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OT: Welcome home, Mr. Gates
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Bippity10
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7/28/2009  11:56 AM
I think racism is still prevalent in our society, but I think you should have to be able to prove racism before you accuse of racism. It's just not fair to the people involved and does nothing but fan the flames

[Edited by - bippity10 on 07-28-2009 11:57 AM]
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TMS
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7/28/2009  11:58 AM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by TMS:
I think all people should be treated equally.

clearly they're not in this country... that's the whole point of this debate.

In what country are they? This is one of the fairer countries in the world. Not that it makes it right to treat people unequally but it's just a fact of life.

it IS a fact of life in this country, that's the point i've been making from the start... racism exists in America, u can't escape it & no manner of denying its existence will do away w/that fact... & dude, people are killed for being of a different race in this country, that's been going on since this country was founded... a large part of this country was built on the backs of African slaves & exploited Chinese railroad workers, Japanese born US citizens were herded into concentration camps during WW2, all the racial prejudice that divided this country throughout its history has been well documented, you can't deny its existence.

minorities are hated on all the time in many affluent areas to this day... hell, when i was living out in LA i heard some ignorant middle aged fat white woman blurt out "Oh God, here come the Orientals" to her friend when me & my friends were walking into Mastro's, probably 1 of the most upscale steakhouse restaurants in the city... she didn't even make an effort to hide her disdain for the fact that we were coming to eat in the same place as she just did, nevermind calling us "Orientals"... i just had to SMH at the stupidity of that comment, didn't even wanna waste my breath on saying something back to that biotch.

bro, just cuz we're not a 3rd world nation where dictators & tribal leaders run amuck committing genocide against a particular ethnic or religious group doesn't mean the US doesn't have a lot of work to do in order to do away with the hate crimes & prejudice that occur here either... maybe we're going off on a much broader tangent here but i just don't like when i hear people buy into the notion that "everyone is treated equally in the eyes of the law"... that's a buncha BS if u ask me... of course bro, i agree w/u, i think everyone SHOULD be treated equally, but until racism is done away with, that's never gonna be the case.
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TMS
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7/28/2009  12:04 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

I wanna vent a story....

the other day i was getting on the train at jamacia center...Cop shouts me out "Yo....YOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!" I look up like what the **** is going on and so did the whole station...he wanted to see my metro card. I work for the MTA and my Id is red and I was outta uniform...so ok he's in his rights to check. As I show it to him...his partner gets into position with her hand on her gun...the guy looks at it, flexes it for like 5 seconds and then gives if back saying..."ok"...and starts to walk away.

The rage that i had inside of me gave me an instant headache. I stared at him to the point he had to stop and turn around. We stared at each other...he made a grin almost laughing and i just turned around and caught my train.

What was wrong with defusing the situation??? Cop could have said, "Sorry bout that sir (or used my job title or said bro or something), have a nice day"...nah I got a measley "ok". Now if I got mad and said to him, "you can't apologize and wish me well? Thats why everyone hates cops"...he probably would say something smart and i probably would get even more upset or maybe in my anger go on a mild rant....now is it within the cops right to arrest me???

If you say yes...then you are lost.

I've gotten stopped putting my cell back in my belt clip by 3 undercover guys with guns drawn...all i can think about is sean bell and my family. again no apology...taught me not to use a belt case for my phone though.

I've had cops come up to a group of my friends and family inside our gate and told us to go inside our houses that we couldn't sit there. we knew they were gonna say something so we got up and closed the gate so they couldn't walk in and start touching stuff. old and young people were out there. of course they argue with us about open beer and such which isn't illegal if you are on your front porch. they walk away after the older people plead with them, but with the ****y swagger they are known for.

just giving my experience....some people can relate and thats why they would side either way. as human beings...I don't understand how anyone can side with the cops on this one...regardless if its racially motivated. People should not get arrested in their own homes for being angry at a cop that more than likely was disrespectful and intruding. If the cop felt threatened then thats another thing. I think this was a case of who's the bigger dickhead.

