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have the knicks shown evident progress
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djsunyc
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here are results from this newsday poll
quote:
More than halfway through the season, have the Knicks shown "evident progress?" 61.6% Yes, enough to keep Isiah (716 responses) 38.4% No, not enough to keep Isiah (446 responses) 1162 total responses
yes, enough to keep isiah
no, not enough to keep isiah
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babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:11 PM
I say we keep the team as is and let the older players come off the cap and we continue our strong draft.

The Jazz won a title?
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
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Bippity10
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1/30/2007  5:12 PM
Posted by babyKnicks:

most people aren't into micro bashing every game, move, minute, statement, etc.

Most see the youth and the future.

But like I've said previously, it's more fun to read and post with the ... um ... oh, realists.

But reality, the knicks have an extremely youthful and upside filled core.

keep it comin fellas, I'm waiting for the renewal of his contract so most of the realists can stick to their pledges to stop posting. (jokes)

babyknicks is it possible to not question a guys game time moves while at the same time not trust him to build your franchise?

Is it fair to say that if you trust him and think he can build your franchise that it's fair for other fans not to trust him? Or do fans have to have your opinion?

I don't care about his game time moves. I know we are who we are. Isiah can win or lose 3 or 4 more games with his moves. But it's not going to change our status of a mediocre to bad team. But with that in mind, I still don't trust him as GM. He has made to many wasted moves for me to think he will be able to take advantage of Curry and Lee and anyone else he chooses to keep.

Is this fair for me to say this. Or am I a hater simply because I don't agree with your point of view that he can take advantage of it?
I just hope that people will like me
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:14 PM
absolutely...as a GM, questionable, but only because he's been not afraid to take risks.

You're no hater my friend, your a realist, but calling for the head of the head after a disagreement with game time moves does not make you a lover.

LIke I said, I love the high expectations and the attention to detail that can be found in no other place.

but the knicks have shown evident progress.
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:20 PM
losing by one point to the bucks because the team is just too young enough to bring it for 48 minutes game after game is something that get's better as the years go by...blowing it up (new gm) is dumb.

We rolled the dice with this team, let's see what they got...they appear to be responding to the current coach, we tried it with LB, and others and it failed miserably, so we have the best coach for this crew.

Bring in a new GM? Oh, you mean someone that will trade Curry for Boozer? Or Crawford for a non shooting PF? Nope.

Stay the course, 3 years is nothing in basketball years.

Lebron is working on his title still and he's AWESOME...but I'm not seeing one for him in the next 3 MORE years.

So, this fantasy that we are one Role playing big man, or awesome shooting guard away from a title is about as likely as staying the course with our current team and seeing what develops over the next 2 to 3 years.

If we are miserable by the time the REAL free agents are available, BLOW it up...but to cut off isiah's head now is what Notre Dame did and they seem no closer to a national title than with willingham (who got less years than any other ND coach in history) and we all know the current coach is going to get more.

Isiah get's killed after 3 years, how long does the next guy get?
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
MS
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1/30/2007  5:23 PM
The Curry deal is still a bad deal, we are going to the lottery there is no question unless we get very hot, the nets are a better team so its doubtful we will jump them.

So you would rather take Curry over a pick in the 7-10 and one of the following Foye/Roye/Thomas, Curry has proven to be a dominant scorer, but he can't rebound, blk shots, pass or defend anyone and is high turnover prone. So I don't believe it was a great deal.

Frye has been awful this season completely one dimensional and has reached double figure rebounds only twice this season. Granger and Bynum drafted behind him look like buddin All-Stars for years to come and both play defense. Nate has had a few moments but has been very immature and only seems to be concerned with his own scoring and is turnover prone and a defensive liability

Crawford has been awful this season with the exception of a few bright moments, his turnover are up and he is one of the worst defensive guards in the league was getting killed by gary payton of all people, he defense is laugable.....

You have four guys not one team in the league would touch Francis, Rose, James, Jefferies

You want to tell me Lee was an awesome pick I agree he has been great and shown some real promise, even though i believe Balkman would have been there at 30 and Collins was a wasted selection i like his toughness but again isiah doesn't know how to use him.

If Curry is your franchise talent you are ****ed, and that also means that Channing has to be moved if you want to keep eddy.

So when it comes down to it the best things Isiah has done here is draft Balkman and Lee other than that i don't see a lot of parts that will build us towards a winner since we will be just bad enough to miss out on any good players in the lottery or finish at 500 and lose in the first round
Bippity10
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1/30/2007  5:25 PM
Posted by babyKnicks:

absolutely...as a GM, questionable, but only because he's been not afraid to take risks.

