[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Hinkie's Sixers: Bad Plan, Bad Execution, or both?
Author Thread
fishmike
Posts: 53902
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
12/8/2015  3:21 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:

philly.com
76ers hire Jerry Colangelo to be chairman of basketball operations
Keith Pompey

Posted: Tuesday, December 8, 2015, 7:55 AM

The 76ers got their credibility back.

The franchise introduced Hall of Famer Jerry Colangelo as chairman of basketball operations on Monday evening.

"I think he will be very helpful for us," general manager Sam Hinkie said. "I think he can provide open doors. I think he can provide new experiences to me and to ownership. I'll take all the advice he'll give me."

But the biggest question is what does Colangelo's hire mean to Hinkie's longevity with the franchise. The Sixers are saying all the right things about how Hinkie will continue to run the day-to-day operations. But this hire reduces his power.

"There's a new sheriff in town," said an NBA executive, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

League executives believe this move is admittance by the Sixers ownership group that the process is not working. As a result, there's a sense that the move means that Hinkie will ultimately lose some of his power.

"He's coming here on his own terms," another NBA executive said of Colangelo.

Another league executive expects Colangelo to make major changes because "his reputation is on the line."

The league executives were wondering if Colangelo would get the Sixers ownership group to hire his son, Bryan, into a high-ranking front office position. Bryan had general manager stints with the Toronto Raptors and Phoenix Suns.

"To be explicitly clear, I continue to have confidence in Sam," co-managing owner Josh Harris said. "He will continue in his current role, leading us with the day-to-day basketball operations. More important, I want him in the position. Jerry in this new role will be an invaluable resource to help all of us."

Colangelo said Hinkie "will make the call on the final decision. But that's after a lot of collaboration and decision" with Colangelo and the ownership group.

The Sixers (1-21) are in the midst of their third consecutive season of sacrificing wins with the hope of securing top draft picks in the NBA draft. In the process, they have become the laughingstock of the NBA while compiling a 38-148 record since Hinkie was hired in May, 2013.

Several off-the-court incidents involving rookie Jahlil Okafor were also damaging to the franchise's image.

The center returned to action Monday against the Spurs after being suspended for the last two games after a video surfaced Wednesday of him getting into a second fight with a heckler on a Boston street in the early hours of Nov. 26.

Colangelo will evaluate things before giving his input on draft picks, free agency, and building a better culture.

"I'm here to assist in areas where I can already see things that I want to pass on to Sam," he said of having a veteran presence for young players. "And these aren't things that he hasn't already thought about. But when he hears them from me, he's hearing it from a different perspective and hopefully some of things are going to be addressed."

Colangelo is currently the chairman of the board of directors for USA basketball. The 76-year-old formerly owned the Suns, the Arizona Diamondbacks of Major League Baseball, the Phoenix Mercury of the WNBA, the Arizona Sandsharks of the Continental Indoor Soccer League, and Arizona Rattlers of the Arena Football League.

The Hall of Famer began his career with the Chicago Bulls, working as the marketing director, scout and assistant to the team president.

He left the Bulls in 1968 with just $200 in his wallet to become the first general manager of the then expansion Suns. Colangelo had two stints as the Suns coach in the 1970s. In 1987, he put together a group that bought that team. Colangelo also held the posts of chief executive officer, managing general partner and president before selling the team in 2004.

"I think opportunities like this are rare, where you get somebody with his experience that will give his time and expertise to help as an entire organization grow is rare," coach Brett Brown said. "To everyone's credit, we made it happen.

"So you sort of wake up this morning with a real bounce, a real excitement, and what the future can bring with him on board."

This move also takes some of the burden off Brown, who in addition to coaching, served as the Sixers spokesperson.

It also helps with public reception.

The Sixers were not a desired destination for free agents. There were even some draft picks, who didn't want to play for the franchise. Word around the league was that very few players would want to come to Philadelphia until they hired a well-respected basketball mind.

They introduced that person on Monday.

"He's a man of wisdom, of incredible, I think class," said Brown, who coached Australia in the 2012 London Olympics. "I saw him a lot in London when we coached against the United States. I know that my old boss [San Antonio coach Gregg Popovich] probably wouldn't have taken the United States [coaching] job if it weren't for Mr. Colangelo.

"All of those things come to my mind when you say, all of a sudden he is a Philadelphia 76er. This is a good day."

When I read this article I think of a situation where a young player gets a great contract, comes into a lot of $$, starts losing it through stupidity and foolishness, and then hires a professional money manager to install some financial discipline and help him maximize the utilization of his financial assets.

This move is clearly a sign that the Hinkie mystique might be starting to fade.

or that Hinkie got us this war chest but we are not sure that he knows how to spend it.

