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Steve Francis suspended indefintely
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McK1
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1/12/2006  6:04 PM
Posted by fishmike:

I think SF is one of the most overrated players

thats why so many of them make the all-star team.

check the standings. a 6'7 and taller guy who can shoot rebound and pass is a commodity (Mike Miller just had a triple double the other night).

With Shane there they may be willing to move Mike for backcourt talent.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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Silverfuel
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1/12/2006  6:04 PM
Is Francis a bad locker room presence? We finally have some sort of chemistry. I wouldnt want to ruin.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
jaydh
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1/12/2006  6:17 PM
according to SAS, francis was asked to come back into last nights game in the 4th quarter, and he refused. after the game the coach talked to francis and management decided to suspend him after the conversation.
SlimPack
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1/12/2006  6:22 PM
I dont understand why all of you guys want francis, to me he seems to be the selfish ball hoging cancer, that blueseats thinks marbury is. wasnt he JUST suspended for conduct detrimental to the team? briggs as somewhat of a point with the VC and Tmac comparison, but how do we know steve will turn it around once he gets here? our record is even worse than orlando's, and we dont have dwight howard.
BRIGGS
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1/12/2006  6:30 PM
Posted by SlimPack:

I dont understand why all of you guys want francis, to me he seems to be the selfish ball hoging cancer, that blueseats thinks marbury is. wasnt he JUST suspended for conduct detrimental to the team? briggs as somewhat of a point with the VC and Tmac comparison, but how do we know steve will turn it around once he gets here? our record is even worse than orlando's, and we dont have dwight howard.


hes a big time talent. all of this hes a cancer stuff is probably over-rated. other teams call marbury a cancer--actually ive spent the last month listening to knick fans call him a cancer too. you know rasheed was a cancer until he went to the pistons, vince et al. it has a lot to do with who is on the team and who is coaching the team. did steve francis have any problems with rudy t no--has he been an arsehole like rasheed or artest no
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OasisBU
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1/12/2006  6:53 PM
While I dont think we need him, giving up only penny would be a steal. Could he help? Sure - but only if he accepted his role with the team, which I doubt would be the type of role he desires. Unless he doesnt want to be the star - then again, we would probably use him for scoring and keep Marbury at the 1. But then how do you find minutes for Crawford (who I like a lot) and Nate?

Briggs...what kind of rotation would you work with Franchise on this roster?
"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
Bonn1997
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1/12/2006  6:56 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by fishmike:

I think SF is one of the most overrated players

thats why so many of them make the all-star team.

check the standings. a 6'7 and taller guy who can shoot rebound and pass is a commodity (Mike Miller just had a triple double the other night).

With Shane there they may be willing to move Mike for backcourt talent.
Not sure what you're talking about. I think SF=Steve Francis (not Small Forward) in Fish's post.

EnySpree
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1/12/2006  6:56 PM
Posted by fishmike:

Maybe I just like the way these guys are playing and want to see how real and how far this winning goes before I move guys

I feel ya on that one Fishy.

Sometimes Knick fans get a little carried away when a guy looks to be available.....

Kinda like this guy......



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BigRedDog
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1/12/2006  6:56 PM
Posted by oohah:
nah, im not interested in trading craw at all. many teams will shy away from his salary. this would fit under my personal criteria as a guy who i would spend the money to acquire using an ending contract. hes an impact player. wed have the fiercest 3 man guard line up in the legue.

And I think that thinking we could get Francis for a pack of big league chew is unrealistic. You have to give some value to get some value. Part of the attraction to me of Crawford for Francis is dumping JC's nutty contract. (I don't know what SF's is.)

oohah


JC's contact is actually pretty resonable by nba standards. If he keeps playing the way he has been he would be underpaid.-believe it or not.

fishmike 9/27/2024 11:00 PM Ug I hate this. The idea of Towns is great until you see what a pussy he is. Jules is a dog. DD was a flamethrower locked up cheap for 3 more years. First Leon move I hate
BRIGGS
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1/12/2006  6:57 PM
Posted by OasisBU:

While I dont think we need him, giving up only penny would be a steal. Could he help? Sure - but only if he accepted his role with the team, which I doubt would be the type of role he desires. Unless he doesnt want to be the star - then again, we would probably use him for scoring and keep Marbury at the 1. But then how do you find minutes for Crawford (who I like a lot) and Nate?

Briggs...what kind of rotation would you work with Franchise on this roster?



Im just looking at it this way. We have Nate Robinson starting. I love nate, hes done a great job. I think his best role NOW would be as a fourth guard spark plug. Hes getting physically killed, hes going to get hurt the way things are going. I dont think hes made for 30 minutes. I guess if I could get Ruben Patterson and Mike James here--that would be the best in terms of salary cap--but would i take francis for an ending contract--would you take francis over nate?
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OasisBU
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1/12/2006  7:00 PM
Yeah I would take Francis over Nate - without question.

You?

And I agree, Nate is physically getting killed - what happened against Dirk last night on the pick and rolls was a disgrace. Still like the kid though, he has a lot of heart.
"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
McK1
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1/12/2006  7:29 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:


Not sure what you're talking about. I think SF=Steve Francis (not Small Forward) in Fish's post.

whoops - read it wrong!
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
tomverve
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1/12/2006  7:46 PM
ugh. I've never liked Franis, wouldn't want him on this team. The guy can't shoot a lick-- he's hitting .379 eFG% on his jumpers this season. (He shot the exact same percentage on his jumpers last season, so you can't chalk it up to him dogging it.) To give you an idea of how truly bad that is, it's even worse than Q's jump shooting this season (.390). Not sure he could co-exist with both Marbury and Crawford either on offense.

His passing isn't great either-- certainly worse than Marbury's, whom everyone seems to like to complain about. Crawford is probably also a better passer.

He's a great rebounder for his position, but we're already a great rebounding team. And believe it or not, Nate has been a better rebounder this season (9.0 rebound rate) than Francis (7.3). Nate's 9.0 rebound rate is also better than any of Francis's rebound rates for the last three seasons (03-05).

So I don't see that we'd be adding much-- we already have a penetrator on his level, already have better passers, already have better shooters (that's not saying much), even already have a better rebounding PG. Bringing him here would probably cause more chemistry problems than anything else. The only reason I'd trade for him is to upgrade the Penny trading chip.
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bigbeast
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1/12/2006  8:28 PM
Brown plays three guard lineups at the end of the game anyway. Your kidding yourself if you think a lineup of francis, Marbury and Craw wouldn't be more effecient than Marb, craw and Robinson.

Comparing Francis Shooting percentages to qrich is idiotic. Q-Rich is a specialist. If his threes are off he's worthless on O. Francis can put the ball on the floor, penetrate, dish or take it all the way to the rack. He automatically becomes the teams best athlete. With fran, craw and Marb on the floor, either one of them could handle the ball and make a play. FRancis is a play maker while Q-Rich isn't. Francis had years where averaged over 20 and obviously is pulling a Vince down there. He seems lifeless.

Please don't compare a 5'9 guard to an allstar calliber guard like Franchise
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
McK1
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1/12/2006  8:34 PM
Posted by bigbeast:

Brown plays three guard lineups at the end of the game anyway. Your kidding yourself if you think a lineup of francis, Marbury and Craw wouldn't be more effecient than Marb, craw and Robinson.

Comparing Francis Shooting percentages to qrich is idiotic. Q-Rich is a specialist. If his threes are off he's worthless on O. Francis can put the ball on the floor, penetrate, dish or take it all the way to the rack. He automatically becomes the teams best athlete. With fran, craw and Marb on the floor, either one of them could handle the ball and make a play. FRancis is a play maker while Q-Rich isn't. Francis had years where averaged over 20 and obviously is pulling a Vince down there. He seems lifeless.

Please don't compare a 5'9 guard to an allstar calliber guard like Franchise

great post!
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
BRIGGS
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1/12/2006  8:39 PM
Posted by tomverve:

ugh. I've never liked Franis, wouldn't want him on this team. The guy can't shoot a lick-- he's hitting .379 eFG% on his jumpers this season. (He shot the exact same percentage on his jumpers last season, so you can't chalk it up to him dogging it.) To give you an idea of how truly bad that is, it's even worse than Q's jump shooting this season (.390). Not sure he could co-exist with both Marbury and Crawford either on offense.

His passing isn't great either-- certainly worse than Marbury's, whom everyone seems to like to complain about. Crawford is probably also a better passer.

He's a great rebounder for his position, but we're already a great rebounding team. And believe it or not, Nate has been a better rebounder this season (9.0 rebound rate) than Francis (7.3). Nate's 9.0 rebound rate is also better than any of Francis's rebound rates for the last three seasons (03-05).

So I don't see that we'd be adding much-- we already have a penetrator on his level, already have better passers, already have better shooters (that's not saying much), even already have a better rebounding PG. Bringing him here would probably cause more chemistry problems than anything else. The only reason I'd trade for him is to upgrade the Penny trading chip.



I look at it this way, Id rather go after Mike James and Ruben Patterson, but if this presents itself as a ending contract for francis trade, we certainly upgrade our roster considerably. This guy is a 20-6-6 player shooting 43% for his career, very much like Marbury. Jamal has improved under Brown right away, and now Marbury seems to be changing--why cant that happen to francis? he still does have elite level nba talent.
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tomverve
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1/12/2006  9:07 PM
Posted by bigbeast:

Comparing Francis Shooting percentages to qrich is idiotic. Q-Rich is a specialist. If his threes are off he's worthless on O. Francis can put the ball on the floor, penetrate, dish or take it all the way to the rack.

I brought up Q as a reference to show how poor of a jump shooter Francis is. Nowhere did I say anything like "Q is a better offensive player than Francis." If you can't grock that, one has to wonder who the idiotic one here is. (hint: McK1 loves the idiots)
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tomverve
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1/12/2006  9:09 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

I look at it this way, Id rather go after Mike James and Ruben Patterson, but if this presents itself as a ending contract for francis trade, we certainly upgrade our roster considerably. This guy is a 20-6-6 player shooting 43% for his career, very much like Marbury. Jamal has improved under Brown right away, and now Marbury seems to be changing--why cant that happen to francis? he still does have elite level nba talent.

I dunno, I can't see Francis/Marbury/Craw working very well. It might be worth a shot if all we had to give up was Penny, but I'm not crossing my fingers for this one.
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McK1
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1/12/2006  9:22 PM
Posted by tomverve:



I brought up Q as a reference to show how poor of a jump shooter Francis is. Nowhere did I say anything like "Q is a better offensive player than Francis." If you can't grock that, one has to wonder who the idiotic one here is. (hint: McK1 loves the idiots)

ability to break a man down off the dribble nowhere in 82 games.com do they mention that

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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1/12/2006  10:09 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

[quote]Posted by fishmike:




If I saw Golum in a bar I would not look twice. His ass is too small!
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