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4949
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12/29/2008  10:13 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:

[quote]Posted by mattshaw78:

It sucks for fans outside of NY and Boston. That's not my problem but I'm a sympathetic guy and I have tons of sympathy for frustrated fans throughout the US and Canada.

And dude, you gotta get out in the world. Most people absolutely HATE the Yankees, with or without our payroll. I don't feel one bit sorry for any of them. I met some really big *******s over the years, especially in the midwest cities, just for wearing my Yankees cap.

doubtful but we have no way of knowing

I already told you. I travel a lot and have heard the good and bad. Bastan isn't the only place the hates the Yankees.
I'll never trust this' team again.
AUTOADVERT
4949
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12/29/2008  10:14 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by mattshaw78:

I said this in the other thread but I have to say it hear too:

It is crazy thinking by these yankees haters out there. How many ballclubs actually pool all their revenues and dispurse it back to win games for the franchise. Is it pure jealously by yankee haters 'cause their teams don't pull all their allocated resources back into the ball club? Any fan would love their team to invest in ball players to help them win.
All these Yankee haters saying "the yankees buy their world championships" B.S. Just because the yankees sign free agents left and right doesn't mean that we bought the WS. Good example is the 2yrs that the marlins won the world series and the last world series as tampa bay could've won it all. The Marlins last year had a team payroll of like 20 million.
Those counter-examples prove nothing other than that Cash-man tried but failed to buy championships in those prior years. I'm a Yankee fan who watches nearly all the games but I'll freely admit that we *try* to buy championships.

You are totally wrong dude! You don't get it. It is a sport first of all, that has become a competitive business over the years and a market like this needs to survive in. The Yankees are nothing like the loser Knicks! The Knicks are the perfect example of what 'NOT' to do. Look at the Knicks now. What are they' about 2, 3 games above .500 LIFETIME?! The Yankees have above .500 records against every major league baseball team they ever played. If the last 32 years didn't teach you a lesson then nothing will (of course without the George's meddlings).

And where were the Yankees after the last big dynasty ended with Yogi and Mantle, before George came along? We were mediocre. Owned by CBS who didn't do a thing to restore Yankee lore. George made us matter again and has put us into the future of competitiveness.

I agree with every word you wrote but I don't see how it's connected to the statement I made that you're replying to.

If I misunderstood, then my apologies.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  10:15 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by mattshaw78:

I said this in the other thread but I have to say it hear too:

It is crazy thinking by these yankees haters out there. How many ballclubs actually pool all their revenues and dispurse it back to win games for the franchise. Is it pure jealously by yankee haters 'cause their teams don't pull all their allocated resources back into the ball club? Any fan would love their team to invest in ball players to help them win.
All these Yankee haters saying "the yankees buy their world championships" B.S. Just because the yankees sign free agents left and right doesn't mean that we bought the WS. Good example is the 2yrs that the marlins won the world series and the last world series as tampa bay could've won it all. The Marlins last year had a team payroll of like 20 million.

I am sick and tired of these Yankee haters. Stop worry about the Yanks and worry why in hell your team can't win it all half the time as the Yankees. And also ask yourself the luxury tax where the hell does it go for the other teams

Not to mention, in George's 32 years as principle owner and the millions upon millions he spent, he only was able to produce only 6 championship teams. That's about 19 %. Hardly a buy.

In a league with 30 teams on a completely level playing field, you'd expect any one team to win a championship once every 30 years or 3% of the time. By outspending everyone by more than any GM has in any sport, he increased his odds of winning a championship by 600%.


[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 5:18 PM]

And yet we only won 19% under George. 600%?!? You just proved that we don't buy them!

Yes, 600% as in a six fold increase. I don't think you follow the math because I just proved the opposite of what you thought I proved. I don't think you understand the difference between "buying championships" and "trying to buy championships." There's a world of difference between the two. The Yankees do the latter, not the former. To a lesser extent, the Mets and Red Sox do the latter as well.