LMFAO ... was speaking about what philly is thinking as was Walt.

I ain't no philly fan-atic. I like fun story lines. Philly is gonna get boring now.

Its been boring. Building a team is interesting.

Maybe they now start to dig the foundation for a good franchise.

Some, like myself, dislike a guy like Hinkie because we see a pretentiousness in "The Process," or perhaps we are jealous because we see him squandering the draft picks he's acquired while we have given up so many of ours and wish we had some...

...but at some point, especially if Colangelo has success, our dislike for Hinkie might turn to hate if the Sixers actually start to draft real players and build a real team that can compete at a high level for many years.

Hinkie seems to be good with the foreplay...not so good with finishing things. Colangelo was brought in as finisher.

yea its actually scary, because if they draft well, and Colangelo most likely will, and they sign a couple guys they could really set themselves up. Hinkie thinks he's so smart, but not smart enough to keep the keys from getting yanked away

who cares about Hinkie ... how about Philly? Are they smart? They used a guy who knew how to fills the cupboard with lots of shiny jewels but perhaps not a good spender or a willing one and now they put in a guy who knows how to manage the next phase. This is the point. I always said that if Hinkie gets hit by a bus, has he put the next guy in a position to succeed?

Hinkie is like my cheap jewish uncle who amassed and amassed but needed to hire an italian to help him spend/invest his money

having lots of picks does not = being set up for success. If it takes another 3 years because after all the losing nobody wants to play there, the current players have been devalued and the first 3 shiny jewels have been devalued into spare parts at best than no... thats a no for me.

"Phuck the rest of the owners" sounds exciting for Hinkie and the rebellion, but in the real world it doesnt translate. Sometimes you cant just do it your way, no matter how much smarter you are than everyone else. Looks like his disregard for basic team building lost him the keys to daddy's car.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
AUTOADVERT
Knixkik
Posts: 35759
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #11
USA
12/8/2015  3:21 PM
nyk4ever wrote:
mreinman wrote:
nyk4ever wrote:the even more disgusting thing (for philly fans, but i don't feel bad for them) is that their owner was more than happy to let this rage on. i'd be disgusted if i were them.

but they are not disgusted and were not as of a recent poll. We should not speak for them.

your hard on for hinkie is ridiculous. no sports team should advocate the losing that has gone on in philly over the last few years under hinkie. in the end, it's bad for business and thankfully the rest of the owners can see that.

Yeah, i think Philly fans understood they were too far into this thing to abandon it, so their opinion to remain on-board is a little biased and of desperation. But let's put it this way, if they knew they had to sacrifice 3 seasons with embarrassing play, plus more bad seasons for the foreseeable future, knowing what they have on the roster now, i think they would have said to go a different route. Hindsight is 20-20, but this seemed like a bad idea from the start, as many of us had urged a couple of years ago.

Nalod
Posts: 72120
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
12/8/2015  3:28 PM
The owner is a hedge fund guy. THink about that. He made his money not being conventional. He sees an undervalued asset, finances the down fall, then builds a team that is a long term player and either enjoys the toy or sells it for a nice profit.

Guy like that is not some fat cat old guy who is not cognizant of his property, he is setting the agenda and hires Hinkie as he might relate to the metrics and is convinced there is more than just the eyeball test.
Its an interesting theory, but he keeps getting a year behind as they pick Norlens and Embiid as damaged but deep value guys. In Harris (Owner) he is picking up a no. 1 pick at a discount and all he has to do is wait. Oka4 is their first blue chip big that was ready to play. when to go safe? when to get a guy like Amare and take a chance? Its not an easy game.

Knixkik
Posts: 35759
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #11
USA
12/8/2015  3:29 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:

philly.com
76ers hire Jerry Colangelo to be chairman of basketball operations
Keith Pompey

Posted: Tuesday, December 8, 2015, 7:55 AM

The 76ers got their credibility back.

The franchise introduced Hall of Famer Jerry Colangelo as chairman of basketball operations on Monday evening.

"I think he will be very helpful for us," general manager Sam Hinkie said. "I think he can provide open doors. I think he can provide new experiences to me and to ownership. I'll take all the advice he'll give me."

But the biggest question is what does Colangelo's hire mean to Hinkie's longevity with the franchise. The Sixers are saying all the right things about how Hinkie will continue to run the day-to-day operations. But this hire reduces his power.

"There's a new sheriff in town," said an NBA executive, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

League executives believe this move is admittance by the Sixers ownership group that the process is not working. As a result, there's a sense that the move means that Hinkie will ultimately lose some of his power.

"He's coming here on his own terms," another NBA executive said of Colangelo.

Another league executive expects Colangelo to make major changes because "his reputation is on the line."

The league executives were wondering if Colangelo would get the Sixers ownership group to hire his son, Bryan, into a high-ranking front office position. Bryan had general manager stints with the Toronto Raptors and Phoenix Suns.

"To be explicitly clear, I continue to have confidence in Sam," co-managing owner Josh Harris said. "He will continue in his current role, leading us with the day-to-day basketball operations. More important, I want him in the position. Jerry in this new role will be an invaluable resource to help all of us."

Colangelo said Hinkie "will make the call on the final decision. But that's after a lot of collaboration and decision" with Colangelo and the ownership group.

The Sixers (1-21) are in the midst of their third consecutive season of sacrificing wins with the hope of securing top draft picks in the NBA draft. In the process, they have become the laughingstock of the NBA while compiling a 38-148 record since Hinkie was hired in May, 2013.

Several off-the-court incidents involving rookie Jahlil Okafor were also damaging to the franchise's image.

The center returned to action Monday against the Spurs after being suspended for the last two games after a video surfaced Wednesday of him getting into a second fight with a heckler on a Boston street in the early hours of Nov. 26.

Colangelo will evaluate things before giving his input on draft picks, free agency, and building a better culture.

"I'm here to assist in areas where I can already see things that I want to pass on to Sam," he said of having a veteran presence for young players. "And these aren't things that he hasn't already thought about. But when he hears them from me, he's hearing it from a different perspective and hopefully some of things are going to be addressed."

Colangelo is currently the chairman of the board of directors for USA basketball. The 76-year-old formerly owned the Suns, the Arizona Diamondbacks of Major League Baseball, the Phoenix Mercury of the WNBA, the Arizona Sandsharks of the Continental Indoor Soccer League, and Arizona Rattlers of the Arena Football League.

The Hall of Famer began his career with the Chicago Bulls, working as the marketing director, scout and assistant to the team president.

He left the Bulls in 1968 with just $200 in his wallet to become the first general manager of the then expansion Suns. Colangelo had two stints as the Suns coach in the 1970s. In 1987, he put together a group that bought that team. Colangelo also held the posts of chief executive officer, managing general partner and president before selling the team in 2004.

"I think opportunities like this are rare, where you get somebody with his experience that will give his time and expertise to help as an entire organization grow is rare," coach Brett Brown said. "To everyone's credit, we made it happen.

"So you sort of wake up this morning with a real bounce, a real excitement, and what the future can bring with him on board."

This move also takes some of the burden off Brown, who in addition to coaching, served as the Sixers spokesperson.

It also helps with public reception.

The Sixers were not a desired destination for free agents. There were even some draft picks, who didn't want to play for the franchise. Word around the league was that very few players would want to come to Philadelphia until they hired a well-respected basketball mind.

They introduced that person on Monday.

"He's a man of wisdom, of incredible, I think class," said Brown, who coached Australia in the 2012 London Olympics. "I saw him a lot in London when we coached against the United States. I know that my old boss [San Antonio coach Gregg Popovich] probably wouldn't have taken the United States [coaching] job if it weren't for Mr. Colangelo.

"All of those things come to my mind when you say, all of a sudden he is a Philadelphia 76er. This is a good day."

When I read this article I think of a situation where a young player gets a great contract, comes into a lot of $$, starts losing it through stupidity and foolishness, and then hires a professional money manager to install some financial discipline and help him maximize the utilization of his financial assets.

This move is clearly a sign that the Hinkie mystique might be starting to fade.

or that Hinkie got us this war chest but we are not sure that he knows how to spend it.

LMFAO ... was speaking about what philly is thinking as was Walt.

I ain't no philly fan-atic. I like fun story lines. Philly is gonna get boring now.

Its been boring. Building a team is interesting.

Maybe they now start to dig the foundation for a good franchise.

Some, like myself, dislike a guy like Hinkie because we see a pretentiousness in "The Process," or perhaps we are jealous because we see him squandering the draft picks he's acquired while we have given up so many of ours and wish we had some...

...but at some point, especially if Colangelo has success, our dislike for Hinkie might turn to hate if the Sixers actually start to draft real players and build a real team that can compete at a high level for many years.

Hinkie seems to be good with the foreplay...not so good with finishing things. Colangelo was brought in as finisher.

yea its actually scary, because if they draft well, and Colangelo most likely will, and they sign a couple guys they could really set themselves up. Hinkie thinks he's so smart, but not smart enough to keep the keys from getting yanked away

who cares about Hinkie ... how about Philly? Are they smart? They used a guy who knew how to fills the cupboard with lots of shiny jewels but perhaps not a good spender or a willing one and now they put in a guy who knows how to manage the next phase. This is the point. I always said that if Hinkie gets hit by a bus, has he put the next guy in a position to succeed?

Hinkie is like my cheap jewish uncle who amassed and amassed but needed to hire an italian to help him spend/invest his money

having lots of picks does not = being set up for success. If it takes another 3 years because after all the losing nobody wants to play there, the current players have been devalued and the first 3 shiny jewels have been devalued into spare parts at best than no... thats a no for me.

"Phuck the rest of the owners" sounds exciting for Hinkie and the rebellion, but in the real world it doesnt translate. Sometimes you cant just do it your way, no matter how much smarter you are than everyone else. Looks like his disregard for basic team building lost him the keys to daddy's car.

You are right on all of this. One of the biggest flaws in the plan is the extent to which these draft picks and assets are spread out. If you are going to go all-out and do a major rebuild, make sure you target a draft in which you feel confident in the incoming players, and go all-out on 1 draft, or 2 tops. For whatever reason, Hinkie kept delaying and adding players who would be sitting out with injuries or staying overseas, and not taking into account that these assets decrease over time, and rookie contracts expire. Take for example this draft. Had he worked diligently last season to parlay a majority of his assets into 3 lottery picks from this draft, and drafted correctly, he could have ended up with Porzingis, Winslow, and Caley-Stein for example. There is your front-court for the next 10-15 years in one lottery. But spreading out picks, delaying for as long as possible, and then to top it off, drafting poorly, is a recipe unlikely to work. But for Hinkie, it was some job security to delay, but that is catching up with him now too.

WaltLongmire
Posts: 27623
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 6/28/2014
Member: #5843

12/8/2015  4:52 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/8/2015  4:54 PM

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
mreinman
Posts: 37827
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/14/2010
Member: #3189

12/8/2015  6:03 PM
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:

philly.com
76ers hire Jerry Colangelo to be chairman of basketball operations
Keith Pompey

Posted: Tuesday, December 8, 2015, 7:55 AM

The 76ers got their credibility back.

The franchise introduced Hall of Famer Jerry Colangelo as chairman of basketball operations on Monday evening.

"I think he will be very helpful for us," general manager Sam Hinkie said. "I think he can provide open doors. I think he can provide new experiences to me and to ownership. I'll take all the advice he'll give me."

But the biggest question is what does Colangelo's hire mean to Hinkie's longevity with the franchise. The Sixers are saying all the right things about how Hinkie will continue to run the day-to-day operations. But this hire reduces his power.

"There's a new sheriff in town," said an NBA executive, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

League executives believe this move is admittance by the Sixers ownership group that the process is not working. As a result, there's a sense that the move means that Hinkie will ultimately lose some of his power.

"He's coming here on his own terms," another NBA executive said of Colangelo.

Another league executive expects Colangelo to make major changes because "his reputation is on the line."

The league executives were wondering if Colangelo would get the Sixers ownership group to hire his son, Bryan, into a high-ranking front office position. Bryan had general manager stints with the Toronto Raptors and Phoenix Suns.

"To be explicitly clear, I continue to have confidence in Sam," co-managing owner Josh Harris said. "He will continue in his current role, leading us with the day-to-day basketball operations. More important, I want him in the position. Jerry in this new role will be an invaluable resource to help all of us."

Colangelo said Hinkie "will make the call on the final decision. But that's after a lot of collaboration and decision" with Colangelo and the ownership group.

The Sixers (1-21) are in the midst of their third consecutive season of sacrificing wins with the hope of securing top draft picks in the NBA draft. In the process, they have become the laughingstock of the NBA while compiling a 38-148 record since Hinkie was hired in May, 2013.

Several off-the-court incidents involving rookie Jahlil Okafor were also damaging to the franchise's image.

The center returned to action Monday against the Spurs after being suspended for the last two games after a video surfaced Wednesday of him getting into a second fight with a heckler on a Boston street in the early hours of Nov. 26.

Colangelo will evaluate things before giving his input on draft picks, free agency, and building a better culture.

"I'm here to assist in areas where I can already see things that I want to pass on to Sam," he said of having a veteran presence for young players. "And these aren't things that he hasn't already thought about. But when he hears them from me, he's hearing it from a different perspective and hopefully some of things are going to be addressed."

Colangelo is currently the chairman of the board of directors for USA basketball. The 76-year-old formerly owned the Suns, the Arizona Diamondbacks of Major League Baseball, the Phoenix Mercury of the WNBA, the Arizona Sandsharks of the Continental Indoor Soccer League, and Arizona Rattlers of the Arena Football League.

The Hall of Famer began his career with the Chicago Bulls, working as the marketing director, scout and assistant to the team president.

He left the Bulls in 1968 with just $200 in his wallet to become the first general manager of the then expansion Suns. Colangelo had two stints as the Suns coach in the 1970s. In 1987, he put together a group that bought that team. Colangelo also held the posts of chief executive officer, managing general partner and president before selling the team in 2004.

"I think opportunities like this are rare, where you get somebody with his experience that will give his time and expertise to help as an entire organization grow is rare," coach Brett Brown said. "To everyone's credit, we made it happen.

"So you sort of wake up this morning with a real bounce, a real excitement, and what the future can bring with him on board."

This move also takes some of the burden off Brown, who in addition to coaching, served as the Sixers spokesperson.

It also helps with public reception.

The Sixers were not a desired destination for free agents. There were even some draft picks, who didn't want to play for the franchise. Word around the league was that very few players would want to come to Philadelphia until they hired a well-respected basketball mind.

They introduced that person on Monday.

"He's a man of wisdom, of incredible, I think class," said Brown, who coached Australia in the 2012 London Olympics. "I saw him a lot in London when we coached against the United States. I know that my old boss [San Antonio coach Gregg Popovich] probably wouldn't have taken the United States [coaching] job if it weren't for Mr. Colangelo.

"All of those things come to my mind when you say, all of a sudden he is a Philadelphia 76er. This is a good day."

When I read this article I think of a situation where a young player gets a great contract, comes into a lot of $$, starts losing it through stupidity and foolishness, and then hires a professional money manager to install some financial discipline and help him maximize the utilization of his financial assets.

This move is clearly a sign that the Hinkie mystique might be starting to fade.

or that Hinkie got us this war chest but we are not sure that he knows how to spend it.

LMFAO ... was speaking about what philly is thinking as was Walt.

I ain't no philly fan-atic. I like fun story lines. Philly is gonna get boring now.

Its been boring. Building a team is interesting.

Maybe they now start to dig the foundation for a good franchise.

Some, like myself, dislike a guy like Hinkie because we see a pretentiousness in "The Process," or perhaps we are jealous because we see him squandering the draft picks he's acquired while we have given up so many of ours and wish we had some...

...but at some point, especially if Colangelo has success, our dislike for Hinkie might turn to hate if the Sixers actually start to draft real players and build a real team that can compete at a high level for many years.

Hinkie seems to be good with the foreplay...not so good with finishing things. Colangelo was brought in as finisher.

yea its actually scary, because if they draft well, and Colangelo most likely will, and they sign a couple guys they could really set themselves up. Hinkie thinks he's so smart, but not smart enough to keep the keys from getting yanked away

who cares about Hinkie ... how about Philly? Are they smart? They used a guy who knew how to fills the cupboard with lots of shiny jewels but perhaps not a good spender or a willing one and now they put in a guy who knows how to manage the next phase. This is the point. I always said that if Hinkie gets hit by a bus, has he put the next guy in a position to succeed?

Hinkie is like my cheap jewish uncle who amassed and amassed but needed to hire an italian to help him spend/invest his money

having lots of picks does not = being set up for success. If it takes another 3 years because after all the losing nobody wants to play there, the current players have been devalued and the first 3 shiny jewels have been devalued into spare parts at best than no... thats a no for me.

"Phuck the rest of the owners" sounds exciting for Hinkie and the rebellion, but in the real world it doesnt translate. Sometimes you cant just do it your way, no matter how much smarter you are than everyone else. Looks like his disregard for basic team building lost him the keys to daddy's car.

You are right on all of this. One of the biggest flaws in the plan is the extent to which these draft picks and assets are spread out. If you are going to go all-out and do a major rebuild, make sure you target a draft in which you feel confident in the incoming players, and go all-out on 1 draft, or 2 tops. For whatever reason, Hinkie kept delaying and adding players who would be sitting out with injuries or staying overseas, and not taking into account that these assets decrease over time, and rookie contracts expire. Take for example this draft. Had he worked diligently last season to parlay a majority of his assets into 3 lottery picks from this draft, and drafted correctly, he could have ended up with Porzingis, Winslow, and Caley-Stein for example. There is your front-court for the next 10-15 years in one lottery. But spreading out picks, delaying for as long as possible, and then to top it off, drafting poorly, is a recipe unlikely to work. But for Hinkie, it was some job security to delay, but that is catching up with him now too.

group think is awesome especially when the party line all decide to agree.

I would rather keep an open mind.

Group think thought that MDA was an idiot with his crazy offensive ideas. I bought into it too. Now MDA looks like a bit of an underrated offensive genius.

Group think said that shooting too many threes were stupid. Now threes are flying.

Group think say lots of things but in retrospect, we end up being wrong often.

I don't like stating things as if we are absolutely sure that we know what we are talking about when there is so much that we don't know.

People judged the melo trade early while many said repeatedly that we need to see how it plays out. It played out fine.

In 3 years nobody will care that poor Nerlens Noel and Robert Covington had to be subjected to a crappy environment.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/8/2015  6:41 PM
^^^^Have to wonder if hiring Colangelo was encouraged by Adam Silver. After the 51 point loss to the Spurs reserves last night a good friend of mine who is a huge sixer fan was texting me because he is so frustrated. The Lowe article made it sound like owners and agents are frustrated and pissed off at Hinkie. Hinkie is obviously taking the same approach to this season that he has in the past and he is getting the same results. I believe the sixers have 6 players on their team that were undrafted. I know the rationale for what Hinkie is doing but he is leaving out extremely important aspects of team building. I thought
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/8/2015  6:43 PM
^^^^Have to wonder if hiring Colangelo was encouraged by Adam Silver. After the 51 point loss to the Spurs reserves last night a good friend of mine who is a huge sixer fan was texting me because he is so frustrated. The Lowe article made it sound like owners and agents are frustrated and pissed off at Hinkie. Hinkie is obviously taking the same approach to this season that he has in the past and he is getting the same results. I believe the sixers have 6 players on their team that were undrafted. I know the rationale for what Hinkie is doing but he is leaving out extremely important aspects of team building. I thought Rod Thorn did a fantastic job navigating things with the nets, both when he was turning them into a contender and when he was getting the franchise ready to be sold. I don't have the same opinion for the job Hinkie has done.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
mreinman
Posts: 37827
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/14/2010
Member: #3189

12/8/2015  7:02 PM
CrushAlot wrote:^^^^Have to wonder if hiring Colangelo was encouraged by Adam Silver. After the 51 point loss to the Spurs reserves last night a good friend of mine who is a huge sixer fan was texting me because he is so frustrated. The Lowe article made it sound like owners and agents are frustrated and pissed off at Hinkie. Hinkie is obviously taking the same approach to this season that he has in the past and he is getting the same results. I believe the sixers have 6 players on their team that were undrafted. I know the rationale for what Hinkie is doing but he is leaving out extremely important aspects of team building. I thought

well the owners are certainly pissed about what they are doing. You had to figure that Hinkie was going to try to get away with it as long as he could. It looks like that time has run out.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Knixkik
Posts: 35759
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #11
USA
12/10/2015  5:52 PM
Well according to this article, this is nearly the end of the road for Hinkie. This thing has been dubbed a failure faster than most imagined.

More details of the Philadelphia 76ers' big shake-up have emerged, and it sounds like they're done tanking
Business Insider By Scott Davis


The Philadelphia 76ers signaled a major shakeup this week when they announced the hiring of Jerry Colangelo.
Colangelo, the director of USA Basketball, was given a front-office role with the vague title "Special Advisor to the Managing General Partner and Chairman of Basketball Operations."

Nobody was quite sure what this meant for the 76ers. However, at the press conference, owner Josh Harris said Sam Hinkie, the general manager, will still have day-to-day responsibilities, and Hinkie himself sounded happy.

Still, the effects of the shake-up weren't clear. Would Hinkie still be the GM, or would he act under Colangelo, who has the league-wide connections and respect to perhaps turn the team around?

Now new details have emerged, and it doesn't sound good for Hinkie or the team's radical rebuilding plan, dubbed "The Process."

According to CBS' Ken Berger, it sounds like Hinkie's role is even more diminished than previously believed. Berger reports:

Sam Hinkie, architect of the Sixers' three-year strategy of rebuilding through scraping the bottom of the standings while collecting future draft picks like bubble-gum cards, remains the general manager in title alone. No one in the league expects Hinkie's voice to carry over Colangelo's when it comes to personnel decisions going forward. That ship has sailed, along with the needlessly complex equations that built it.

Berger also reports that while NBA commissioner Adam Silver did coordinate the meeting between Harris and Colangelo, but that it was Harris who first approached Silver about who could help dig the 76ers out of the doldrums.

Berger also dispels another widespread rumor, writing that other league owners did not push the 76ers to bring in Colangelo.

This also matches a report from The Intelligencer's Tom Moore, who quoted a source, saying (via CBS Sports), "It's clear (Hinkie) has, for all intents and purposes, been fired." Moore reported that Colangelo wouldn't take this position if he had to take orders from someone else.

ESPN's Zach Lowe appeared to think somewhat differently, however. Given the 76ers' situation — they're 1-21, without a clear franchise player, and they haven't yet turned their potential assets into actual players — they can't just stop the process on a dime. Lowe said on his podcast "The Lowe Post:"

"I don't think they're suddenly gonna try to win 40 games next year. I think that objective — this is just my educated guess, it could change — but I think that objective is still the same ... But just that the product on the court is more watchable, that we have a more realistic chance to compete every night.

And maybe that's like, take a shot on a couple of these younger free agents that could help stabilize a couple of positions of need. Even if they're not here on the exact contract that we want, or not here on a four-year minimum, or even if they'll help us win four or five more games. If they help us stabilize things, so we're not a story all the time. So we're not a laughing stock. But we're still run-of-the-mill bad — I think they got, like, one more year of that."

As mentioned, the 76ers are still a long way from finishing their rebuild. While they have some nice, young players in Jahlil Okafor, Nerlens Noel, Robert Covington, Nik Stauskas, and Joel Embiid, if he can get healthy, it's not clear if there's a permanent building block in the bunch. The 76ers could end up with several draft picks this year, but those picks haven't conveyed yet, and the 76ers would still need to draft the right players.

There's a belief that Colangelo was brought in to help the 76ers in the free-agent market because of his connections across the league. That could help, but it's fair to wonder if free agents would be willing to join the Sixers before there's proof that a turnaround is on the way. Some might, but the team may have trouble recruiting actual productive players that can quicken the rebuild.

Nonetheless, reports indicate that the 76ers' most radical part of the rebuild is over. While Hinkie did manage to get a few talented players and set the table for more, ultimately, his idea and execution were too lengthy to see through.

CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/10/2015  6:23 PM
^^^^Thanks for posting that. Here is Berger's article:
Josh Harris' office is located six city blocks from Adam Silver's, so given their mutual interest in the success of a $5 billion business, it's no surprise that they'd occasionally bump into each other and talk.

As a member of the NBA's planning committee, Harris often has formal business to conduct with the commissioner. But this business was more pressing. This was Harris, as the managing owner of the Philadelphia 76ers, realizing he had a problem on his hands.

The problem, as outlined here, was that his team was awful -- and in the view of observers around the league, getting worse. As teams go through cycles of winning and rebuilding and then doing it all over again, it's a common refrain among personnel decision-makers that you can only sell two things in the NBA: success and hope.

Harris' Sixers had neither.

The tipping point was the revelation that the team's foundational star, No. 3 pick Jahlil Okafor, had gone rogue with a series of legal transgressions -- including a much-publicized fight outside a Boston nightclub. Not that a grown, 19-year-old man needs a babysitter, but Okafor had arrived after one championship season at Duke and been dropped into a rancid dunk tank of losing, with virtually no veterans around to show him the way.

It's not clear who called whom, or exactly when, but it was around this time when Harris and Silver first spoke about how best to reroute the organization's course.

"[Harris] realized this is a tremendous asset that he has, and that it's not just about my draft picks and not just about my wins and losses," a league source familiar with the discussions told CBS Sports.

Harris and his partners, including fellow private equity titan David Blitzer, came to the conclusion that they needed what one league source described as a "course correction."

"It was him saying, 'I need help,'" the source said.


Enter Jerry Colangelo, the 76-year-old architect of USA Basketball's renaissance, former Suns owner and past chairman of the league's Board of Governors to save the day.

For Silver, I'm guessing that a team on the West Coast that's 23-0 and one on the East Coast that's 1-21 isn't what he had in mind when he reconstructed the league's collective bargaining agreement four years ago in search of competitive balance. But while the commissioner had a role in the Sixers hiring Colangelo to right the ship, how proactive Silver was has been a bit misunderstood.

Silver did not compel Harris to make the change, nor did other owners twist his arm to intervene, a person familiar with the highest levels of the talks told CBS Sports. When Harris asked for advice, Silver gave it in the form of a list of people with what one person described as "real-life experiences" to consider for the job. At the top of the list was Colangelo, who Silver has known since his first day in the NBA 23 years ago.

Silver spoke with Colangelo to gage his interest, made the introduction to Harris, and then stepped aside, league sources said. Silver is not even privy to the details of Colangelo's contract, which league sources speculate includes an ownership stake in addition to control over basketball decisions. His official title: Special Advisor to the Managing General Partner and Chairman of Basketball Operations.

Sam Hinkie, architect of the Sixers' three-year strategy of rebuilding through scraping the bottom of the standings while collecting future draft picks like bubble-gum cards, remains the general manager in title alone. No one in the league expects Hinkie's voice to carry over Colangelo's when it comes to personnel decisions going forward. That ship has sailed, along with the needlessly complex equations that built it.

So as the Sixers' tale of woe wound hopelessly around the league, the lone victory registered against the equally clueless Lakers on Dec. 1, it made its way to the six-block, one-avenue radius that separates NBA headquarters from Harris' office at Apollo Global Management. And now, there's a new pilot at the controls.After all, it's just basketball -- and the point of basketball is simply to collect good basketball players and get them to play together.

