Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

TPercy wrote:Marbury and Melo are nowhere near kyrie.

Kyrie is better than Marbury but I don't think the difference is huge. I think Marbury in his prime with LeBron and Love (hypothetically if the ages worked) could have won 1 championship in 3 years too.

One big difference between Marbury and Irving: when Marbury arrived he was on his fourth team by age 26. And pretty much each team he left got better after his departure. On the other hand, Jason Kidd had a similar career path but teams tended to get better when he arrived.

OK but team wins isn't necessarily the best way to evaluate one player. How many of Marbury's teams were as bad as Kyrie's team was every year before LeBron came?

Yeah, but at some point trends are no longer a coincidence. I'm not saying Kyrie = Marbury. Just the opposite. Marbury had proven he didn't improve teams when he arrived here that's why I don't think the comparison is valid.

I dont get how saying Kyries team won 30 games before Lebron is even a valid critique. The guy was in what his 3rd year, thats like saying Porzingis sucks if we got Kyrie and they won 42 games. You could say before Kyrie Porzingis wasn't **** he coudnt even make the playoffs.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/notoriousIT/status/888845273686056960

meloshouldgo wrote:If he wants to lead a team why doesn't he stay put? It will be his team to lead when LeBron leaves. I just don't get this whole thing. Maybe Melo told him where the easy money is? You know you they pag Max contract millions for sucking the life blood out of a franchise, they will even reward maximum sucktitude with a even crazier second contract. I can't think of any other possible explanations

To be honest I see no chance of this happening so the 17 pages of posts are just wasted time

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I haven't gone through all 12 pages and don't know how much of this has been said but there are several reasons why I think Irving is going to cost a fortune - way more than just Melo if Melo even agrees to a trade there.

1 - A 24 year old all-star coming off a strong season is going to cost more than a 32 year old coming off a weaker season automatically.
2 - Irving has a bigger list of teams he's willing to play for and there are 29 teams Cleveland could trade him to since he has no NTC.
3 - We'd probably want Irving more than they'd want Melo. Do they really need three all-star forwards? They can get a younger, better player who fits their roster both now and in the long-term in case Lebron leaves better than Melo does.
4 - They probably realize they can't win a championship with Melo instead of Irving. They're just a weaker, less balanced team than the one that lost last year.

If the trade was just Melo for Irving or something close to that, sure I'd do it. If we're giving up a fortune to get Irving, no thanks.

Whats a fortune people wont part with Frank which is ridiculous. Someone actually said Frank was a better version than Jason Kidd. I'm sorry I've watched Frank play and I never once seen the court vision Kidd had. I think the kids tape is pretty ordinary, I dont think he was a top 10 pick

Comparing 18 year old Frank to a 26 year old Kidd? Or are you comparing 18 year old Frank with 18 year old Kidd? Frank is likely a totally different player than Kidd. I would be satisfied if Frank became some form of a modern day Dennis Johnson.

18, Franks high dribble and lack of explosion really bothers me. He looks like a very skilled 2.

Not that I'm comparing the two, but Magic had a high dribble too.

He was 6'9"

Magic was really 6'8 even though his card said 6'9 and he also didn't have a large wingspan .

The only pg that comes close to franks wing span is rondo and his is a 6'9 wingspan

Also frank is still growing, I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being 6'7 with a 7'3 wing span.

Frank doesn't need lightning quick speed he can literally in one step move past his defender, or on the opposite end allow his opponent to take a step or two he in one step can use his length to keep up . I guy like frank will dominate and frustrate his opponents. his lateral movements have never been a issue so why would it now. At 6'5 or by now 6'6 dribbling from his huge wingspan looks larger then it really is, and if he had dribbling issues he wouldn't have been a pg in France.

I don't think people realize the unicorn we drafted at pg a defenseive stud who shoots 40 % from three and makes his teammates better. A natural born leader, if he played in college which next yea, he would have went right after fritz and ball ... Dsj has got nothing on frank . Again a 6'6 pg with a 7'1 wingspan that shoots 40% from three, and makes his teammates better....

Frank should be just as untouchable as KP

Knicks get:

Kyrie Irving
TJ Warren
Iman Shumpert
Channing Frye
Edy Taveras

Cavs get:

Carmelo Anthony
Eric Bledsoe
Courtney Lee
Tyson Chandler

Suns get:

Kevin Love
Frank Ntilikina

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I haven't gone through all 12 pages and don't know how much of this has been said but there are several reasons why I think Irving is going to cost a fortune - way more than just Melo if Melo even agrees to a trade there.

1 - A 24 year old all-star coming off a strong season is going to cost more than a 32 year old coming off a weaker season automatically.
2 - Irving has a bigger list of teams he's willing to play for and there are 29 teams Cleveland could trade him to since he has no NTC.
3 - We'd probably want Irving more than they'd want Melo. Do they really need three all-star forwards? They can get a younger, better player who fits their roster both now and in the long-term in case Lebron leaves better than Melo does.
4 - They probably realize they can't win a championship with Melo instead of Irving. They're just a weaker, less balanced team than the one that lost last year.

If the trade was just Melo for Irving or something close to that, sure I'd do it. If we're giving up a fortune to get Irving, no thanks.

Whats a fortune people wont part with Frank which is ridiculous. Someone actually said Frank was a better version than Jason Kidd. I'm sorry I've watched Frank play and I never once seen the court vision Kidd had. I think the kids tape is pretty ordinary, I dont think he was a top 10 pick

Comparing 18 year old Frank to a 26 year old Kidd? Or are you comparing 18 year old Frank with 18 year old Kidd? Frank is likely a totally different player than Kidd. I would be satisfied if Frank became some form of a modern day Dennis Johnson.

18, Franks high dribble and lack of explosion really bothers me. He looks like a very skilled 2.

Not that I'm comparing the two, but Magic had a high dribble too.

He was 6'9"

And? A high dribble is a high dribble regardless of the reason for it. Point being it didn't prevent him from being successful.

Hard to compare the situation IMO. Magic had eyes in the back of his head, which allowed him to do things like employ a high dribble without coughing up the ball often. Magic was always scanning the court, often looking down on a defender. He could use his large frame to shield himself as well.

Does Frank have the ability to use a high dribble, and not cough up the ball in a faster league? IDK. I do believe he's smart, part of why he was drafted, so Im sure he will adapt. Its his ceiling thats the big question mark at this point for me.

TPercy wrote:I don't get why people keep citing kyrie before Lebron arrived. If anyone is paying attention to the finals he is a different player now and is clearly the most unstoppable guard in the league. We need to get this deal done.

It's crazy and everyone seems to believe Dennis Smith will become the best point guard and scorer this league has ever seen. When in reality he will never be close to the all time star MVP caliber player Kyrie is

GustavBahler wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I haven't gone through all 12 pages and don't know how much of this has been said but there are several reasons why I think Irving is going to cost a fortune - way more than just Melo if Melo even agrees to a trade there.

1 - A 24 year old all-star coming off a strong season is going to cost more than a 32 year old coming off a weaker season automatically.
2 - Irving has a bigger list of teams he's willing to play for and there are 29 teams Cleveland could trade him to since he has no NTC.
3 - We'd probably want Irving more than they'd want Melo. Do they really need three all-star forwards? They can get a younger, better player who fits their roster both now and in the long-term in case Lebron leaves better than Melo does.
4 - They probably realize they can't win a championship with Melo instead of Irving. They're just a weaker, less balanced team than the one that lost last year.

If the trade was just Melo for Irving or something close to that, sure I'd do it. If we're giving up a fortune to get Irving, no thanks.

Whats a fortune people wont part with Frank which is ridiculous. Someone actually said Frank was a better version than Jason Kidd. I'm sorry I've watched Frank play and I never once seen the court vision Kidd had. I think the kids tape is pretty ordinary, I dont think he was a top 10 pick

Comparing 18 year old Frank to a 26 year old Kidd? Or are you comparing 18 year old Frank with 18 year old Kidd? Frank is likely a totally different player than Kidd. I would be satisfied if Frank became some form of a modern day Dennis Johnson.

18, Franks high dribble and lack of explosion really bothers me. He looks like a very skilled 2.

Not that I'm comparing the two, but Magic had a high dribble too.

He was 6'9"

And? A high dribble is a high dribble regardless of the reason for it. Point being it didn't prevent him from being successful.

Hard to compare the situation IMO. Magic had eyes in the back of his head, which allowed him to do things like employ a high dribble without coughing up the ball often. Magic was always scanning the court, often looking down on a defender. He could use his large frame to shield himself as well.

Does Frank have the ability to use a high dribble, and not cough up the ball in a faster league? IDK. I do believe he's smart, part of why he was drafted, so Im sure he will adapt. Its his ceiling thats the big question mark at this point for me.

Which makes it all the more remarkable for Magic because you can have all of those great tools but a big man PG having a high dribble is a basketball equivalent of a death wish, regardless. Generally, Frank seems to lower his dribble when he needs to, which is what's good.

Jmpasq wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

stanleybostitch wrote:This is where Mills and Perry prove their worth. Do they starphuck yet again and drain us of assets, or do they play this right and take Irving for Melo + spare parts (Lee, KOQ, Mindy, etc.)? Every single time we are on the path to a youth rebuild, we muck it up. My main concern is if Kyrie - who wants to be 'the man', and does not want to play with one of the greats - turns into a Melo-Rose 2.0 ball stopping ME player. WE're trying to build a TEAM here!

I'd be concerned if we didn't already have KP in place. You don't build a team around 8th picks. Knicks should know.

Worst case scenario it blows up and we luck out in the lottery this time. And become a triple threat team that's young and still growing to its full potential.

We already blew yet another chance to build a contender through the draft alone. The key is to put together a talented young championship caliber core.

Not to mention marquee talent will come here, Irving has weight around the league no one is coming to play with Frank

Very true!

meloshouldgo wrote:If he wants to lead a team why doesn't he stay put?

Strategic decision by Nike and it's marketing department. Rich Paul and Maverick Carter are idiots so this could not have come from them.

LBJ is leaving the Cavs. No doubt about it. No chance to beat the Warriors with this current team and with it's current asset base. Instead of eating all the backlash upon leaving, he clearly leaked this about Irving, true or not, to operate as a stalking horse. Irving will take all the fire for "abandoning" the Cleveland team. And LBJ will walk mostly unscathed this offseason.

Same as pro wrestling, guy isn't talented enough to be the elite "good guy", then you make him a bad guy. Irving is now cast as a bad guy by perception.

Kid yourself not, if Nike caught wind of Tiger Wood's open infidelity and knew about all those side pieces he had, and before it hit the open press, do you think any of those women would still be alive today?

Upon the altar of that blithering idiot LeBron James, Kyrie Irving just got sacrificed like a goat in some bizarre ritual in the jungle.

fitzfarm wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:I haven't gone through all 12 pages and don't know how much of this has been said but there are several reasons why I think Irving is going to cost a fortune - way more than just Melo if Melo even agrees to a trade there.

1 - A 24 year old all-star coming off a strong season is going to cost more than a 32 year old coming off a weaker season automatically.
2 - Irving has a bigger list of teams he's willing to play for and there are 29 teams Cleveland could trade him to since he has no NTC.
3 - We'd probably want Irving more than they'd want Melo. Do they really need three all-star forwards? They can get a younger, better player who fits their roster both now and in the long-term in case Lebron leaves better than Melo does.
4 - They probably realize they can't win a championship with Melo instead of Irving. They're just a weaker, less balanced team than the one that lost last year.

If the trade was just Melo for Irving or something close to that, sure I'd do it. If we're giving up a fortune to get Irving, no thanks.

Whats a fortune people wont part with Frank which is ridiculous. Someone actually said Frank was a better version than Jason Kidd. I'm sorry I've watched Frank play and I never once seen the court vision Kidd had. I think the kids tape is pretty ordinary, I dont think he was a top 10 pick

Comparing 18 year old Frank to a 26 year old Kidd? Or are you comparing 18 year old Frank with 18 year old Kidd? Frank is likely a totally different player than Kidd. I would be satisfied if Frank became some form of a modern day Dennis Johnson.

18, Franks high dribble and lack of explosion really bothers me. He looks like a very skilled 2.

Not that I'm comparing the two, but Magic had a high dribble too.

He was 6'9"

Magic was really 6'8 even though his card said 6'9 and he also didn't have a large wingspan .

The only pg that comes close to franks wing span is rondo and his is a 6'9 wingspan

Also frank is still growing, I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being 6'7 with a 7'3 wing span.

Frank doesn't need lightning quick speed he can literally in one step move past his defender, or on the opposite end allow his opponent to take a step or two he in one step can use his length to keep up . I guy like frank will dominate and frustrate his opponents. his lateral movements have never been a issue so why would it now. At 6'5 or by now 6'6 dribbling from his huge wingspan looks larger then it really is, and if he had dribbling issues he wouldn't have been a pg in France.

I don't think people realize the unicorn we drafted at pg a defenseive stud who shoots 40 % from three and makes his teammates better. A natural born leader, if he played in college which next yea, he would have went right after fritz and ball ... Dsj has got nothing on frank . Again a 6'6 pg with a 7'1 wingspan that shoots 40% from three, and makes his teammates better....

Frank should be just as untouchable as KP

Thank you for this!