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After watching the past 3 games, one thing about Antonio Davis I realized...
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fishmike
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11/8/2005  12:37 PM
this is where you #'s lovers are lost. Do the Knicks play well when AD is in or dont they?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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rvhoss
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11/8/2005  12:38 PM
If by play well you mean win, they don't play well with ANYBODY in

If you mean send games to overtime, then yes.

This reminds me of one of my buddies lawyer questions...I'll bet you have the stats cut and pasted and ready for anybody that says yes...so cheese.

Just post the stats sucka!

[Edited by - rvhoss on 11-08-2005 12:39 PM]
all kool aid all the time.
rvhoss
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11/8/2005  12:41 PM
I just think you are directing your ire in the wrong direction...davis is the ONLY non rookie front court player doing something.

Jerome's minutes should be diminished first, then Rose...but to diminish AD makes no sense.
Posted by Allanfan20:

You see 8.7 rebounds a game, I see 3 losses, and Davis was the core of all those losses, and when the Knicks were making runs, Frye was in the middle of all of it, along with Lee and Ariza. Davis needs to have his role diminished by the day, and I could care less about his moaning and groaning. He wont be here next year anyway.


all kool aid all the time.
rvhoss
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11/8/2005  12:44 PM
and another thing

You say you could care less about stats and AD is AVERAGING 9 boards per loss, but heck, it was a loss, but then you point out the Lee grabbed 10 in ONE GAME (kind of skews the sample size) and you say that's proof in the pudding AD hits the pine.

While Rose, JJ and MoT combine for 7.4 a game.

Rotate Curry, Frye, Lee and AD, the rest can rot.
Posted by Allanfan20:

I could care less about those stats you throw at me rvhoss. Watch the game. Davis is slow and Frye is all over the place putting a hand up in everyones face and playing solid healthy help defense. The rebounds are good, but Frye and Lee and Curry can make up for that if they play more. Heck, Lee grabbed a crapload the other day against a solid rebounding Warriors team.


all kool aid all the time.
Stevo718
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11/8/2005  1:05 PM
Why AD will get minutes at least through halfway through the season:

1. he grabs boards
2. he knows his role on the team
rvhoss
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11/8/2005  1:10 PM
I couldn't have said it better myself.

There has to be another trade. Can Rose, JJ and Penny get us KG, Melo or Bron? (just kidding)
Posted by Stevo718:

Why AD will get minutes at least through halfway through the season:

1. he grabs boards
2. he knows his role on the team


all kool aid all the time.
knicksmsg33
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11/8/2005  1:34 PM
A Davis is a good veteran presence to have on this team, but we do need to give the energy guys more burn out there to develop them, we are not excatly competing for a title, so making Davis play 30mog is a wash, that would be better served with Fyre 25mpg, Lee about 15mpg.

I think Larry will start to utilize his timeouts, so if we get in a situation like sunday, he can call a timeout and give his players atleast a 2 minute rest.

then again, maybe our players are watching the dancers and their games go arye for the 1'st qrtr
Galong Knicks
BasketballJones
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11/8/2005  11:39 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

He's old, slow and looks like he's about ready to retire. Don't get me wrong, he still plays hard, but he's not that affective anymore, and if anything, he's completely taking the minutes away from Frye and even Lee ....

I think that is what's meant by the phrase "Old and in the way".

https:// It's not so hard.
Knight
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11/8/2005  11:46 PM
I would try to trade AD straight up for Van Horn as soon as I could.
"He only went to Georgia Tech for one year, and that's an engineering school." -LB
nyk4ever
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11/8/2005  11:50 PM
Posted by Knight:

I would try to trade AD straight up for Van Horn as soon as I could.

Davis can't be moved until January becuase he was recently just traded and the Knicks have to wait 90 days until they can move him again.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Knight
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11/8/2005  11:51 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Knight:

I would try to trade AD straight up for Van Horn as soon as I could.

Davis can't be moved until January becuase he was recently just traded and the Knicks have to wait 90 days until they can move him again.

He's not going anywhere anyway--the only reason he stayed was because Larry and IT told him they REALLY wanted him.
"He only went to Georgia Tech for one year, and that's an engineering school." -LB
Allanfan20
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11/8/2005  11:52 PM
Posted by Knight:

I would try to trade AD straight up for Van Horn as soon as I could.


I would actually do that trade too. Van Horn is playing real solid in his role in Dallas. The guy just isn't a go to player but he's still very talented. I think things will come together for the guy.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Allanfan20
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11/8/2005  11:58 PM
Posted by Knight:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Knight:

I would try to trade AD straight up for Van Horn as soon as I could.

Davis can't be moved until January becuase he was recently just traded and the Knicks have to wait 90 days until they can move him again.

He's not going anywhere anyway--the only reason he stayed was because Larry and IT told him they REALLY wanted him.


They also said NO PROMISES if you don't remember. I don't think there are any untradables on this team anymore.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
nyk4ever
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11/9/2005  12:49 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:

They also said NO PROMISES if you don't remember. I don't think there are any untradables on this team anymore.

I wasn't saying I didn't think he wouldn't be moved, I was just pointing out he cant be moved until January...


"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
OAK
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11/9/2005  6:34 AM
Having AD is great. Guys like Frye & Lee can learn a lot from him, and AD still is a decent player.

The fact that his is a big body bruiser, ex-LB player, a great leader, AND an ending contract makes him a very good piece to have on this team. I would think that Frye will be ready to start and play very well by the time AD gets traded at the deadline (though I think Frye should be starting NOW).
JUNKMEIN
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11/9/2005  7:04 AM
There's no reason to move AD. He's played well on the defensive side of the ball and his rebounding has been fantastic. He's no offensive juggernaut but everyone knew that coming in. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath water folks.

Our starting lineup and their backups will end up being:
C - Curry; Butler (JB will force LB to move James to the wood)
PF - Frye; AD; MoT (Lee and MoT will often play with Frye at the 5 for a speed/press lineup)
SF - Ariza; Lee; Barnes; (LB will start experimenting with Lee here also)
SG - Q; Crawford
PG - Marbury, Nate

James, Malik, Penny will have pine for breakfast, lunch and dinner) Nate needs to be left alone allowed to get his feet wet just like the other young bigs.

The only move I hope that Isiah can make is Malik and or James for a quality guard or small forward. Earl Watson comes to mind. I'll make a decision about Miles tonight.

In the meantime folks, let's not panic and please let LB do his job.

[Edited by - Junkmein on 11-09-2005 07:06 AM]
Caseloads
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11/9/2005  8:28 AM
you've got to start davis as a vet out there and get some respect against opponents. you can sub frye in midway through the 1st, run with him in the game down the stretch. dont underestimate toni davis as a vet.
nykdunk
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11/9/2005  9:07 AM
I've watched every minute of every game so far and can't really see why there is so much hatred towards AD. He's playing hard and still is reasonably effective. The reason he is ineffective at times is because he is 37 and being asked to play big minutes. Still, he has given a good effort in every game and I don't mind his presence on the team. If we can diminish his role, then I believe we can augment his value. He's still a good player.
Allanfan20
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11/9/2005  9:17 AM
I'm not bashing AD. I said he plays hard. But Frye and Lee have been better, and when AD is playing big minutes, he's losing. This isn't hatred. It's realism and it's the truth. Those times he WASN'T in the game, the Knicks were making those big runs b/c the youngies were playing MUCH better. Again, I don't bash AD himself b/c I know he plays hard and decently. But he doesn't play effective enough to play big minutes.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
nykdunk
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11/9/2005  12:48 PM
Fair enough. With that I think everyone would agree. He is definitely being overused and a lot more of his minutes ought to go to Frye. It's mainly that I'd rather have a hardworking vet like him play than guys like J.James and MoT who don't bring it every night. I'm glad we have him over TT.


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After watching the past 3 games, one thing about Antonio Davis I realized...
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