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Jackie we hardly knew ye'
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nyk4ever
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7/18/2006  4:17 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

If Larry were still coaching he'd be blamed for this. You know... "hates kids" and "wants Ratliff", etc

But since Isiah doesn't want him I guess he's just not as good a value as a 30 yr old out of shape Jerome James...

I mean, only a senile saboteur like Larry would play veteran he overpaid for over a promising kid, right?

LOL! So true Blue.
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EnySpree
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7/18/2006  6:13 PM
You guys are crazy. More tabloid bs.

Isiah was the one that found Jackie and rescued him from the CBa. Jackie has been around a while now. I'm sure isiah is thinking hard. He's had his coaching staff working hard with him. Why all of a sudden blackball a guy you picked up off the street?

and isiah looked up to brown. Isiah went to his house and was with his family trying to get him to coach his team. Isiah said he dresses the way he does cuz of brown. They had a falling out but no one can say isiah always hated brown.

Tabloid bs!
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martin
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7/19/2006  9:16 AM
Posted by EnySpree:

You guys are crazy. More tabloid bs.

Isiah was the one that found Jackie and rescued him from the CBa. Jackie has been around a while now. I'm sure isiah is thinking hard. He's had his coaching staff working hard with him. Why all of a sudden blackball a guy you picked up off the street?

Cause Dolan said "no mas!"

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Rich
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7/19/2006  9:52 AM
Posted by VDesai:

The contract is cheap in the NBA market for centers, plain and simple. Marc Berman continues to prove to be an absolute moron with his editorializing in these articles.

Quoted for emphasis.
BRIGGS
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7/19/2006  10:54 AM
Posted by tomverve:

Keeping Butler at that contract would be far from fiscal insanity. It'd be a prudent investment. The extra luxury tax money is a drop in the bucket compared to what the franchise has paid in recent years.

I really hope we at least keep Woods, though I'm doubting it since there hasn't been a peep about him in the media.


id say most of the 500mm that isiah has spent has been fiscal insanity
--to let this guy go for 2+mm a year would be CRAZY! All of a sudden we believe that this team is going to be a lightning bolt up and down the court jackie wont keep up yet fat arse james Curry or Mo taylor will????? when the door closes on isiah, when we are left with no draft picks and another 20-30 win season, keeping jackie butler for the new GM is important.



Hey Isiah we'll give you Mo Taylor for an ending contract--he's only on IR because he hd a bo bo on his pinkie, no problems there--I know it will cost you 20mm per to take him, but he could be your missing piece, especially since you just picked up malik--you know grab Jerome James in FA next year and you guys are looking strong. but I will have to ask you to throw in a 2, but dont worry Im sure with your squad it'll be in the mid 50s
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crzymdups
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7/19/2006  10:56 AM
anyone hear whether we matched or not? will there be an announcement this afternoon or something?

I hope Jackie is here to stay, but it isn't looking pretty.
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rain
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7/19/2006  12:33 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

anyone hear whether we matched or not? will there be an announcement this afternoon or something?

I hope Jackie is here to stay, but it isn't looking pretty.

"Because of a clerical error on Butler's offer sheet, the Knicks have until Thursday, instead of tomorrow, to make their decision."

I think we'll hear tommorrow...

Bippity10
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7/19/2006  1:10 PM
This just shows you how poorly Isiah has run things. We can't make a good signing because in the past we've made too many bad signings.
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Solace
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7/19/2006  1:22 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

This just shows you how poorly Isiah has run things. We can't make a good signing because in the past we've made too many bad signings.

Don't worry, Bip. Now that we haven't resigned Butler, give it a week and the majority of people who loved Butler will say they're glad he's gone and that he's a scrub. Once you can hear from the guys that he's a scrub, you can then rest peacefully.