You're no hater my friend, your a realist, but calling for the head of the head after a disagreement with game time moves does not make you a lover.

LIke I said, I love the high expectations and the attention to detail that can be found in no other place.

but the knicks have shown evident progress.

babyknicks: Analyzing game time decisions has been going on forever. It's been going on since Lenny and Don and JVG and even Pat Riley. Fans always criticize moves. They always overreact after wins and losses. This is not new and why I ignore most of those threads. I could care less about his game time decisions. There is no line-up we can put on the floor that is going to turn us into something we aren't. Should Lee be starting? In my opinion, yes. Will that change our record drastically. No.

But judging this guy as GM has to be a different animal. We are saying all he has to do to show evident progress is to beat out what happened last year. It's like we are saying he played no part in last year. When the reality is he brought the entire mix together. This is the only management situation in the league in which this would be the case. Most GM's are held accountable for their coaching hires. Ours can bring in 5 coaches in 3 years and we are fine with it. I need someone to explain to me, how low are the standards for an organization that finds this acceptable? Why is a team that has not won in 34 years not following the examples of winning franchises?

I am judging him as GM/coach seperately. As coach I can't criticize a whole lot. I don't like his methods but I predicted 35-38 wins and so far he is in the ball park. Can't call for his head based on that. But as GM we are now in year 3 of his regime and 38-41 wins would be a miracle. And we will still have to get rid of half the roster to pair with our "franchise" player. It's time to get a proven builder in here that can use a mid-level wisely, not cut half his acquisitions and not trade away a young guy with potential for growth for a vet that has no role with the team simply because someone might have asked him too. I want a coherent plan and someone with the mindset to stick with it.
I just hope that people will like me
MS
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1/30/2007  5:28 PM
God now i know your an idiot ND who i ****ing hate has one of the best recruiting classes in the country next season and although they got smoked in the bowl games, they in all honesty beat USC last year and are much better under weiss, have more exposure because of him and people want to play for him because he helped lead the pats to three superbowl wins.
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:31 PM
still, I see evident progress.

Sorry, you see crappy crawford, I see him getting better and better.
you see frye sucking, I see last year frye and future 7 footer that can hit the open jumper.

you say we are headed to the lottery this year, I have said all along the nets are the class of the atlantic and we're getting in either beating them or sneaking by the bottom feeders (currently Heat, Indiana, Toronto, Orlando

It's just a matter of how you choose to see it.

I'm unfazed by the multiple TrueBlue posts.

To me, it's about evident progress (the original question)

and there is has been evident progress without a doubt (and from the looks of the non UK.com polls, I'm not alone)
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:33 PM
Posted by MS:

God now i know your an idiot ND who i ****ing hate has one of the best recruiting classes in the country next season and although they got smoked in the bowl games, they in all honesty beat USC last year and are much better under weiss, have more exposure because of him and people want to play for him because he helped lead the pats to three superbowl wins.

Knicks beat the heat and have more exposure under Isiah.
Still not seeing the point of firing a coach before his contract is up and allowing another coach (arguably better) to reap the benefits of the foundation you restored.

But hey, I'm a Penn State fan, so I believe in staying the course. (joe pa baby!)

BTW...way to keep it clean.

[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-30-2007 5:33 PM]
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TrueBlue
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1/30/2007  5:36 PM
What you NITWITS don't understand is if a team decides mutiny is the only option(let's forget the fact they're getting paid millions to do their job) last yr and decide this yr, hey we better be on our best behavior, that's not progress. The team ran out of excuses, they have no choice, other than to play hard in the most ideal situation and it's equates to a projected 33win season.(This is right where I had them before the season tipped off)

The Franchise has No Integrity and niether does 60% of it's NITWITTED fan base. PATHETIC!


Just in case comprehension is a problem It's asking has the TEAM made EVIDENT progress. If fans were smart they could have looked at this poll as an opportunity to at least make their voice heard loud and clear, they would like Zeke fired. If he gets hired back, I'm placing a ton of blame on the fans.



[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-30-2007 4:37 PM]
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:40 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:

What you NITWITS don't understand is if a team decides mutiny is the only option(let's forget the fact they're getting paid millions to do their job) last yr and decide this yr, hey we better be on our best behavior, that's not progress. The team ran out of excuses, they have no choice, other than to play hard in the most ideal situation and it's equates to a projected 33win season.(This is right where I had them before the season tipped off)

The Franchise has No Integrity and niether does 60% of it's NITWITTED fan base. PATHETIC!
Now you are bashing the fan base...you sound like Isiah!
Just in case comprehension is a problem It's asking has the TEAM made EVIDENT progress. If fans were smart they could have looked at this poll as an opportunity to at least make their voice heard loud and clear, they would like Zeke fired. If he gets hired back, I'm placing a ton of blame on the fans.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-30-2007 4:37 PM]

Another great post! Way to go TB, you are proving my point with every post.

