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frye: keep him or trade him?
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djsunyc
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we're now starting to see isiah get more and more comfortable with david lee down the stretch with eddy. it seems we go to frye early in the game to get him going but then his productions takes a big dip after the 1st quarter and definitely in the 2nd half. he's still picking up some bad fouls so that gets him out of the flow some of the games...but it's pretty apparent that he's restricted to offensive subs late in games and that's it. he's in his 2nd year and has a smooth jumper. and when he gets major burn without curry on the floor, he does get in the post more and gets to use that hook shot. should we play him more WITHOUT curry or should we begin to put feelers out there to see what his market value is? i feel that we can help our team balance out much more by trading him since his value will go down if he's playing a more of a backup role.
keep him
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playa2
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1/22/2007  10:36 AM
frye is too soft to keep to play in NYC, our starting pf should have a TUDE.

Channing Frye is a surburban dude plaing on a innercity team.

David Lee is more than enough, he has worked on his ft's and jump shooting...can't wait to see how much he will improve next yr.




[Edited by - playa2 on 01-22-2007 10:41]
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
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VDesai
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1/22/2007  10:38 AM
I've been a fan of his, but I think with the way our team is constituted and with Curry entrenched in the middle, his value to us might be higher as a trade chip than as a player.
izybx
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1/22/2007  10:41 AM
His value will be coming off the bench along with JJ. The dude is a hole in our SL right now.
Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  10:42 AM
now, there is something to be said in keeping all 3 and giving lee some time at the small forward spot. let them grow together. but this is where talent evaluation and advance scouting come in. does isiah believe that frye CAN play next to curry? does he believe lee CAN play sf? does he believe that all 3 can co-exist regardless of who starts and who doesn't? if so, then he's going to keep all three. but i feel that if we can get a long term starter at one of the perimeter positions, then we should trade one of them (imho frye) to get one.

we have alot of long term holes to fill - pg, sg, sf, and possibly pf. maybe frye helps us fill one of them IF he's not the anwer to the pf hole. (and i don't think he is)
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  11:07 AM
it's 14 to 11 here saying to trade him.
realgm has it 23 to 18 to keep him.

whatever the case, it seems pretty even that fans are on the fence with him. (unlike a david lee poll which would be a landslide to keep him)
TMS
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1/22/2007  11:24 AM
Frye & Jefferies for Etan Thomas, Jarvis Hayes & a future pick
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
PresIke
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1/22/2007  11:33 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

it's 14 to 11 here saying to trade him.
realgm has it 23 to 18 to keep him.

whatever the case, it seems pretty even that fans are on the fence with him. (unlike a david lee poll which would be a landslide to keep him)

C'mon DJ, you know us Knick/NY fans tend to be fickle when it comes to players we think are "soft." It's always "what have done for us lately," expecially when it comes to those who seem this way unless you've won a championship for a NY team, which suddenly turns the hardened "we don't want no softees 'cause this is NYC!" type of fans into apoligists for players who suddenly turn into scrubs (like Tino Martinez vs. Giambi when he first arrived on the Yankees). I can see Frye being moved in the right deal, but I'm not 100% sure I would even trade him for Ray Allen, as crazy as that sounds. Allen is on the downward swing of his career, although no major signs of decline yet but he isn't going to turn the Knicks into a championship contender, with our horrific defense. I'd rather see how the young guys grow, and Frye still has a great deal of potential. It's disappointing to see many of us already willing to run the guy out on a rail in the middle of his 2nd year in the league, when we've seen him do some really good things.


His D is weak, sure. But he's a valuable player in the NBA, with potential, that many teams I suspect would be interested in. However, his value is not as high as it was, so what's the point of dealing him if we know that there is a good chance he will be probably better down the road and you may not get equal value? Because he's cheap? (I decided to abstain from voting because I don't believe he HAS to be traded or HAS to stay).

I also believe your assertion that this has "ZERO" to do with David Lee is reaching. You must know that people think he should be traded because we have Lee. If Lee was not on this team do you honestly believe that the poll would be the same? It doesn't ONLY have to do with Lee, and surely the issue of Frye's and Lee's defense is real, but the debate about who to keep between them is clearly part of the equation.

I don't think we can predict Frye's ceiling just yet.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  11:41 AM
Posted by PresIke:
Posted by djsunyc:

it's 14 to 11 here saying to trade him.
realgm has it 23 to 18 to keep him.

whatever the case, it seems pretty even that fans are on the fence with him. (unlike a david lee poll which would be a landslide to keep him)

C'mon DJ, you know us Knick/NY fans tend to be fickle when it comes to players we think are "soft." It's always "what have done for us lately," expecially when it comes to those who seem this way unless you've won a championship for a NY team, which suddenly turns the hardened "we don't want no softees 'cause this is NYC!" type of fans into apoligists for players who suddenly turn into scrubs (like Tino Martinez vs. Giambi when he first arrived on the Yankees). I can see Frye being moved in the right deal, but I'm not 100% sure I would even trade him for Ray Allen, as crazy as that sounds. Allen is on the downward swing of his career, although no major signs of decline yet but he isn't going to turn the Knicks into a championship contender, with our horrific defense. I'd rather see how the young guys grow, and Frye still has a great deal of potential. It's disappointing to see many of us already willing to run the guy out on a rail in the middle of his 2nd year in the league, when we've seen him do some really good things.


His D is weak, sure. But he's a valuable player in the NBA, with potential, that many teams I suspect would be interested in. However, his value is not as high as it was, so what's the point of dealing him if we know that there is a good chance he will be probably better down the road and you may not get equal value? Because he's cheap? (I decided to abstain from voting because I don't believe he HAS to be traded or HAS to stay).

I also believe your assertion that this has "ZERO" to do with David Lee is reaching. You must know that people think he should be traded because we have Lee. If Lee was not on this team do you honestly believe that the poll would be the same? It doesn't ONLY have to do with Lee, and surely the issue of Frye's and Lee's defense is real, but the debate about who to keep between them is clearly part of the equation.

I don't think we can predict Frye's ceiling just yet.

when i posed this question, this really had nothing to do with david lee. this is about frye and whether we should keep him, even if he ends up being a 6th man. he has scoring skill so there's nothing wrong with having a guy like that on the roster.

but it still is interesting to see where he ranks in fans view. last year, he was the "chosen" one. everybody loved him. but watching him come back virtually the same player may have caused some fans to take a step back and re-assess their outlook on him.

and i think many people that posted here that kept bringing up frye and curry's lack of defense as a reason they couldn't really start next to each other (as early as last may/june) is starting to see their fears somewhat come to a realization.

forget "soft" or any of that jazz. the guy has a sweet stroke but it's obvious this team is now eddy's and he is the focal point. is frye a good complement to him or not b/c at this time, that's the question we must ask about all our players, are they a good complement to eddy or not?

i think the kind of deal we should be looking for is a charlie v/tj ford type of swap. young for young, just another position.
TMS
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1/22/2007  11:45 AM
j o s h
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King1
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1/22/2007  11:45 AM
This teams has a lot of holes and the two best trading chips are Frye and Lee. Trade one and fill another hole. I dont think either one of the kids have tapped their potential. Everyone says Frye is a great scorer and what I see is a man averging 10 points a game on 43% from the field.
TMS
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1/22/2007  11:51 AM




After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
kam77
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1/22/2007  11:53 AM
Too early to trade Frye or Lee this season. You guys saying to make a trade, why not wait til next year? His value aint going down, he's a 2nd year player for cripes sake who has barely played 82 games.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
bigbeast
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1/22/2007  11:57 AM
Posted by TMS:

j o s h

I would love to see Josh Smith here, but I doubt ATL gives him up despite the sur-plus of forwards they have.

The other Josh might be getable, however. Would trade Frye in a packaged to get Childress? Just throwing it out there.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  11:58 AM
Posted by kam77:

Too early to trade Frye or Lee this season. You guys saying to make a trade, why not wait til next year? His value aint going down, he's a 2nd year player for cripes sake who has barely played 82 games.

why won't his value go down? if lee is getting all 4th quarter minutes, then won't other gm's realize this if it continues?

the longer you wait, the longer it could bite you in the tail.

colangelo traded charlie v at the highest his value could have been. he assessed his team's needs and made the move. he knows charlie could've done much better elsewhere but his max has been reached on the raptors so he went to fill another hole.

how much better is frye going to get here with not only the offense running through curry, but having to guard other team's pf's where he gets abused every night. and then gets in foul trouble against the better ones?

sometimes you sell high.
bigbeast
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1/22/2007  12:00 PM
This is a tough call. On one hand, Frye on paper and at times on the court is a good fit next to Curry. Excellent range on his shot and opens up the lane for Curry. Also shows flashes of post play.

On the other hand, we still have glaring holes on this team namely a good wing player and Frye might be the only chip to help fill that void being that we don't have any high draft picks.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
TMS
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1/22/2007  12:02 PM
Posted by bigbeast:
Posted by TMS:

j o s h

I would love to see Josh Smith here, but I doubt ATL gives him up despite the sur-plus of forwards they have.

The other Josh might be getable, however. Would trade Frye in a packaged to get Childress? Just throwing it out there.

nah, Childress is a clone of Dermarr Johnson... we don't need him... Channing has a way higher upside than Josh 2... Josh Smith is the guy i want...

Frye, Nate & CHI's pick for Josh... that's a lot to give up but i really like Smith's upside.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
kam77
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1/22/2007  12:05 PM
His value is established already djsu. The value is what it is. Not as high as last season, but higher than it was a couple months ago when he was rusty coming back from two separate injuries. Its not getting worse as he is showing his regained shooting touch now. So what he isn't playing crunch minutes, he's still a starter, lottery pick, former rookie of the month winner.

Where does it say his value is decreasing? Where do you make that LEAP? Why are you so impatient djsu?
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  12:14 PM
Posted by kam77:

His value is established already djsu. The value is what it is. Not as high as last season, but higher than it was a couple months ago when he was rusty coming back from two separate injuries. Its not getting worse as he is showing his regained shooting touch now. So what he isn't playing crunch minutes, he's still a starter, lottery pick, former rookie of the month winner.

Where does it say his value is decreasing? Where do you make that LEAP? Why are you so impatient djsu?

it's not about impatience. do you see his defense improving to the point where you're comfortable with him and curry as the starting frontcourt?

they both make up the worst defensive frontcourt in the league right now.

as the season wears on, he's going to slowly become a first half player. they go to him early but as the game goes on, we sort of stop. his #'s will start taking hits as isiah has to play his best guys to win games now that each game takes on a heightened importance as the end of the season approaches.
kam77
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1/22/2007  12:47 PM
even if i did not disagree with your forecast, i would still counsel no trades this year. let the guys play and not worry about trade.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
djsunyc
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1/22/2007  12:53 PM
Posted by kam77:

even if i did not disagree with your forecast, i would still counsel no trades this year. let the guys play and not worry about trade.

well i agree about the no trades b/c isiah may not be back next year. unless they are for equal or less years on contracts.
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