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The guy who can be had and I mean realistically had is Miles
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tkf
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8/8/2005  11:14 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by djsunyc:

briggs, apparently isiah passed on him already, for the paltry price of frank and othella. so maybe he's not on our radar anymore. maybe isiah just doesn't like him.

i like him, but it doesn't matter what your or i think anyways.

isiah passed on him once already.

yeah i know stocking up on the jerome james's the Vin Baker's Mo taylor's malik Rose's Penny Hardaway's the Q richardson's will bring us far.

come on briggs. do you think we are stocking up penny Hardaway or Mo Taylor type players or are they just here for a brief stop and really not part of the knicks plans? You know that answer.
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
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HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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8/8/2005  11:23 AM
Posted by Nalod:


I hate TT, but lets be real about a few things. He is a veteran player and he has been under Larry before. Given his new maturity and contract year status, I would give him a chance. I would not trust any improved play to resign him, but he might bring some value.

He might have some value after all.

I agree. TT may indeed improve whil under LB in his contract year. I think we can get the most for him at the deadline if the right deal comes along. If all else fails, hey, he just drops off our cap. It looks like a win/win for us.

Penny is the one i'd rather trade, because he is contributing NOTHING but drama to our team. Get his cryin' ass outta here ASAP.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
djsunyc
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8/8/2005  11:39 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

briggs, apparently isiah passed on him already, for the paltry price of frank and othella. so maybe he's not on our radar anymore. maybe isiah just doesn't like him.

i like him, but it doesn't matter what your or i think anyways.

isiah passed on him once already.

after re-assessing the situation, it could possibly be that isiah had already talked to chicago about jamal and they said that frank and othella would be part of the deal since isiah used them in the crawford trade in the summer.

so isiah may not have passed on him b/c he didn't like him, but b/c he wanted crawford more.
rvhoss
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8/8/2005  11:41 AM
amen...I've been saying Penny is the one that should go, atleast TT has won a game for us at the buzzer and still averages 15 ppg.

Penny contributes nothing and is extremely redundant with the off season acquisitions.

I've said it a few times before and been burned, but I see timmy picking it up on both ends this year.
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vandal182nyk
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8/8/2005  11:56 AM
Posted by DarkKnicks:

BRIGGS, the Blazers don't need more SF, they already have 4! They just need a back up PF. Maybe Rose and Ariza for Miles could work, although if I'm a Blazer I would not do it.


Don't need anymore SF? Yet thats exactly what Ariza is ...
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BRIGGS
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8/8/2005  12:06 PM
If i could get a package of Miles for an ending contract or Miles and Patterson for a combination of ending contracts, I will do it.

I posted this on a thread the other day

Malik Rose to Boston for Mark Blount a Boston #1 pick in 2007 and a 2006 2nd rounder

Tim Thomas and Jackie Butler to Portland for Ruben Patterson and Darius Miles


that would give us a third C and increase our defense 100%. At the end of the dya my bet is LB would rather have Miles and Patterson on the D than Malik and Thomas + we get a similar deal we did with SA where we take on a little extra $ at the end --give them rose and get a third C who has good talent
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Bonn1997
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8/8/2005  12:13 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

If i could get a package of Miles for an ending contract or Miles and Patterson for a combination of ending contracts, I will do it.

I posted this on a thread the other day

Malik Rose to Boston for Mark Blount a Boston #1 pick in 2007 and a 2006 2nd rounder

Tim Thomas and Jackie Butler to Portland for Ruben Patterson and Darius Miles


that would give us a third C and increase our defense 100%. At the end of the dya my bet is LB would rather have Miles and Patterson on the D than Malik and Thomas + we get a similar deal we did with SA where we take on a little extra $ at the end --give them rose and get a third C who has good talent
Why not keep TT? TT will call Miles fugazy once he steals TT's starting spot and Miles will do what he always does: fight a teammate (TT) in a bar at night and get arrested and get suspended for conduct detrimental to the team. It's amazing how you're willing to overlook a player's character history because he had a 47 point game.
BRIGGS
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8/8/2005  12:28 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by BRIGGS:

If i could get a package of Miles for an ending contract or Miles and Patterson for a combination of ending contracts, I will do it.

I posted this on a thread the other day

Malik Rose to Boston for Mark Blount a Boston #1 pick in 2007 and a 2006 2nd rounder

Tim Thomas and Jackie Butler to Portland for Ruben Patterson and Darius Miles


that would give us a third C and increase our defense 100%. At the end of the dya my bet is LB would rather have Miles and Patterson on the D than Malik and Thomas + we get a similar deal we did with SA where we take on a little extra $ at the end --give them rose and get a third C who has good talent
Why not keep TT? TT will call Miles fugazy once he steals TT's starting spot and Miles will do what he always does: fight a teammate (TT) in a bar at night and get arrested and get suspended for conduct detrimental to the team. It's amazing how you're willing to overlook a player's character history because he had a 47 point game.



They would want an ending contract and TT plays their positions. Character, wasn't John Starks a guy who claimed he introduced crack cocaine to Tulsa Oklahoma? Im not worried about a guy who called his coach a name[happens both ways in sports all the time] from everything I read, Darius is a good kid playing in a bad environment. If there is a poster boy for character problems, it was sheed. Im not going to go back and name all the problems with sheed, but they make a profane outburst look like sunday school. Miles and Patterson will make us much better NOW. Today. To me the Tim Thomas experience is done and if its not, its just a combustible problem waiting to happen.

you have to understand Larry brown to know where Im coming from--hed RATHER have the defensive player than the offensive player--miles Patterson--defense who CAN ALSO provide offense.
Guys like Tim Thomas and Q, if they are here--I see them as the two main targets for the bench.

Craw will get to play 1 so he will guard 1 and he CAN guard 1, and while Marbury is short he is strong enough to guard 2 at times.

guys like Q and TT===no for L brown.
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crzymdups
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8/8/2005  12:34 PM
I'd take on Darius for Tim. I just don't want to give up anything more. Darius plays defense, which would be weird for us, I know, but it'd be a good thing.
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bobs3304
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8/8/2005  12:35 PM
^ Knick fans wanted SAR as soon as they found out he was even remotely available.

For me atleast, that says it all. If you're not in a Knicks uniform, we want you, no matter who you are.

I wonder if all fans are like that...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
TMS
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8/8/2005  12:41 PM
just get Ruben Patterson & Theo Ratliff in a deal for TT & Mo T if you want to add a perimeter defender & a C...both those guys will fit into LB's system nicely.

why trade for Darius Miles who's the exact opposite of the type of player that LB likes to plug into his rotations? add that to the fact that he's signed to a longterm contract...who wants a malcontent, immature & selfish player who's uncoachable on this team for the next 5 years.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
crzymdups
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8/8/2005  12:42 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

^ Knick fans wanted SAR as soon as they found out he was even remotely available.

For me atleast, that says it all. If you're not in a Knicks uniform, we want you, no matter who you are.

I wonder if all fans are like that...

I've spoken out against SAR MANY times, so please, don't point your arrow at me and act like I'm jumping on the bandwagon of an available player. SAr is one of the worst defensive forwards in the league. So is Walker. Find a thread where I said I've wanted those losers.

Darius plays defense, Tim doesn't. Darius rebounds, Tim doesn't. Darius blocks 1.5 shots per game, a stat that would have LED this team last season. He represents a need. He basically does everything else (except 3pfg) just as well as Tim. Darius scored 13ppg, Timmy scored 12ppg. Darius is 23, Timmy is 29. If Portland wants to get out from under that contract, it's a good opportunity to add a quality player and upgrade the defense.

You say acquring Darius is all about potential and I'm talking about the stats he alread puts up as being better than Tim.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 08/08/2005 12:42:54]
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crzymdups
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8/8/2005  12:44 PM
Posted by TMS:

just get Ruben Patterson & Theo Ratliff in a deal for TT & Mo T if you want to add a perimeter defender & a C...both those guys will fit into LB's system nicely.

why trade for Darius Miles who's the exact opposite of the type of player that LB likes to plug into his rotations? add that to the fact that he's signed to a longterm contract...who wants a malcontent, immature & selfish player who's uncoachable on this team for the next 5 years.

I'm not buying the malcontent line. No one was calling him a malcontent when he was running in Clip-dom with Q. Portland seems to be a breeding ground for hatred right now. That team is hated by it's fans (who I guess were spoiled by those 27 years of playoffs and guys like Clyde), Darius needs a change of scenery. It's not like he didn't produce.
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rvhoss
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8/8/2005  12:48 PM
I think Darius Miles IS Tiny Tim Thomas (atleast, a younger version).

Same difference, same stats, nothing more nothing less.

I tend to take stats with a grain of salt when they are on a true losing situation.

How can portland be so bad, according to the UltimateKnicks Forum, a core team of Miles, Ratliff and Patterson, with a sprinkle of Damon Stoud and they should be atleast in contention.

I'll take my chances with Q and Ariza holding down the fort for years to come.

[Edited by - rvhoss on 08/08/2005 12:49:00]
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HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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8/8/2005  12:50 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

^ Knick fans wanted SAR as soon as they found out he was even remotely available.

For me atleast, that says it all. If you're not in a Knicks uniform, we want you, no matter who you are.

I wonder if all fans are like that...

Nah, just the fickle ones that don't matter. Good fans just want good players for good reasons. Most of those I've discussed SAR with don't want him here because he appears too soft. I agree with this. However, if we got him, I'd hope he can man up and shun that label. On the nets, to me, everyone there has that label, so whatever.

Miles has the kind of baggage the Knicks can do without IMO. I'd rather groom Trevor for whatever role Darius would play for us.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
bobs3304
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8/8/2005  12:50 PM
Darius Miles is exactly what's wrong with this league, and if I have to justify that with more words than maybe some of you aren't as bright as I expected.
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
bobs3304
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8/8/2005  12:53 PM
Posted by HARDCOREKNICKSFAN:

Most of those I've discussed SAR with don't want him here because he appears too soft. I agree with this. However, if we got him, I'd hope he can man up and shun that label. On the nets, to me, everyone there has that label, so whatever.

Are you kidding me? You actually think that a guy that's been in the league for 8 seasons can suddenly become something he's not?

Granted, the same could be said for Marbury - but he's the heart and soul of the team, and despite his shortcomings as a leader, I have to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he deserves a chance under Larry Brown...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
TMS
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8/8/2005  12:57 PM
the guy's working on his 3rd team in 5 professional seasons...he couldn't get along w/Maurice Cheeks, who's just about as much of a "player's coach" as coaches get in the NBA...POR was a team that was going towards the youth movement last year & Miles couldn't even grasp that opportunity w/o being a pain in the arse & a disruption for his team.

you don't have to buy any line about him...it's just a fact...he's been a malcontent & an immature, selfish player who's clashed w/his coaches in both CLE & POR...sorry, but there's nothing at all about him that suggests he'd ever flourish in a LB system...for any of you to assume that he'll just all of a sudden "get it" is a huge stretch...at the money he's signed to & for the length of his contract, i'll pass.
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HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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8/8/2005  12:59 PM
Posted by bobs3304:
Posted by HARDCOREKNICKSFAN:

Most of those I've discussed SAR with don't want him here because he appears too soft. I agree with this. However, if we got him, I'd hope he can man up and shun that label. On the nets, to me, everyone there has that label, so whatever.

Are you kidding me? You actually think that a guy that's been in the league for 8 seasons can suddenly become something he's not?

Granted, the same could be said for Marbury - but he's the heart and soul of the team, and despite his shortcomings as a leader, I have to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he deserves a chance under Larry Brown...

I was just speculating on the "SAR as a Knick" thing. Calm down.
As for Marbs, he'll get his chance to improve and should make the best of it.I think we'll see him make some headway on those shortcomings under LB- especially the leadership part.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
crzymdups
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8/8/2005  1:01 PM
Ricky Davis clashed with his coach in Cleveland (Silas, same as Miles), but then played just fine for Doc. Sheed clashed with everyone after Dunleavy in POR, played great for Brown. Weird, sometimes people react differently to different environments.
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The guy who can be had and I mean realistically had is Miles
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