[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Not the best press for Scowlbury. Larry wants "Head".
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 2 of 2 ‹ Previous 1  2 
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  2:55 PM
Posted by rojasmas:

I agree with Vescey that all 3 have to go: LB, Marbs and Isiah. We need a fresh start with a coach who can relate to our uptempo type youth. Paul Westphal would be a good candidate. Nice guy, smart, much more easygoing than LB. Patient.


trust me..he's horrible..would not last in New York with the press...He would be under the gun rather quickly...

He's like Lenny Wilkins without the experience...





[Edited by - holfresh on 03-19-2006 2:56 PM]
AUTOADVERT
arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
3/19/2006  3:38 PM
This makes it an exiting show. He also is a unique personality and as any persona have a good and bad in him. It makes a drama which is good for media and business.
The only problem is - all this nothing to do with winning and greatness. This what we fans want from out team.
Marbs is not the right persona to bring to New York and to any other place.
Talking about LB. Look at the Pistons - great team with very impassive talented players, but where us their defense and greatness - Knicks shoot 57% in the win an Raseed and Rip get themselves ejected. Do they win the title this year - I doubt it.
The only way to get to the top in any team sports is team work, dedication, and sticking to the system. See Spurs, Lakers, Browns Pistons, the Isaiah Pistons. So what the NY fans want drama and excitement (Marbayy) of winning and greatness (LB)...
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
3/19/2006  3:39 PM
I am not concern with Marbs at all. He is a star player with great skills. There is a lot of this in NBA
This makes it an exiting show. He also is a unique personality and as any persona have a good and bad in him. It makes a drama which is good for media and business.
The only problem is - all this nothing to do with winning and greatness. This what we fans want from out team.
Marbs is not the right persona to bring to New York and to any other place.
Talking about LB. Look at the Pistons - great team with very impassive talented players, but where us their defense and greatness - Knicks shoot 57% in the win an Raseed and Rip get themselves ejected. Do they win the title this year - I doubt it.
The only way to get to the top in any team sports is team work, dedication, and sticking to the system. See Spurs, Lakers, Browns Pistons, the Isaiah Pistons. So what the NY fans want drama and excitement (Marbayy) of winning and greatness (LB)...
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  3:41 PM
Posted by TMS:
A championship..I'm not too sure about that...But if you think that Larry can implement his style of play and win in 3 years, you are kidding yourself

for me, it's all about creating a culture of winning in NY & BUILDING TOWARDS that championship... i don't see that happening as long as Marbury's on the team... whether LB can win one or not, who knows, but i do know that he'll leave this team better than he got it, & they'll be a better franchise for having LB as thier coach in the long run.



It should be the least he can do getting 10 mil per season, coming in a with wins in the low 30s....So tell me this...If he walks away after the Knicks have a 40 win season..I guess you will call it a success?
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
3/19/2006  4:31 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by TMS:
A championship..I'm not too sure about that...But if you think that Larry can implement his style of play and win in 3 years, you are kidding yourself

for me, it's all about creating a culture of winning in NY & BUILDING TOWARDS that championship... i don't see that happening as long as Marbury's on the team... whether LB can win one or not, who knows, but i do know that he'll leave this team better than he got it, & they'll be a better franchise for having LB as thier coach in the long run.



It should be the least he can do getting 10 mil per season, coming in a with wins in the low 30s....So tell me this...If he walks away after the Knicks have a 40 win season..I guess you will call it a success?



it all depends on how the team is progressing if & when he leaves... if the team is made up of young guys that are just beginning to mature, & he has them playing good fundamental style basketball & gelling as a team, then sure, i'd be happy w/that, because that means the next coach to come in will have a team that's ready to hit the next level... but if after several years of LB coaching here & the team is still looking as if they're stuck at mediocre & not on their way up, then no, i wouldn't be happy... but tell me the last time LB left a team worse than they were when he got there? it hasn't happened.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  4:50 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by TMS:
A championship..I'm not too sure about that...But if you think that Larry can implement his style of play and win in 3 years, you are kidding yourself

for me, it's all about creating a culture of winning in NY & BUILDING TOWARDS that championship... i don't see that happening as long as Marbury's on the team... whether LB can win one or not, who knows, but i do know that he'll leave this team better than he got it, & they'll be a better franchise for having LB as thier coach in the long run.