Harris, with an assist from the commissioner, finally realized that it's not rocket science.


http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/25408575/story-behind-the-sixers-much-needed-colangelo-course-correction
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
mreinman
Posts: 37827
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/14/2010
Member: #3189

12/10/2015  6:36 PM
You guys should listen to that podcast. It was Lowe interviewing JVG and it may have been one of the best interviews / bball convo's that I've ever heard.

JVG has a completely different take then that article. He does not blame hinkie and understands the process. He does not think that Colangelo will be doing much besides talking to the press. He also thinks that the NBA, owners and the agents are all full of it and if they want they can stop this tank crap by changing the rules but they chose not to.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/10/2015  6:44 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/10/2015  6:44 PM
mreinman wrote:You guys should listen to that podcast. It was Lowe interviewing JVG and it may have been one of the best interviews / bball convo's that I've ever heard.

JVG has a completely different take then that article. He does not blame hinkie and understands the process. He does not think that Colangelo will be doing much besides talking to the press. He also thinks that the NBA, owners and the agents are all full of it and if they want they can stop this tank crap by changing the rules but they chose not to.

Gottlieb ( a guy that I really like) talked a lot about Hinkie/PHilly/Colangelo yesterday. He had a very pro-Hinkie take on the situation and he knows his stuff. I do think the thought that Okafor's trouble sped up the hiring of Colangelo is accurate. One thing that I found interesting in Berger's article was that he said Harris went to Silver for suggestions on how to remedy the situation. I originally thought Silver approached Harris. I will listen to the podcast. I like both guys a lot.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/10/2015  6:46 PM
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
mreinman
Posts: 37827
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/14/2010
Member: #3189

12/10/2015  7:04 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
mreinman wrote:You guys should listen to that podcast. It was Lowe interviewing JVG and it may have been one of the best interviews / bball convo's that I've ever heard.

JVG has a completely different take then that article. He does not blame hinkie and understands the process. He does not think that Colangelo will be doing much besides talking to the press. He also thinks that the NBA, owners and the agents are all full of it and if they want they can stop this tank crap by changing the rules but they chose not to.

Gottlieb ( a guy that I really like) talked a lot about Hinkie/PHilly/Colangelo yesterday. He had a very pro-Hinkie take on the situation and he knows his stuff. I do think the thought that Okafor's trouble sped up the hiring of Colangelo is accurate. One thing that I found interesting in Berger's article was that he said Harris went to Silver for suggestions on how to remedy the situation. I originally thought Silver approached Harris. I will listen to the podcast. I like both guys a lot.

Its phenomenal! It really is. And not only about the sixers but about pace and everything else.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/10/2015  7:30 PM
mreinman wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
mreinman wrote:You guys should listen to that podcast. It was Lowe interviewing JVG and it may have been one of the best interviews / bball convo's that I've ever heard.

JVG has a completely different take then that article. He does not blame hinkie and understands the process. He does not think that Colangelo will be doing much besides talking to the press. He also thinks that the NBA, owners and the agents are all full of it and if they want they can stop this tank crap by changing the rules but they chose not to.

Gottlieb ( a guy that I really like) talked a lot about Hinkie/PHilly/Colangelo yesterday. He had a very pro-Hinkie take on the situation and he knows his stuff. I do think the thought that Okafor's trouble sped up the hiring of Colangelo is accurate. One thing that I found interesting in Berger's article was that he said Harris went to Silver for suggestions on how to remedy the situation. I originally thought Silver approached Harris. I will listen to the podcast. I like both guys a lot.

Its phenomenal! It really is. And not only about the sixers but about pace and everything else.

I listened to thirty minutes of it and then life got in the way What I heard was awesome. I will probably listen to the rest of it over the weekend. I use wifi for data on my phone so I can't listen to it in tne car.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
12/11/2015  4:07 PM
¿ △ ?
mreinman
Posts: 37827
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/14/2010
Member: #3189

12/11/2015  4:07 PM
crzymdups wrote:

tank move!

no really ... very good move

so here is what phil is thinking ....
crzymdups
Posts: 52018
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/1/2004
Member: #671
USA
12/11/2015  4:09 PM
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:

tank move!

no really ... very good move

Colangelo will be good for them. And I think Brown is a fine coach. That team is terrible, but he has borderline D-League talent competing every night. They've blown a ton of leads just because they have no guards and no depth, but they've built leads on a lot of teams. Anyway, solid move.

¿ △ ?
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
12/11/2015  6:35 PM
crzymdups wrote:
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:

tank move!

no really ... very good move

Colangelo will be good for them. And I think Brown is a fine coach. That team is terrible, but he has borderline D-League talent competing every night. They've blown a ton of leads just because they have no guards and no depth, but they've built leads on a lot of teams. Anyway, solid move.

Good signing. It probably means that the rumors that the team will be sold at the end of the season are false.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Hinkie's Sixers: Bad Plan, Bad Execution, or both?

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy