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BlueSeats
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1/28/2007  10:48 PM
Thing with Jeffries and Frye off the bench is the risk of them getting buried there. When you go to your bench you want someone who can change they dynamic of the game, like a defensive brut or a scorer.

Guys like Lee, Crawford, Q, even Nate would get the call much sooner in time then guys like Jeffries or Frye. So if you move them to the bench they become 7th, 8th, 9th men. And are either of them the type to get to work fast when they do come in?

That's why Isiah likes Lee and JC coming off the bench, he doesn't have to worry about them, he knows they'll get it going regardless.

By bringing Frye and Jeffries off the bench he risks losing them to the oblivion. Especially Jeffries, who gets outplayed by every other Knick at his position. Frye would even be a better SF than JJ2.
AUTOADVERT
Erniecat
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1/29/2007  1:42 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Thing with Jeffries and Frye off the bench is the risk of them getting buried there. When you go to your bench you want someone who can change they dynamic of the game, like a defensive brut or a scorer.

Guys like Lee, Crawford, Q, even Nate would get the call much sooner in time then guys like Jeffries or Frye. So if you move them to the bench they become 7th, 8th, 9th men. And are either of them the type to get to work fast when they do come in?

That's why Isiah likes Lee and JC coming off the bench, he doesn't have to worry about them, he knows they'll get it going regardless.

By bringing Frye and Jeffries off the bench he risks losing them to the oblivion. Especially Jeffries, who gets outplayed by every other Knick at his position. Frye would even be a better SF than JJ2.


I think after seeing him play all of 2 minutes, 33 seconds Sunday as Balkman went for 12 and 8 in 19 minutes, it's safe to say that Jeffries already has been buried. (At least that's my hope).
TheGame
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1/29/2007  8:07 AM
Posted by islesfan:

Jared "The Difference Maker" Jeffries got 4 more minutes than Big Snacks.

Jeffries does make a difference. When he sits on the bench our team plays better. Thus, he is the difference maker. IT was right all along.

Seriously, like Blueseats stated, IT brings Lee off the bench for energy. His hope is that he can get the starting unit playing well enough to get us off to good starts and then bring in Lee to keep things going. Plus, if you start Lee, we are still going to have some games where the team starts slow. If that happens, who are you going to bring off the bench for energy and a change of pace. Frye is not a change of pace/energy type player. Personally, I would start my top-5 players, but I understand why IT is bringing Lee off the bench and as long as Lee is getting good minutes, I am not going to go crazy over it.

[Edited by - TheGame on 01-29-2007 08:18 AM]
Trust the Process
bigbeast
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1/29/2007  8:52 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Thing with Jeffries and Frye off the bench is the risk of them getting buried there. When you go to your bench you want someone who can change they dynamic of the game, like a defensive brut or a scorer.

Guys like Lee, Crawford, Q, even Nate would get the call much sooner in time then guys like Jeffries or Frye. So if you move them to the bench they become 7th, 8th, 9th men. And are either of them the type to get to work fast when they do come in?

That's why Isiah likes Lee and JC coming off the bench, he doesn't have to worry about them, he knows they'll get it going regardless.

By bringing Frye and Jeffries off the bench he risks losing them to the oblivion. Especially Jeffries, who gets outplayed by every other Knick at his position. Frye would even be a better SF than JJ2.

Couldn't agree with you more.

"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
King1
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1/29/2007  9:31 AM
I can live with them not starting Lee. The start someone that will play defense for Frye. If he isnt hitting his jump shot he isnt bringing anything to the team
Anji
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2/3/2007  11:38 PM
Frye had everything going in the first half and played 27 minutes in total, scored 18 points got 7 rebounds with 2 assists plus a block. When Frye was on the floor with out curry he looked great and this is the kind of production that would have won the knicks 5 or 6 more games. It is very clear that Frye should come off the bench because he is more aggressive/focused and start David Lee (who had a sub-par game spitting time with Jerome tonight.)

Jared didn't even play and everything was fine tonight, I have no reason to post about him being a bench player anymore.

But I saw something about Crawford here http://www.nba.com/hotzones/ which tracks were players shoot best from on the floor. If you look, you will find that Crawford shoots a pretty consistance rate of 43 percent from every where on the floor except three places. And if Crawford began to stop shooting the 23 foot diagonal three point shot his average would go up .3 or .4 points(which is what most scorers like JC shoot). I think Isiah really needs to run more screens and curls for JC to get him taking more shots in these areas of the floors. Plus it would probably help keep teams from doubling Curry all the time.



