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Curry HAS To Show Up In '06, Or Else.
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Pharzeone
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5/25/2006  11:51 AM
Posted by fishmike:

believe it or not I'm with Pharzone, while I would MUCH rather have our pick this year and next and even Sweetney in the fold Curry's downside is what he did this year, 15/6 and shooting over 55% in 28-32 minutes or so. Not the end of the world. But if we are going to make a Curry/Frye front court of the future work we need at least 2 dirty work guys in there to get things done. My vote would be for Reggie Evans and Theo Ratliff. If I could trade QRich and Malik for Ratliff that would create a roster space, then sign Reggie to the MLE and your frontcourt looks like
Curry/Ratliff
Frye/Reggie

Nice mix IMO. Ratliff only needs to be a 15-18 minute a night guy, and Reggie can get 10 boards a night in 20 minutes and doesnt need to take shots.

You are right about that, I am not the biggest Evans fan, though he will help. At this stage I think Theo is just too old, the Knicks should have gotten him years ago when they had the opportunity. Right now he would be worst than an old version of AD, I rather have a healthy Nene or Dalembert. Keep Butler too. One thing I like what Brown was doing late in the year was using Butler and Curry at the same time. It was effective. Thats why I am very in favor of getting a Sene in the draft if you can swing it. An athlethic shotblocker with young legs.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
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misterearl
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5/25/2006  11:57 AM
Could Jackie Butler be molded into the shape of Ben Wallace at the four?

Sene at center

Frye at the three for outside offense

Me like
once a knick always a knick
fishmike
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5/25/2006  12:05 PM
can I be molded into Johan Santana? I pitch, I'm left handed...

You guys have seen Sene, I havent. I would be shocked if he made it to 20 based on people's evaluations.

Phar, I think Nene is out of reach and Dalembert is just a bad basketball player.

Part of what I like about Ratliff is he IS old, and we arent asking anything except good bench play. Also I'm looking to use him to make a 2 for 1 roster move to clear up a spot, for either a pick or just resigning Butler/Woods.

Reggie is easily one of the league top 5 rebounders, he's a dirty player, he doesnt need the ball and he's liked by teammates. I think a future of Curry/Frye gives you great frontcourt scoring, but you need that "got your back" kind of role player. At least until they mature some more
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Marv
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5/25/2006  12:09 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Could Jackie Butler be molded into the shape of Ben Wallace at the four?

do that many steroids exist in the world?
fishmike
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5/25/2006  12:17 PM
he could work on a fro
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Pharzeone
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5/25/2006  12:26 PM
Posted by fishmike:

can I be molded into Johan Santana? I pitch, I'm left handed...

You guys have seen Sene, I havent. I would be shocked if he made it to 20 based on people's evaluations.

Phar, I think Nene is out of reach and Dalembert is just a bad basketball player.

Part of what I like about Ratliff is he IS old, and we arent asking anything except good bench play. Also I'm looking to use him to make a 2 for 1 roster move to clear up a spot, for either a pick or just resigning Butler/Woods.

Reggie is easily one of the league top 5 rebounders, he's a dirty player, he doesnt need the ball and he's liked by teammates. I think a future of Curry/Frye gives you great frontcourt scoring, but you need that "got your back" kind of role player. At least until they mature some more

Dalembert is being asked to do alot in Cheeks system. They are thin up front so when he picks dumb fouls it sticks out alot. With this team he provide that support against penetrating swingman and guards. On this team he could collect fouls as long as he rebounds and blocks you don't mind him picking up some of those. He has younger legs than Theo. To me with Evans he is a tough defender but he isn't a shotblocker, with Dalembert you can get that. I also think Evans will get alot more than the MLE, too (although that nutgrab may cost him some millions but it seems to be the norm in the NBA now). Sene would be a perfect fit for this team. He has a chance of being a taller version of Ben Wallace than Butler.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
rvhoss
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5/25/2006  12:45 PM
I don't want to bring anybody else in, what's the garuntee they will be any good once they arrive...why not stick with our current kids...Jackie and Lee seem to be the rugged duo you want and frye and jj will be the shot blockers you crave.

Bringing in more losers won't help anything and dreaming about dalembart is even worst.

I like the original theme of this thread...what we got have to step up just a smidgeon, they do that and we will be more than fine.
all kool aid all the time.
McK1
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5/25/2006  12:46 PM
Posted by fishmike:

You guys have seen Sene, I havent. I would be shocked if he made it to 20 based on people's evaluations.

exactly. if he works out and is as good as the hype, he is off the board at 20.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
BigSm00th
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5/25/2006  1:08 PM
the first post that started this topic is on par with the scene in dumb and dumber when lloyd christmas, upon hearing that he has a one-in-a-million chance to hook up with mary swanson, says "so you're saying there's a chance?"

so if eddy curry doesn't morph into amare stoudemire, we're screwed? really? you think so? thanks for the heads up bobs.
#Knickstaps
rvhoss
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5/25/2006  1:51 PM
lol...right on smooth...

Curry can stay as is IMHO.

JJ and QRich are the two acquisitions that really need to improve their game and we are well on our way...we would immediately get a shot blocker (for a fraction of the price of the 80 year old shell of his former self ratliff) and a perimeter defender and consistent outside threat.

If those two play like they did the year before they arrived, then we can shelve all this stupid Get kmart, etc. talk and stick with the team we have.

They both (along with curry) just need to show up in shape.

I envisioned a lineup of (2004-2005 stats for vets, 2005-2006 for rooks)

Starbury (22/8)
Crawford (18/4)
QRich (15/2)
Frye (12/6)
Curry (16/5)

and a bench of:
Jerome James (1.5 blocks)
Lee (5/5)
Nate (10/2)
Reezy/Qwoods (7/4 rebounds) and DEFENSE
JackieB (5/3)

That's a team! Forget about Jrose, SFranchise and the others, the above team is young and hungry and marbury and JJ are the only one's over 26.

Stop this madness with bringing in the other teams broken down, has been malcontents...

We have our starters, we have our bench, we have our role players...

WE HAVE OUR TEAM!!!
all kool aid all the time.
fishmike
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5/25/2006  2:30 PM
Posted by rvhoss:

I don't want to bring anybody else in, what's the garuntee they will be any good once they arrive...why not stick with our current kids...Jackie and Lee seem to be the rugged duo you want and frye and jj will be the shot blockers you crave.

Bringing in more losers won't help anything and dreaming about dalembart is even worst.

I like the original theme of this thread...what we got have to step up just a smidgeon, they do that and we will be more than fine.
well, the whole point of my response is what you just said. Getting guys like Ratliff and Reggie Evans are to make Curry/Frye better. Getting a good wing defender would make it easier on Marbury, Nate and Crawford, all good scorers but poor defenders. The point is by balancing the roster we can make our current players better. Reggie, Ratliff helps with that. Getting rid of Mo, Jalen and Francis helps with that also

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
crzymdups
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5/25/2006  2:41 PM
Posted by fishmike:

take it out even further... try to package Francis and both our picks with cash (of course) for the Hawks pick and you have a shot at a guy like Ronnie Brewer or even Gay if he slips a bit. There should be some good wing players there.

Even better is if we can do that we get a trade exception as we dont take a player back from the Hawks (only a pick). This would let us outright release Mo T and Jalen Rose as they dont fit, and still leave us with a big trade exception we could use at the deadline if it so suits us.

absolutely agree about signing Reggie Evans to the MLE. iffy about adding Theo. I think it's a waste. If they do Jalen for Theo or Malik and Mo T for Theo, okay. otherwise, no way. I'd like to keep QRich.

Francis to Atlanta seems like one of the few Francis moves that makes sense (that and Denver). I think Francis for their lotto or Francis for Al Harrington both make sense for us. You know Zeke covets Al, probably more than a lotto. I think Al is a versatile player, capable of putting up a lot of points. I don't know if he fits here. Personally, I'd rather add Kmart for Francis, if his knee checks out. I don't know, I don't see Atlanta trading their lotto pick when they have a high chance of sending their pick next year to PHX.
¿ △ ?
rvhoss
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5/25/2006  2:52 PM
I think butler and lee are here already, cheaper and help make curry/frye better. (an in shape JJ as well), we have a good wing defender if QRich is in better shape and QWoods continues to improve (he's pretty good already). The point is that the roster is already balanced.

And getting rid of Mo, Jalen and Francis will still keep it balanced if we bring in nobody to replace them.

Don't jump on the LB "I hate these knicks" bandwagon, Lee and Butler are more than preferred over Ratliff and Reggie Evans. And Ratliff had the same stats as Jerome James (when he was in shape) so we know JJ is the same (if he is in shape), so shoot, we have Lee, butler and JJ.

We have our roster, stop LarryLoving every other teams players.

I can honestly say, no kool aid involved, that I would rather have Lee and Butler get the minutes on the cheap and rebuilding path than theo ratliff and reggie evans. Lee, if given evans minutes is a better defender and rebounder and we've seen what jackie can do.

David Lee 5/5 in 14 minutes a game...Reggie Evans 5/10 in 24 minutes a game. In terms of shot blocking, JJ cost $5 mill, ratliff costs $15...do the math.

So, look at the roster, we have your wing defender in QRich (in shape) and you have the shot blocker in JJ and you have the rebounding and downlow presence in Lee and Butler.

You want to rebuild but at the same time you want to bring in high priced over hyped scrubs from other teams to take minutes away from Jackie/Lee and our other youngins.

We have our team...just open your eyes.
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crzymdups
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5/25/2006  2:55 PM
I don't hate this team, I love like 8 or 9 of the guys we have, but if you think we don't need a defensive big man who can give us a good hard 20-30 minutes a night, you need to open your own eyes.

We have some great pieces, we need the complimentary parts now. Evans or Kmart would add 10 wins to this team just in the way they complemented the other players.
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fishmike
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5/25/2006  2:58 PM
We have our team...just open your eyes.
maybe you have missed the last 2-3 years
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
djsunyc
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5/25/2006  3:40 PM
Posted by fishmike:

take it out even further... try to package Francis and both our picks with cash (of course) for the Hawks pick and you have a shot at a guy like Ronnie Brewer or even Gay if he slips a bit. There should be some good wing players there.

Even better is if we can do that we get a trade exception as we dont take a player back from the Hawks (only a pick). This would let us outright release Mo T and Jalen Rose as they dont fit, and still leave us with a big trade exception we could use at the deadline if it so suits us.

looks like when all is said and done, it'll probably end up being marbury/francis for harrington in a s&t.
bobs3304
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5/25/2006  8:27 PM
For those of you that are actually being reasonable (unlike me) and saying that its unfair to expect to so much out of Curry.............I say kudos unto you...........BUT YOURE STILL WRONG.


As fans, are you honestly willing to wait 3 years to get under the cap, just to get the CHANCE to sign somebody good?

THREE YEARS.


Do you think with the personell we have now, we're gonna be any better than 1st round team?

Right now, we're basically on track to become a poor man's Washington Wizards, which is pretty friggin disgusting if you ask me.


In order to have ANY hope for the near future, Eddy Curry HAS to become everything he was advertised to be. There's no doubt about it.

Now, if I was a betting man I'd say he doesnt, in which case we really are screwed.
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
bobs3304
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5/25/2006  8:28 PM
Oh.............and what's with this Francis to Atlanta talk?


It'll like NEVER happen.................EVER.
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
nixluva
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5/25/2006  10:07 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

For those of you that are actually being reasonable (unlike me) and saying that its unfair to expect to so much out of Curry.............I say kudos unto you...........BUT YOURE STILL WRONG.


As fans, are you honestly willing to wait 3 years to get under the cap, just to get the CHANCE to sign somebody good?

THREE YEARS.


Do you think with the personell we have now, we're gonna be any better than 1st round team?

Right now, we're basically on track to become a poor man's Washington Wizards, which is pretty friggin disgusting if you ask me.


In order to have ANY hope for the near future, Eddy Curry HAS to become everything he was advertised to be. There's no doubt about it.

Now, if I was a betting man I'd say he doesnt, in which case we really are screwed.

Actually I don't think we're in bad shape at all talent wise. Its just that we have to allow our young talent to develop. We have a balanced lineup. I'd like another deep threat and a defensive swingman, but aside from that, I like the roster. We just need to leave things alone and let the team develop chemistry. If we're always making major changes that will never happen.
bobs3304
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5/26/2006  6:22 AM
You like the talent level?


We're capped out without any lottery picks, and a fringe head coach with bad management.

Oh ya, and not to mention --- WHERE'S THE FRANCHISE PLAYER?
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
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