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MELO UPDATE THREAD: Denver Post: Melo Deal Done
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nixluva
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2/22/2011  1:56 AM
I just think that even right now this team is better and the chances for the team to get even better down the line still exist. We're not much different than Miami in that regard. Just compare what we saw in Boston. KG was 31 when he joined the C's and Allen was 32. They're both 34 and 35 now. We're getting STAT and Melo just turning 27 and 28. We could be looking at a very nice long run with these guys of 5 or more years easy.
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crzymdups
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2/22/2011  1:57 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  1:58 AM
PresIke wrote:i really don't think it's clear that we overpaid.

it's quite debatable.

like nixluva pointed out, we no longer need to wonder if gallo or wilson would show up. with melo that ain't happening.

now defensively, yes, we aren't any better, but our o, should be better.

we HAD to give up wilson if we wanted melo in free agency.

but we know he wanted to get paid, and would have gone to the nets.

meanwhile, you know amar'e is a risk, so we need ready to play guys who we know will be consistently top players as soon as possible. it wasn't clear that gallo, wilson, or mozgov would be that.

we might have had to give up gallo after next season, and felton too, if we wanted one of the big pg's.

felton was hurting us after a great start to the year, with his poor outside shooting.

that was a concern for me, and we were a .500 team. not a contender, or even legit potential contender with a few tweaks.

billups deal expires next year, and if things go well, we can add one of the major stars available.

this is easily the best 1-2 combo we have had since the 70's title teams.

good post.

in a few years people will be like, "what did the knicks give up for melo again? ...oh. yeah, that was a good deal for them."

what did the Celtics give up for KG? you have to look it up, because there's no memorable young guy they gave away that makes the Celtics pine with regret.

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SupremeCommander
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2/22/2011  1:59 AM
crzymdups wrote:what did the Celtics give up for KG? you have to look it up, because there's no memorable young guy they gave away that makes the Celtics pine with regret.

it's Al Jefferson and the pupu platter. I don't think any of the Knicks traded will be as valuable as Al

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
crzymdups
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2/22/2011  2:05 AM
SupremeCommander wrote:
crzymdups wrote:what did the Celtics give up for KG? you have to look it up, because there's no memorable young guy they gave away that makes the Celtics pine with regret.

it's Al Jefferson and the pupu platter. I don't think any of the Knicks traded will be as valuable as Al

gerald greene was involved, too - a lot of dudes here were convinced he was Tmac 2.0. he never panned out. youth in the nba is tricky.

guys like Melo come in and dominate from day 1. some other guys you think will develop but never really do.

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SupremeCommander
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2/22/2011  2:09 AM
crzymdups wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
crzymdups wrote:what did the Celtics give up for KG? you have to look it up, because there's no memorable young guy they gave away that makes the Celtics pine with regret.

it's Al Jefferson and the pupu platter. I don't think any of the Knicks traded will be as valuable as Al

gerald greene was involved, too - a lot of dudes here were convinced he was Tmac 2.0. he never panned out. youth in the nba is tricky.

guys like Melo come in and dominate from day 1. some other guys you think will develop but never really do.

oh yeah. The Human Pogo Stick without basketball IQ or any work ethic. I remember him. Sebastian Telfair too. They made a documentary about him because he was supposed to be really good

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
PresIke
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2/22/2011  2:14 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  2:15 AM
folks will tell you kg was a better player, and a more of a 2 way player.

however,

1) melo is 26, and kg was 31 when he was dealt.

2) i think melo has been more and more underrated over the past year or so, with a lot of focus on his deficiencies.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
PresIke
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2/22/2011  2:15 AM
tkf wrote:see you later gallo. good luck in denver. I know you will be a star... screw the knicks..

i don't see gallo as a certified future star, and i was a huge supporter. way too inconsistent, even from his strengths, for me, this year.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
nixluva
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2/22/2011  2:19 AM
ESPN said that Melo has hit 18 Game winning shots. This is kind of what we always talked about. We have never had that guy who could consistently be the man at the and of the game. STAT does it pretty well, but Melo is even better and that has to help this team when it comes to winning games. We may not be great on D, but teams will have a tough time stopping us too. It was already hard, but now it's even tougher. That goes for Billups as well. How many times did Felton fail to come thru in the clutch? Now we have a PG known for coming thru.
PresIke
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2/22/2011  2:21 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  2:22 AM
folks got VERY attached to our team this year because of the early excitement, but we were fizzling.

raymond stopped hitting his shots. gallo and wilson were helter skelter, one good night, one bad night, 5 good games, 3 mediocre games. amar'e being run into the ground, and mda not even being able to run his offense because of some of these problems.

amar'e iso's, and as i posted about in the knickerblogger article which i think no one posted a response to that was posted the other day, felton's bad shooting was hurting the team a lot because of the need for a good outside shooting pg in ssl.

billups is FAR superior as a shooter than felton. and while he may be slower, he widely regarded as a good defender, and in mda's offense, you just have to be faster than the other team's bigs to make it work. it isn't like nash is chris paul.

one thing i hope is that billups and melo's learning curve are a bit shorter to get ssl because they played on the olympic team that used mda's offense to crush all opponents.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
BlueSeats
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2/22/2011  2:22 AM
PresIke wrote:
tkf wrote:see you later gallo. good luck in denver. I know you will be a star... screw the knicks..

i don't see gallo as a certified future star, and i was a huge supporter. way too inconsistent, even from his strengths, for me, this year.

Walsh, D'Antoni, and scores of Knicks fans would've loved to keep Gallinari, too. But in November, when asked if he believed he could develop into a star or superstar, Gallinari provided this answer:

"I don't think so ... I don't think I have those abilities ... To get to be a superstar you have to have a lot of things, and if you compare me to Carmelo and LeBron, there's a big difference."

crzymdups
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2/22/2011  2:24 AM
nixluva wrote:ESPN said that Melo has hit 18 Game winning shots. This is kind of what we always talked about. We have never had that guy who could consistently be the man at the and of the game. STAT does it pretty well, but Melo is even better and that has to help this team when it comes to winning games. We may not be great on D, but teams will have a tough time stopping us too. It was already hard, but now it's even tougher. That goes for Billups as well. How many times did Felton fail to come thru in the clutch? Now we have a PG known for coming thru.

I actually wonder if Amar'e and Melo will have trouble determining who is the alpha dog in that role, a little bit.

It was an adjustment for Wade and Bron... might be an adjustment period here, too.

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PresIke
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2/22/2011  2:24 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  2:24 AM
BlueSeats wrote:
PresIke wrote:
tkf wrote:see you later gallo. good luck in denver. I know you will be a star... screw the knicks..

i don't see gallo as a certified future star, and i was a huge supporter. way too inconsistent, even from his strengths, for me, this year.

Walsh, D'Antoni, and scores of Knicks fans would've loved to keep Gallinari, too. But in November, when asked if he believed he could develop into a star or superstar, Gallinari provided this answer:

"I don't think so ... I don't think I have those abilities ... To get to be a superstar you have to have a lot of things, and if you compare me to Carmelo and LeBron, there's a big difference."

i remember that...heck i was the one who posted that quote/article here, i believe...haha.

i had hopes for gallo this year. maybe he's playing hurt, with the wrist but his shot is not dropping like it used to, to me.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
MaTT4281
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2/22/2011  2:27 AM
Ok, now that I've stepped away from the hoopla for a couple hours and come back, I'm starting to come around on the trade. Go ahead and call me a flip flopper.

We've had it ingrained that this was almost the worst-case scenario in terms of giving up the farm because Dolan steps in, not to mention I've really gotten attached to our guys over the past few years (still have to sport the Chandler jersey until I make the investment in an Amar'e one).

Ah well, even when you win the lottery, you still have to pay those damn taxes.

Guess it's time to celebrate - we got our 2nd star! STAT's carried this team for half a season, we have someone to take off some of the strain from our all star (sorry - the first of our all stars). We're not completely depleted either, taking back 6 guys. Not expecting much outside of Melo/Billups, but the other 4 now have a 28 game audition towards part of a serviceable bench.

This team had its moments over the 1st half of the season, and it was easy to get comfortable with that and assume it would just progress, but we were obviously far from a finished product. Things are taking shape now. STAT/Melo can really make an impact in the East. This is going to be fun.

nixluva
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2/22/2011  2:28 AM
crzymdups wrote:
nixluva wrote:ESPN said that Melo has hit 18 Game winning shots. This is kind of what we always talked about. We have never had that guy who could consistently be the man at the and of the game. STAT does it pretty well, but Melo is even better and that has to help this team when it comes to winning games. We may not be great on D, but teams will have a tough time stopping us too. It was already hard, but now it's even tougher. That goes for Billups as well. How many times did Felton fail to come thru in the clutch? Now we have a PG known for coming thru.

I actually wonder if Amar'e and Melo will have trouble determining who is the alpha dog in that role, a little bit.

It was an adjustment for Wade and Bron... might be an adjustment period here, too.

That's the beauty of adding Billups. He made an immediate impact when he joined Denver and I think he can help this team a lot as well. He'll be the brains on the court and as a guy with a ring, he'll get instant respect from everyone on the team.
People are nuts if they don't think MDA isn't ELATED to have Billups running the team! He's coached him before and i'm sure he trusts him and expects big things from him.

SupremeCommander
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2/22/2011  2:32 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  2:32 AM
MaTT4281 wrote:Guess it's time to celebrate - we got our 2nd star!

right. They're damned near impossible to procure, and they're rarely made available. So when you can trade for a star you have to pay a top price. I think getting him was expensive. But I don't think it was way to much. Melo is too good. you can't usually get a player like this unless you win the draft or really luck out and the team in front of you takes Darko or Oden

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
y2zipper
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2/22/2011  3:22 AM
The Knicks gave up a lot in this deal, but it's hard to argue that they didn't get significantly better.

PG: Billups
SG: Fields
SF: Melo
PF: Amare
C: Turiaf

What's even more underrated is that if Anthony Carter can give them a little bit of minutes as the backup PG for Billups, they can shuffle Douglas back to his natural shooting guard position and fix one of this season's biggest problems, which means you'd have Carter/Douglas/some combination of Walker/Williams/Brewer or somebody else at SF and they'll probably bring Earl Barron back to fortify the front line. The interior defense sucks, but that's not a big deal in the East until they actually play Boston. Plus, they can upgrade in the offseason if they play their cards right.

Analyzing what they gave up, they lost Chandler and Curry, who'd both be gone to get anyway for them to get Melo, they lost Felton but got a better player back in Chauncey, so that's at least a wash considering that Felton probably wouldn't be here after 2012 and has been struggling as of late. They lost Gallo, which is valuable, but Melo's a much better better player at this point, and they lost Randolph and Mosgov. Randolph wasn't going to fit in here anyway and Mosgov right now is still a developmental prospect. The draft picks hurt, but Walsh seems to do a pretty good job of finding guys and should be able to fortify the front line and fill in the backup point guard position.

smackeddog
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2/22/2011  5:12 AM
What I find depressing is that once again Eddy Curry has cost us a draft pick! We had to give up AR just to the Twolves would take his contract. SO overall, this is what Eddy had cost us over his career with us (of which he hasn't really played for the last 3 years:

Joakim Noah (top 10 pick)
Tyrus Thomas (Could have been L Aldrich)(top 10 pick)
Jordan Hill (top 10 pick)
The right to swap our 2011 pick with Houston and our 2012 pick (had to give up these and Jordan Hill because of Eddy's contract hoggin our cap space)
Anthony Randolph (top 10 pick) who could have been traded for a first rounder

He has basically cost us FOUR top ten picks, plus what will probably be a mid first round pick in 2012, and if we get hit by an injury this year then we could end up having to swap our picks this year too. Has any other player in the history of basketball ever cost a team so much for so little production?!?!

THANK F**K HE'S FINALLY GONE!

Marv
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2/22/2011  6:09 AM
what i wanted to see is us hold out mozgov from this trade, or demand nene back if he were included. i think there's a point where you say enough is enough, and dolan or isiah or whoever was making it, wouldn't do it.
Bonn1997
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2/22/2011  6:50 AM
Marv wrote:what i wanted to see is us hold out mozgov from this trade, or demand nene back if he were included. i think there's a point where you say enough is enough, and dolan or isiah or whoever was making it, wouldn't do it.

I wanted to see us hold Mozgov, Gallo, and Felton from this trade!

fishmike
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2/22/2011  6:53 AM
Bad trade... We aren't as good as the hawks... No cap room, no prospects and we gave up a ton of picks. This is a win now team as constructed. Are we beating the bulls in round one even?

Walsh did great work finding us some gems and he's going to be out of here.

This is just a starphuck team built with zero vision that is not equipped to win in the playoffs. I'm surprised we didn't take back big buckets al harrington back

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
MELO UPDATE THREAD: Denver Post: Melo Deal Done

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