You gotta admit, I had you though. Dohhh!
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  10:16 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

You know you've scratched something truthful and hurtful when people get this defensive about your statements. I'm convinced you two are incorrectly thinking that I'm blaming the Yankees though somewhere and you need to defend them against some (mis)perceived blame.

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 9:17 PM]

No, we just get sick and tired of all the jealous people in the world and we get extra pissed when some of our own come off defending these jerks. That's all.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  10:20 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by mattshaw78:

I said this in the other thread but I have to say it hear too:

It is crazy thinking by these yankees haters out there. How many ballclubs actually pool all their revenues and dispurse it back to win games for the franchise. Is it pure jealously by yankee haters 'cause their teams don't pull all their allocated resources back into the ball club? Any fan would love their team to invest in ball players to help them win.
All these Yankee haters saying "the yankees buy their world championships" B.S. Just because the yankees sign free agents left and right doesn't mean that we bought the WS. Good example is the 2yrs that the marlins won the world series and the last world series as tampa bay could've won it all. The Marlins last year had a team payroll of like 20 million.
Those counter-examples prove nothing other than that Cash-man tried but failed to buy championships in those prior years. I'm a Yankee fan who watches nearly all the games but I'll freely admit that we *try* to buy championships. It's the league's fault (not the Yankees') for having that kind of system in place but fans look like they have their heads in the sand when they won't admit what we (and to a slightly lesser extent, the Mets and Red Sox) are doing. We certainly weren't trying to buy another 3rd place finish with the $423 mil spent this off-season! What exactly besides a championship were we trying to buy? Whether we'll succeed is a separate story. This is the only sport with this degree of payroll inequity. It sucks for fans outside of NY and Boston. That's not my problem but I'm a sympathetic guy and I have tons of sympathy for frustrated fans throughout the US and Canada.

if u have so much sympathy for them then go root for another team... i swear to God you're freakin' annoying w/your constant negative talk about the franchise you supposedly support... at least islesfan knows what the hell he's talking about when he disses the Knicks... you don't even have your facts straight & you diss on them... name me 1 major market team in baseball that doesn't try to "buy their way to a championship" as you would call it... go root for the damn Royals or Pirates & then hate on the Yankees all u want... any Yankee fan that complains about their financial advantage is beyond stupid.
Chill pill time. I can't change teams as easily as perhaps you can; so that's not something I'd even consider. I agree 100% that other teams in major markets try to buy championships; in all other sports, there are salary restrictions that prevent them from being able to do that. You CAN'T expect the owner to do that on their own. I attribute no blame to the Yankees for trying to capitalize on an unfair system. I bolded this above to make it as clear as possible. Any negativity I've attributed to the Yankees for having a high payroll is a figment of your imagination.


[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 5:08 PM]

You'd still be making a big mistake for taking sides. I thought you were a stand up Yankee fan. I'm disappointed.

Sorry I do not follow what you're saying. What side do you think I'm taking? On what issue? How am I not a stand up Yankee fan? What is a "stand up" fan anyway? I'm usually sitting down when I watch and root for the Yankees. You've totally confused me.

Well BONN, what else am I supposed to think of this. I mean feeling bad for bastan? Do the Celtic fans feel sorry for our Knicks. After all, they have the winningest record against the Knicks through the years. We aren't even close and they abused us for many of those championships. No, no, no. I don't feel one damn bit sorry for any of them. They either respect us or nothing.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  10:25 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by GKFv2:

Calling Steinbrenner's ownership a failure is a joke. Most teams can't even win 1 title in 85 years(Red Sox) or 1 in 100(Cubs). Yankees won 6 in his 32 years. Unless you think he should have won every year he was owner, I'd say that's a pretty damn good number of titles for an owner.

