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So far Isiah is doing great for this organization!!!
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TheloniusMonk
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10/17/2005  10:36 PM
People are talking about the eye for talent that Isiah has shown. Not just the money. There have been aother GMs privy to the same type of money before Isiah. We're impressed with the 'who' of the situation. It's all about the direction and the colection of the TYPE of player that he's brought here. The combination. Even when people were down on the fact that he drafted a few unknowns in the Arizas and the Lees, Isiah saw something. Nate as well. At the same time people are happy about the direction of the team as a whole. That's the gist of it.
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
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djsunyc
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10/18/2005  7:46 AM
isiah thomas summer 2005 - ALL CONSPIRACY

1. gets LB after a heads up from dumars before the finals is over
2. gets curry after a heads up from craw before the qualifying offer was extended
3. gets h20 to retire instead of using the amnesty rule on him

don't tell me NONE of this wasn't planned months before being executed. dumars and isiah had a wink wink deal in the works for a while concerning LB. once the whole curry heart saga unfolded, jamal and isiah have been in his ear 24/7. curry was coming to ny no matter what. and of course, h20. why didn't we use the amnesty rule on him? b/c he agreed to retire. he would come into camp and make a "showing" and then proclaim himself unfit to play.

all of this was planned and all of it were executed to perfection.

now hopefully isiah's deal with the devil doesn't mean we don't win in the process

i won't be able to check back for a few days so in the meantime, let's go knicks and i'd like to "SUPERSIZE" that kool aid please
fishmike
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10/18/2005  7:53 AM
Posted by BigRedDog:
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by tomverve:
I thought Isiah had more to work with then you give him credit for.

This has got to be one of the funniest, most ridiculous statements I have ever heard. Who the F**K was on this team worth any value when IT took over. Typical of "what have you done for me lately" He turned over an entire team in 1 year, that was already over the salary cap in a league where trades are so difficult. He built an exciting young team that is watchable and hes still not done.
show me one other team in the NBA that has been able to carry the payroll or take on HALF the future salaries that we have. Also notice that the teams we have traded with have faired VERY well.

I'm not saying I'm unhappy or that Isiah hasnt done a good job. I am and he has. But dont tell me he's squeezed blood from a stone here or turned water into wine. Jerry West isnt allowed to take back $50mm in salary every time he makes a trade.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
GoNyGoNyGo
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10/18/2005  8:16 AM
take a look at your roster in October 2003. Take a look at it today. Isiah is a genius.
fishmike
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10/18/2005  8:18 AM
if you said it it must be true
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
GoNyGoNyGo
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10/18/2005  9:21 AM
Fishmike - are you talking to me? if so, please explain to me what you mean by that.

[Edited by - gonygonygo on 10-18-2005 09:25 AM]
Nalod
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10/18/2005  9:29 AM
Isiah as genious for Allan retiring and he is a genious for logical use of the amnisty? Isiah gets a lot of props, but lets not call this a one man show. We have contract lawyers, financial people, accounting people, insurance people, (some might do double duty) and its there job to look at all the angles. Isiah has scouts and assistant coaches to help him evaluate talent.

Nobody is taking anything away from him, but its a team effort from the owner on down. Isiah is the face of the franchise for now, and its great, but lets just be real about how many Jobs this man has!
Bonn1997
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10/18/2005  9:37 AM
the teams we have traded with have faired VERY well
Nope! About a third have faired well at least based on last season (Phoenix & SA) and a third haven't (Milwaukee, Atlanta) and third have had decent seasons but nothing special (Houston, Chicago). Really nothing shocking from that pattern!
show me one other team in the NBA that has been able to carry the payroll or take on HALF the future salaries that we have.
No one's doubting that we have a high payroll (although you're #s are wrong as plenty of tteams have at least half our payroll for this and future years); we're doubting your claim that payroll alone (without a very smart, clever GM) is a usefull asset.
diderotn
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10/18/2005  9:38 AM
Nalod!!!!!!! be reasonable,,,,when it comes to criticize Isiah you never mention the other folks that you have mentioned above, why must we be different when it comes to giving him props????
The true Knickabocker..........
fishmike
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10/18/2005  9:39 AM
I was being sarcastic. Why is Isiah a genius? Yes.. the turnaround in talent on the roster is awesome. I 100% agree and I'm thrilled about it. That being said his biggest accomplishment has been his success in the draft so far. In almost every trade he's done he's helped the other team accomplish a goal, usually by helping them free up cap room or get flexibility. That not genius, thats spending. In cases its been good, others not so good. We didnt rob any one. We didnt make any Jermaine Oneil for Dale Davis trades. Isiah did a great job taking advantage of Pax's blundering of the Curry situation and I credit him for that. Otherwise what Isiah did was spend where others could not and helped some teams along the way. He did a good job, dont get me wrong, but saying he had nothing to work with just isnt accurate, because he had cash, and its proven to be a worthy asset.

IMO Isiah's best job so far has been with the draft. Ariza, Frye, Nate and Lee in 2 years is a great job IMO and something the roster desperately needed. Probably not any franchise players but a good injection of youth and good players.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Nalod
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10/18/2005  9:39 AM
Posted by GoNyGoNyGo:

take a look at your roster in October 2003. Take a look at it today. Isiah is a genius.

Add some Benjamins that were also on the rosters and they were even better trade values!
Bonn1997
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10/18/2005  9:39 AM
yeah, be more reasonable Nalod!!!!!
diderotn
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10/18/2005  9:47 AM
Fish! in his first year, he had to give to receive...As you can see, his approach is totally different in his second year.

Posted by fishmike:

I was being sarcastic. Why is Isiah a genius? Yes.. the turnaround in talent on the roster is awesome. I 100% agree and I'm thrilled about it. That being said his biggest accomplishment has been his success in the draft so far. In almost every trade he's done he's helped the other team accomplish a goal, usually by helping them free up cap room or get flexibility. That not genius, thats spending. In cases its been good, others not so good. We didnt rob any one. We didnt make any Jermaine Oneil for Dale Davis trades. Isiah did a great job taking advantage of Pax's blundering of the Curry situation and I credit him for that. Otherwise what Isiah did was spend where others could not and helped some teams along the way. He did a good job, dont get me wrong, but saying he had nothing to work with just isnt accurate, because he had cash, and its proven to be a worthy asset.

IMO Isiah's best job so far has been with the draft. Ariza, Frye, Nate and Lee in 2 years is a great job IMO and something the roster desperately needed. Probably not any franchise players but a good injection of youth and good players.


The true Knickabocker..........
GoNyGoNyGo
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10/18/2005  9:49 AM
Posted by fishmike:

I was being sarcastic. Why is Isiah a genius? Yes.. the turnaround in talent on the roster is awesome. I 100% agree and I'm thrilled about it. That being said his biggest accomplishment has been his success in the draft so far. In almost every trade he's done he's helped the other team accomplish a goal, usually by helping them free up cap room or get flexibility. That not genius, thats spending. In cases its been good, others not so good. We didnt rob any one. We didnt make any Jermaine Oneil for Dale Davis trades. Isiah did a great job taking advantage of Pax's blundering of the Curry situation and I credit him for that. Otherwise what Isiah did was spend where others could not and helped some teams along the way. He did a good job, dont get me wrong, but saying he had nothing to work with just isnt accurate, because he had cash, and its proven to be a worthy asset.

IMO Isiah's best job so far has been with the draft. Ariza, Frye, Nate and Lee in 2 years is a great job IMO and something the roster desperately needed. Probably not any franchise players but a good injection of youth and good players.
Well, I agree with you that his best success has been in the draft. He obviously has an eye for talent. When I say he is a genius, I am comparing him to our previous GM who built the team that was the Knicks in October of 2003. That being said, anyone of us may cold be geniuses when compared to Layden.

What I admire that he has done is the following:

- the Knicks have gone from an over 30 something team to a under 28 something team.
- the Knicks have gone from undersized to decent size.
- the Knicks have gone from unathletic in most cases to athletic in most cases.
- the Knicks have gone from Don Chaney to Larry Brown!!
- The knicks have gone from no hope to tons of hope and excitement!

So no, I don't know is IT has an IQ of 150, but I do know what I see and from what I see he has a great eye for young talent and a good understanding of what it takes to win in this league. He has built a young, tall and athletic team and teamed them with a coach who coaches FUNDAMENTALS better than anyone else in the wolrd perhaps! This can only mean good things.

So yes, in my opinion, IT is a genius.........so far.

GoNyGoNyGo
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10/18/2005  9:57 AM
As for using the money he has at his disposal, I give him credit for that too. Any smart person will use all his available assets to give himself a better chance. IT has used cash wisely and turned a pathetic roster into something decent. Layden had the same money and he blundered it. IT is making good decisions with it. Yeah, MoT may not have been the best move or JJ may not be either but the thing is he is at least acquiring pieces that can be reshuffled. MoT will get in shape and play or LB will bench him. As a relatively young man, he will realize that his future $$ depend on him getting into shape and playing so that another team will be fooled into taking him and paying him. JJ as a starter....eh....but as a backup?? Overpaid, sure! But bball wise, nice insurance move.

If Curry turns out to be healthy, that deal will go down as a DDavis for O'Neal. TT is worhtless and Sweets is good but will he ever be great?? Curry can be great!

Anything that a GM does is a risk.
Nalod
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10/18/2005  10:05 AM
Posted by diderotn:

Nalod!!!!!!! be reasonable,,,,when it comes to criticize Isiah you never mention the other folks that you have mentioned above, why must we be different when it comes to giving him props????

I am reasonable. I don't openly criticize Isiah either. I only say give some balance and objectivity to his body of work, and his record.

Our team has much potential, but that is not anything to celebrate.

Isiah has done some pretty stupid things also. I don't harp on that either.

How many owners would allow 11 mil a year for a coach with a young team rebuilding? Not many!

I give props to Isiah or whom ever on the franchise who allowed Allan the dignity to go out like he did with one more try. Isiah last year was all but ready to run him out of time. It might appear that Isiah would not have been patient, and perhaps not let it all fall into place.

I give him props to be patient to see if Larry became available.
diderotn
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10/18/2005  10:06 AM
GoNy! you are a wise man..
The true Knickabocker..........
Pharzeone
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10/18/2005  10:28 AM
Posted by Nalod:
Posted by diderotn:

Nalod!!!!!!! be reasonable,,,,when it comes to criticize Isiah you never mention the other folks that you have mentioned above, why must we be different when it comes to giving him props????

I am reasonable. I don't openly criticize Isiah either. I only say give some balance and objectivity to his body of work, and his record.

Our team has much potential, but that is not anything to celebrate.

Isiah has done some pretty stupid things also. I don't harp on that either.

How many owners would allow 11 mil a year for a coach with a young team rebuilding? Not many!

I give props to Isiah or whom ever on the franchise who allowed Allan the dignity to go out like he did with one more try. Isiah last year was all but ready to run him out of time. It might appear that Isiah would not have been patient, and perhaps not let it all fall into place.

I give him props to be patient to see if Larry became available.
Dr. Jerry Buss.

I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
GoNyGoNyGo
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10/18/2005  10:44 AM
Posted by diderotn:

GoNy! you are a wise man..


You are making me blush....
TheloniusMonk
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10/18/2005  1:58 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Isiah as genious for Allan retiring and he is a genious for logical use of the amnisty? Isiah gets a lot of props, but lets not call this a one man show. We have contract lawyers, financial people, accounting people, insurance people, (some might do double duty) and its there job to look at all the angles. Isiah has scouts and assistant coaches to help him evaluate talent.

Nobody is taking anything away from him, but its a team effort from the owner on down. Isiah is the face of the franchise for now, and its great, but lets just be real about how many Jobs this man has!

Why is it that when criticism comes Isiah Thomas' way he stands in the spotlight alone? But when praise is coming his way people all of a sudden start mentioning accountants, financial people, assistant coaches, lawyers or whoever else? Who are the people??? lol Where are they when Isiah Thomas get bashed? I guess we need to start learning the names of all of these people and start bashing them all when we don't like something. lol This is ridiculous.

When the exec of the year award is given out, if Isiah were to get it, I suppose it shouldn't be presented to him. It should be the first "EXECUTIVES OF THE YEAR AWRD". For the first time a GM will not recieve the credit. It will be accountants and the finacial people who will get the front page honors next to Isaih.

Just a thought.

'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
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So far Isiah is doing great for this organization!!!
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