[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Knick fans still mourning the loss of Ariza...
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 2 of 4 ‹ Previous 1  2  3  4 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
nyk4ever
Posts: 41010
Alba Posts: 12
Joined: 1/12/2005
Member: #848
USA
6/14/2006  3:06 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by fishmike:

I always like Trev... but its funny how Holfresh and co can go on and on about how Larry's comments can ruin a player's motivation, but then stories like this come up. Maybe the Orl coaching staff said mean things to Trev also?



What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


That is the most ignorant post I've seen. To say that playing in summerleague bares absolutely nothing on someones performance during the season is ridiculous. Theres a reason they made the summerleague, to give young players(like Ariza) who come out of college before they are ready for the NBA to play in and work on parts of their game. Trevor has ALOT of skills to work on if he is ever going to be more then what he is in the NBA right now and summerleague is a great way for him to work on these things.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
AUTOADVERT
eViL
Posts: 25412
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 1/21/2004
Member: #561
USA
6/14/2006  3:08 PM
Posted by holfresh:

...Magic and Bird worked out on their own...

Trevor has made his way into exclusive company.
check out my latest hip hop project: https://soundcloud.com/michaelcro http://youtu.be/scNXshrpyZo
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
6/14/2006  3:11 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Anji:

I liked Ariza, but how does not wanting to go to summer camp = not working on his game?????

Summer camp is playing against professional competition to work on parts of your game that you lack, which Ariza has ALOT of. How do you see not constituting working on your game? Basketball is a TEAM sport, as hard as it for some of you to realize.



What are you talking about...I know you really have no idea but you want to project like you know what you are talking about...How do you know that the summer league does not cut into his personal workout schedule...How do you know he is does not have his own schedule of things to work on, playing in real games against 1st and 2nd year pros might actually hurt what he wants to get accomplished in the offseason...Do you realize that pros often work out with other professionals in the offseason....Why are you so quick to assume the worse when reading anything...
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
6/14/2006  3:13 PM
Posted by eViL:
Posted by holfresh:

...Magic and Bird worked out on their own...

Trevor has made his way into exclusive company.



You can refer to one of your fellow Ariza trashers who introduces some the the game's greats to make his point...
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
6/14/2006  3:13 PM
Ariza is not working on his game. never has never will as evident by the original post
Anji
Posts: 25523
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 4/14/2006
Member: #1122
USA
6/14/2006  3:16 PM
Posted by holfresh:





What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


Of course. Trevor isn't a millionare and he may want to stay with his training. Who says him working out with his trainers, where he most likely worked out his whole basketball life, with his coaches isn't what is best for him???? Or it wouldn't make him better, then flying to where ever Orlandos SL is and staying in a hotels for a month.


Every year in the NFL the Miami Hurricane players skip mini camps to go down to Miami to workout at the U, Shocky and Vilma don't care about getting better???? GTFOH. It's not either he feels he has nothing to work on or he goes to summer league.




[Edited by - Anji on 06-14-2006 3:19 PM]

[Edited by - Anji on 06-14-2006 3:19 PM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
6/14/2006  3:19 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by fishmike:

I always like Trev... but its funny how Holfresh and co can go on and on about how Larry's comments can ruin a player's motivation, but then stories like this come up. Maybe the Orl coaching staff said mean things to Trev also?



What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


That is the most ignorant post I've seen. To say that playing in summerleague bares absolutely nothing on someones performance during the season is ridiculous. Theres a reason they made the summerleague, to give young players(like Ariza) who come out of college before they are ready for the NBA to play in and work on parts of their game. Trevor has ALOT of skills to work on if he is ever going to be more then what he is in the NBA right now and summerleague is a great way for him to work on these things.



At this point in Ariza's career, summer league means absolutely nothing...He should be at home working on his jumpshot...He should not waste time watching younger players learn the nuances of the game that he already knows...Complete waste of time...He should be taking 1000 jump shots per day and work on his handle hours on end....Running a summer schedule cuts into all that...You guys are just nuts...Be for real will you for a minute....
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
6/14/2006  3:22 PM
Posted by Anji:
Posted by holfresh:





What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


Of course. Trevor isn't a millionare and he may want to stay with his training. Who says him working out with his trainers, where he most likely worked out his whole basketball life, with his coaches isn't what is best for him???? Or it wouldn't make him better, then flying to where ever Orlandos SL is and staying in a hotels for a month.


Every year in the NFL the Miami Hurricane players skip mini camps to go down to Miami to workout at the U, Shocky and Vilma don't care about getting better???? GTFOH. It's not either he feels he has nothing to work on or he goes to summer league.





[Edited by - Anji on 06-14-2006 3:19 PM]

[Edited by - Anji on 06-14-2006 3:19 PM]



Please answer this, why do you assume he is not working out as we speak?


Shocky got killed for not being in Giant mini camp because he wanted to work out at Miami...People thought he should have been in camp getting to know his new QB...He has his own offseason workout schedule...So your point supports the opposite of what you are saying...



[Edited by - holfresh on 06-14-2006 3:25 PM]

[Edited by - holfresh on 06-14-2006 3:25 PM]
Anji
Posts: 25523
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 4/14/2006
Member: #1122
USA
6/14/2006  3:28 PM
Posted by holfresh:





At this point in Ariza's career, summer league means absolutely nothing...He should be at home working on his jumpshot...He should not waste time watching younger players learn the nuances of the game that he already knows...Complete waste of time...He should be taking 1000 jump shots per day and work on his handle hours on end....Running a summer schedule cuts into all that...You guys are just nuts...Be for real will you for a minute....


Just to emphasize, I agree with you.



[Edited by - Anji on 06-14-2006 3:29 PM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
6/14/2006  3:29 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by fishmike:

I always like Trev... but its funny how Holfresh and co can go on and on about how Larry's comments can ruin a player's motivation, but then stories like this come up. Maybe the Orl coaching staff said mean things to Trev also?



What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


Where do people learn to dribble? When you find out, please let Ariza know.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
6/14/2006  3:36 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by fishmike:

I always like Trev... but its funny how Holfresh and co can go on and on about how Larry's comments can ruin a player's motivation, but then stories like this come up. Maybe the Orl coaching staff said mean things to Trev also?



What does playing in a summer league have to do with his development...Not one damn thing...Magic and Bird worked out on their own as another poster tried to implicate him...You guys just nitpick at the silliest things..Who cares if he shows up for summer camp...It has absolutely no bearing oh his performance during the season...People don't learn to dribble in summer camp...


Where do people learn to dribble? When you find out, please let Ariza know.



Just for your guide, this whole thing about Ariza not being able to dribble is all overblown...He can get better but his jumper needs more work thand his handle...



[Edited by - holfresh on 06-14-2006 3:58 PM]
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
6/14/2006  3:48 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by crzymdups:

um, players heading into their third year don't have to attend summer league. Mike Sweetney, among others, refused to take part in summer league in the same situation.

but, yeah, you guys are right, giving away Ariza for Stevie Disenfranchised was a great move, especially when everyone admits we have a guard glut and need perimeter defenders and a small forward. Larry Brown is such a genius! I'm really glad he was so right about Ariza and he really used Francis once he got him!

by the way, the Magic finished 16-4 with Ariza playing 21mpg.
Larry's not the GM. Isiah makes all the trades

Right, remember when Isiah called Ariza delusional and stopped allowing Larry to play him. And Isiah asked Larry for Francis and then didn't play him or define a role for him. Sorry, I forgot that Isiah is the scapegoat and Larry is teflon because no one has ever fired him before. My bad.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-14-2006 1:04 PM]

Who is the President/GM of the NY Knicks?

Who was hired to rebuild the NY Knicks and who was hired to coach the NY Knicks?

Do you honestly believe that Isiah had no interest in acquiring Rose or Francis but only did so because Larry wanted him to? 2 players who nobody would ever think would be Larry Brown type players but who are exactly the type of player that Isiah has acquired since he's been here.

Oh, but LB was at the Dog and Pony press conference saying he was all for the move even though he looked like someone shot his dog.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Allanfan20
Posts: 35947
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #542
USA
6/14/2006  4:06 PM
Larry claimed to be kidding about the delusional comments and the Georgia Tech comment as well. Who cares? Isiah pulled the trigger. It's Isiah's job to make these trades. Isiah made a bad trade. I have a question. Did you want Jeff Van Gundy fired when he benched Camby and made Sprewell the 6th man as we stumbled to the 8th seed in '99??