Personally, my thought is at a little over $2 MM a year, on a three year deal, Butler would be one of the best value contracts we have on the team. But we didn't go that route, because we have Big Snaxx.
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Bonn1997
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7/19/2006  1:39 PM
I don't love Butler but I do like him. I'll be disappointed (but not surprised) if JJ is on the roster next week and Butler is not.
rvhoss
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7/19/2006  3:06 PM
http://ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=16953
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fishmike
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7/19/2006  4:26 PM
the hypocrisy around here is off the charts. When Isiah picks up guys like Dermaar Johnson or Jackie Butler or QWoods its gushing praise about how great a talent finder he is, how draft picks are overrated, how Isiah finds great young talent in creative ways. Then when we dump them its fine because why overpay? But then you hear "it aint your money" when you bring up some of the unsavory contracts our GM has added, and how they continue to hurt what we can do.

Jackie Butler is a good young player who will have a cap friendly cheap contract for the next 3 years. A good find by Isiah and something worth keeping. Maybe nothing more than a role player, maybe more. If we let him go it will be because we have guys like Jerome James and Mo Taylor on this roster, and who's fault is that? We are literally paying for those guys twice.

It sucks, but when Isiah is your GM you get used to such things.
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crzymdups
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7/19/2006  4:27 PM
Posted by fishmike:

the hypocrisy around here is off the charts. When Isiah picks up guys like Dermaar Johnson or Jackie Butler or QWoods its gushing praise about how great a talent finder he is, how draft picks are overrated, how Isiah finds great young talent in creative ways. Then when we dump them its fine because why overpay? But then you hear "it aint your money" when you bring up some of the unsavory contracts our GM has added, and how they continue to hurt what we can do.

Jackie Butler is a good young player who will have a cap friendly cheap contract for the next 3 years. A good find by Isiah and something worth keeping. Maybe nothing more than a role player, maybe more. If we let him go it will be because we have guys like Jerome James and Mo Taylor on this roster, and who's fault is that? We are literally paying for those guys twice.

I agree. No one is happy to see Jackie go.
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fishmike
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7/19/2006  9:37 PM
you know... I really want Isiah to so something good.

I mean... this was my sig for 3 years, and I STILL wanted LAyden to do well. I was rooting for hell for McDyess to be healthy. Hell, I thought a KT/McDyess/Houston/Spree(then KVH)/Ward team would be decent in a size deprived East if McDyess was his pre knee 20/8 self. Obviously it didnt happen, and it pretty let all the hope out of my sails in terms of last ditch moves.

Even when we got Marbury and we saw Marbury create jumper after open jumpers for KT, Doleac, Houston and KVH I thought we had a little something. That team played very well for a stretch. Good role players and Marbs was creating well... playing good team ball, and the rest was history.

The nail in the coffin for me was (no mystery) Jerome JAmes. Once I saw Isiah thought giving this POS a 5 year deal made sense for the Knicks I knew there was no way this guy was ever going to create winning team and winning environment.

Do I hope he succeeds? On some level, but its the same kind of hope I have when I spend 5 bucks on mega millions, or put place 8 bucks on a 40-1 horse. Sure.. there's always a chance but I'm sick of long shots. I want a real horse thats actually WON a race before.

Sorry if I'm pissy all the time, just sick of the losing and the losers.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
kNYks342
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7/19/2006  10:38 PM
you have to remember, at the time we didnt have a starting center, kt was gone and curry wsnt in the picture yet. i mean all we had was bruno....that wasnt going to work out...isiah did what he had to do to get the only available center with experience on the team, 5 yrs is long, but he had ny pressure to get someone in there. i could understand if we already signed curry.
CrushAlot
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7/19/2006  10:43 PM
The reason we didn't have a center was because Isiah traded Mohammed for Malik Rose. I am not sure why he had to have Malik so badly. Remember he almost traded KT for him also.
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Allanfan20
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7/20/2006  2:18 AM
and drew goomdman
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Rich
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7/20/2006  3:08 AM
Mistake.
BasketballJones
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7/20/2006  5:22 AM
So much negativity! We need to focus on something we can accomplish. How about, first NBA team with a billion dollar payroll, and a 10-72 record?

Think positively!
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joec32033
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7/20/2006  5:24 AM
Posted by CrushAlot:

The reason we didn't have a center was because Isiah traded Mohammed for Malik Rose. I am not sure why he had to have Malik so badly. Remember he almost traded KT for him also.

He traded Nazr for Malik Rose, David Lee, and Mardy Collins. Remember we got two first round picks from them.
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