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nba finals teams and why we're not on the path
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MS
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1/25/2007  4:40 PM
Thats true Detriot should have lost to NJ in round two but kid was injured and they got an injured JO and then got an la team with an injured Malone....

However they should have beat the spurs the next year, Dumars has dropped the ball lately though, if he wasn't going to sign wallace he should have moved him, Darko should be a piston still if your passing on wade, melo, bosh. That one is baffling. He let Okur as well.....and god knows if chauncey leaves they are dead
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Bippity10
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1/25/2007  4:49 PM
The team taht wins the title is the team with the least amount of weaknesses. Stars make it easier for you to eliminate those weaknesses because they can cover for your role players. You can build a title contender without a superstar but it's harder because you have to really focus on balancing your roster with 8-10 gusy that really compliment each other.

We on the other hand go out and get 5 or 6 guys at one position that do the exact same thing. Have the exact same weaknesses and can't figure out what the problem is. Whether it's 9 undersized PF's or 4 undersized SG's. It's all the same. Until you focus on building a team with parts that can score, rebound, pass, defend etc. no matter who is on the court. It's going to be an impossible task.
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Solace
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1/25/2007  4:57 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

The team taht wins the title is the team with the least amount of weaknesses. Stars make it easier for you to eliminate those weaknesses because they can cover for your role players. You can build a title contender without a superstar but it's harder because you have to really focus on balancing your roster with 8-10 gusy that really compliment each other.

We on the other hand go out and get 5 or 6 guys at one position that do the exact same thing. Have the exact same weaknesses and can't figure out what the problem is. Whether it's 9 undersized PF's or 4 undersized SG's. It's all the same. Until you focus on building a team with parts that can score, rebound, pass, defend etc. no matter who is on the court. It's going to be an impossible task.

So true. The irony is we have four PGs... who all play like SGs. All like to shoot the ball, to all of them, passing is secondary, to all of them perimeter defense isn't even an afterthought. Somehow the combo doesn't work. Figure that one out.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
efw
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1/25/2007  4:57 PM
i don't know what criteria you're talking about but here are some current teams that had a good team in place of role players and then added a star:
phoenix
chicago
NJ (when they added Kidd)
TMS
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1/25/2007  5:07 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

The team taht wins the title is the team with the least amount of weaknesses. Stars make it easier for you to eliminate those weaknesses because they can cover for your role players. You can build a title contender without a superstar but it's harder because you have to really focus on balancing your roster with 8-10 gusy that really compliment each other.

We on the other hand go out and get 5 or 6 guys at one position that do the exact same thing. Have the exact same weaknesses and can't figure out what the problem is. Whether it's 9 undersized PF's or 4 undersized SG's. It's all the same. Until you focus on building a team with parts that can score, rebound, pass, defend etc. no matter who is on the court. It's going to be an impossible task.

So true. The irony is we have four PGs... who all play like SGs. All like to shoot the ball, to all of them, passing is secondary, to all of them perimeter defense isn't even an afterthought. Somehow the combo doesn't work. Figure that one out.

wouldn't Marcus Williams also fall under the same category? not to rehash the old debate here, but just wondering why you wanted MWill when you have that line of thinking.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Solace
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1/25/2007  5:10 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

The team taht wins the title is the team with the least amount of weaknesses. Stars make it easier for you to eliminate those weaknesses because they can cover for your role players. You can build a title contender without a superstar but it's harder because you have to really focus on balancing your roster with 8-10 gusy that really compliment each other.

We on the other hand go out and get 5 or 6 guys at one position that do the exact same thing. Have the exact same weaknesses and can't figure out what the problem is. Whether it's 9 undersized PF's or 4 undersized SG's. It's all the same. Until you focus on building a team with parts that can score, rebound, pass, defend etc. no matter who is on the court. It's going to be an impossible task.

So true. The irony is we have four PGs... who all play like SGs. All like to shoot the ball, to all of them, passing is secondary, to all of them perimeter defense isn't even an afterthought. Somehow the combo doesn't work. Figure that one out.

wouldn't Marcus Williams also fall under the same category? not to rehash the old debate here, but just wondering why you wanted MWill when you have that line of thinking.

If we drafted Marcus Williams, we'd *have* to trade some of our backcourt glut or trade Marcus Williams for more assets. Simply put, he's too good a player to pass up at that slot.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
MS
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1/25/2007  5:17 PM
Frankly it was stupid......

Marbury's knee may break down, Francis is breaking down and Crawford you can't count on. Nate is what he is.....

we needed a pg
TMS
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1/25/2007  5:26 PM
don't wanna get back into that whole debate again & hijack dj's thread... just wanted Solace to elaborate cuz the 2 concepts didn't seem to jive
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bippity10
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1/25/2007  6:52 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

The team taht wins the title is the team with the least amount of weaknesses. Stars make it easier for you to eliminate those weaknesses because they can cover for your role players. You can build a title contender without a superstar but it's harder because you have to really focus on balancing your roster with 8-10 gusy that really compliment each other.

We on the other hand go out and get 5 or 6 guys at one position that do the exact same thing. Have the exact same weaknesses and can't figure out what the problem is. Whether it's 9 undersized PF's or 4 undersized SG's. It's all the same. Until you focus on building a team with parts that can score, rebound, pass, defend etc. no matter who is on the court. It's going to be an impossible task.

So true. The irony is we have four PGs... who all play like SGs. All like to shoot the ball, to all of them, passing is secondary, to all of them perimeter defense isn't even an afterthought. Somehow the combo doesn't work. Figure that one out.

wouldn't Marcus Williams also fall under the same category? not to rehash the old debate here, but just wondering why you wanted MWill when you have that line of thinking.

Where does this false notion come from about Marcus being a shootfirst PG? Or a SG in a PG's body. Did Isiah sell us on this so we wouldn't be upset with the Knicks not picking him. The media talks about thsi, the fans talk about this. PRetty much anyone who didn't watch him at Uconn. He is a pass first PG and one of the best passers to come out of college in a while. Stop this nonsense about him being a scoring PG. He can score, but anyone that says he is shootfirst, I really have to question whether they have ever seen the guy play.

In NJ when he is on the floor he is often paired with JKidd. JKidd runs the offense and they ask Marcus to score. But his core as a player is a pass first PG.

This isn't a Marcus vs. Balkman debate. I personally didn't even mention Marcus. Someone else brought him up. It's a "what we need" conversation. I personally think if one of your key offensive players is 24 and plays a position that needs others to get him the ball. It makes sense to target a PG that is young and very good at making sure he gets the ball. A PG that is not shoot first/and can run an offense(like Marcus) to me just makes good sense. Now we didn't pick Marcus so we move on from him. That doesn't change my opinion that this is still what we need. Eddie is a Center that can be here for 10 years. Why not target a PG that can do the same?
I just hope that people will like me
TMS
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1/25/2007  7:03 PM
all i can base him on is what i've seen of him in games i've watched Bip... i'm not a huge Uconn fan like you so obviously you know more about him than i do... everytime I'VE seen him play, he's pretty much looked for his shot & has not been a good defender on the perimeter... playing w/J Kidd probably has a lot to do w/him shooting when they're on the floor together, but what about when Kidd's on the bench & M Will is orchestrating the offense? i don't get visions of John Stockton or Mark Jackson when i watch him running the offense, but that's just me... maybe he was a great passing PG in college, but i can't speak to stuff i haven't seen so i'll leave it at that.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
bettalaylow
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1/25/2007  7:06 PM
You might as well Asterisk Det championship via Kobe handing it to them on a silver platter because he was in full blown Tank B**** MODE, IT'S MY TEAM GET SHAQ OFF OF IT OR ELSE I"LL BOLT IN FA TO THE CLIPPERS.

Yea Kobe is a complete a**hole.
bobs3304
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1/25/2007  7:09 PM
Can Reggie Miller really be considered a "great" player?


DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
holfresh
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1/25/2007  9:11 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Can Reggie Miller really be considered a "great" player?

No and he is not top 50...

holfresh
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1/25/2007  10:02 PM
The converse argument is; does trying to obtain a franchise player through the draft guarantee us a shot at a championship..The answer is a resounding NO...How long as an organization are you willing to wait for that special player to fall in your lap?..We can all sit here and count the number of teams on our hands and toes that have set out on this path and are in no better position than the Knicks...How many years should an organization wait to have this to run its course?...The Clippers has been trying the last 22 years since moving to LA..Chicago has been trying for 9 years now since Jordan left...I personally believe Chicago will have a hard time beating the Knicks in a 5 game series if we are healthy and playing it right now...Lots of luck in involved in this process..Who knew Kobe would be Kobe..Certainly not the Hornets...What if Curry shows up next year and decides to play defense and rebound..Is that really a big if..Has he not amazed us with his offensive output so far this year..I for one think he can play defense and rebound, it requires effort and dedication...If this happens we have a franchise player...Thats where luck comes in..I had high hopes for Frye but he has been an utter dissapointment so far this year..I'm not giving up on Frye yet...Lee is a player we can build something special with..Marbs has alot a mileage but still has some good ball in him..Maybe he can hold on until these young players can learn the game and take the torch and go forth..Lots of ifs and moving pieces there but I prefer this than 10 years of hell in the mecca of basketball with the hopes that we land some one who will take us to the promise land...We are here now and have some pieces..Lets see if they can play to their potential..If they can the East is theirs in a few years...If not, in 2009 we have payroll of 41 mil and will be under the cap...The picture really isn't as bad as it being painted...
djsunyc
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1/25/2007  10:06 PM
Posted by holfresh:

The converse argument is; does trying to obtain a franchise player through the draft guarantee us a shot at a championship..The answer is a resounding NO...How long as an organization are you willing to wait for that special player to fall in your lap?..

great, so let's go the ZERO chance route instead of the 10% chance route.
djsunyc
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1/25/2007  10:07 PM
and how long am i willing to wait? i guess 34 years and counting...
Solace
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1/25/2007  10:15 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by holfresh:

The converse argument is; does trying to obtain a franchise player through the draft guarantee us a shot at a championship..The answer is a resounding NO...How long as an organization are you willing to wait for that special player to fall in your lap?..

great, so let's go the ZERO chance route instead of the 10% chance route.

Right. I never understand that logic.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
holfresh
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1/25/2007  10:27 PM

Detroit proved that building a team through trades and free agency can work...LA Lakers can be argued was built through trades and free agency as well..I think that figure is much less than 10 percent...Miami's most important piece is a trade...The Knicks will be under the cap in 2 years...Is that too much to ask to see if Curry, Frye and Lee is the answer?

Solace
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1/25/2007  10:47 PM
Posted by holfresh:

The Knicks will be under the cap in 2 years...

Do you honestly believe that? Which of our sophmores are we not resigning to make sure we have the cap room? All of them? That means no Nate, Frye, Lee, no more MLEs, and no increasing salary trades for the next few years.
Posted by holfresh:

Is that too much to ask to see if Curry, Frye and Lee is the answer?

Yes, it's too much to ask. They're the answer... just not to the right question.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
djsunyc
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1/25/2007  10:51 PM
Posted by holfresh:


Detroit proved that building a team through trades and free agency can work...LA Lakers can be argued was built through trades and free agency as well..I think that figure is much less than 10 percent...Miami's most important piece is a trade...The Knicks will be under the cap in 2 years...Is that too much to ask to see if Curry, Frye and Lee is the answer?


detroit built their team on defense and they are the one team in the past 30+ years that doesn't have a HOF player or perennial allstar that won a title. and you know who got them to play good enough together and win it.

and the knicks will not be under the cap in 2 years. do the math again.
nba finals teams and why we're not on the path

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