Good coaches do stuff like that. It's not just Larry Brown. I'm pretty sure Pat Riley would have been the same exact way. Let me ask you something. Do you think Phil Jackson should have been fired when he called Kwame Brown a P**sy? You think we'd be better off if Stan Van Gundy were out coach? NO. We wouldn't have been any better. The roster sucked last season that Isiah Thomas put together.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
oohah
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/7/2005
Member: #887
6/14/2006  4:31 PM
I wonder what it is that Ariza did that makes so many people around here dislike him?

Was he supposed to go from totally raw to completely refined in one summer? Was he supposed to transform into a sweet-shooting, fancy-dribbling, 6'8" forward one year into his NBA career, as one of the youngest players in the league and the youngest on the Knicks?

Was that it?

When did he become "Mr. Poor work ethic"? Every article last summer was about how hard he was working. Did anyone ever see him dog it when he played?

When did he become "Mr. Bad attitude"? Was it because he dared to answer some reporter's questions? Did he say something against somebody at that time? How come if he answers a question, not even in a bad way, it is insubordinance, he is a malcontent worthy of benching or dumping, he needs to learn respect for his superiors, he has no future, but it is okay for you-know-who to do it?

Ariza is what he was last year: Young, Raw, and packed with potential. He did not get worse this year, he got better. He just didn't become the player that we wanted him to be, and it was unfair that we wanted him to be that player so quickly.


***

Summer League: Summer League is for developing (unestablished) players, but it is much more of a tryout for fringe players. Any player who is no longer playing for a contract takes a big risk playing in the summer leagues, though I think more should play just to stay in shape.

Mike Sweetney did not take part in summer league last year, and I would be surprised of Lee, Frye, or Nate will play Summer league after the next season.

But if anyone seriously thinks Ariza, or any other young player not named Eddie Curry, is taking the summer off, is not training, is not working on a skill, then they are most likely wrong.

Give the kid a break.

oohah





Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Allanfan20
Posts: 35947
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #542
USA
6/14/2006  4:34 PM
I wasn't dogging Ariza. I was dogging Isiah
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
6/14/2006  4:37 PM
Posted by oohah:

I wonder what it is that Ariza did that makes so many people around here dislike him?

He sucked.

He was overrated from day 1 because he was the first young player to get any playing time in NY as a rookie. He was exposed in year 2
oohah
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/7/2005
Member: #887
6/14/2006  4:52 PM
He sucked.

He was overrated from day 1 because he was the first young player to get any playing time in NY as a rookie. He was exposed in year 2

The only thing that was exposed about Ariza is that he was a young player that is not ready for big minutes. We shoulda known that anyway.

What did you expect him to become in his second year that he fell so short of? Maybe these expectations were a tad unrealistic?

By the way, most veteran 6'8" players are not particularly good dribblers, and many are not particularly good shooters. It seems to me that Ariza's skillset is being held to a guard-level standard.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
6/14/2006  4:57 PM
I've gone through this a million times but there are certain things that even young players need to have already learned by the time they enter the league. Dribbling is one of them and unless Ariza changes that horrific looking jumpshot it will never improve
islesfan
Posts: 9999
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 7/19/2004
Member: #712
6/14/2006  5:22 PM
Posted by oohah:


The only thing that was exposed about Ariza is that he was a young player that is not ready for big minutes. We shoulda known that anyway.

Well some of us knew that but the majority, including NY Knicks management felt he was a lot more than that and pushed for him to get more minutes than he deserved.

What did you expect him to become in his second year that he fell so short of? Maybe these expectations were a tad unrealistic?

I expected him to be able to dribble 5 feet with his head up and not turning it over. I expected to see some kind of improvement on his jump shot. I expected him to have some kind of clue when it comes to playing in a half court offense. I expected him to have a much better attitude than he did, like he had already had things coming to him just because the fans liked him.

Personally I don't think any of that is so unrealistic.

By the way, most veteran 6'8" players are not particularly good dribblers, and many are not particularly good shooters. It seems to me that Ariza's skillset is being held to a guard-level standard.

I think you're holding him to a power forward/center level standard in terms of his basic skills.





[Edited by - islesfan on 06-14-2006 5:23 PM]

[Edited by - islesfan on 06-14-2006 5:24 PM]
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30255
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
6/14/2006  5:24 PM
Ariza's game is based on a Pheniox Suns/New Jersey Nets style of basketball. Him playing in a slowed down halfcourt offense just won't work for him. If Orlando don't keep him. Look for him to end up in Pheniox.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Page 2 of 4 ‹ Previous 1  2  3  4 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Knick fans still mourning the loss of Ariza...
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy