i don't see a 60 win Suns team downgrading in talent & going into rebuild mode while giving up a key player like Marion... if they deal him, it will be to UPGRADE in talent to help the team take the next step to winning a championship.
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Bonn1997
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6/8/2007  2:58 PM
I could see Pho doing that trade because of JO's interior defense. His injury history is a risk, though.
TMS
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6/8/2007  3:05 PM
i still think Vince fills more of what they need than JO does... it gives them more balance to have a scoring threat like Vince on the perimeter who can create his own shot to replace Marion at the 2/3... JO & Amare play the same type of game in many ways, only Amare can run the floor a lot better, so he fits w/a more uptempo style, just like Vince... JO would fit a lot better on the Lakers IMO.
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MS
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6/8/2007  3:13 PM
They don't want to pay the luxury tax they are not taking vince or jo they want to clear salaries
Nalod
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6/8/2007  3:53 PM
Who has young player not too expsive with upside, a decent draft pick, and can accept a big enough contract?

Orlando.

Darko, their pick (Do they have one?) for Marion.

Fair? No, but it works. They shed salary and add another Euro. Then maybe package him or Diaw for another piece.

Darko is still really really young. Marion on orlando next to Dwight might really open things up.

A dump is a dump.
MS
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6/8/2007  4:07 PM
they don't want to just dump for a guy that isn't improving them
TrueBlue
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6/8/2007  4:12 PM
Posted by tomverve:
Posted by TrueBlue:

LOL weren't people saying they downgraded when they traded Joe Johnson for Diaw?


They probably would have won the championship this year if they had Joe Johnson instead of Diaw. LOL!


Keep thinking that.... stats say otherwise. ?The furthest PHX went the past 3 yrs was when they didn't have Joe, Amare, and Kurt playing in the playoffs. Once again regular season record is very overrated. Cleveland is in the Finals winning only 50gms, Det won the Finals 2004 winning only 54gms, New Jersey got to the Finals in 2003 winning only 49gms. So often times fans over evaluate individual talent vs having enogh of what's needed to get the job done.
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Anji
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6/8/2007  4:22 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Who has young player not too expsive with upside, a decent draft pick, and can accept a big enough contract?

Orlando.

Darko, their pick (Do they have one?) for Marion.

Fair? No, but it works. They shed salary and add another Euro. Then maybe package him or Diaw for another piece.

Darko is still really really young. Marion on orlando next to Dwight might really open things up.

A dump is a dump.

THat's why they should trade with the bobcats.
Gerald wallaces could be Marion lite
Bobcats have cap space and a top ten pick
Wallace(S&T 8 million) & 8th pick for Marion & Cavs Pick

THe best deal I see, because you can't sign & trade a player for less then 3 years. So they have to get a player they want.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
bobs3304
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6/8/2007  4:44 PM
Posted by Anji:


THat's why they should trade with the bobcats.
Gerald wallaces could be Marion lite
Bobcats have cap space and a top ten pick
Wallace(S&T 8 million) & 8th pick for Marion & Cavs Pick

THe best deal I see, because you can't sign & trade a player for less then 3 years. So they have to get a player they want.


quote the author baby...

my idea!

DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
Anji
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6/8/2007  4:59 PM
Screw you, I didn't read your post.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
tomverve
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6/8/2007  5:54 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:

Keep thinking that.... stats say otherwise. ?The furthest PHX went the past 3 yrs was when they didn't have Joe, Amare, and Kurt playing in the playoffs. Once again regular season record is very overrated. Cleveland is in the Finals winning only 50gms, Det won the Finals 2004 winning only 54gms, New Jersey got to the Finals in 2003 winning only 49gms. So often times fans over evaluate individual talent vs having enogh of what's needed to get the job done.

Diaw was at best a mediocre bench player for the Suns in the playoffs this year. Replace a mediocre bench player with Joe Johnson and you get better, period.
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Nalod
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6/8/2007  6:19 PM
They trade Marion for the pick straight up and dump. They need to reduce.

Its ok to dump and cultivate other players. Give more time to Diaw while rookie pick develops.

Addition by subtraction. Not not marion is a bad player, but he might not be the fit, is costing the owner, and you bring in new talent.

Might not get them over the hump, but it keeps you going forward. Say you trade Nash back to Mavs for Harris and josh howard?

Thinking forward is what gets you ahead and stay there. Maybe Suns don't think they can win it next year and nash ain't getting any younger?
bobs3304
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6/8/2007  7:03 PM
Posted by Anji:

Screw you, I didn't read your post.

bad hair day huh?
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
OT: Suns 50-50 On Marion Trade

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