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What will it take for the fans to trust Isiah & his Knicks?
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Bippity10
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10/27/2006  12:34 PM
I'm with Allanfan on this one. As far as the players earning my trust. It's easy. They don't even have to win a lot of games. They will earn my trust and respect if they shut up, stop making excuses, stop whining, stop blaming other people and just go out and play your assessss off. Do that and start out 5-15 and I'm still hanging in there. But after last year if I hear one more excuse(besides the 50 I've heard Isiah use so far) I'm going to lose it.
I just hope that people will like me
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TMS
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10/27/2006  1:09 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

I'm with Allanfan on this one. As far as the players earning my trust. It's easy. They don't even have to win a lot of games. They will earn my trust and respect if they shut up, stop making excuses, stop whining, stop blaming other people and just go out and play your assessss off. Do that and start out 5-15 and I'm still hanging in there. But after last year if I hear one more excuse(besides the 50 I've heard Isiah use so far) I'm going to lose it.

agreed... i felt the same way when the Knicks were losing some games the past few years as long as they showed some fight & toughness... if i see guys coasting, giving up easy baskets, not hustling on defense, etc., then i'ma lose it too.

[Edited by - TMS on 10-27-2006 1:09 PM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Nalod
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10/27/2006  1:48 PM
Posted by TheGame:
Originally posted by Nolad:
You have to respect any organization that has the balls to trade away Starbury. Especially Phoenix. They didn't get much back for him, but somtimes when you have a plan you can take steps to achieve them.

Well, what if Steve Nash had decided to stay in Dallas. Where would Pheonix's plan be then after they basically gave away Marbury? My point is that you can have a plan, but if things don't go as expected, your plan is going to fail and you are going to look like you had no plan at all. IT had a plan and took risks on Curry, Q, and Marbury. So far the plan has not worked and because of that, you conclude there was no plan. What if LB had not been trying to sabotage the season? What if Curry had been in shape and improved the fundamentals of his game? What if Q's back did not give him problems last year and his brother was not killed? If those things happen, we would have an entirely different view of this team and more people would be saying that IT's plan is paying some dividends.

If nash stayed then they are big under the cap, and who knows what plan b might have been. They might have done someting even smarter for all we know!

Its easy to look backwards, but I preach thru the years to have a plan. Even when hiring coaches, don't hire the name, hire the fit. And if your going to hire the name, then make it fit!

Good teams need to get buy injurys. Great teams get lucky. WE were neither.

Q's did not make or break this team last year. Nor was it Larry, it was a dysfunctional planning process that is chasing its tale.

WE have been doing this for about 28 years! Enough!

Bippity10
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10/27/2006  1:54 PM
You have to put yourself in position to get "lucky". You have to be in the lottery to draft the next superstar. YOu have to be under or at the cap to sign the great free-agent. You have tradeable players that other teams covet to trade for a star. If you don't put yourself in position to acheive any of these three things you are right it's going to take a lot of luck.

Decide on a plan. Stick with a plan. Sooner or later you will find yourself getting "lucky"

[Edited by - bippity10 on 10-27-2006 1:55 PM]
I just hope that people will like me
gunsnewing
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10/27/2006  1:58 PM
great post Nalod...its very hard to trust anything Isiah does at this point.
BlueSeats
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10/27/2006  2:01 PM
Nash was a great pickup for Phoenix, but they knew what they were trying to do and they'd have found other means, though probably no one would have served them quite as well.

but look at Colangelo now in TO. He wants to do similar things there, so he picks up TJ ford, who when healthy is probably as close to nash as you can get in this league. he also goes and signs a bunch of interesting Euros, and FWIW, I think they went 6-0 in preseason, ANd they'll be way under the cap this summer.

They have a method.
Nalod
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10/27/2006  2:04 PM
What would make me trust Isiah?

Letter or resignation or an obituary!
gunsnewing
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10/27/2006  2:05 PM
When you look at the past problems the guys Isiah has brought in why cant you say the same? Marbury has never won, Curry has always had work ethic/weight issues, Crawford has always had bad shot selection.. these are the guys Isiah risked the future of the franchise on. Could they work out? Of course.. there's always the possibility but is that a good bet?

Hey, maybe George Bush tax the rich and give it to the middle class. Its possible right?

That is a great point Fish! At least Layden had an idea of how to build a winner and a team that plays hard every night and never blamed anyone but themselves.

Isiah's idea of building a winner is being Young & Athletic, completely overlooking defense, rebounding & leadership...lets starphuch instead of trying to fix the cap problems and landing a true superstar/leader while stockpiling on lottery talent. Lets just trade for Mo Taylor and sign Jerome James for 5yrs!!



[Edited by - gunsnewing on 10-27-2006 2:06 PM]
gunsnewing
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10/27/2006  2:14 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

You have to put yourself in position to get "lucky". You have to be in the lottery to draft the next superstar. YOu have to be under or at the cap to sign the great free-agent. You have tradeable players that other teams covet to trade for a star. If you don't put yourself in position to acheive any of these three things you are right it's going to take a lot of luck.

Decide on a plan. Stick with a plan. Sooner or later you will find yourself getting "lucky"

[Edited by - bippity10 on 10-27-2006 1:55 PM]


Amen to that! thats what I wanted 4yrs ago instead we add James, Taylor, Roses, Francis since
SlimPack
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10/27/2006  2:31 PM
a winning season, and in some poster's case two. and in other poster's case the acquisition of franchise talent, of course with no high draft picks or cap space itll be virtually impossible to acquire said talent, but im just speaking in hypotheticals here.

[Edited by - slimpack on 10-27-2006 2:31 PM]
MS
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10/27/2006  3:04 PM
RV are you Isiah

Although that was well written and almost believable......

Lets review
Go after the cornerstones of a losing franchise that hasn;t sniffed the playoffs and give them contract when no other team will. Check....

Trade away anyone that doesn't fit with your self proclaimed franchise talent check....

Blame Larry Brown for everything including making the deals that the gm has to sign off on check.....

Bring in career losers with no playoff victories Crawford, Curry, Marbury, Mo Taylor, Francis, check......

Bring in 15 players without have a true facilitator who enjoys giving up the ball check.........

Bring in players that care only about themselves, Marbury, J.Rose, Eddy Curry, JJ1, Francis, Nate check......

Sexual harrass employs, belittled coaches, make the knicks the biggest joke in all of sports in three years......CHECK
nyk4ever
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10/27/2006  3:05 PM
Posted by MS:

RV are you Isiah

Although that was well written and almost believable......

Lets review
Go after the cornerstones of a losing franchise that hasn;t sniffed the playoffs and give them contract when no other team will. Check....

Trade away anyone that doesn't fit with your self proclaimed franchise talent check....

Blame Larry Brown for everything including making the deals that the gm has to sign off on check.....

Bring in career losers with no playoff victories Crawford, Curry, Marbury, Mo Taylor, Francis, check......

Bring in 15 players without have a true facilitator who enjoys giving up the ball check.........

Bring in players that care only about themselves, Marbury, J.Rose, Eddy Curry, JJ1, Francis, Nate check......

Sexual harrass employs, belittled coaches, make the knicks the biggest joke in all of sports in three years......CHECK

Isiah has passed with flying colors!
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
martin
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10/27/2006  3:07 PM
Posted by MS:

RV are you Isiah

Although that was well written and almost believable......

Lets review
Go after the cornerstones of a losing franchise that hasn;t sniffed the playoffs and give them contract when no other team will. Check....

Trade away anyone that doesn't fit with your self proclaimed franchise talent check....

Blame Larry Brown for everything including making the deals that the gm has to sign off on check.....

Bring in career losers with no playoff victories Crawford, Curry, Marbury, Mo Taylor, Francis, check......

Bring in 15 players without have a true facilitator who enjoys giving up the ball check.........

Bring in players that care only about themselves, Marbury, J.Rose, Eddy Curry, JJ1, Francis, Nate check......

Sexual harrass employs, belittled coaches, make the knicks the biggest joke in all of sports in three years......CHECK

oh man that's funny.

and it's true.
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nyk4ever
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10/27/2006  4:53 PM
What will make me trust Isiah? Well...

-A winning record or is that too much to ask, I'm not asking for multiple.. just ONE
-not making a trade where the Knicks get hosed
-not trading for other teams castoffs and malcontents

Oh and a trade that doesn't send the other team 2 lottery picks.

Isiah has a loooong way too go.

[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-27-2006 4:54 PM]
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
McK1
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10/27/2006  5:13 PM
always felt Isiah coaching this team (the guards in particular) would be the best option so he and Stiph gets an open minded look to start the season.

Stiph takes a backseat to Steve and NY may be finally on to something
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
What will it take for the fans to trust Isiah & his Knicks?

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