The funniest part is you edited it.

[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-30-2007 5:40 PM]
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
TrueBlue
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1/30/2007  5:43 PM
Posted by babyKnicks:
Posted by TrueBlue:

What you NITWITS don't understand is if a team decides mutiny is the only option(let's forget the fact they're getting paid millions to do their job) last yr and decide this yr, hey we better be on our best behavior, that's not progress. The team ran out of excuses, they have no choice, other than to play hard in the most ideal situation and it's equates to a projected 33win season.(This is right where I had them before the season tipped off)

The Franchise has No Integrity and niether does 60% of it's NITWITTED fan base. PATHETIC!
Now you are bashing the fan base...you sound like Isiah!
Just in case comprehension is a problem It's asking has the TEAM made EVIDENT progress. If fans were smart they could have looked at this poll as an opportunity to at least make their voice heard loud and clear, they would like Zeke fired. If he gets hired back, I'm placing a ton of blame on the fans.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-30-2007 4:37 PM]

Another great post! Way to go TB, you are proving my point with every post.

The funniest part is you edited it.

[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-30-2007 5:40 PM]



Just stop, you aren't good at this seriously! Nice edit job yourself.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:45 PM
You talking to me or addressing the subject.

Not good at what? I don't get it...and what did I edit?
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
MS
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1/30/2007  5:45 PM
Again if you see crawford getting better and better I have to question your intelligence.

He is one of the worst defenders at the guard spot in the league so right away he is one dimensional

04-05 His first season as a Knicks
17.7pts 4.3ass 2.9rbs 2.1tos 1.3stls
15.7shots taken 39%from the field 36%from 3

06-07
17.8pts 4.6asst 3.1rbs 2.7tos 1.0stls
15.7shots taken 39%from the field 31% from 3

No difference in three years and his three point shooting has been terrible
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:46 PM
am I supposed to post inflammatory posts just to elicity a response? is that what I'm not good at?
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:47 PM
Posted by MS:

Again if you see crawford getting better and better I have to question your intelligence.

He is one of the worst defenders at the guard spot in the league so right away he is one dimensional

04-05 His first season as a Knicks
17.7pts 4.3ass 2.9rbs 2.1tos 1.3stls
15.7shots taken 39%from the field 36%from 3

06-07
17.8pts 4.6asst 3.1rbs 2.7tos 1.0stls
15.7shots taken 39%from the field 31% from 3

No difference in three years and his three point shooting has been terrible

He's not supposed to be a defender, he's supposed to be Redd light.
Also, he's the defacto sixth man who comes off the bench like vinnie johnson.

I'm wondering who you guys expect crawford to be for $8 mill a year.
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:49 PM
crawford may not have lived up to your expectations, but he's lived up to mine.

Maybe it just comes down to one's definition of evident progress?
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
babyKnicks
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1/30/2007  5:49 PM
I think for some of you it's title or bust.

EDIT: THIS YEAR.

[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-30-2007 5:49 PM]
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
TrueBlue
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1/30/2007  5:53 PM
Posted by babyKnicks:

You talking to me or addressing the subject.

Not good at what? I don't get it...and what did I edit?


If Crawford was doing his job to full capacity there would have been no need to trade for Francis, Jalen Rose and draft Nate. If Q was doing his job to full capacity there would have been no need to sign Jeffries and draft Balkman. If these players were doing their job to full capacity there wouldn't be so many frequent benchings. If they were doing their job to full capacity and showing progress they'd have the division lead right now, they wouldn't be below .500 @ home, every game since the past month wouldn't be a must win, fans wouldn't have to hope game after game for every team above and below them to lose, they wouldn't be battling fans and getting into fights with 15yr olds in the stands, inciting brawls when getting blown the F out @ home, getting mopped off the floor by a gutter team @ home several times, producing a sexy 2-5 division record thus far, cursing at championship coaches and challenging players to fights during games, they'd be sending a player to the All-Star game, they wouldn't be rumored every other week to be trading for K.G. or some other big chipper. I'll stop right there.



[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-30-2007 5:01 PM]
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
MS
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1/30/2007  5:55 PM
Wow Baby your salary reference proves how ****ing dumb you are, so he is not expected to play defense and we can't expect him to have a brain and play team ball because he is making 8million

Billups 6.3million
Prince 7.8 million
Gerald Wallce 5.5 million
Caron Butler 7.4 million
Okur 8.2 million
Artest 7 million to name a few
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