[Edited by - anji on 02-04-2007 12:01 AM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
Nalod
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2/3/2007  11:40 PM
last year fryes minutes were bitched about as it was translated that Larry was holding him back.

Frye can't play big minutes most nites and be effective.

But he can be effective!
Anji
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2/4/2007  12:04 AM
^^^ Frye was the best front court player on the knicks last year. This year Curry has pushed him being an option. Frye needs time and space to work, thats why he should start off the bench.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
Anji
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2/4/2007  12:05 AM
If you go by the Hot Chart:http://www.nba.com/hotzones/
Curry shoots the same from the Left and Right block, but he should play the right because Frye likes the left block and Lee like likes the left side.

Frye Likes Left block and strate away from the doted line, foul line to the top of the cirlce in side the three point line. He should play the high post and Lee passing makes him good from up there as well.

Crawford should not feed the post unless he is the corner or strate away. He should get alot of screens and curls so he shoots inside more.

Marbury likes to shoot from the left side of the floor, so he should feed curry on the right and clear through to the other side. If the play is on the left it looks like Marbury operates really well 10-18 feet away from the basket on the base line. He should try to get to that area with a pump fake, stand inside the three point line or attack for a lay up.

Q shoots the three ball well from three every where but strate on. He should be trying to feed curry diagonally in to the post. His post up really isn't that effective unless he get's in the paint.

Nate seems to like the baselines and the right side of the floor.

Francis should never shoot unless it's a corner three.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
oohah
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2/4/2007  12:11 AM
There is no solid evidence that Frye is better off the bench. Last season he had much better numbers as a starter.

This season he has started every game to this point. He has been playing better as the season progresses. This was one game, and he has had games like this as a starter, recently.

However, if the point is that Frye produces more points when he can be featured as opposed to Curry, that may be true.

oohah



[Edited by - oohah on 04-02-2007 12:21 AM]
Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Anji
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2/4/2007  12:28 AM
Frye started 14 of 65 games last season. Why are you fighting this???? Everything in Frye gmaes seems to be geared towards him coming off the bench with Curry as the top Dog.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
oohah
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2/4/2007  12:33 AM
Posted by Anji:

Frye started 14 of 65 games last season. Why are you fighting this???? Everything in Frye gmaes seems to be geared towards him coming off the bench with Curry as the top Dog.

Fighting? I'm not sure what you mean. Curry is the top dog no matter what. I just don't think putting Frye on the bench and starting Lee & Jeffries is a good idea because we lose a lot of offensive ability. Other teams can double/triple team Curry and Jeffries and Lee won't make them pay by sticking the J as Frye has done since right after his 8 game slump to start the season. I think Jeffries is the one who should go to the bench.

In the 14 games Frye started last season, he had much better numbers than the 51 he came off the bench. What I am saying is there is no evidence yet that he is a better player off the bench. But if we want to compile the data we have, he has been better as a starter than as a bench player.

So why exactly should he come off the bench again? I hope it isn't because in the one game he came off the bench this season he had an good game, because he has had equally good games as a starter recently.

oohah



[Edited by - oohah on 04-02-2007 12:34 AM]
Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
djsunyc
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2/4/2007  12:37 AM
frye and curry just haven't "clicked" yet when playing together. will they? that's the million dollar question. but we can all agree that they just haven't yet.
oohah
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2/4/2007  12:44 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

frye and curry just haven't "clicked" yet when playing together. will they? that's the million dollar question. but we can all agree that they just haven't yet.

I think Curry has clicked and Frye is working his way to clickage. He has been handed the role that Allan Houston was going to play--the outside shooting double and triple team buster! He may be an perimeter player by nature, but this is a new role for him to adjust to, and he is doing it pretty well!

Frye is shooting 44.4 percent this season after starting out with an incredibly putrid 8 games. That means he has shot pretty well consistently to rehabilitate that FGP.

Last season Frye shot 47.7 percent and everyone was happy. I'm not sure why everyone is so down on him, it's like they can't let go of those first 8 games. I wish someone less lazy than I would calculate his shooting percentage after the first 8 games, I'll bet you it is pretty good!

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Anji
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2/4/2007  12:46 AM
Posted by oohah:
Posted by Anji:

Frye started 14 of 65 games last season. Why are you fighting this???? Everything in Frye gmaes seems to be geared towards him coming off the bench with Curry as the top Dog.