Eny, i guess we all just need to learn our place... can't argue against cops... just shut up & take our medicine no matter what they do to us... a badge gives u the right to dehumanize & disrespect anyone you come across, didn't they teach u this in school?

[Edited by - TMS on 07-28-2009 12:04 PM]
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EnySpree
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7/28/2009  12:21 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by EnySpree:

I wanna vent a story....

the other day i was getting on the train at jamacia center...Cop shouts me out "Yo....YOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!" I look up like what the **** is going on and so did the whole station...he wanted to see my metro card. I work for the MTA and my Id is red and I was outta uniform...so ok he's in his rights to check. As I show it to him...his partner gets into position with her hand on her gun...the guy looks at it, flexes it for like 5 seconds and then gives if back saying..."ok"...and starts to walk away.

The rage that i had inside of me gave me an instant headache. I stared at him to the point he had to stop and turn around. We stared at each other...he made a grin almost laughing and i just turned around and caught my train.

What was wrong with defusing the situation??? Cop could have said, "Sorry bout that sir (or used my job title or said bro or something), have a nice day"...nah I got a measley "ok". Now if I got mad and said to him, "you can't apologize and wish me well? Thats why everyone hates cops"...he probably would say something smart and i probably would get even more upset or maybe in my anger go on a mild rant....now is it within the cops right to arrest me???

If you say yes...then you are lost.

I've gotten stopped putting my cell back in my belt clip by 3 undercover guys with guns drawn...all i can think about is sean bell and my family. again no apology...taught me not to use a belt case for my phone though.

I've had cops come up to a group of my friends and family inside our gate and told us to go inside our houses that we couldn't sit there. we knew they were gonna say something so we got up and closed the gate so they couldn't walk in and start touching stuff. old and young people were out there. of course they argue with us about open beer and such which isn't illegal if you are on your front porch. they walk away after the older people plead with them, but with the ****y swagger they are known for.

just giving my experience....some people can relate and thats why they would side either way. as human beings...I don't understand how anyone can side with the cops on this one...regardless if its racially motivated. People should not get arrested in their own homes for being angry at a cop that more than likely was disrespectful and intruding. If the cop felt threatened then thats another thing. I think this was a case of who's the bigger dickhead.

Eny, i guess we all just need to learn our place... can't argue against cops... just shut up & take our medicine no matter what they do to us... a badge gives u the right to dehumanize & disrespect anyone you come across, didn't they teach u this in school?

[Edited by - TMS on 07-28-2009 12:04 PM]

police need to change their slogan then...."serve and protect"...more like "harass and disrespect"
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sebstar
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7/28/2009  12:24 PM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by sebstar:




Nice try, and a predictable one at that...only problem is that her version is confirmed by the 911 call.

Try again.

Predictable? I'm not a racist no matter what you think or how you try to paint me as one. So just drop it already - besides - not for nothing Seb, you come off as a guy who thinks everyone is racist. That's not fair to "everyone" nor to yourself because you work yourself up to unneeded levels over nothing far too often.

Breath deep man, breath deep, there is a VERY logical explanation as to why this situation got a little out of hand, and race has nothing to do with it except for those that WANT it to be about race. In the case of a select few, who insist on fueling the flames each and every time, a non-black man can't even accidentally bump into a black man in a crowded train station without it being an overt act of premeditated racism.

To those who act that way they're part of the problem not the solution of any manner that involves racism. Your Al Sharptons and Jesse Jacksons do their fellow man a great disservice always going way out of line over the most minor of situations.

I guess they, and those like them, have to cure their boredom and vent their misplaced anger somehow. That's fine, but, it does noone any good at all.

I dont think you're a racist. Not at all. I dont know you and I'm not going to jump to conclusions just because I disagree with you on a particularly complicated issue.

What I meant is that I think you're adopting a pro-authority posture because it suits your worldview. I wouldnt expect you to come out and say "wait a minute, this arrest was unjust"...not saying you're a racist, fam.

That said, this strikes in contrast with the conservative philosophy that attacks big government. I guess its not ok to give the government responsibility when it comes to assisting the poor and with healthcare, but they can have guns and unlimited authority when it comes to harassing innocent citizens and locking them up for no reason. Thats too big of an inconsistency as far as I'm concerned.
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Cosmic
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7/29/2009  11:55 AM
*falls off chair*

Damn, Seb, alright, it's all good then. Sorry to try to peg you then.

As to being pro-authority I'm not. I've had my fair share of run-ins and I don't like being told what to do.

I'm just saying when a cop is entering a scene he has to be on the highest of alert. Just because someone says "It's my house" doesn't mean it is. They don't know. Man could be lying. And again if you're acting loud and animate towards the cops they can't afford to take any chances. They have to contain the situation and with force if necessary. How does a cop know when someone will or won't draw down on them? They don't.

You take all precautions first.

What I don't like is how the cops didn't bother to sort it out once they had control. So what if someone yelled at you. You bust into my house I'm yelling at you too. All they had to do once they had him under wraps was check his ID, make sure he wasn't truly going insane (which would require a trip to the hospital) and then move on.

They didn't and that's the point in time that the cops screwed up.

Now, I'm pretty much done with this convo, I've said plenty on it, and again my feeling is that BOTH sides screwed up, but, the man wasn't beaten in the process so I don't see how the cops were criminals or racists in this matter.

And, final word, police dispatchers are required to give descriptions of people possibly committing crimes. When a police dispatcher says "Black Male" or "White Male" they're not being racist, nor can you claim the police will act racist born off that description. It's just a description to let the cops know why to look for so they don't show up CLUELESS to a scene of a crime.

This thing got so blown out of proportion it's insane!

This thing is on the level of an apology from the Police Department, and maybe giving the man one of those "get out of jail free cards" if he gets pulled over speeding in the future. Really, that's it.

One last time, you go nuts on the cops they're taking you away. I've done it and looking back I understand why I was hauled off. They just can't know if you're crazy upset - or - crazy and about to draw down on them. They can't.

There's plenty of jerkoff cops out there but for the most part, even during a moment of confusion, you act calm then the cops will act calm and it will get sorted out.

They can't afford to be calm with a raving lunatic. They just can't.

Anyways, I'm moving on.....
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fishmike
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7/29/2009  1:39 PM
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0723092gates1.html

Interesting read of the police report. More cop conspiracy? Or did Gate lose his ****
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Nalod
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7/29/2009  1:42 PM
Catch John Stewarts program at 8 tonite, a reapeat of last nite.

Very funny stuff!
Rookie
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7/29/2009  1:55 PM
20 years ago NYC was not such a friendly place. I think we've come a long way...on both sides.

And btw- it has been my experience that law enforcement will mess with anybody who has a big mouth no matter what race they are.
kam77
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7/29/2009  1:58 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by kam77:
Posted by TMS:


just using my own race as an example, look at every Hollywood movie & television series out there... when's the last time u watched a movie where an Asian man was represented in a positive light other than as some kinda kung fu expert? it's always either a yakuza gangster, or a non-English speaking chinese food delivery guy William Hung type mockery, or sometimes both...



a spineless, anally retentive Asian dude working in an office who gets taken advantage of by his coworkers & doesn't have the balls to step up to a hot latin chick that lives in his building & spends his weekends smoking weed with his pot addicted Indian roommate who'd rather smoke weed than go to med school is a positive representation of an Asian male in your eyes?


OK OK.... you don't like that example. Well how about Miles from Lost?



Or... this guy from Oz



Or Roland from Prison Break

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
TMS
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7/29/2009  6:21 PM
i don't watch the first 2 shows so can't comment on it... but Roland from PrisonBreak? are you sheetin' me dude? that guy was a puny, weasely, no spine having coward computer geek hack who got bullied around regularly by everyone on that show & ended up getting shot in the stomach & bleeding to death by the agent that was after them because he couldn't control his gambling addiction... u call that a positive image of an Asian male? ROFL!!!
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nixluva
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7/29/2009  7:10 PM
Man I feel comfortable talking about any racial issue cuz my own ehtnic history is so mixed. To look at me, I'm what you would call African American, but my great Grandfather was white and I have a bit of Native American in there and guess what TMS, Asian too on my fathers side. There was a lot of rape going on way back in Slavery era, so I can't account for any of that, but It's all part of my family history. Our family reunions really look crazy. We go from Sudanese Black to Pale White Skin, Brown Hair, Dirty Blond Hair, Flaming Red Hair, Freckles and all kinds of Eye colors. The only thing that bothers me is that to me none of that matters. I don't really see people that way. I only put people in categories of good people you want to associate with and those you don't. I don't care what a person looks like.

I only wish that society as a whole didn't fixate on it so much. It's funny cuz there really isn't any such thing as individual races. There's only one race... the HUMAN race. What people fixate on is just a function of regional gene pools being isolated long enough to develop distinct characteristics. Much of them effected by the area the people lived in. Inside we're all the same. It's gonna get better one day, if not in my lifetime, then surely my grandkids.
Cosmic
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7/29/2009  7:15 PM
Oh and TMS I hear you, I do, but I'm just saying that we're one of the BEST countries when it comes to equal opportunity. Does this mean any wrongdoing should be accepted? Of course not. Yet if you look outside our borders what we gripe about here is largely childs play.
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TMS
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7/29/2009  7:41 PM
Posted by nixluva:

Man I feel comfortable talking about any racial issue cuz my own ehtnic history is so mixed. To look at me, I'm what you would call African American, but my great Grandfather was white and I have a bit of Native American in there and guess what TMS, Asian too on my fathers side. There was a lot of rape going on way back in Slavery era, so I can't account for any of that, but It's all part of my family history. Our family reunions really look crazy. We go from Sudanese Black to Pale White Skin, Brown Hair, Dirty Blond Hair, Flaming Red Hair, Freckles and all kinds of Eye colors. The only thing that bothers me is that to me none of that matters. I don't really see people that way. I only put people in categories of good people you want to associate with and those you don't. I don't care what a person looks like.

I only wish that society as a whole didn't fixate on it so much. It's funny cuz there really isn't any such thing as individual races. There's only one race... the HUMAN race. What people fixate on is just a function of regional gene pools being isolated long enough to develop distinct characteristics. Much of them effected by the area the people lived in. Inside we're all the same. It's gonna get better one day, if not in my lifetime, then surely my grandkids.

nixluva, in a Utopian ideal that is exactly how i wish people were viewed too... i hate the race labels cuz it always leads to hurt feelings & unnecessary arguments... but we can't just ignore the race issue & pretend it doesn't exist, cuz that only hides the problem, it doesn't address it... thanks for relating your family geneology tho, that's an interesting blend of cultures you have in your family line & you are lucky to be able to tap into so many diverse backgrounds to draw experience & knowledge from.
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kam77
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7/30/2009  12:12 AM
Posted by TMS:

i don't watch the first 2 shows so can't comment on it... but Roland from PrisonBreak? are you sheetin' me dude? that guy was a puny, weasely, no spine having coward computer geek hack who got bullied around regularly by everyone on that show & ended up getting shot in the stomach & bleeding to death by the agent that was after them because he couldn't control his gambling addiction... u call that a positive image of an Asian male? ROFL!!!

The Doc from Knocked up


lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
martin
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7/30/2009  1:26 AM
if you'all want to create another thread and discuss Asian lead roles, please do so, otherwise it's really off-topic from this thread. Thanks.
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Allanfan20
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7/30/2009  1:45 AM
Posted by martin:

if you'all want to create another thread and discuss Asian lead roles, please do so, otherwise it's really off-topic from this thread. Thanks.

It's not that off topic. TMS was trying to make a point that generally speaking, Asians are portrayed in a less than positive light in movies b/c of racism, which I agree with that MOST OF THE TIME. Kam was trying to prove him wrong.
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Nalod
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7/30/2009  2:52 AM
GKFv2
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7/30/2009  2:54 AM
Posted by Nalod:


Is this a porn?
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TheGame
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7/30/2009  8:02 AM
Posted by Nalod:


Those dudes aren't asian.
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