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OT: Major terror plot thwarted
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nykshaknbake
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8/10/2006  6:05 PM
I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.
AUTOADVERT
Rich
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8/10/2006  6:08 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.

Bullsh it.

A lot of us would like a president who puts national security above politics, and who didn't get us into a war in Iraq based on lies that has spawned terrorists and weakened the war on terror.
Vmart
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8/10/2006  6:21 PM
Its better to be safe then sorry. When the news came out I felt the same way what a joke they are using thier fear machine again to go into another war. But in this time we can not take anything for granted. We have reached a no tuning back point now and we will now have to live in fear just as our government wants us to live. We will never know if a plot is real or some government coverup. Basically this is wag the dog. We will never know the truth.
nykshaknbake
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8/10/2006  6:25 PM
Maybe those of you that actually acknowledge that there are terrorists that exist that is. It seems about half of you think any terrorism is ultimately initiated and paid for by our gov't to control us. But then again judging from the bitterness expressed, I still think lots would have been happier had something exploded.
Posted by Rich:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.

Bullsh it.

A lot of us would like a president who puts national security above politics, and who didn't get us into a war in Iraq based on lies that has spawned terrorists and weakened the war on terror.
firefly
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8/10/2006  6:54 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

Maybe those of you that actually acknowledge that there are terrorists that exist that is. It seems about half of you think any terrorism is ultimately initiated and paid for by our gov't to control us. But then again judging from the bitterness expressed, I still think lots would have been happier had something exploded.
Posted by Rich:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.

Bullsh it.

A lot of us would like a president who puts national security above politics, and who didn't get us into a war in Iraq based on lies that has spawned terrorists and weakened the war on terror.

Yeah, there are a lot of very strange responses in this thread. Living in England, I have no doubt whatsoever that this threat was real. I dont live with the Bush politics etc. so maybe I have a more objective view. This threat didnt come from the US. It came from Pakistan and England, so I dont really see what involvement the US govornment would have in it.

A few weeks ago there was a major counter-terrorist operation in London(Forest Gate) and two brothers were arrested. One was shot in the shoulder during the arrests. They were subsequently freed, but my opinion is that should these two be found completely innocent (which by the way, Im not so sure they are, a look into their background has already found an inordinate amount of cash, and possible drugdealing), I dont blame the police or government for doing it. The counter-terrorist guys are doing everything they can to prevent another 9/11, and I support them fully. I know I will never do anything that could possibly be construed as associated with terrorism, so I know I am safe from that.

I cant see any reason why the police and govornment would put the public through such nuisance at airports etc. I am 100% sure this threat was clear and present, and I truly cannot understand some of the reactions on this thread. From the paranoid (Rich) to the ridiculous (earthmansurfer).
Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream things that never were and ask why not?
TMS
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8/10/2006  7:24 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

That's bullShit. Even if you think we are terorrists the fact that this plot happened, isn't enough to label these guys terrorists? How are they not? Explain your enlightened 'perception' to me.
Posted by TMS:

who are the real terrorists? us or them? it's all a matter of perception.

imagine you're living in Palestine... bombs are shaking your roof every night... you live in fear of your life every single day... who do you consider the terrorists then?

again, as i said, it's all a matter of perception... not quite sure why you're getting upset over that comment.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Rich
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8/10/2006  8:02 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

Maybe those of you that actually acknowledge that there are terrorists that exist that is. It seems about half of you think any terrorism is ultimately initiated and paid for by our gov't to control us. But then again judging from the bitterness expressed, I still think lots would have been happier had something exploded.
Posted by Rich:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.

Bullsh it.

A lot of us would like a president who puts national security above politics, and who didn't get us into a war in Iraq based on lies that has spawned terrorists and weakened the war on terror.

What are you nuts? Who the f* ck thinks terrorists don't exist?

Stop parroting the RNC talking points and think for yourself.

Our borders are not secured. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

We don't check the cargo bays of planes. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

We have underfunded homeland security because of the war in Iraq. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

What's your response? You question my patriotism by saying I wouuld rather let people die than help Bush.

Nothing can help Bush. The majority of the American people now know he has made us less safe from terrorists.
Rich
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8/10/2006  8:11 PM
Terrorism expert Roger Cressey on MSNBC: "The British are better than us when it comes to the credibility question, so I'll trust them."
arkrud
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8/10/2006  10:07 PM
I am not afraid of the terrorism even after this event.
You guys have no idea what the fear is.
I was leaving 30 years in Soviet Union and I know what the fear is. When you live can be destroyed by the Communist Government machine any day and any time. And it was good times - my parents remember the time when people was taken from home any time of the day and disappeared in Siberia forever just because of the letter from the neighbor which want you gone.
You are leaving in US and Britain enjoying the protection and democracy and you are afraid because of 21 crazy man want to blow the Plaines. Common. They are good enemies. We should go over them and the courtiers who harbor them like Iran, Syria, Palestine, etc. and just crush them to nothings. Their people leave in fear all their live and we can free them forever this way or another. We should be grateful to Israel who is doing dirty job for us. Instead a lot of "humanists" are crying about civilian casualties and similar crap.
They want us to be afraid - they will not get it from me. They will not get it from Israel. They will not get it from Russia. They have no chance.
.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
nykshaknbake
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8/10/2006  10:47 PM
So basically these guys plotting to blow up planes are nice folks..depending on your perception.
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

That's bullShit. Even if you think we are terorrists the fact that this plot happened, isn't enough to label these guys terrorists? How are they not? Explain your enlightened 'perception' to me.
Posted by TMS:

who are the real terrorists? us or them? it's all a matter of perception.

imagine you're living in Palestine... bombs are shaking your roof every night... you live in fear of your life every single day... who do you consider the terrorists then?

again, as i said, it's all a matter of perception... not quite sure why you're getting upset over that comment.
nykshaknbake
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8/10/2006  10:53 PM
Hit a chord did we?

Who questioned your patriotism? Or maybe you what I said is true of you?

Hey Bush has doone a terrible job. He's the dumbest US prez in recent history. Doesn't mean it wasn't good that these terrorists got stopped or that this was a Bush plot to control your globally insignificant life.

Interesting how if I don't think the same way you do I'm parroting the FNC or administration line. So I should think more independently by changing my viewpoint to yours...right. gotcha.
Posted by Rich:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

Maybe those of you that actually acknowledge that there are terrorists that exist that is. It seems about half of you think any terrorism is ultimately initiated and paid for by our gov't to control us. But then again judging from the bitterness expressed, I still think lots would have been happier had something exploded.
Posted by Rich:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I think a bunch of folks would rather it suceeded so Bush could look even worse than he already does.
Posted by PhilinLA:

Wow, an unbelievably horrific tragedy is averted and it's only greeted with cynicism.

Bullsh it.

A lot of us would like a president who puts national security above politics, and who didn't get us into a war in Iraq based on lies that has spawned terrorists and weakened the war on terror.

What are you nuts? Who the f* ck thinks terrorists don't exist?

Stop parroting the RNC talking points and think for yourself.

Our borders are not secured. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

We don't check the cargo bays of planes. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

We have underfunded homeland security because of the war in Iraq. Go ahead and excuse Bush for that.

What's your response? You question my patriotism by saying I wouuld rather let people die than help Bush.

Nothing can help Bush. The majority of the American people now know he has made us less safe from terrorists.
TMS
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8/10/2006  10:55 PM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

So basically these guys plotting to blow up planes are nice folks..depending on your perception.
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

That's bullShit. Even if you think we are terorrists the fact that this plot happened, isn't enough to label these guys terrorists? How are they not? Explain your enlightened 'perception' to me.
Posted by TMS:

who are the real terrorists? us or them? it's all a matter of perception.

imagine you're living in Palestine... bombs are shaking your roof every night... you live in fear of your life every single day... who do you consider the terrorists then?

again, as i said, it's all a matter of perception... not quite sure why you're getting upset over that comment.


no, that's not what i'm saying at all... is it really that hard to understand the point i'm trying to make here? i'm saying if you were a Palestinian or someone who lived in the Middle East, that you would probably feel that the terrorists were us... i don't know where you're drawing all these assumptions from here... you seem to be looking to label anyone who's not completely in line with your views as a supporter of terrorists... pretty silly if you ask me... no one here is saying they support terrorism for God's sake.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
nykshaknbake
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8/10/2006  11:11 PM
I'm just saying there's no way these guys are not terrorists..OBJECTIVELY. I don't see any way around that.
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

So basically these guys plotting to blow up planes are nice folks..depending on your perception.
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nykshaknbake:

That's bullShit. Even if you think we are terorrists the fact that this plot happened, isn't enough to label these guys terrorists? How are they not? Explain your enlightened 'perception' to me.
Posted by TMS:

who are the real terrorists? us or them? it's all a matter of perception.

imagine you're living in Palestine... bombs are shaking your roof every night... you live in fear of your life every single day... who do you consider the terrorists then?

again, as i said, it's all a matter of perception... not quite sure why you're getting upset over that comment.


no, that's not what i'm saying at all... is it really that hard to understand the point i'm trying to make here? i'm saying if you were a Palestinian or someone who lived in the Middle East, that you would probably feel that the terrorists were us... i don't know where you're drawing all these assumptions from here... you seem to be looking to label anyone who's not completely in line with your views as a supporter of terrorists... pretty silly if you ask me... no one here is saying they support terrorism for God's sake.
simrud
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8/10/2006  11:33 PM
I don't undertand the idea of who is the terrorist. Every country does things for its own good. So every country, that ever was, was at some point involved in the busines of terrorism, at lest if we are going to use such a loose description.

Personally I don't care if what I do to be the vicorious side makes me a terrorist. When somebody wants to blow me up, and I blow him up instead, I don't see a prolem.

I have no desire for the moral high ground. Just give me the phycisal high ground to shell my enemy from and I will be fine.

All this talk about morality and such, is pointless when real things go down. Because guess what, regardless of why some people are pissed off at your country, they view you as a monlith entity, and they will gladly kill you, whether you agree with your government or not. Once war is commenced, there is no choice but to support your own. Choice comes before and after the war. Vote and try to get politicians who don't put your country into war, vote out ones that got it into war, but don't waste your time and endanger your entire nation by protesting during the war.

And one final thing, as much as you can blame the west on the poor situation in the muslim countries, there is still a large portion of people there who simply viewus as the infidel and thats it. They would never be in power if those countires were well off, but they are not. Whatever the reason, its too late to play nice now. Our governmetns fcked up in the past, and now you have rabid dogs out to get you. There is no choice people, liberal or not, a suicide bomber sees no difference.

A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
joec32033
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8/11/2006  12:09 AM
When somebody wants to blow me up, and I blow him up instead, I don't see a prolem.

Oh if I didn't just change my sig like 2 days ago. I gotta save this one for later...Thanks sim.
~You can't run from who you are.~
Rich
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8/11/2006  1:01 AM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

Hit a chord did we?

Who questioned your patriotism? Or maybe you what I said is true of you?

Hey Bush has doone a terrible job. He's the dumbest US prez in recent history. Doesn't mean it wasn't good that these terrorists got stopped or that this was a Bush plot to control your globally insignificant life.

Interesting how if I don't think the same way you do I'm parroting the FNC or administration line. So I should think more independently by changing my viewpoint to yours...right. gotcha.

Hit a chord? You must be tone deaf.

You made a moronic statement that some people would rather see innocent people die than see Bush get credit. That's an idiotic questioning of someone's patriotism.

Only a Commie would say something so stupid.

WTF is the FNC?
smackeddog
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8/11/2006  8:32 AM
Interesting- the home secretary over here, John Reid was asked if the police found any explosives, and he dodged the question! Think I'll take that as a no then!
TMS
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8/11/2006  9:09 AM
Posted by nykshaknbake:

I'm just saying there's no way these guys are not terrorists..OBJECTIVELY. I don't see any way around that.

from who's point of view? from yours & mine, sure, there's no way around it... those guys are terrorists... but to people living in the middle east, they're martyrs willing to die for a cause to fight against western occupation...

300 years ago, the British would have probably considered some colonists raiding their ships dressed as Native American Indians, tossing their tea overboard into the Boston harbor & killing their soldiers as "terrorists" too... again, it's all about perception.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
simrud
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8/11/2006  8:30 PM
I agree that its all about percpetion.

But I also don't see how it matters of these people are terrorists or freedom figheters. Either way they are our enemies who want to kill our civilians. So once again, does it matter what you call your enemy?

A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
Rich
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8/12/2006  9:30 PM
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14320452/

Source: U.S., U.K. at odds over timing of arrests
British wanted to continue surveillance on terror suspects, official says
LONDON - NBC News has learned that U.S. and British authorities had a significant disagreement over when to move in on the suspects in the alleged plot to bring down trans-Atlantic airliners bound for the United States.

A senior British official knowledgeable about the case said British police were planning to continue to run surveillance for at least another week to try to obtain more evidence, while American officials pressured them to arrest the suspects sooner. The official spoke on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of the case.

In contrast to previous reports, the official suggested an attack was not imminent, saying the suspects had not yet purchased any airline tickets. In fact, some did not even have passports.

[...]
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