Posted by nixluva:

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by EnySpree:

Posted by Masterplan:

Posted by EnySpree:

Anyway nobody can tell me that the bulls are a well thought out and put together team. They are some lucky bastards. Knicks are gonna burry them next season. Mark my words!

barring injuries

If the bulls had lost deng, nocioni, gordan and hinrich down the stretch what would they be able to accomplish? Those players share the same importance on the bulls as lee, Q, marbs and craw on the knicks. So its a valid argument.

That's not really a fair analogy. We lost David Lee and then some role players who are inferior to all the Bulls' players you're listing.

42 points, 21 rebs. 8 asts and 30+ mpg for the guys we lost is not a bunch of role players. Those are 3 of our best players. Just because you may regard the Bulls players as better doesn't mean that the guys we lost aren't VERY important to what we do. Even if you change out a guy for the Bulls the point still has merit, cuz losing 3 guys that play 30+ mins for you and in particular are in the game in crunchtime, is a HUGE hit. Some of us want to minimize that, but it's really only a convenient argument for those who want to bash the team.

Which players are you counting in the 42, 21, and 8 stats?

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by Bonn1997:

Which players are you counting in the 42, 21, and 8 stats?

When we lost Lee, Q and Jamal that's how much production we lost, plus the fact that they were some of our best FT shooters and clutch performers.

Some of you are seriously overstating the negative.

MS we were 5 games under when the injuries hit.

Franco12 this year we had 3 2nd year players and 2 rooks that we were trying to develop and fit into the scheme. Now you can add Morris and our draft pick to that young group. Curry is also one of our best players along with Lee etc.

islesfan, you can't say that Q isn't a part of this when he just had a corrective surgery that has a high degree of success. It remains to be seen how much of an improvement it will be, but he already said that his posture has improved and he feels no pain except for the wound from the surgery, which will heal. It doesn't sound like the kind off injury that will hold him back. He could've had the surgery earlier, but didn't want to have them work on his back. That's an understandible fear. Still the prognosis is for normal back function now that the iritating fragments have been removed.

Blueseats you really think it made sense for steph to continue to play hurt? Even if he could've toughed it out, why take a chance on him overcompensating and really injuring himself? He's going to be an important part of this team for the next 2 years, so why risk it?

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:
Marbury could have played at the end but him and Eddy where getting nowhere together. I think Isiah decided it would look better to lose a lot of games with Marbury on the bench than with his two stars both playing. And Collins did well with the time given him.

Blueseats you really think it made sense for steph to continue to play hurt? Even if he could've toughed it out, why take a chance on him overcompensating and really injuring himself? He's going to be an important part of this team for the next 2 years, so why risk it?

I didn't say Isiah did anything wrong, only that I wouldn't count Marbury among those who were wholly unavailable. In fact, as someone who feels Marbury has been little more than an unhealthy distraction I was pleased to see his possible replacement getting play.

But it is odd Isiah would shut Marbury down in a season when our pick goes to another team and there is nothing to be gained in losing. But what the heck, they'd only won 2 of the last 6 before he got hurt, so how much worse could it get? Going out in a tailspin with your two franchise players on the floor doesn't look good, so, with he extension already secured, what's to be gained?

On the other hand, it's funny that so many posters here felt that this team when healthy could beat the 2003 squad when healthy. Hobbybury, Crawford, Lee and Curry would beat McDyess, Kurt, Houston, and Spree? Seriously?. The talent advantage of the '03 team aside, that team had twice the toughness and integrity for the game this one has.

For example, that '03 team saw a 31 year old Allan Houston play all 82 games on bad knees (heading for off-season surgery) even after playoff elimination, all in a year we DID have our own pick. He even had his best statistical season of his career in the process. Houston and Chaney surely could have shut it down, but they didn't. It might have something to do with them having a level of pride, commitment, and respect for the game that I long to see from this squad.

So funny that Isiah feels the need to save Marbury from toe pain when he's the guy who scored like 24 points in a quarter on a severely sprained ankle. You just can't teach that kind of will to win, though some coaches seem to inspire more of it than others.

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:
Marbury could have played at the end but him and Eddy where getting nowhere together. I think Isiah decided it would look better to lose a lot of games with Marbury on the bench than with his two stars both playing. And Collins did well with the time given him.

Blueseats you really think it made sense for steph to continue to play hurt? Even if he could've toughed it out, why take a chance on him overcompensating and really injuring himself? He's going to be an important part of this team for the next 2 years, so why risk it?

I didn't say Isiah did anything wrong, only that I wouldn't count Marbury among those who were wholly unavailable. In fact, as someone who feels Marbury has been little more than an unhealthy distraction I was pleased to see his possible replacement getting play.