Good one G! Hey BONN, how do you explain the scrubs????????? Did we do that too? How do you explain the white sux? Did we do them wrong to??? And how bout those red sux??? Don't tell me that we robbed them too of more w.s. than us, by taking the Babe away. The guy they themselves wanted to give to us? You think I feel sorry for any of those losers?
I'm not sure what you're asking me to explain or why you're asking me to explain it. Can you re-ask your question? There are plenty of bad, poorly run teams in this sport and any other sport. Is that all you were asking about?



[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 10:27 PM]

Am I crazy BONN, or did you or did you not speak out against the Yankees spending the money they spent? Did you or did you not' say that you felt sorry for other cities?? I don't understand the confusion about what I have been saying?

And can someone (whoever did it) please hit the return button on your post to shorten the left to right page? Thanks! (it was probably me)

I'll never trust this' team again.
Bonn1997
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12/29/2008  10:27 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by mattshaw78:

I said this in the other thread but I have to say it hear too:

It is crazy thinking by these yankees haters out there. How many ballclubs actually pool all their revenues and dispurse it back to win games for the franchise. Is it pure jealously by yankee haters 'cause their teams don't pull all their allocated resources back into the ball club? Any fan would love their team to invest in ball players to help them win.
All these Yankee haters saying "the yankees buy their world championships" B.S. Just because the yankees sign free agents left and right doesn't mean that we bought the WS. Good example is the 2yrs that the marlins won the world series and the last world series as tampa bay could've won it all. The Marlins last year had a team payroll of like 20 million.
Those counter-examples prove nothing other than that Cash-man tried but failed to buy championships in those prior years. I'm a Yankee fan who watches nearly all the games but I'll freely admit that we *try* to buy championships. It's the league's fault (not the Yankees') for having that kind of system in place but fans look like they have their heads in the sand when they won't admit what we (and to a slightly lesser extent, the Mets and Red Sox) are doing. We certainly weren't trying to buy another 3rd place finish with the $423 mil spent this off-season! What exactly besides a championship were we trying to buy? Whether we'll succeed is a separate story. This is the only sport with this degree of payroll inequity. It sucks for fans outside of NY and Boston. That's not my problem but I'm a sympathetic guy and I have tons of sympathy for frustrated fans throughout the US and Canada.

if u have so much sympathy for them then go root for another team... i swear to God you're freakin' annoying w/your constant negative talk about the franchise you supposedly support... at least islesfan knows what the hell he's talking about when he disses the Knicks... you don't even have your facts straight & you diss on them... name me 1 major market team in baseball that doesn't try to "buy their way to a championship" as you would call it... go root for the damn Royals or Pirates & then hate on the Yankees all u want... any Yankee fan that complains about their financial advantage is beyond stupid.
Chill pill time. I can't change teams as easily as perhaps you can; so that's not something I'd even consider. I agree 100% that other teams in major markets try to buy championships; in all other sports, there are salary restrictions that prevent them from being able to do that. You CAN'T expect the owner to do that on their own. I attribute no blame to the Yankees for trying to capitalize on an unfair system. I bolded this above to make it as clear as possible. Any negativity I've attributed to the Yankees for having a high payroll is a figment of your imagination.


[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 5:08 PM]

You'd still be making a big mistake for taking sides. I thought you were a stand up Yankee fan. I'm disappointed.

Sorry I do not follow what you're saying. What side do you think I'm taking? On what issue? How am I not a stand up Yankee fan? What is a "stand up" fan anyway? I'm usually sitting down when I watch and root for the Yankees. You've totally confused me.

Well BONN, what else am I supposed to think of this. I mean feeling bad for bastan? Do the Celtic fans feel sorry for our Knicks. After all, they have the winningest record against the Knicks through the years. We aren't even close and they abused us for many of those championships. No, no, no. I don't feel one damn bit sorry for any of them. They either respect us or nothing.
I don't feel bad for Boston either. I was talking about small market teams.

Bonn1997
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12/29/2008  10:30 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by GKFv2:

Calling Steinbrenner's ownership a failure is a joke. Most teams can't even win 1 title in 85 years(Red Sox) or 1 in 100(Cubs). Yankees won 6 in his 32 years. Unless you think he should have won every year he was owner, I'd say that's a pretty damn good number of titles for an owner.

