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Are Eddie and Frye untouchable?
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SugarRayRichardson
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10/23/2006  11:03 AM
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by fishmike:

Crawford probably the most complete guard we have
Sometimes I don't know what games you guys are watching?


What guard is more complete? Jclutch gives you outside shooting, driving ability, rebounds, assists, speed, long arms, leaping ability, dunks, liked by teammates, coachable, can feed the post, can throw the lob, and when a big shot needs to be taken he makes it instead of running from it. He isnt a master at all these things but which of our guards can do them all?

[Edited by - SugarRayRichardson on 10-23-2006 11:07 AM]
I LOVED how Curry just exploded in the 4th, speaking as a fan of the Raptors, Curry looked well, scary I think is the word. Or Shaq-like Curry: 19.1ppg-7.3rpg-58%fg
AUTOADVERT
djsunyc
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10/23/2006  11:05 AM
what if francis works out here? do they give credit to isiah or lb?
what if francis is a bust? who gets the blame, isiah or lb?
what if francis doesn't get traded? then was isiah the one that really wanted him?

we can revisit those questions later in the season.
fishmike
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10/23/2006  11:08 AM
funny, because while Francis *can* do all those things all I see is him dribble out the clock, then take a jumper or his guy off the dribble.
He hasnt defended anyone in years
He's quit on 2 coaches
He's been a problem on the last 2 teams he was one, NOT including ours

There's no doubt Francis and Marbury are far superior in their ability to score and beat their man.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Swishfm3
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10/23/2006  11:16 AM
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by fishmike:

Crawford probably the most complete guard we have
Sometimes I don't know what games you guys are watching?

i'm surprised comments like these still surprise you.


PREDICTION:

Francis WILL be moved by the deadline along with one of our rookies from last year...
izybx
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10/23/2006  11:18 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:
We arent going to be offered anything crazy for these guys. I think its worthwhile to sit on them.

What makes you think that? Would you trade Frye this season and our pick for a top 5 pick from this years draft?

...maybe. Depends if top five mean #1 or #5. Huge difference. But im not looking to trade Frye. I just bought his jersey
Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
izybx
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10/23/2006  11:20 AM
[I was not for the curry trade and I fear he is the second coming of oliver miller.[/quote]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. CMON MAN!

Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
fishmike
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10/23/2006  11:24 AM
Posted by Swishfm3:
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by fishmike:

Crawford probably the most complete guard we have
Sometimes I don't know what games you guys are watching?

i'm surprised comments like these still surprise you.


PREDICTION:

Francis WILL be moved by the deadline along with one of our rookies from last year...
Isiah's deadline trades dont usually work out that well

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
djsunyc
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10/23/2006  11:25 AM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by Swishfm3:
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by fishmike:

Crawford probably the most complete guard we have
Sometimes I don't know what games you guys are watching?

i'm surprised comments like these still surprise you.


PREDICTION:

Francis WILL be moved by the deadline along with one of our rookies from last year...
Isiah's deadline trades dont usually work out that well

zach randolph....welcome to ny!!!
martin
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10/23/2006  11:26 AM
Posted by izybx:
I was not for the curry trade and I fear he is the second coming of oliver miller.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. CMON MAN!

Curry is physically better than Oliver could EVER be. Miller had more savy, smarts than Curry will ever have.
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TMS
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10/23/2006  12:14 PM
Posted by fishmike:

Being that Franbury is untradable, Crawford probably the most complete guard we have we are built around scoring combo guard that dont defend, and two skilled frontcourt guys who are as bad on help D as anyone in the league.

a)Do people think we can win with that formula
b)whats the best way to go about changing it?

Also, attaching Frye/Curry to Francis might be the only way to move Steve.


a - what do u define as "winning" though? you mean win a title? no way... not as long as Marbury is the best player on this roster... if you're talking about making the playoffs, i think they can.

b - i would trade Frye & Nate in a Francis deal if we were getting back KG or Jermaine O'Neal... we need a go to guy on this team... we don't currently have one... i think we have to keep Curry cuz there's no way we'd ever get fair value for him back in a trade, especially considering everything we gave up to get him in the first place... we need to give him at least another season to see if he'll ever live up to his expectations.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
fishmike
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10/23/2006  12:54 PM
a - winning in the playoffs. A team that should be advancing every year. The Nets may not be a realistic title team, but you look at them every year and expect them to advance.

b - is Frye/Nate/Francis fair value for KG or Oneil? I just dont see how it is. While we may not get back what WE paid for Curry I still have no doubt he's got a lot of value. Look at Dampier and what he was paid... Curry is a much better piece IMO. But if you trade him you need to get the PF compliment to play next to Frye who moves to center. I just dont know who that is thats remotely available. Hell.. Elton Brand would look great, but its not going to happen
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
TMS
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10/23/2006  1:01 PM
Posted by fishmike:

b - is Frye/Nate/Francis fair value for KG or Oneil? I just dont see how it is. While we may not get back what WE paid for Curry I still have no doubt he's got a lot of value. Look at Dampier and what he was paid... Curry is a much better piece IMO. But if you trade him you need to get the PF compliment to play next to Frye who moves to center. I just dont know who that is thats remotely available. Hell.. Elton Brand would look great, but its not going to happen

i'd throw in CHI's pick along w/Jalen's contract & take on some of their garbage if i had to in order to make it work... & i'd easily trade Curry for Brand, & throw in Balkman & Nate to boot.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
rvhoss
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10/23/2006  1:17 PM
i think the key to this statement is in bold below.

Dampier is making MORE than curry (I think, someone will definitely check that for me) and does NOTHING for dallas.

Curry atleast in his failure underachieving year gave us 16/6.

as far as centers go, that's Amazing in this day and age.

With a year behind him and isiah coaching him, he's going to get better.