It should be the least he can do getting 10 mil per season, coming in a with wins in the low 30s....So tell me this...If he walks away after the Knicks have a 40 win season..I guess you will call it a success?



it all depends on how the team is progressing if & when he leaves... if the team is made up of young guys that are just beginning to mature, & he has them playing good fundamental style basketball & gelling as a team, then sure, i'd be happy w/that, because that means the next coach to come in will have a team that's ready to hit the next level... but if after several years of LB coaching here & the team is still looking as if they're stuck at mediocre & not on their way up, then no, i wouldn't be happy... but tell me the last time LB left a team worse than they were when he got there? it hasn't happened.



There also is always an upgrade of talent when Larry coaches a team as well...Sheed going to the Pistons was a tremendous upgrade...One that Larry wasn't winning a Championship without..So does Joe Dumars get kudos for that or does Larry?
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
3/19/2006  5:00 PM
does Joe Dumars get kudos for that or does Larry?

of course Dumars gets kudos for putting that team together... but LB does as well for instilling into them the correct team first mindset that propelled them to championship heights... do you think Flip Saunders would have that team playing as well as they are right now if it hadn't been for LB's having gotten those guys all playing stellar defense & team basketball the 2 years prior? the same way Flip has benefitted from LB's having been there before him, LB also inherited a well coached team by Rick Carlisle as well (another top notch coach in my eyes)... you can't possibly take 1 ounce of credit away from LB for helping that team win a title & coming w/in a game of another.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  5:07 PM
Posted by TMS:
does Joe Dumars get kudos for that or does Larry?

of course Dumars gets kudos for putting that team together... but LB does as well for instilling into them the correct team first mindset that propelled them to championship heights... do you think Flip Saunders would have that team playing as well as they are right now if it hadn't been for LB's having gotten those guys all playing stellar defense & team basketball the 2 years prior? the same way Flip has benefitted from LB's having been there before him, LB also inherited a well coached team by Rick Carlisle as well (another top notch coach in my eyes)... you can't possibly take 1 ounce of credit away from LB for helping that team win a title & coming w/in a game of another.



And I don't take any credit from LB for that...It's just that you guys give him so much credit and much of it is undeserved...Also,I do think Carlisle would have taken them to the Championship if Sheed was in Detroit while Carlisle was there...Flip, I'm not sure..But you have to admit this...Larry ran to that team after he saw the players fit his style of coaching...
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  5:09 PM

My point is that the trade for Sheed was bigger than Larry's input...Carlisle would have done the job...Don't forget in Larry's first season Detroit won 54 games...Under Carlisle they had 2 consecutive 50 win seasons...
oohah
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/7/2005
Member: #887
3/19/2006  6:34 PM
My point is that the trade for Sheed was bigger than Larry's input...Carlisle would have done the job...Don't forget in Larry's first season Detroit won 54 games...Under Carlisle they had 2 consecutive 50 win seasons...

Exactly. Does anyone really believe that LB would have won the champinoship, or even beaten Maimi to get to the finals without Rasheed Wallace? If not for Rasheed, LB's Pistons end exactly where Carlisle's Pistons ended--at the conference finals.

As for all of the LB taught them how to play defense stuff, I guess he did a hell of a job teaching defensive player of the year before LB Ben Wallace defense. He taught Rasheed Wallace how to play defense in record time, about 30 games!

Rick Carlisle got jobbed by the Pistons. LB did not do a better job than Carlisle, he inherited a very good team which got upgraded in talent in a major way halfway through the season, and who knows if Wade/Mailman did not get injured, if even the improved personnel would have been good enough?