Good one G! Hey BONN, how do you explain the scrubs????????? Did we do that too? How do you explain the white sux? Did we do them wrong to??? And how bout those red sux??? Don't tell me that we robbed them too of more w.s. than us, by taking the Babe away. The guy they themselves wanted to give to us? You think I feel sorry for any of those losers?
I'm not sure what you're asking me to explain or why you're asking me to explain it. Can you re-ask your question? There are plenty of bad, poorly run teams in this sport and any other sport. Is that all you were asking about?



[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-26-2008 10:27 PM]

Am I crazy BONN, or did you or did you not speak out against the Yankees spending the money they spent? Did you or did you not' say that you felt sorry for other cities?? I don't understand the confusion about what I have been saying?

And can someone (whoever did it) please hit the return button on your post to shorten the left to right page? Thanks! (it was probably me)
I don't disapprove of the Yankees spending money. They're following the league's rules. I do feel bad for the fans of teams that can't compete, though. It's the league's job, not the Yankees, to create a level or at least fairly level playing field.
4949
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12/29/2008  10:46 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:

In a league with 30 teams on a completely level playing field, you'd expect any one team to win a championship once every 30 years or 3% of the time.

that's like the classic gambler's fallacy logic at work there.

[Edited by - TMS on 12-26-2008 2:34 PM]
Except it isn't

Tell that to Cubs fans.

I know a couple of bookies that would love you as a client.
Right; the point is that it's NOT a level playing field and the one cchampionship in thirty statement does not apply. I don't think you read the entire discussion between me and 4949. It looks like you (and TMS) joined in at the point where you quoted me and are misunderstanding the (bolded) premise of my statement. All I'd tell Cubs' fans is that the premise of my conditional statement is not met. Are you disagreeing with that? If not, then what's your point?

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-27-2008 09:01 AM]

Dude, you are clearly defending chicago and the scrubs. Your being too kind to the league. That's not the way it works! This game is not just a sport anymore. And it certainly hasn't been a very clean one either with the steroids.

I look at the red sux, the white sux, and the scrubs. All three constituted 189 years combined without a w.s., until the red sux won it finally. And then the white sux won it. And the scrubs nearly made it to the w.s., needing just three more outs to do it. All within four years of each other. I find it strange that all three of those teams suddenly were all w.s. bound, after 189 years and in this era of steroids.

The point being, if you want to talk level playing field, then Selig and the league should cough up the lies and cheating that has been going on for the last ten to twelve years or so, rather than everyone telling our franchise that we are buying w.s. and basically that we are bullies of the league. Bull ****!!!

This Mitchell character goes out and finds dirt on the majority both NY teams, when everyone knows this Mitchell character is very much a part of the bastan red sux organization.

So what you say about being fair to the league is a little bigotry to me, seeing what has been going on all these years behind closed doors and behind players backs, while being stabbed in the ass with a needle. This just insults me to no end. I grow very tired of this double edged sword in baseball and using the Yankees to blame for everything wrong with it.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:01 PM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by 4949:

I wonder how BONN would explain how we won the first 20 world series also?

Ever hear of Arnold Johnson? That should explain the 2 WS titles in the 60s.

And your point is? Yeah, I know who he is. The chicagoan who owned the Phil. A's, who sent us Terry, Maris, Shantz, Lopez, Boyer and Ditmer to join forces with our Mantle and Yogi and the rest. And he didn't pay mega bucks to do it either. And they weren't exactly huge names we got either. It was the chemistry they brought to the Yankees, to that fabulous dynasty (one of them) for the magical decade ride. We just didn't know that Roger would have a greater season then Mantle and The Babe in 61'. I was born in between two of those Yankee world series championships, so I knew early on that I was destined to be a Yankee.

(This should score even more points with TMS).
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:08 PM
Posted by jaydh:

It's funny because there is an article on RealGM about how the league was not fair for a very long time and that only big market teams had a chance because of their spending and that small market teams had less than a 5% chance. Supposedly something was done about this in 2000.

yeah, when I see teams like Florida winning not only once, but twice, this math just doesn't make any sense at all. I lay in bed at nights, just before I close my eyes for the big dream and I ask myself 'Philadelphia must of paid dearly for that w.s. last year'. A big market, I'd say they paid top dollar for it. Secretly outspending the Yankees for sure.

And weren't the scrubs, sux and sux poor teams (cities) also. I wonder how they out bought the Yankees for their w.s.? I'm baffled and quite shocked and surprised and disappointed as to how they paid without anyone knowing? And knowing that it takes 'buying' the w.s. series nowadays. I mean really!!
I'll never trust this' team again.
TMS
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12/29/2008  11:22 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by 4949:

I wonder how BONN would explain how we won the first 20 world series also?

Ever hear of Arnold Johnson? That should explain the 2 WS titles in the 60s.

And your point is? Yeah, I know who he is. The chicagoan who owned the Phil. A's, who sent us Terry, Maris, Shantz, Lopez, Boyer and Ditmer to join forces with our Mantle and Yogi and the rest. And he didn't pay mega bucks to do it either. And they weren't exactly huge names we got either. It was the chemistry they brought to the Yankees, to that fabulous dynasty (one of them) for the magical decade ride. We just didn't know that Roger would have a greater season then Mantle and The Babe in 61'. I was born in between two of those Yankee world series championships, so I knew early on that I was destined to be a Yankee.

(This should score even more points with TMS).

man, i wish i had been able to see Maris & Mantle battling for the home run record in '61... that musta been awesome.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:35 PM
Posted by TMS:

& i repeat:

so the Boston Red Sox had been playing on an uneven playing field for 86 years before they finally won a championship? they play in probably the second largest sports market in baseball... what's their excuse?

Yeah, and for gosh sakes, we have two (count em' two) baseball teams to support! We used to have three and two of them left town. I'm beginning to realize that people are upset because we have a bigger city then everyone else. Well' if that's the case, then that's too bad, so sad and it ain't ever going away! Hell, we even have two football teams and basically three hockey teams and soon we may have three basketball teams in the area to support.

I mean bastan doesn't even have a local football team. And what about chicago? They been bitching for years, acting like a small market and calling itself the worlds greatest city since the 1920's. Detroit? That place is a simply a sad economic city (and state - MI) and they have no right to complain. And what's Philly looking silly's excuse? And bastan has the Celtics. And L.A. has the Lakers?? I mean come on! L.A. with their' market, they can't put it together in baseball? Give me a break!

Now for places like Houston, Kansas, Dallas, Colorado, etc., etc., etc. these and other cities are surrounded by plains, desert and/or mountains! I mean if they can't get more people to move there, then is that our fault???????

A lot of young people don't realize that major leagues sports used to be New York, Detroit, Philadelphia, chicago, bastan, Baltimore, Cleveland, and eventually got to Milwaukee, L.A., S.F., Oakland and then all the other itty bitty markets out in the middle of nowhere wanted to be big. That's the problem with ML Sports. It's too damn big. A team like the Yankees aren't just competing against a dozen markets. Now it's against 30 or more markets. it's now wonder they have to spend so much money.

And I'll tell you all one more thing. If a cap is put on baseball also, then the little markets will win. Just ask the Knicks, or Rangers, or even the Jets. I can't give any excuses for the Mets, other than being the second baseball team in NYC and kicked around everyday. But lets put this into perspective, if any of us are going to make a legit point about the Yankees buying anything.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:38 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

That was fun. 'Til next time.

Chicken! Come back here!
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:41 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

I'm choosing not to continue responding to distortions of or outright lies about my views. Sorry.

