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Taking This Season WAY Too Seriously...
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nyk4ever
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11/24/2005  10:05 PM
At the beginning of this season, I predicted this team to win 41-43 games. I am a LITTLE surprised by the teams slow start but by no way did I expect them to be MUCH better then what they are. I said this in another thread just earlier today.. With 3 rookies in the rotation and a Hall Of Fame coach who is very precise with EVERY move that things were going to take some time. That's why I'm not really let down by whats going on.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
AUTOADVERT
jaydh
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11/24/2005  10:24 PM
Posted by FireIsiah:

This is my 1st post and i couldn't disagree any more than this situation. I can't stand isiah he has ruined this team. He still has no true center, outside shooter, big rebounder or a defensive specialist. How is this team improving, the only upside is Frye and Lee. Curry is a good player but he is not a rebounder and can't hit free throws. Crawford is a joke to watch, he is one of the worst 2 guards in the league. Nate is just to small and out of control. Ariza has no offensive skills except when he dunks. Its a sad story, instead of rebuilding and trying to get under the cap we will trade penney and antonio for more contracts. We have by far the worst outside shootig team in the league. Our best outside shooter is Fyre. What a joke!!!! Rebuild!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

curry not a true center?? most of our team is very young, and LB will teach them, otherwise they will be gone. I'm sure you liked how layden constructed our team much better. what a joke, isiah has done wonders at getting good young talent on the team. but that doesnt mean they are going to be at their full potential from day 1. BTW, we are rebuilding, thats why most of our team is 25 or younger. get under the cap...what for? we can still do sign&trades, i'd rather have $100mil payroll, rather than $40mil since you can have a lot more talent for $100mil(eventually, but layden didnt really give him much to work with).

but of course all the emotional fans who change their minds with each game will agree with your post.
bobs3304
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11/24/2005  10:57 PM
Desperate fans are the ones that have something going on in their private lives (or maybe not enuff going on).....know wat I mean...

It's OK to be an enthusiastic fan -- but desperate/emotional fans have something going on there besides just basketball...

obsessiveness is rarely good.


[Edited by - bobs3304 on 11-24-2005 11:01 PM]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
bobs3304
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11/24/2005  10:59 PM
oh.....


and i've been guilty of that before...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
fishmike
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11/25/2005  7:37 AM
I guess I am a drama queen. When you give up your unrestricted first rounder to sign a guy to big big big deal you hope to see something that makes you feel ok about that signing. Right now I see a player thats out of shape has poor fundamentals and that pick would be the 3rd pick in the draft right now.

When you give a guy thats 30 a 5 year deal for the max you can offer you arent rebuilding. You would also like to see that player show an ounce of motivation, maybe show up in shape or average more points than fouls in the couple of games he graced the floor.

I'm glad Frye is playing well, and I'm glad that Nate and Lee continue to get minutes even though they are terrible. But buried on the bench is Ariza right now. Q has given us NOTHING and the outcome of these games is balanced on how well MAlik Rose can hit that 15 foot baseline jumper.

Dont give me some crap about the record doesnt matter because we are going in the right direction. Please remdind me what direction that is. I seem to have lost the memo.

We gave up our #1 this year because with all the talent we have and money we spent we were supposed to be a decent team. Right now there are only 2 teams worse that us but we have no pick.

We have a good shot to turn things around. We have played a boat load of road games as its feasible as we start to play better the schedule also becomes more favorable but dont blow some smoke up my ass about the direction because it sucks right now.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  7:47 AM
The majority of the team is young, talented players. Teams DON'T win the first year when they're best players are this young. For so many years, the Bulls, Grizzlies, Clippers looked like they had good young players but couldn't win. Knowledgable fans realize that even after you get good young players, it takes years to form a winning club.
fishmike
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11/25/2005  8:19 AM
and knowledgeable management knows that if there is a possibility you are going to be horrible you dont trade away a #1 pick with no lottery protection. Knowledgeable fans that watch their management add $200mm plus in future salary would also know that their management has some expectations regarding level of play.

Offseason aquisitions/years experience
Curry/4 years
Davis/12
Frye/R
James/7
Lee/R
Q/5
Nate/R

This team is built to start winning right away, and if its not we have the worst management ever, because if your trading unprotected #1s you damn well better be confident your going have a decent team.

Knowledgeable fans know that just because things can get better doesnt mean they will, so you hope management has a back up plan. Look how our offseason aquisitions have performed so far.

I hope like hell Larry gets these guys straightened out pretty fast.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  8:28 AM
knowledgeable management knows that if there is a possibility you are going to be horrible you dont trade away a #1 pick with no lottery protection.
So if we miss the playoffs, would you really prefer a pick around #8 in a weaker draft over Curry? Curry's playing hard on both ends of the court and has upside that you probably won't get from a #8 pick. I would not have let the lottery protection on the pick be the deal breaker.
When you give a guy thats 30 a 5 year deal for the max you can offer you arent rebuilding.
So you aren't rebuilding if you make a lot of good decisions and one bad one? To rebuild successfully, you DON'T have to get 100% of your decisions correct. That's a concept few understand. The Grizzlies have rebuilt quite nicely and they just gave a much bigger max deal that they could offer to a mediocre 28 year old with no upside (BC).
Look how our offseason aquisitions have performed so far.
What's that supposed to mean? I'm happy with how Frye, Lee, Nate, and Curry are playing. Curry looks very promising on both ends of the court. His #s are a little deflated because he played poorly with the calf injury in his last 2 games.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 11-25-2005 08:31 AM]
fishmike
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11/25/2005  8:57 AM
being that we are 3-8 just who arent you happy with?

Please get off the we are rebuilding crap. Isiah has said we arent rebuilding. I am VERY glad ISiah has chosen to use the draft as a tool to get players, but we are in no how no way rebuilding. Rebuilding teams dont trade unrestricted #1s. And this draft isnt weak. It may be light at the bottom.

Who said anything about #8? Take a better look at the standings. Right now we are #3
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
BRIGGS
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11/25/2005  9:52 AM
this is a 500mm$ business with a 175mm$ payroll after lux taxes. you are smoking tokes if you don't think they are DARN serious about winning right NOW. They didnt go out and spend additional huge $$$ on vets like Jerome James, Q-Rich Mo Taylor or hand over 50mm$ to Eddie Curry and beg to keep A Davis after they promised to relese him because they want to lose. They didnt bring in Larry Brown because they expect to lose. Rebuilding ===cutting payroll, not adding more than everyone else for the third consecutive year. People who sit here and say this team will win in a couple of year dont sweat it--well knowing that we have isiah and larry brown at the helm, this club wont be anywhere near it is personell wise. I doubt guys like ariza, lee and nate will be here
RIP Crushalot😞
jaydh
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11/25/2005  10:15 AM
give me a break... wah wah wah


we have a new coach(who will actually coach), 7 new players, 3 rookies in the rotation(getting decent minutes), 2 2nd yr players in the rotation(bulter&ariza) and you people expected to win out of the gates? yes we spent money, yes we traded picks, and we are a much better team now than we were last year. it is going to take time. too many people want instant gratification.
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  10:18 AM
Posted by jaydh:

give me a break... wah wah wah


we have a new coach(who will actually coach), 7 new players, 3 rookies in the rotation(getting decent minutes), 2 2nd yr players in the rotation(bulter&ariza) and you people expected to win out of the gates? yes we spent money, yes we traded picks, and we are a much better team now than we were last year. it is going to take time. too many people want instant gratification.
You're exactly right; Briggs and Fish would never last one minute with the kind of full rebuilding that they're asking for. When Chicago started 0-1 last season, they would have jumped off a bridge. It's fans like them that are the reason people say you can never rebuild in NY.




[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 11-25-2005 10:19 AM]
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  10:40 AM
Who said anything about #8? Take a better look at the standings. Right now we are #3
LOL; if 80% of our games for the entire season were road games [and if we weren't merely adjusting to a new coach, new system, and new young players], I'd expect us to remain 4th (where we currently are).
fishmike
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11/25/2005  10:42 AM
hey Bonn.. you can barely speak for yourself, dont speak for me.

Where did I say I wanted to rebuild? I'm responding to dumb coments from less than knowledgeable fans that say this SEASON doesnt matter because we are rebuilding.

Your right Jay, it will take time. What you look for along the way is some improvement or direction. So far we have seen Channing Frye look great and I'm thrilled about that. So far we have played hard on D, but not well. Hey.. its an improvement.

Just dont give me some crap about this season not mattering though, or that we are rebuilding and its really about a couple years from now. If this season didnt matter we would have stuck with Herb rather than pay $10mm for a guy with a history of favoring veteran players. We wouldnt have given a 5 year deal to guy thats 30. We wouldnt have added Mo Taylor or begged for AD to stay.

Its not immediate gratification. Its getting embarrased by Kareem Rush. Its being 3-8 with no set rotation. Any knowledgeable fan would be dismayed by this because of whats at stake this year.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
djsunyc
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11/25/2005  10:47 AM
we're in this holding pattern with this roster. we need to fully turn the page and do the full rebuild. our vets ARE GARBAGE. they are not good enough to help bring the young guys along. that's why our plan is flawed. it's one thing to have a veteran team that will win 50 games and bring the young guys along slowly. it's another when the young guys ARE ALREADY BETTER than your vets...yet we don't do anything about it. TURN THE F'N PAGE ALREADY!!! we are not going anywhere with the ad's, malik's, and mo taylor's...especially with steph leading them. make a commitment one way or the other b/c there's no balance. either go all out after vets and try to win now or go all young and rebuild. but we make these half assed attempts which at the end of the day, just prolong the process.

this year is a wash and can be accepted ONLY if we play the young guys and clear the dead wood. but with talks of kg, it doesn't look like it's gonna happen, and it's a shame.

i know i know, there's time to turn it around...but turning it around with the DUDS lb put out there in charlotte would be a DISGRACE. that charlotte game was an absolute WASTE OF TIME, MONEY, and OPPORTUNITY. get with the program already...
jaydh
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11/25/2005  10:56 AM
Posted by fishmike:

Just dont give me some crap about this season not mattering though, or that we are rebuilding and its really about a couple years from now. If this season didnt matter we would have stuck with Herb rather than pay $10mm for a guy with a history of favoring veteran players. We wouldnt have given a 5 year deal to guy thats 30. We wouldnt have added Mo Taylor or begged for AD to stay.

why would we stick with Herb if we were rebuilding? to me, LB is a better teacher of the game which is what we need most with our players. i'm not saying the season doesnt matter, but our players are still learning the fundamentals(!!), so its difficult to expect a playoff caliber team just yet.
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  11:12 AM
Posted by fishmike:

hey Bonn.. you can barely speak for yourself, dont speak for me.
huh? Cute attack, but where did I speak for you fishy?



[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 11-25-2005 11:16 AM]
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  11:14 AM
we're in this holding pattern with this roster. we need to fully turn the page and do the full rebuild.
How would the roster look different by doing the "full rebuild"? it's already a young roster mostly of 20 to 25 year olds. Maybe we'd have cap space if you're into that. Is that what you mean by full rebuild?
Bonn1997
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11/25/2005  11:15 AM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by fishmike:

Just dont give me some crap about this season not mattering though, or that we are rebuilding and its really about a couple years from now. If this season didnt matter we would have stuck with Herb rather than pay $10mm for a guy with a history of favoring veteran players. We wouldnt have given a 5 year deal to guy thats 30. We wouldnt have added Mo Taylor or begged for AD to stay.

why would we stick with Herb if we were rebuilding? to me, LB is a better teacher of the game which is what we need most with our players.
Yeah, I don't get that either. You want to teach the young guys who you rebuilding with. So the smart decision is to have Herb instead of Larry teach them. I wonder if you took a poll of GMs or knowledgable fans around the league, how many would agree with Fish's view on this one.


fishmike
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11/25/2005  11:17 AM
jay, because LB wasnt just brought in here to be a teacher. He was brought in to get wins out of Marbury, Mo T, AD, Q, Jerome James, Crawford, Rose and he's being paid $10mm a year to do so.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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