But it is odd Isiah would shut Marbury down in a season when our pick goes to another team and there is nothing to be gained in losing. But what the heck, they'd only won 2 of the last 6 before he got hurt, so how much worse could it get? Going out in a tailspin with your two franchise players on the floor doesn't look good, so, with he extension already secured, what's to be gained?

On the other hand, it's funny that so many posters here felt that this team when healthy could beat the 2003 squad when healthy. Hobbybury, Crawford, Lee and Curry would beat McDyess, Kurt, Houston, and Spree? Seriously?. The talent advantage of the '03 team aside, that team had twice the toughness and integrity for the game this one has.

For example, that '03 team saw a 31 year old Allan Houston play all 82 games on bad knees (heading for off-season surgery) even after playoff elimination, all in a year we DID have our own pick. He even had his best statistical season of his career in the process. Houston and Chaney surely could have shut it down, but they didn't. It might have something to do with them having a level of pride, commitment, and respect for the game that I long to see from this squad.

So funny that Isiah feels the need to save Marbury from toe pain when he's the guy who scored like 24 points in a quarter on a severely sprained ankle. You just can't teach that kind of will to win, though some coaches seem to inspire more of it than others.

I REALLY don't think that Chaney inspires more out of his players than Isiah. It's not even about that to me. I think the team played hard, but not always SMART. That is a product of inexperience. Can they play harder and smarter, OF COURSE. That can also be a learning experience for young players who don't know what it really takes to win in the NBA. A lot of them THINK they're playing as hard as they can, but in time they can come to learn otherwise. When you gain experience you also learn how to channel your energy better and focus more. I think you're too quick to cast aspersions towards Isiah and players on this team. It must be that they are lazy and uncoachable rather than there are a lot of new guys who are still learning what it takes to win. Isiah must have ulterior motives for sitting a player rather than he knows what's best for that player given their health status and what he can realistically give the team. Somehow you have it all figured out and it just so happens to always come out on the negative side of the scale for this team.

Now you have some valid points cuz we all know this team has flawed players, but you seem to me to be guilty of taking things too far. There's no give your assessment of the team and it's players. They aren't good enough and likely never will be or they are of questionable character etc. All that is just too much to me.

The thing is that this team isn't a finished product and wasn't EXPECTED to be this last season. We wanted to see some progress and growth from the young players. This wasn't a case where they had high expectations for the season like a playoff team trying to get to the conf. finals or something. We just wanted to improve and make a push for the playoffs. We made some improvement, but failed to reach the playoffs. That's not a total disaster as some want to paint it. Since last season this became a team looking towards the future and not just the present. If you judge this team like a team that is all about the present then you miss the point of what's really going on. You won't have patience for the youth to develop and for us to find the right mix on this roster to make this a contending team. Some of you want that right now and that's not gonna happen over night. Not if you're going to try and do it with a mostly young team. I thought that would be something most fans would actually want this franchise to do, but even that's not enough. We have to have all of the top draft picks or else no one is happy. Unless we have a D. Howard, Oden, Durant or any other big name young player none of you will ever be happy with this team. That's really all you want. Forget that you still have to put together a TEAM and that there are many examples of Superstar players who have STILL not made the finals. It often takes those guys YEARS to get to the promised land unless you add SHAQ. It's not a guarantee of success. What we are doing now still has a chance to work. Let's show some patience and let things unfold and maybe in 2 years we'll get a nice surprise or maybe we already have a team that can get to the finals and we just have to let it develop. You won't know if you don't let it happen.

Nix which drugs are you using?
I evaluating product for what it is not for marketing spins
The product we have is good for nothing. The club produced crap already for 4 year under current leadershp and "direction".
Who cares about the exuses? Crap is crap.
Isiah FAILED misarably. And if somebody (Dolan) want to continie feed this guy for nothing we will have another 4 years of failures and exuses
IT is not cappable for GM job, he hardly avrage coach on NBA level.
He is a good entertainer and public relation persone who took somebody else job and waisting Cablevision money.

Posted by arkrud:

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:
Marbury could have played at the end but him and Eddy where getting nowhere together. I think Isiah decided it would look better to lose a lot of games with Marbury on the bench than with his two stars both playing. And Collins did well with the time given him.

Blueseats you really think it made sense for steph to continue to play hurt? Even if he could've toughed it out, why take a chance on him overcompensating and really injuring himself? He's going to be an important part of this team for the next 2 years, so why risk it?

I didn't say Isiah did anything wrong, only that I wouldn't count Marbury among those who were wholly unavailable. In fact, as someone who feels Marbury has been little more than an unhealthy distraction I was pleased to see his possible replacement getting play.

But it is odd Isiah would shut Marbury down in a season when our pick goes to another team and there is nothing to be gained in losing. But what the heck, they'd only won 2 of the last 6 before he got hurt, so how much worse could it get? Going out in a tailspin with your two franchise players on the floor doesn't look good, so, with he extension already secured, what's to be gained?

On the other hand, it's funny that so many posters here felt that this team when healthy could beat the 2003 squad when healthy. Hobbybury, Crawford, Lee and Curry would beat McDyess, Kurt, Houston, and Spree? Seriously?. The talent advantage of the '03 team aside, that team had twice the toughness and integrity for the game this one has.

For example, that '03 team saw a 31 year old Allan Houston play all 82 games on bad knees (heading for off-season surgery) even after playoff elimination, all in a year we DID have our own pick. He even had his best statistical season of his career in the process. Houston and Chaney surely could have shut it down, but they didn't. It might have something to do with them having a level of pride, commitment, and respect for the game that I long to see from this squad.

So funny that Isiah feels the need to save Marbury from toe pain when he's the guy who scored like 24 points in a quarter on a severely sprained ankle. You just can't teach that kind of will to win, though some coaches seem to inspire more of it than others.

I REALLY don't think that Chaney inspires more out of his players than Isiah. It's not even about that to me. I think the team played hard, but not always SMART. That is a product of inexperience. Can they play harder and smarter, OF COURSE. That can also be a learning experience for young players who don't know what it really takes to win in the NBA. A lot of them THINK they're playing as hard as they can, but in time they can come to learn otherwise. When you gain experience you also learn how to channel your energy better and focus more. I think you're too quick to cast aspersions towards Isiah and players on this team. It must be that they are lazy and uncoachable rather than there are a lot of new guys who are still learning what it takes to win. Isiah must have ulterior motives for sitting a player rather than he knows what's best for that player given their health status and what he can realistically give the team. Somehow you have it all figured out and it just so happens to always come out on the negative side of the scale for this team.

Now you have some valid points cuz we all know this team has flawed players, but you seem to me to be guilty of taking things too far. There's no give your assessment of the team and it's players. They aren't good enough and likely never will be or they are of questionable character etc. All that is just too much to me.

The thing is that this team isn't a finished product and wasn't EXPECTED to be this last season. We wanted to see some progress and growth from the young players. This wasn't a case where they had high expectations for the season like a playoff team trying to get to the conf. finals or something. We just wanted to improve and make a push for the playoffs. We made some improvement, but failed to reach the playoffs. That's not a total disaster as some want to paint it. Since last season this became a team looking towards the future and not just the present. If you judge this team like a team that is all about the present then you miss the point of what's really going on. You won't have patience for the youth to develop and for us to find the right mix on this roster to make this a contending team. Some of you want that right now and that's not gonna happen over night. Not if you're going to try and do it with a mostly young team. I thought that would be something most fans would actually want this franchise to do, but even that's not enough. We have to have all of the top draft picks or else no one is happy. Unless we have a D. Howard, Oden, Durant or any other big name young player none of you will ever be happy with this team. That's really all you want. Forget that you still have to put together a TEAM and that there are many examples of Superstar players who have STILL not made the finals. It often takes those guys YEARS to get to the promised land unless you add SHAQ. It's not a guarantee of success. What we are doing now still has a chance to work. Let's show some patience and let things unfold and maybe in 2 years we'll get a nice surprise or maybe we already have a team that can get to the finals and we just have to let it develop. You won't know if you don't let it happen.

Nix which drugs are you using?
I evaluating product for what it is not for marketing spins
The product we have is good for nothing. The club produced crap already for 4 year under current leadershp and "direction".
Who cares about the exuses? Crap is crap.
Isiah FAILED misarably. And if somebody (Dolan) want to continie feed this guy for nothing we will have another 4 years of failures and exuses
IT is not cappable for GM job, he hardly avrage coach on NBA level.
He is a good entertainer and public relation persone who took somebody else job and waisting Cablevision money.

I thought our "direction" has been changed at least 2 times in those 4 years?

As far as miserably failed - i don't agree, i mean sure things could have went better and it can't be called a success yet. . . it didn't get worse and i at least now can think ahead and think about the future of this team.

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by ramtour420:

Posted by arkrud:

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by BlueSeats:
Marbury could have played at the end but him and Eddy where getting nowhere together. I think Isiah decided it would look better to lose a lot of games with Marbury on the bench than with his two stars both playing. And Collins did well with the time given him.

Blueseats you really think it made sense for steph to continue to play hurt? Even if he could've toughed it out, why take a chance on him overcompensating and really injuring himself? He's going to be an important part of this team for the next 2 years, so why risk it?

I didn't say Isiah did anything wrong, only that I wouldn't count Marbury among those who were wholly unavailable. In fact, as someone who feels Marbury has been little more than an unhealthy distraction I was pleased to see his possible replacement getting play.

But it is odd Isiah would shut Marbury down in a season when our pick goes to another team and there is nothing to be gained in losing. But what the heck, they'd only won 2 of the last 6 before he got hurt, so how much worse could it get? Going out in a tailspin with your two franchise players on the floor doesn't look good, so, with he extension already secured, what's to be gained?

On the other hand, it's funny that so many posters here felt that this team when healthy could beat the 2003 squad when healthy. Hobbybury, Crawford, Lee and Curry would beat McDyess, Kurt, Houston, and Spree? Seriously?. The talent advantage of the '03 team aside, that team had twice the toughness and integrity for the game this one has.

For example, that '03 team saw a 31 year old Allan Houston play all 82 games on bad knees (heading for off-season surgery) even after playoff elimination, all in a year we DID have our own pick. He even had his best statistical season of his career in the process. Houston and Chaney surely could have shut it down, but they didn't. It might have something to do with them having a level of pride, commitment, and respect for the game that I long to see from this squad.

So funny that Isiah feels the need to save Marbury from toe pain when he's the guy who scored like 24 points in a quarter on a severely sprained ankle. You just can't teach that kind of will to win, though some coaches seem to inspire more of it than others.

I REALLY don't think that Chaney inspires more out of his players than Isiah. It's not even about that to me. I think the team played hard, but not always SMART. That is a product of inexperience. Can they play harder and smarter, OF COURSE. That can also be a learning experience for young players who don't know what it really takes to win in the NBA. A lot of them THINK they're playing as hard as they can, but in time they can come to learn otherwise. When you gain experience you also learn how to channel your energy better and focus more. I think you're too quick to cast aspersions towards Isiah and players on this team. It must be that they are lazy and uncoachable rather than there are a lot of new guys who are still learning what it takes to win. Isiah must have ulterior motives for sitting a player rather than he knows what's best for that player given their health status and what he can realistically give the team. Somehow you have it all figured out and it just so happens to always come out on the negative side of the scale for this team.

Now you have some valid points cuz we all know this team has flawed players, but you seem to me to be guilty of taking things too far. There's no give your assessment of the team and it's players. They aren't good enough and likely never will be or they are of questionable character etc. All that is just too much to me.

The thing is that this team isn't a finished product and wasn't EXPECTED to be this last season. We wanted to see some progress and growth from the young players. This wasn't a case where they had high expectations for the season like a playoff team trying to get to the conf. finals or something. We just wanted to improve and make a push for the playoffs. We made some improvement, but failed to reach the playoffs. That's not a total disaster as some want to paint it. Since last season this became a team looking towards the future and not just the present. If you judge this team like a team that is all about the present then you miss the point of what's really going on. You won't have patience for the youth to develop and for us to find the right mix on this roster to make this a contending team. Some of you want that right now and that's not gonna happen over night. Not if you're going to try and do it with a mostly young team. I thought that would be something most fans would actually want this franchise to do, but even that's not enough. We have to have all of the top draft picks or else no one is happy. Unless we have a D. Howard, Oden, Durant or any other big name young player none of you will ever be happy with this team. That's really all you want. Forget that you still have to put together a TEAM and that there are many examples of Superstar players who have STILL not made the finals. It often takes those guys YEARS to get to the promised land unless you add SHAQ. It's not a guarantee of success. What we are doing now still has a chance to work. Let's show some patience and let things unfold and maybe in 2 years we'll get a nice surprise or maybe we already have a team that can get to the finals and we just have to let it develop. You won't know if you don't let it happen.

Nix which drugs are you using?
I evaluating product for what it is not for marketing spins
The product we have is good for nothing. The club produced crap already for 4 year under current leadershp and "direction".
Who cares about the exuses? Crap is crap.
Isiah FAILED misarably. And if somebody (Dolan) want to continie feed this guy for nothing we will have another 4 years of failures and exuses
IT is not cappable for GM job, he hardly avrage coach on NBA level.
He is a good entertainer and public relation persone who took somebody else job and waisting Cablevision money.

I thought our "direction" has been changed at least 2 times in those 4 years?

If only every GM were so lucky as to just say "we changed directions" and get a fresh start.

. . .or be so lucky to have a direction. . .