Your not a real Yankee fan. You'll throw them under the bus, to help some poor defenseless team win it all. Again, you want to talk morality, then start talking about the steroids!
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:42 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by Bonn1997:

And I repeat
All those "counter"-examples can be explained by the fact that money spent is merely one of MANY factors that determine how many games a team wins. Why is it that you always come up with counter examples that don't counter anything I've ever said?
Explain to me where you got confused with this answer. When I said "many factors" did you make the incorrect inference that all the factors somehow related to an unlevel playing field? Maybe the Red Sox spent money but had bad decision-making or bad luck or whatever. The fact that you're even asking the question indicates that you still think I'm saying "money is the only factor that impacts wins."

Now why would anybody think that?
By outspending everyone by more than any GM has in any sport, he increased his odds of winning a championship by 600%.

Oh yeah, that's why.

You're horrible at this Bonn, your argument is all over the place and it keeps changing to suit your needs.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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12/29/2008  11:51 PM
Oh' and while we're at it, let's bring Manny in, just to antagonize BONN.
I'll never trust this' team again.
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12/30/2008  3:27 AM
Bonn, here's an example of the type of idiotic hatred that small market fans have for the Yankees' franchise... this is what you're wasting your time lending your sympathy towards:

http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/36767824.html?elr=KArksi8cyaiUqCP:iUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aULPQL7PQLanchO7DiU
Beauty of this insanity would be Yanks' failure

By PATRICK REUSSE, (Minneapolis) Star Tribune

Last update: December 26, 2008 - 9:56 PM

The New York Yankees have gone eight seasons without winning a World Series and five years without playing in one. Their streak of playoff seasons ended at 13 last fall.

The Yankees' response has been to guarantee $423.5 million over the next eight years to three players: first baseman Mark Teixeira and pitchers CC Sabathia and A.J. Burnett.

And the response to this has been panic -- with even the huge-spending Boston Red Sox joining the woe-are-we cacophony.

There also have been the e-mailers and blog respondents declaring they are officially finished with baseball until a salary cap is imposed to create equitable competition. These folks are either bluffing, or they are football fans interested in taking a shot at the grand old game.

Mark me down as a hardball hardcore who has been enjoying the Yankees' desperation. From here, it's knee-slapping humor to discover that the next generation of Steinbrenners might be even wackier than The Boss when it comes to burning money.

The Yankees' latest dynasty was for the eight seasons from 1996 through 2003. They played in six World Series and won four.

Gene Michael created the foundation for this in the early '90s when he was in full charge of the baseball operation. That's because Steinbrenner was banned for 2 1/2 years because of his underhanded dealings with Dave Winfield.

Michael changed the philosophy to keeping the Yankees' best prospects, and building the team in the Bronx around pitching rather than bombing.

The Boss was back in 1993 and Michael became an adviser, but developing players and spending the big bucks on pitchers stuck as the approach for several years.

There were exceptions, such as making the Chuck Knoblauch trade with the Twins in 1998, but it wasn't until 2002 that Steinbrenner returned fully to his old ways.

He signed Jason Giambi away from the Oakland A's, then the Yankees' top challenger in the American League. Giambi departed after last season, with a $5 million buyout that left his résumé in New York at $120 million received, no championships and a steroids scandal.

Two years after Giambi, George pushed aside Boston and acquired Alex Rodriguez from Texas. That move coincides with the Yankees avoiding the World Series for five years.

Rodriguez collected $120 million for those five seasons, with $247 million guaranteed over nine more years -- until the summer he turns 42.

The chagrin recently expressed by John Henry, a Red Sox owner, was based on the Yankees swooping in to sign Teixeira, another position player sought by Boston.

Henry should remember what happened the last time the Yankees tried this. Then, he would be laughing, not complaining.

The Red Sox trailed the Yankees 26-0 in World Series victories in the 84 played from 1919 through 2003. Then, New York stole A-Rod, and Boston leads 2-0 in World Series victories since then.

Teixeira is a nice hitter, but having a gaudy lineup card hasn't been the Yankees' problem. It has been pitching -- thin in starters and mediocre relief in front of closer Mariano Rivera.

That's why the Yankees spent enormous millions for Sabathia and Burnett, but we have to ask:

Is Sabathia going to outdo the 20-9 with a 3.37 ERA of retired ace Mike Mussina? And will Burnett, with 65 missed starts from 2003 through 2007, retain a healthy right arm for a second full season in a row?

There's a myth floating around that the Yankees' payroll will be lower in 2009 because of all the salaries that came off the books. So far, they have added $67.3 million for 2009 with Teixeira, Sabathia, Burnett and Nick Swisher, and removed $82 million (when you include buyouts for Giambi and Carl Pavano).

A-Rod and Robinson Cano are due a combined $8 million in raises, putting the Yankees at $189 million for 15 players.

Throw in arbitration awards and the bodies needed for the rest of the roster, and surpassing last season's $222 million should not be a problem for Hank and Hal, George's wacky offspring.


gee, i suppose the Yankees aren't spending the big bucks now on pitching like this "journalist" was complementing them for doing in years past, & are now back to the irresponsible "Steinbrenner" ways of the mid 80s to early 90s when they spent big bucks on guys like Danny Tartabull & trading promising prospects away for past their prime players like Ken Phelps? i guess signing up the top 2 pitching free agents in baseball & the best positional player free agent on the market who's 29 years old & in his prime is just another in a long line of nonsensical moves that point to the Steinbrenners' "wacky waste spending of their money" that this writer finds so hilarious? i guess the Yankees have no interest in building up their young talent now after refusing to trade away homegrown talent like Chien Ming Wang, Robinson Cano, Joba Chamberlain, Phil Hughes, Ian Kennedy & Melky Cabrera in recent years? Bonn, this is the type of ridiculous anti-Yankee bias that you have sympathy for???

this writer points to the fact that the Yankees haven't won a WS in 8 years & haven't played in in the past 5... last time i checked the Minnesota Twins haven't played in the WS in 17 years & they're owned by the richest owner in baseball, Carl Pohlad, a man whose net worth according to Forbes magazine is $3.1 billion dollars, just about $2 billion more than the NY Yankees' owner's estimated net worth, George Steinbrenner.

(http://www.startribune.com/business/16332206.html)

now shouldn't this writer be writing stories about how his own cheapskate owner isn't investing some of those dollars into his own franchise the way the Steinbrenner's do every year in an effort to win rather than trashing the most successful franchise in sports history for conducting a business model that has vaulted their franchise to the most valuable in all of sports? of course not, because telling it like it is wouldn't cater to the idiots out there that choose to focus their frustration & their anger over their own teams' failures onto the big bad Yankees for conducting "unfair business practices" on uneven playing fields instead. Twins fans like this are happy to have their franchise collect luxury tax payments from the Yankees every year to help finance their team & yet they get on the Yankees' case for spending their own money to finance theirs??? what a joke!

if u ask me, it's this sort of garbage from completely clueless sports writers & the fact that there are a number of equally clueless morons out there who actually buy into this stuff that qualifies as the knee-slapping humor... this guy calls himself a "hardball hardcore"... gimme a break... "knuckleheaded idiot" is more like it.

[Edited by - TMS on 12-30-2008 02:49 AM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
TMS
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12/30/2008  4:04 AM
here's some more sour grapes from an LA beat writer... i wonder what this guy's stance will be when the Dodgers spend $60 mil to sign Manny in a few weeks? or what it was when the Angels spent $210 mil to sign Vlad, Torii Hunter & Gary Matthews Jr. to free agent contracts?

http://www.dailynews.com/sports/ci_11322859
Yankees' spending spree is tough to stomach
By Tom Hoffarth, Columnist
Updated: 12/27/2008 10:42:45 PM PST

Hank Steinbrenner has gloriously morphed into the horribly obese man from the "Monty Python" movie who enters the restaurant, orders everything from the menu, expels it in the most volatile way, and then gluttons ahead for more.

He's become so full of himself, and the New York Yankees' tradition of overspending simply because it somehow can, that he never becomes full.

And it doesn't matter that the other patrons in the place are completely and absolutely repulsed. And all they do is get, uh, spat upon.

He's scanned the menu, chuckling at those items listed as "market price," and merely points to the CC Sabathia stuffed lobster, the A.J. Burnett beluga caviar, after a pause to belch, the Mark Teixeira tri-tip.

He's extracted the Citicorp credit card from his wallet and, with no bailout plan in mind, prepares to pay the tab when the waiter comes by with the tiniest of desserts.

C'mon, taste the Manny Ramirez raspberry tart.

We dare ya.

We double-dog dare ya.

It's such an obscenely delightful, squeamishly selfish scene, watching Steinbrenner 2.0 operate through this baseball offseason minefield just like his crusty old man. A real chip off the old blockhead. Buying bullishly while the rest of the owners find their rosters more and more bare.

It's the Yankee tradition. We come to accept it as a fact of life. Like it or not. Sorta.

Except this time around, when more of the Yankees' fan base is at a point to where it has to decide whether to use that last $20 bill on the electric bill or a supply of Swanson TV dinners, the stench off this particular Steinbrenner dirty, sexy money holiday spending spree comes off far more putrid.

Obnoxious doesn't begin to cover it. Toxic is closer to the point. And, bottom line, it's simply a poor reflection of this free-market, non-salary cap enterprise exercise that it appears as if a backlash is coming around the corner.

George Costanza wouldn't even allow such self-indulgence if he was still around. Maybe not even Papa George either.

They've already squeezed public funding to squat on a public baseball field next to the old Yankee Stadium so they could construct their own new, improved, income-generating palace. It pales in comparison to the Dodgers' ownership, the McCourt family, spending money on building new needed baseball fields around Los Angeles while refurbishing the existing Dodger Stadium.

Now, spending eTrade money as if they're oblivious to the world around them, the Yankees' prodigious portfolio continues to represent all that's wrong with the American deflated economy at this critical point in time.

We hate it when they Boras with the details, but this is a franchise that has tied up more in five players - those three above, added to the two highest-paid employees in the game with Alex Rodriguez and Derek Jeter - than some owners put out for the original cost of their franchise, plus their current 25-man roster budget.

It shows no sense of responsibility to its customers, acting as if the outside world has no impact on what's going on its own solar system.

And the beauty of all this is - there's absolutely no guarantee that any of this will bring the Yankees a world championship, let alone an American League wild-card spot.

Not with the Boston Red Sox looming nearby as the second-best spenders in the arms' race somewhat keeping pace but acting a little less obnoxious about it. (OH PUH-LEASE!!!) And then there's those pesky reigning AL champion Tampa Bay Non-Devil Rays, the Walmart of baseball who has figured out that what makes more sense is a smart manager, a group of young hungry talent and an ugly domed ballpark that not even the St. Petersburg city zoo would want to call home.

So we squirm and watch, holding our breath as well as our noses, as this Steinbrenner offspring continues to blindly devour everything carted out of the kitchen, oblivious to the luxury tax assessed so far, but amusing us just the same as the crumbs collect on his chin and the buttons begin to pop off his shirt from the expanding girth.

Bully for you.

The waiter stands off to the side, trembling a bit as he holds up the small cracker on the silver platter - the ManRam after-dinner mint - acting as if he's holding a stick of dynamite.

Can't eat another bite?

C'mon, it's wafer thin.

Go ahead, stammerin' Hank, we'll put it on your tongue.

Bud Selig is standing by with a mop. And an extra bucket.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bonn1997
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12/30/2008  9:21 AM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by Bonn1997:

I'm choosing not to continue responding to distortions of or outright lies about my views. Sorry.

Your not a real Yankee fan. You'll throw them under the bus, to help some poor defenseless team win it all. Again, you want to talk morality, then start talking about the steroids!
Those are all figments of your imagination

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 12-30-2008 09:21 AM]
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