HofstraBBall wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:smackeddog wrote:gunsnewing wrote:Uptown wrote:fwk00 wrote:Uptown wrote:GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:TPercy wrote:I don't get why people keep citing kyrie before Lebron arrived. If anyone is paying attention to the finals he is a different player now and is clearly the most unstoppable guard in the league. We need to get this deal done.
Why do we need to get this deal done again?
Whats the alternative? Hope and pray that Frank can be three quarters of the player Kyrie is at this point? Odds are against us drafting a player of Kyries callibre...
Tell me why again Kyrie is a fit in a rebuild team? Oh, yeah, well let's chuck that rebuild in the trash can so that we can recreate the same scenario we've had for the last fifteen years.
We already drafted a player who will eclipse Kyrie's talent level in Nitty. We also have a Phil Jackson/Mills/Gaines designed team that will grow together and become next-generation contenders rather than this-generation wannabes.
Wish Kyrie well somewhere else.
Rebuild? We just overpaid for a 25 yr old FA. Does he fit the rebuild? If so, why wont Kyrie who is also 25 and is a champion and is one of the most electric scorers in the league. A player other teams have to gameplan for. Kyrie is the type of talent we can only hope and wish we can draft nxt yr or the yr after and the odds are against it.
Highly unlikely that Frank will turn out to be as good as Kyrie. If he turns out to be half the playet kyrie is we will celebrate...phil is in montana, thank god, so im not sure why you are still attaching hom to this franchise. We just hired a new GM...
During the press conference they said they want young, athletic players...Kyrie checks those boxes and then some...
Exactly it doesn't make any sense to me. People went on about how great each PG in this years draft will be and then you might possibly have a chance to trade for a 25yr old star PG, the day he played his first game in this league, and people still think Frank will be better. The 8th pick and what 4-5 PG's picked ahead of him?
It's not just about comparing those two players, you need to look at the bigger picture. If you keep Frank, he's locked into a rookie contract for 4 years (so we have more cap space to facilitate trades or sign free agents, if we moved Lee or O'Quinn), he also will take several years to develop which means we lose more, which means we end up with higher first round picks for 2 or 3 years. If you trade him or Irving, we won't have cap space and you win more over the next few years which means would end up with much poorer first round draft picks. How do you get from being a mediocre team with Irving to a contender with no cap space and only middle of the road draft picks? If you keep frank and don't get Irving, then you have a better shot at landing another 2 potential talents on rookie contracts, plus cap space.
This is madness. Kyrie was probably, at many times, the best player on the court in 2 NBA finals. Specially last year. The constant whining of being a crappy team and when presented with a game changer, people are talking about POSSIBLE picks that may develop? Ok let's say NO to every young All Star for a few chances at picking another Gallinari, Frye and Hill. F That!!
He also had plenty of games where he was the worst player on the court (something like 6 for 20 shooting with a -20 on/off differential). I like Kyrie. What matters is the cost of getting him.
Ok.whats the cost? Let's say we cant trade Melo. In a weak East we may get a 8th seed and mediocre pick. What does that cost? If we trade Melo for Anderson or another similar piece, does that guarantee a lottery pick? Dont think so. If we somehow find a way to tank for the next few years, does KP.stay or go to a better organization (29 of them) that are better positioned to win. Just look at our great history of picks. Who do we still have? Not counting the guy we just reclaimed for 71M.
The logic is flawed as all the stars in the league were all brought into the league by the draft process. The Knicks due to trading away draft picks held less attempts at a acquiring these stars. Which is why the misses on picks have been even more damaging. The 2 picks we traded away for Eddie Curry turned into Noah and LMA. While Irving is better then Curry that still wouldn't be the point. The final pick that we had to give away from the Marbury trade turned into Gordan Hayward who was also one pick before Paul George.
With that said I would trade Melo and 2 future picks. One unprotected and one lotto protected. Other things like Kuz & KOQ being included and maybe a swap of Lee for Shump if they are interested can also be included. I wouldn't give up any of Frank, KP, Willy in the deal. This way you have your core of 18-25yr olds in place of Irving, Frank, Hardaway, KP, Willy locked in and have 5 yrs to build on top of that before anyone turns 30. If Baker and Dotson become contributors then the Knicks mostly need to target experienced vets on the bench. Since you can't trade back to back picks. We would have a pick in between the 2 we gave up to target a natural SF.
I don't see Irving as a franchise player. Tony Parker also was Finals MVP as was Andre Igoudala and he is closer to those players then he is Jordan, Kobe, Magic, Thomas etc. Being in the best possible situation and scoring buckets in big moments in the finals isn't the same as being a franchise player having to carry at team though 82 games and playoffs.
I don't want to pay the price of a player who carried a team through 82 games into the playoffs as the best player when he hasn't proven to be capable of doing so yet.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
7/23/2017 9:08 AM