Fighting? I'm not sure what you mean. Curry is the top dog no matter what. I just don't think putting Frye on the bench and starting Lee & Jeffries is a good idea because we lose a lot of offensive ability. Other teams can double/triple team Curry and Jeffries and Lee won't make them pay by sticking the J as Frye has done since right after his 8 game slump to start the season. I think Jeffries is the one who should go to the bench.

In the 14 games Frye started last season, he had much better numbers than the 51 he came off the bench. What I am saying is there is no evidence yet that he is a better player off the bench. But if we want to compile the data we have, he has been better as a starter than as a bench player.

So why exactly should he come off the bench again? I hope it isn't because in the one game he came off the bench this season he had an good game, because he has had equally good games as a starter recently.

oohah



[Edited by - oohah on 04-02-2007 12:34 AM]
Jeffries isn't a starter any more. I don't think I can get stats that detailed, but everyone sees that Curry totally disrupts Frye and they don't play well together.

In theory Frye is making teams pay by hitting his jump shot when they try and double Curry. In actual game play, we run a couple of plays for Frye in the first quarter then sit him for Lee because he isn't really getting a chance to shoot when we dump it down to Curry. Lee helps Curry more and Frye scores more when the offense is ran threw him. Curry, Lee anf Frye dropped 54 points tonight.... even though they gave alot time to James. That's what the kninkcs need, we could get way more production out of these three if you didn't have Curry and Frye disruting each others offense to score.


[Edited by - anji on 02-04-2007 12:47 AM]

[Edited by - anji on 02-04-2007 12:49 AM]

[Edited by - anji on 02-04-2007 12:50 AM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
oohah
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2/4/2007  12:51 AM
Jeffries isn't a starter any more. I don't think I can get stats that detailed, but everyone sees that Curry totally disrupts Frye and they don't play well together.

In theory Frye is making teams play hitting his jump shot when they try and double Curry. In actual game play, we run a couple of plays for Frye in the first quarter then sit him for Lee when because he isn't really getting a chance to shoot when we dump it down to Curry.

I agree it started out that way, but Frye seems to be making the adjustment, he has been shooting well! I do agree that Frye might not get the scoring opportunities that he would with playing as the main front-court option, but I am not sure that it makes the team better is Frye comes off the bench.

I don't agree with the way Isiah has used Frye/Lee. I think they should start and play together with Curry. That lineup played well, all three of them.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
oohah
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2/4/2007  2:18 AM
Frye has been solid since his eight game slump.

Channing Frye since game 9 of the season:

5/10, 48% fgp, 12 points per game, 6 rebounds, 27 MPG.

Not that bad is it?

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
djsunyc
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2/4/2007  2:25 AM
Posted by oohah:

Frye has been solid since his eight game slump.

Channing Frye since game 9 of the season:

5/10, 48% fgp, 12 points per game, 6 rebounds, 27 MPG.

Not that bad is it?

oohah


so we have TMS as mr. crawford
sugarray as mr. curry
and you-hah as mr. frye

those aren't bad #'s, but those are exactly the same #'s as last season.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 02-04-2007 02:27 AM]
oohah
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2/4/2007  2:37 AM
so we have TMS as mr. crawford
sugarray as mr. curry
and you-hah as mr. frye

those aren't bad #'s, but those are exactly the same #'s as last season.

As long as it isn't Mrs. Frye!

The whole front court offense is geared to Eddie Curry. Eddie Curry's role in the offense has been greatly expanded, while Frye Frye's role has actually been narrowed since last season. But he is doing fine at it.

My feeling is that if Isiah got Frye the 20 shots per game or whatever Curry is getting, Frye could produce more points than Frye currently is producing. And honestly I thought that is what IT was going to do.

However, if IT tried to change Eddie's role and make him the supporting guy, I am not sure he would give you the same bang for the buck he does as "The Focus", so maybe he made the right call.

Has Frye complained? No. Did he break down and crumble after that terrible start? No. He just has taken the role he has been given, adjusted, and made a very nice recovery. He is young, smart, and hard-working. I really don't see what is not to like about what he brings to the game.

DJ, after seeing the numbers since the first 8 games, don't you think the perception/reaction to Frye this season has been totally shaped by his first 8 putrid games and folks have ignored his steady play since then?

oohah



[Edited by - oohah on 04-02-2007 02:40 AM]
Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
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