Dumping francis should not be the goal...getting better should be.

And dumping francis because everyone THINKS he is a malcontent and it won't work out is not enough for me to say "let's toss in one of our bigs"

There is always an adjustment period...the first year of any of these trades will result in nothing. (except for when we got marbury, we seemed to get better and make the playoffs, then everyone got hurt TT, H20, etc.).

I know all the speculation is fun and all, but Curry Frye are the future and are untouchable.

KG is starphucking, pure and simple...he and marbury will not do anything by themselves.

and frye and lee immediately get marginalized in the offense as we run through KG.

I think Frye and Curry = KG IHMO.

and we have a longer lease on those two...KG has maybe 3 years tops left as a superstar...and until he was paired with spreewell and cassell, he never got out of the first round either.
Posted by fishmike:

a - winning in the playoffs. A team that should be advancing every year. The Nets may not be a realistic title team, but you look at them every year and expect them to advance.

b - is Frye/Nate/Francis fair value for KG or Oneil? I just dont see how it is. While we may not get back what WE paid for Curry I still have no doubt he's got a lot of value. Look at Dampier and what he was paid... Curry is a much better piece IMO. But if you trade him you need to get the PF compliment to play next to Frye who moves to center. I just dont know who that is thats remotely available. Hell.. Elton Brand would look great, but its not going to happen

all kool aid all the time.
technomaster
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10/23/2006  2:25 PM
In the long run, I really don't think we'll ever get the most out of either Frye or Curry if they stay paired together. The ideal situation is to get a defensive/stable/solid big man next to either one of them (Think PJ Brown, Charles Oakley, Horace Grant) and call it a day.

I don't feel comfortable letting these young "franchise" big men take charges. They should be in the air challenging shots while their brute partner takes the hits.

I wonder if either David Lee or Renaldo is rugged enough to defend big men in that role. Maybe we already have the right player in Malik Rose. We can afford to have a small defensive big man in the game now that we have an oversized SF (Jeffries) in the mix.

Pair Eddie or Frye up with a guard and upgrade.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
fishmike
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10/23/2006  2:48 PM
this is why I wanted to sign Reggie Evans. Great post... remember Ewing and Cartwright were paired together (poorly... cough cough oohah) and the trade was made for Chi, who got equal value.

I think Frye is the guy I want to keep.
He's skilled
He works hard
He's always in shape and prepared
He's better at center than at PF (the #'s prove this last year)

Another guy I covet is Ronnie Brewer. I think Curry for Boozer (who could probably benefit from a new start) and Brewer makes some sense also. Boozer is a house next to Frye (especially on the defensive glass) and Brewer is long athletic perimeter stopper I covet.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
nyk4ever
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10/23/2006  2:54 PM
Posted by fishmike:

this is why I wanted to sign Reggie Evans. Great post... remember Ewing and Cartwright were paired together (poorly... cough cough oohah) and the trade was made for Chi, who got equal value.

I think Frye is the guy I want to keep.
He's skilled
He works hard
He's always in shape and prepared
He's better at center than at PF (the #'s prove this last year)

Another guy I covet is Ronnie Brewer. I think Curry for Boozer (who could probably benefit from a new start) and Brewer makes some sense also. Boozer is a house next to Frye (especially on the defensive glass) and Brewer is long athletic perimeter stopper I covet.

I agree about Boozer Fish and Brewer is an excellent young player, I'm really looking forward to seeing what he does in the NBA. I would make that trade in a second, I feel that Boozer is the kind of player that would really balance this team out. He's a banger and he can score inside consistantly. Only problem I have, good luck getting Jerry Sloan to accept a deal for Curry. Guarenteed he'd ask Larry's opinion of Curry and I think its safe to say his opinion wouldn't be glowing.
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TMS
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10/23/2006  3:23 PM
the scouting report on Brewer caught my eye before the draft... i mentioned that i wanted Isiah to trade up to get him if he could... that Curry for Boozer/Brewer trade sounds good if it were on the table, but like you said i doubt Sloan takes that deal.

what about Jamal, Frye & Malik for Boozer & Brewer? then maybe sign Jay Will to take the 12th man spot on the roster.

C - Curry / Big Hemorrhoid
PF - Boozer / Lee
SF - Jared / Q Rich / Balkman
SG - Francis / Brewer
PG - Marbury / Nate / Jay Will
IA - Collins / Jalen / Skita
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fishmike
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10/23/2006  3:26 PM
Jamal and Frye are the ones I want to keep. Pass for now. I think Eddie's got a lot of value and would do well with AK47 to help him on help. I think Sloan may be more sick of Boozer than anything else. If I have to include Nate I do it. No way we are getting = value for Curry but we can do good. I think he's got good value, even after last year.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
technomaster
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10/23/2006  3:58 PM
I like Boozer a lot-- he's fundamentally sound (on offense). On defense, he's no Oakley, but at the same time, he's no Curry either. We won't need to worry about him fouling out.

He doesn't have the upside or the light feet of Curry, but what we'd get is realized potential and a more pure PF. It still won't fix our defensive big man issue, but we'll at least be getting a beast of a rebounder (probably few arguments over his rebounding ability).

Any Curry trade will begin with the shape of his heart - while the Knicks were willing to hire a medical staff around the heart issue, other teams may not be into it.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
rvhoss
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10/23/2006  4:01 PM
yeah, eddy and frye are untouchable until we can see what we have as a team.

year two, let's see how it unfolds, but staying with the topic, they are both untouchable.

Any player under 27 is untouchable IMHO.

Edit:
do you really think that there is a serious trade out there that makes us an contender this year?
If not, then why give up our future?

[Edited by - rvhoss on 10-23-2006 4:02 PM]
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Are Eddie and Frye untouchable?
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