LB did a much more notable job with his 76ers finals squad, and for that matter, at Kansas.

LB's least notable coaching performance? 2005/2006 New York Knicks

oohah



Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
3/19/2006  7:02 PM
Posted by oohah:
My point is that the trade for Sheed was bigger than Larry's input...Carlisle would have done the job...Don't forget in Larry's first season Detroit won 54 games...Under Carlisle they had 2 consecutive 50 win seasons...

Exactly. Does anyone really believe that LB would have won the champinoship, or even beaten Maimi to get to the finals without Rasheed Wallace? If not for Rasheed, LB's Pistons end exactly where Carlisle's Pistons ended--at the conference finals.

As for all of the LB taught them how to play defense stuff, I guess he did a hell of a job teaching defensive player of the year before LB Ben Wallace defense. He taught Rasheed Wallace how to play defense in record time, about 30 games!

Rick Carlisle got jobbed by the Pistons. LB did not do a better job than Carlisle, he inherited a very good team which got upgraded in talent in a major way halfway through the season, and who knows if Wade/Mailman did not get injured, if even the improved personnel would have been good enough?

LB did a much more notable job with his 76ers finals squad, and for that matter, at Kansas.

LB's least notable coaching performance? 2005/2006 New York Knicks

oohah


i'm talking about team defense... Carlisle's team were playing solid D, & LB helped them take it 1 step further... don't pick out 1 player in Ben Wallace & assume i'm talking about him only... it's a collaborative effort that got the Pistons that NBA title... not just the addition of Rasheed, not just the defense of Ben Wallace, but the entire team buying into a mentality of playing together as a team... LB helped them achieve that, whether you care to believe it or not.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081
3/19/2006  7:07 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by oohah:
My point is that the trade for Sheed was bigger than Larry's input...Carlisle would have done the job...Don't forget in Larry's first season Detroit won 54 games...Under Carlisle they had 2 consecutive 50 win seasons...

Exactly. Does anyone really believe that LB would have won the champinoship, or even beaten Maimi to get to the finals without Rasheed Wallace? If not for Rasheed, LB's Pistons end exactly where Carlisle's Pistons ended--at the conference finals.

As for all of the LB taught them how to play defense stuff, I guess he did a hell of a job teaching defensive player of the year before LB Ben Wallace defense. He taught Rasheed Wallace how to play defense in record time, about 30 games!

Rick Carlisle got jobbed by the Pistons. LB did not do a better job than Carlisle, he inherited a very good team which got upgraded in talent in a major way halfway through the season, and who knows if Wade/Mailman did not get injured, if even the improved personnel would have been good enough?

LB did a much more notable job with his 76ers finals squad, and for that matter, at Kansas.

LB's least notable coaching performance? 2005/2006 New York Knicks

oohah


i'm talking about team defense... Carlisle's team were playing solid D, & LB helped them take it 1 step further... don't pick out 1 player in Ben Wallace & assume i'm talking about him only... it's a collaborative effort that got the Pistons that NBA title... not just the addition of Rasheed, not just the defense of Ben Wallace, but the entire team buying into a mentality of playing together as a team... LB helped them achieve that, whether you care to believe it or not.



OK...just answer one question, who was a more important addition to that team..LB or Sheed?
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
3/19/2006  7:13 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by oohah:
My point is that the trade for Sheed was bigger than Larry's input...Carlisle would have done the job...Don't forget in Larry's first season Detroit won 54 games...Under Carlisle they had 2 consecutive 50 win seasons...

Exactly. Does anyone really believe that LB would have won the champinoship, or even beaten Maimi to get to the finals without Rasheed Wallace? If not for Rasheed, LB's Pistons end exactly where Carlisle's Pistons ended--at the conference finals.

As for all of the LB taught them how to play defense stuff, I guess he did a hell of a job teaching defensive player of the year before LB Ben Wallace defense. He taught Rasheed Wallace how to play defense in record time, about 30 games!

Rick Carlisle got jobbed by the Pistons. LB did not do a better job than Carlisle, he inherited a very good team which got upgraded in talent in a major way halfway through the season, and who knows if Wade/Mailman did not get injured, if even the improved personnel would have been good enough?

LB did a much more notable job with his 76ers finals squad, and for that matter, at Kansas.

LB's least notable coaching performance? 2005/2006 New York Knicks

oohah


i'm talking about team defense... Carlisle's team were playing solid D, & LB helped them take it 1 step further... don't pick out 1 player in Ben Wallace & assume i'm talking about him only... it's a collaborative effort that got the Pistons that NBA title... not just the addition of Rasheed, not just the defense of Ben Wallace, but the entire team buying into a mentality of playing together as a team... LB helped them achieve that, whether you care to believe it or not.



OK...just answer one question, who was a more important addition to that team..LB or Sheed?


there's no way to quantify that question or come up w/a valid, indisputable answer... obviously both played a huge role in helping the Pistons win a title last year... same can be said for every other member on that Pistons team... to say something like "Sheed was more important than LB's coaching" is short sighted & unjustifiable.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
oohah
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/7/2005
Member: #887
3/19/2006  8:16 PM
i'm talking about team defense... Carlisle's team were playing solid D, & LB helped them take it 1 step further... don't pick out 1 player in Ben Wallace & assume i'm talking about him only... it's a collaborative effort that got the Pistons that NBA title... not just the addition of Rasheed, not just the defense of Ben Wallace, but the entire team buying into a mentality of playing together as a team... LB helped them achieve that, whether you care to believe it or not.

The problem with this statement is that you're making it sound like LB had them doing somthing that they weren't doing under Carlisle. Carlisle got coach of the year in his last year with Detroit.

The Pistons were a very good defense-oriented team before LB got there. If you look at the Piston's record with LB before R. Wallace, there is nothing to back up the statement that LB made them play more like a team or better on D. They were on the exact same pace that Carlisle had them. Until Wallace showed up. Go check the wins and losses.

What changed the defensive complexion of Detroit was Rasheed Wallace, whether you want to believe it or not. They added another guy who can guard ANY big man, and who can block anyone's shot around the basket. And in Wallace they added a guy who can shoot out to the 3 efficiently. It changed the depth chart of the Pistons dramatically.

If you want an example of LB's coaching greatness: 76ers/Kansas, definitely not Detroit.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
3/19/2006  10:42 PM
this conversation's going nowhere... you believe what you want dude... i'm sure thousands of fans in DET give LB all the credit in the world for helping their franchise win an NBA title... but go on thinking what you're thinking if you like.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Nalod
Posts: 71929
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
3/19/2006  10:54 PM
Funny, Phil jax does not get cred seeing " how you lose with Mike-Pip or Kobe-Shaq.

Dude has 9 rings!

Larry is not in that class, but he might be seen has making more out of what he has.

Until this year of course.

I give larry credit for one thing, he is not caving in and compromising. His job is safe, and he does not have to prove much this year. Herb would be panicking long ago!

Hey it sucks, but we arguing the mans career. His records speak for themselves.

As does Francis, Marbs, and Isiah.
oohah
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/7/2005
Member: #887
3/19/2006  11:15 PM
this conversation's going nowhere... you believe what you want dude... i'm sure thousands of fans in DET give LB all the credit in the world for helping their franchise win an NBA title... but go on thinking what you're thinking if you like.

Where is the conversation supposed to go?

Funny, I was in Detroit and Pontiac this past summer where I enjoyed an Detroit Shock game at the Palace. Everyone I talked to was happy to see LB go, and in fact considered him to be a weasel because of the way he well, weaseled out of Detroit. Joe Dumars was the one they gave the credit to.

But who cares what people in Detroit think anyway? I'm quite capable of observing and forming my own equaly valid opinion.

oohah


Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Page 2 of 2 ‹ Previous 1  2 
« Reply To Topic
Not the best press for Scowlbury. Larry wants "Head".
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy