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OT--USA military shouldve helped get the people out of nO BEFORE the fact
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fishmike
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9/9/2005  2:10 PM
FEMA director just got yanked off Katrina and is heading back to DC
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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TheloniusMonk
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9/9/2005  2:17 PM
Posted by fishmike:

FEMA director just got yanked off Katrina and is heading back to DC

I'm sorry, I know someone already answered this but...WHO HIRED THIS GUY!!!!???
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
fishmike
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9/9/2005  3:50 PM
same guy in charge of appointing supreme court justices, same guy who is commander in chief of the military, same guy who lost the popular vote in 2000 but somehow made it into office despite some suspect vote counting in his brother's state. Same guy who didnt serve in Nam because he was in the Nation Guard, same guy that went to war on terror but somehow failed to capture Bin Laden.

That guy.

[Edited by - fishmike on 09-09-2005 4:00 PM]
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
TheloniusMonk
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9/9/2005  4:15 PM
Posted by fishmike:

same guy in charge of appointing supreme court justices, same guy who is commander in chief of the military, same guy who lost the popular vote in 2000 but somehow made it into office despite some suspect vote counting in his brother's state. Same guy who didnt serve in Nam because he was in the Nation Guard, same guy that went to war on terror but somehow failed to capture Bin Laden.

That guy.

[Edited by - fishmike on 09-09-2005 4:00 PM]

Makes perfect sense.


'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
Rich
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9/9/2005  4:36 PM
Posted by fishmike:

thats a good article. I do disagree with the war in Iraq impacting the NG and their ability to mobilize. I dont know the #s to be honest, but I will keep going back to my orginal point about my 2 friends in the NG and hurricane Floyd. 12 hours after it hit their units (NJ) were flown to Fla for security. They stayed as part of a massive labor force for 4 weeks. Now they are in Iraq, along with their unit's vehicles.

There is no doubt that local gov failed first and foremost. There arent very man Rudy G's and we were lucky to have him after 9/11 happened (so was Bush for that matter). That being the Fed gov is the ultimate authority and I cant imagine how they and FEMA werent more involved from the get go for a disaster of this magnitude.

I'm not looking to blame Bush for this. That doesnt make any sense. It is however an example of how bad this administration is IMO.

If the entire of city of New York would have been destroyed, Rudy wouldn't have come out of 9/11 looking very good either.
GoNyGoNyGo
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9/9/2005  4:42 PM
Point your fingers all you like. None of my facts have been disproven because they can't be. They are facts.

As for the article, notice I said I agree with most of it. That being part of it. What I see is a pathological hatred for one person blinding all else. The sheer stupidity of that is why the Democratic Party is in the shambles it is in now. They just can't stop putting their collective foot in their collective big mouths! It's really kind of sad.

You keep trying and failing.



[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 4:43 PM]
Rich
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9/9/2005  4:53 PM
Posted by GoNyGoNyGo:

Point your fingers all you like. None of my facts have been disproven because they can't be. They are facts.



[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 4:43 PM]


Accountability matters, or so we were told by Bush when he falsely told the American people that he would bring honor and dignity back to the White House.

The massive tax cuts have caused many essential domestic programs to be underfunded. That is FEMA's biggest problem.
djsunyc
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9/9/2005  5:19 PM
we can talk facts left and right all day.

at the end of the day, the perception of GW, not only in the states, but across the world is that of an idiot. as a compassionate man, he's just not cutting it as the leader of this country. the situation in new orleans is just embarassing. can you imagine what the world thinks of us now with all this bickering going on here about how it was handled.

just going by that alone, he has not done a good job.

we just need a more compassionate man in the position. this guy is clueless.
Rich
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9/9/2005  5:53 PM
Killing two birds with one stone (or preying on the vulnerable):

From the WSJ:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?W280155CB

"Ten U.S. Army recruiters are offering volunteer help for Katrina evacuees at Houston's Astrodome. But the recruiters, struggling to keep enlistment up during Iraq war, are also available with options for the jobless. "Our intent is to approach the evacuees at the right time for them,'' says Army spokesman Douglas Smith."

[Edited by - Rich on 09-09-2005 5:55 PM]
GoNyGoNyGo
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9/9/2005  5:54 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

we can talk facts left and right all day.

at the end of the day, the perception of GW, not only in the states, but across the world is that of an idiot. as a compassionate man, he's just not cutting it as the leader of this country. the situation in new orleans is just embarassing. can you imagine what the world thinks of us now with all this bickering going on here about how it was handled.

just going by that alone, he has not done a good job



we just need a more compassionate man in the position. this guy is clueless.

Oh you want someone to "feel your pain"! Haha, now hat is funny.

Across the states? Hello, he won like 40 states both times!!!! Its you who doesn't get it. Have you seen the RED- BUSH COUNTRY MAPS? LOL! The world is full of idealists socialists! I am glad they don't get it. I DONT GET THEM!

You are the guys doing the bickering , cant you see that? I think the world is upset because we are no longer the patsies we have been.

Even in the face of the facts, you still don't get past your hatred.



[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 6:12 PM]

[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 6:13 PM]

[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 6:15 PM]
Rich
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9/9/2005  7:01 PM
Let's see, we have overextended our military in an unnecessary war based on provable lies that has made us less safe at home and abroad, and we aren't patsies? LOL
Rich
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9/9/2005  8:27 PM
From the conservative National Review:

http://corner.nationalreview.com/05_09_04_corner-archive.asp#076094

It would be very wrong, I believe, to let the ignominious Michael Brown be the scapegoat for FEMA's sins. Check out this front-pager from the WaPo. Turns out that a raft of FEMA's top leaders have little or no emergency management experience, but are instead politically well connected to the GOP and the White House. This is a scandal, a real scandal. How is it possible that four years after 9/11, the president treats a federal agency vital to homeland security as a patronage prize? The main reason I've been a Bush supporter all along is I trusted him (note past tense) on national security -- which, in the age of mass terrorism, means homeland security too. Call me naive, but it's a real blow to learn that political hacks have been running FEMA, of all agencies of the federal government! What if al-Qaeda had blown the New Orleans levees? How much worse would the crony-led FEMA's response have been? Would conservatives stand for any of this for one second if a Democrat were president? If this is what Republican government means, God help the poor GOP Congressmen up for re-election in 2006.
tkf
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9/10/2005  12:43 AM
Posted by Rich:

Let's see, we have overextended our military in an unnecessary war based on provable lies that has made us less safe at home and abroad, and we aren't patsies? LOL

less safe? were we safef before this war? is that why we were sucessfully attacked on 9/11?

who knows? right?....

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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9/10/2005  12:46 AM
Posted by Rich:
Posted by GoNyGoNyGo:

Point your fingers all you like. None of my facts have been disproven because they can't be. They are facts.



[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 4:43 PM]


Accountability matters, or so we were told by Bush when he falsely told the American people that he would bring honor and dignity back to the White House.

The massive tax cuts have caused many essential domestic programs to be underfunded. That is FEMA's biggest problem.



lets not talk about accountability? come on man how many promises were broken in the white house? It just didn't start these last two terms.. I like bill clinton, but how accountable was he bringing shame to the whitehouse with the lewinsky scandal...

Hey at least he made cigars famous again...LOL..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Rich
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9/10/2005  12:59 AM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by Rich:
Posted by GoNyGoNyGo:

Point your fingers all you like. None of my facts have been disproven because they can't be. They are facts.



[Edited by - gonygonygo on 09-09-2005 4:43 PM]


Accountability matters, or so we were told by Bush when he falsely told the American people that he would bring honor and dignity back to the White House.

The massive tax cuts have caused many essential domestic programs to be underfunded. That is FEMA's biggest problem.



lets not talk about accountability? come on man how many promises were broken in the white house? It just didn't start these last two terms.. I like bill clinton, but how accountable was he bringing shame to the whitehouse with the lewinsky scandal...

Hey at least he made cigars famous again...LOL..

Compared to an unnecessary war based on lies that has needlessly killed 1895 Americans (and counting) and ten of thousands of Iraqis, ZERO SHAME. I don't give a **** about what a president does on his own time.

Clinton was held accountable by that unconstitutional impeachment. If a sex lie warrants impeachment, clearly Bush's lies do as well.


[Edited by - Rich on 09-10-2005 02:01 AM]
Rich
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9/10/2005  1:09 AM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by Rich:

Let's see, we have overextended our military in an unnecessary war based on provable lies that has made us less safe at home and abroad, and we aren't patsies? LOL

less safe? were we safef before this war? is that why we were sucessfully attacked on 9/11?

who knows? right?....

If stopping terrorist attacks is such a worthwhile goal, why did Bush ignore the Presidential Daily Briefing of August 6, 2001 entitled: "bin Ladin Determined to Strike in US"?

Most experts agree that the war in Iraq has created more terrorists, not less. It has provided al Qaeda with a unique recruiting opportunity. It's quite possible, if not likely, that the end result of the war will be an Iraq dominated by the Shiites who align themselves with Iran. That result would be far worse than leaving Saddam in power. It is why Bush I didn't remove Saddam in the first Gulf War (the one that actually needed to be fought).

Eight years elapsed between the two attacks on the WTC. These scum operate on their own timetable. If they attack again, Bush's mismanagment of the DHS and FEMA have demonstrated that the US is woefully unprepared because the massive tax cuts for the rich and the war in Iraq have gutted our defense of the US mainland.
TheloniusMonk
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9/10/2005  1:12 AM
1895????? Damn!!!! That's pretty bloody.

Much love goes out to the troops who are over there doing what they have been asked to do.

Tkf, there is a corny but interesting car bumper sticker that says:

"When Bill Clinton lied nobody died."
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
tkf
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9/10/2005  2:02 AM
Posted by TheloniusMonk:

1895????? Damn!!!! That's pretty bloody.

Much love goes out to the troops who are over there doing what they have been asked to do.

Tkf, there is a corny but interesting car bumper sticker that says:

"When Bill Clinton lied nobody died."

how true..

But did bush lie or was he given bad information? I am not saying I agree with the war to any degree, but didn't bush get info from the CIA, or did he just make up every report to start a war. If he did that, then he is a liar and borderline murderer, but somehow I don't think that is the case, but feel free to elaborate, really I am not into politics that much...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
GoNyGoNyGo
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9/10/2005  4:35 AM
My God! How naive are you guys? Yeah it was all the idiot's idea! This whole global conquering thing. Do you really think that is true. Do you really believe we are in IRAQ because Georgie said so?!!?!? How naive! This whole thing is part of the AMERICAN agenda. I wont spell it out for you but hopreully you can understand why it is we have an interest there. It starts with O and ends with L! Yes, you guys think you understand that but you think it is to line the pockets of Bush/Cheney/Haliburton. and Yes, while that is a nice side effect for them,it has really MUCH more to do with GLOBAL SUPERPOWER STATUS AND CONTROL! The country that countrols the oil will be the power. It is simple as that. We need the bases in the Middle East to preserve our way of life. If you cannot accept that in your liberal guilt minded head then you act as you do. If you can than you do so and move on. China is a thirsty, waking giant. They are thirsty for OIL and one of the main reasons the price of GAS has skyrocketed. Their thirst has made the demand high and supply lower! I f the US hsa a base in IRAQ, which we do now, we can still control the future of OIL, the lifeblood of out economy. This whole thing has been planned for years. BuSH is just the guy they needed to execute it! Do you really think GORE would have been able to? Would Kerry have been able to?? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

As for the reason for the war, the whole world was in on it. Clinton said the same things Bush did, 3-5 years earlier about IRAQ and WMD, look it up! This has been germinating for years!

This whole LEFT v Right thing is just a diversion for us to follow while the real work is done by both parties right under our noses!
Rich
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9/10/2005  10:35 AM
Why did former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill state that Bush talked about invading Iraq before 9/11, and why did former terrorism czar Richard Clarke state that Bush was looking for a link between 9/11 and Iraq even after he was told that none existed?

Because he had a pre-determined agenda to attack Iraq.

Why did Bush order the UN inspectors out of Iraq before they finished their work?

If he had left them in, they would have found that there were no WMD, which was the pretext for his timetable for war.

Why did Bush say in his 2003 State of the Union speech that "British intelligence" believes that Iraq had tried to purchase "yellow cake" uranium from Africa (Niger) when the CIA had told it it wasn't true?

Because he knew that without that false claim his lie that Iraq posed an "imminent" threat would be revealed. Remember, Cheney continually invoked the prospect of a "mushroom cloud."

Why was Gen. Eric K. Shinseki relieved of his duties when he told Congress that several hundred thousand troops would be needed Iraq, not the 100,000 that Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz had sad?

Because Bush knew that politically, it would be harder to sell such a large numnber to the American people. Having too few troops in the post war period is one of the major reasons we are losing the war.

Why does Colin Powell now say that his report to the UN in February of 2003 was the low point of his career?

Because he had been fed faulty intelligence that many in the Adminstration knew at the time was false.

Who is naive?

The Bush supporters.
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OT--USA military shouldve helped get the people out of nO BEFORE the fact
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