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Marbury Loves Larry Brown....Period
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joec32033
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6/18/2006  11:58 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by crzymdups:

yeah, I mean Marbury SHOULD be nervous. again, who knows? maybe Isiah hasn't spoken to him all summer and Marbury is feeling the Minnie trade winds blowing.

I just think Marbury is judged pretty harshly - this is a pretty genuinely generous guy. as crazy as he is, he gives a lot and I think he usually says what he means (which gets him into trouble). so when he says he wants to die a Knick, I think he may be nervous that he won't, but I also think he is being completely sincere.

it doesn't matter what kind of guy you are outside of basketball. as long as you win, that's all that matters. that's why guys like kobe, who was accused of rape, was still cheered at home. guys like zo, who sh tted on nj, is still cheered in miami and lauded on abc. guys like jkidd who beat his wife, are heralded as one of the greatest pg's of all time. or very charitable guys like h20 would get booed at the garden b/c of his $100 mil deal and the knicks not winning his last few years.

there has to be seperation of bball player and the off court person. lb is a prick but is only tolerated b/c he knows how to coach. steph is a prick but isn't tolerated b/c his teams don't win.

winning is everything. forget about getting judged harshly or not. these guys get paid MILLIONS upon MILLIONS. that's why i could care less about lb's feelings. i want him back as coach but i'm don't feel sorry for him. he'll have enough money from this contract alone where his great great great grandkids won't have to work.

I agree 99.9% with this statement. After a guys contract is signed (I mean look, somebody had to OFFER it to him), money plays no part in how I look at players on the court, IMO. I have never said "This guy make x millions and he can't make a foul shot". I personally try to keep all judgements about a player on court because after the contract is signed (keep in mind BEFORE the contract is signed, I'll say "damn that's alot of money for that guy") it really makes no difference what a player makes in any given game.
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crzymdups
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6/18/2006  12:01 PM
yeah, I agree too. then again, some folks around here judge Curry pretty harshly on the court because of what gave up for him.

but as for Marbury, I wasn't talking about anything to do with his on the court performance at all, just his statements and how they usually seem to rile people. where Brown gets away with saying some of the most ludicrous BS I've ever heard and no one bats an eye.
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djsunyc
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6/18/2006  12:04 PM
Posted by newyorknewyork:

DJ wouldn't that contradict the theory that Marbury has more juice than Brown?? And that Brown is being moved because how he treated the "golden child" Marbury.

Didn't Brown say in his own words that he didn't want to do to Marbury what other teams have done. And that he didn't want to trade Marbury unless it was for a Kobe type of player. So if Brown wants Marbury gone as bad as some of you think. Then wouldn't that make him a liar.

i'm not sure how many people believe that marbury has more juice than brown. i think the prevalent theory is that isiah has the juice over lb. i have no doubt in my mind that isiah would sell marbury down the river in a blink of an eye. marbury is just a pawn in this whole thing. this is really about isiah, lb, and dolan.

i don't understand why that whole "kobe" thing was said. why did they have to tell marbury that during his exit interview?

at the end of the day, lb wanted billups gone but dumars said no. lb could want marbury gone too but isiah could say no.

lb also made it work with iverson and billups. so maybe that happens here also, crazier things have happened.
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6/18/2006  12:04 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

I'm not talking about judging Steph as a player, that's obviously different. I'm talking about accusing him of Machiavellian scheming. especially when so many people seem to take Next Town Brown at his word.


The people who take Brown at his word are the ones who want to pin the Rose and Francis trades on him and who think he wouldn't move Steph for anyone but KG or Kobe.
djsunyc
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6/18/2006  12:05 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

yeah, I agree too. then again, some folks around here judge Curry pretty harshly on the court because of what gave up for him.

i was NEVER a curry fan and this pre-dates his arrival to new york. if we ever get a search function on this board, i'll bring up my 2005 NO THANKS CLUB and curry was a card-carrying member.

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6/18/2006  12:07 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
at the end of the day, lb wanted billups gone but dumars said no. lb could want marbury gone too but isiah could say no.

dj, you're pretty good with the articles. I never actually saw where that rumor originated, and i haven't been able to google it. do you happen to have it?

crzymdups
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6/18/2006  12:07 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by crzymdups:

I'm not talking about judging Steph as a player, that's obviously different. I'm talking about accusing him of Machiavellian scheming. especially when so many people seem to take Next Town Brown at his word.


The people who take Brown at his word are the ones who want to pin the Rose and Francis trades on him and who think he wouldn't move Steph for anyone but KG or Kobe.

See! Why would you ever believe a single word that came out of Brown's mouth after that crap! But for some reason, when he makes a sad puppy to Marc Berman, everything Larry says is "straight from the heart"...
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crzymdups
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6/18/2006  12:08 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by djsunyc:
at the end of the day, lb wanted billups gone but dumars said no. lb could want marbury gone too but isiah could say no.

dj, you're pretty good with the articles. I never actually saw where that rumor originated, and i haven't been able to google it. do you happen to have it?

it came out in Detroit after they fired Brown. it was reported as one of the reasons the Pistons front office and ownership got fed up with Brown.
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joec32033
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6/18/2006  12:08 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

yeah, I agree too. then again, some folks around here judge Curry pretty harshly on the court because of what gave up for him.

but as for Marbury, I wasn't talking about anything to do with his on the court performance at all, just his statements and how they usually seem to rile people. where Brown gets away with saying some of the most ludicrous BS I've ever heard and no one bats an eye.


2 things, 1-You are operating under the false assumption that Larry gets away with it-alot of LB supporters think he should just shut up also-myself included. 2-And this goes back to an old argument. Larry has done this with Philly (and took them to the Finals), Detroit (took them to the Finals twice and won a championship), Indy (was a constant Finals threat)...everywhere...and it has worked everywhere.

I look at what Larry does as he equvilant of the parent telling their child, OK, we'll do it your "new" way, but if you screw it up, I am damn sure gonna laugh at it, and tell my friends about it because I know my way works.
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crzymdups
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6/18/2006  12:09 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by crzymdups:

yeah, I agree too. then again, some folks around here judge Curry pretty harshly on the court because of what gave up for him.

i was NEVER a curry fan and this pre-dates his arrival to new york. if we ever get a search function on this board, i'll bring up my 2005 NO THANKS CLUB and curry was a card-carrying member.

I remember that. I'm not talking about you in particular. plenty of folks have created trade Curry threads and woe is us for losing the no.2 pick threads.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-18-2006 12:10 PM]
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OngBok
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6/18/2006  12:15 PM
I'm with you crzydumps
Isiah Thomas will lead us back to the playoffs in 2006 !!!
BlueSeats
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6/18/2006  12:16 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by crzymdups:

I'm not talking about judging Steph as a player, that's obviously different. I'm talking about accusing him of Machiavellian scheming. especially when so many people seem to take Next Town Brown at his word.


The people who take Brown at his word are the ones who want to pin the Rose and Francis trades on him and who think he wouldn't move Steph for anyone but KG or Kobe.

See! Why would you ever believe a single word that came out of Brown's mouth after that crap! But for some reason, when he makes a sad puppy to Marc Berman, everything Larry says is "straight from the heart"...

oh, that. i didn't think anybody took that stuff too seriously. this is all gamesmanship.

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6/18/2006  12:19 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by djsunyc:
at the end of the day, lb wanted billups gone but dumars said no. lb could want marbury gone too but isiah could say no.

dj, you're pretty good with the articles. I never actually saw where that rumor originated, and i haven't been able to google it. do you happen to have it?

it came out in Detroit after they fired Brown. it was reported as one of the reasons the Pistons front office and ownership got fed up with Brown.

I saw the story where it was rumored he had asked for one of the starters to be traded, but I never saw where it was said to have been Billips.

djsunyc
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6/18/2006  12:24 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by djsunyc:
at the end of the day, lb wanted billups gone but dumars said no. lb could want marbury gone too but isiah could say no.

dj, you're pretty good with the articles. I never actually saw where that rumor originated, and i haven't been able to google it. do you happen to have it?

i did a quick google search, but i got it from ian o'connor's recent article. i'm not sure who originally reported it but if i find it i'll post it. here's ian's article:

Memo to Dolan: time to cash out Brown

By IAN O'CONNOR
THE JOURNAL NEWS
(Original Publication: May 25, 2006)

Don't do it, Jimbo. Don't even think about it.

Don't let Larry Brown burrow his way back into your life.

Mr. Dolan. Jimmy, my boy. Listen up before you grant one last audience to a basketball coach who keeps committing flagrant fouls against his own body of Hall of Fame work.

This is the same Larry Brown who wanted the Pistons to trade Chauncey Billups, Rip Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince before they won him his only NBA crown.

This is the same guy who trashed the Olympic selection committee after he approved every single pick it made for Athens. This is the same guy who wanted Jalen Rose and Steve Francis in New York one minute, and wanted them booked for the first stretch limo out of town the next.

He's going to charm you in that meeting, Jimbo, whenever and wherever it comes off. He's going to say you promised him a roster full of Larry Brown players last summer during a pathetically public courtship, even though Brown's idea of a Brown player changes more often than his starting lineup.

Brown's going to tell you that he's finally healthy, that his recent bladder surgery made him a new man, that you're going to get the Larry Brown you paid for in the 2006-07 season and beyond. He's going to tell you he'll be a good boy in the papers, too.

He'll pledge to pass on every on-the-record and off-the-record chance to tarnish the star in Starbury and to ridicule Isiah Thomas, who deserved better — no matter how his moves worked out — from a man he waited and waited and waited on, ultimately giving him $50 million while sacrificing any credit he might otherwise get if the Knicks ever won.

Brown's going to work you, Jimbo, and work you real good, even if Thomas is sitting right there in the same room. Watch your back, and your front. Brown is a lot better at moving and shaking these days than he is at settling on a rotation.

Before you know it, Brown will have you believing that 23-59 was part of his master plan. He'll point you toward the 1988-89 season in San Antonio, where he won all of 21 games before winning 56 and 55 the next two seasons. Brown won't mention that David Robinson showed up after the 21-victory season; he'll hope, or assume, that you're too clueless a basketball owner to have recalled.

Brown will refer you to his first year in Philly, his 31-51 year, and the five straight playoff seasons that followed, including a trip to the Finals. Brown will hope, or assume, you didn't bother reading his own quotes this past season, when he insisted — in Lloyd Bentsen, Dan Quayle, Jack Kennedy form — that Stephon Marbury was no Allen Iverson.

The guy knows all the angles. The Pistons gave him $13 million, including buyout pay, last year, and now you're willing to give him his entire five-year contract to make him disappear. Anyone who positions himself to make $63 million for two seasons as a gym teacher definitely qualifies as a player.

He's not going to settle for a nickel less than the $40 million coming his way. But give him the full balance, anyway, for it's better than the alternative: another hate-fest of a season lowlighted by the acquisition of more bloated contracts — in a vain attempt to appease Brown — and the eventual firing of the coach, who'll still end up with the $40 million.

Brown won 23 games with a $125 million payroll and a roster more talented than those that secured 33 to 39 victories over the previous three seasons for Don Chaney, Lenny Wilkens and Herb Williams. But you don't want to fire him because of the numbers, Jimbo. You want to fire him because your gut tells you that no matter what Brown says about next year, he's going to burn your organization to a back-page stake.

Trust your gut on this one. No, it's not easy. Your gut has let you and all of New York down in a monumental way. In fact, your track record says you are among the very worst owners in the league. Maybe you can arm wrestle Paul Allen for the title.

Only before you do, Jimbo, make sure you play the kind of defense your Knicks didn't play all season. Brown's going to throw his entire playbook at you. He hasn't landed eight head-coaching jobs in the NBA and two in major college ball for nothing.

Fend him off, box him out, do what I told you to do five weeks ago: hand over the cash and be done with it.

If Isiah can't coach this team to playoff contention next season, then run him out of here, too, so a legitimate rebuilding job can begin. But for now, Brown needs to be put away, knocked hard to the canvas.

He's dangerous on the ropes, Jimbo, so be careful as you stagger in. Ring the bell, pay the purse, and send in the underlings to mop up the blood.

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6/18/2006  12:32 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
This is the same Larry Brown who wanted the Pistons to trade Chauncey Billups, Rip Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince before they won him his only NBA crown.

Thanks.

Pretty funny. I guess he wanted to trade them for Snow, Lynch, and Ratliff...

newyorknewyork
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6/18/2006  12:42 PM
I don't think Marbury is saying these things because he fears being traded. I think he is just trying to appeal to the fans more. He has lost a lot of fans in NY these last few yrs. He allways loved NY as well. It is how he truley feels though. He has allways been the person to state how he feels. He doesn't plan his statments for an agenda.

Nothing he said was even really about basketball.
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newyorknewyork
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6/18/2006  12:48 PM
Let me rephase that. Not that he wants to appeal to NY fans more so that he gets some sort of power advantage. But he allways loved NY. And has & will allways let that be known.
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6/18/2006  1:00 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by djsunyc:

sounds like steph is desperate and may see the writing on the wall.

maybe he's the dead man walking? maybe he's not hearing anything from isiah or dolan to give him a vote of confidence? maybe he's bothered by the trade rumors? maybe he's worried that he burned his last bridge in new york? maybe isiah told him that he doesn't want to coach the team and he's asking dolan to keep lb? maybe maybe maybe?!?!?

btw, why is he allowed to talk?

sounds like he's making one last ditch effort not to get traded...at least that's how it's coming off.

I love this skepticism about anything marbury says, but if Larry Brown speaks it's as if it came down on a stone tablet from the mountain tops. give the guy a break. maybe he was just saying what he felt.

of course he said what he felt. and it's coming off as desperate.

he's signing autographs "i want to die a knick" - how else are you supposed to take that?
DJ where do you come up with your theories, I mean some of them have no merit at all. What writing. The owner and GM like the guy. The guy help the Owner take his team to the playoffs on a mandate that the owner placed to help secure his position.

Any longtime Knick fan knows how much Marbury has always want to be a KNick. The guy was a Ewing fan when many so called Knick fans were booing him. Marbury said that on his draft night eve. When asked where would he like to go, he said that he wish he would drop to the 18th slot so the KNicks could take him. He wasn't kidding either. The reporter was shocked. Being a Knick was something Marbury always talk about. You have those type of guys. On the other hand Brown claimed that coaching the Knicks was his dream job. He tried to get the job once before but revoked the contract. So I have always been skeptical of his desire. I know he often used the Knicks as part of his negotations. So who knows. Ewing once said the same thing except it was during his contract negotation year. Houston said the same thing, was he desperate too?
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Killa4luv
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6/18/2006  1:12 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by djsunyc:

sounds like steph is desperate and may see the writing on the wall.

maybe he's the dead man walking? maybe he's not hearing anything from isiah or dolan to give him a vote of confidence? maybe he's bothered by the trade rumors? maybe he's worried that he burned his last bridge in new york? maybe isiah told him that he doesn't want to coach the team and he's asking dolan to keep lb? maybe maybe maybe?!?!?

btw, why is he allowed to talk?

sounds like he's making one last ditch effort not to get traded...at least that's how it's coming off.

I love this skepticism about anything marbury says, but if Larry Brown speaks it's as if it came down on a stone tablet from the mountain tops. give the guy a break. maybe he was just saying what he felt.

of course he said what he felt. and it's coming off as desperate.

he's signing autographs "i want to die a knick" - how else are you supposed to take that?
DJ where do you come up with your theories, I mean some of them have no merit at all. What writing. The owner and GM like the guy. The guy help the Owner take his team to the playoffs on a mandate that the owner placed to help secure his position.

Any longtime Knick fan knows how much Marbury has always want to be a KNick. The guy was a Ewing fan when many so called Knick fans were booing him. Marbury said that on his draft night eve. When asked where would he like to go, he said that he wish he would drop to the 18th slot so the KNicks could take him. He wasn't kidding either. The reporter was shocked. Being a Knick was something Marbury always talk about. You have those type of guys. On the other hand Brown claimed that coaching the Knicks was his dream job. He tried to get the job once before but revoked the contract. So I have always been skeptical of his desire. I know he often used the Knicks as part of his negotations. So who knows. Ewing once said the same thing except it was during his contract negotation year. Houston said the same thing, was he desperate too?

ditto. Steph said similar things before he was traded, after he got here, and now. He loves NY and wants to be a Knick, no different than if we were profeesional ball players. But leave it to DJ to concoct some bizarre theory that fits what he wants to be reality. It can't be that Steph really means what he is saying, its gotta be some elaborate move to trick people and hide his true intentions.

1 thing that seperates the LB-lovers from the rest of us is: the LB lovers reject anything that that doesnt fit their version of reality. Direct quotes from LB, direct quotes from Steph, none of those quotes matter unless they are negative towards Steph. A player who is bankrupt in credibility (Tim "Fugazy" Thomas) makes a negative remark about Steph and it ends up as someones signature. these guys are about as consistant as Jamal "I step up when it doesn't count" Crawford. get outta here!!
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6/18/2006  1:35 PM
Posted by Killa4luv:
1 thing that seperates the LB-lovers from the rest of us is: the LB lovers reject anything that that doesnt fit their version of reality. Direct quotes from LB, direct quotes from Steph, none of those quotes matter unless they are negative towards Steph. A player who is bankrupt in credibility (Tim "Fugazy" Thomas) makes a negative remark about Steph and it ends up as someones signature. these guys are about as consistant as Jamal "I step up when it doesn't count" Crawford. get outta here!!

And this is the one I love best: when a fan actually tries to claim some sort of higher moral ground just for liking Steph.

It's okay to bash KT, Brown, Crawford or anyone else on the team, but if you like Cancerbury you're supposedly a "true" fan. A principled fan.

Marbury Loves Larry Brown....Period

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