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Game Thread: Knicks travel to Houston; 1/3/14 8:00 PM ET
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anrst
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1/3/2014  10:45 PM
i knew i shoulda gone to sleep ... now im angry... and for what
AUTOADVERT
holfresh
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1/3/2014  10:45 PM
But Beno is just as bad, as the PG you should hold the ball with 17 sec left...Instead of passing it to JR...
VDesai
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1/3/2014  10:46 PM
If you want to re-set as soon as you get the rebound fine.

But what JR ended up with was a wide open look that you never get with the game on the line. Yes it was a 3, but he a complete look at the basket with no one around him. Thats generally a high percentage shot and a look you dont get when you play iso ball down the stretch. I think you have to take that shot.
blkexec
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1/3/2014  10:46 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
MS wrote:Why the **** is JR in the game. 1-7 from downtown and he decides to shoot another one. Re-post on your instagram. The dude is a huge minus every game.

So many fails for this team


Agree. Cutting Chris had a positive impact on the team. Sitting jr for any reason, poor play, social media mishaps etc. Shump is back, Tim is a great spark off the bench. Send the message.

Must be an under the table aggreement between JR and Knick management.....I'm sure his brother was part of that.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
OasisBU
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1/3/2014  10:46 PM
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
VDesai
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1/3/2014  10:48 PM
OasisBU wrote:
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

Yeah but he's a shooter. You always think you're gonna make your next shot. Especially when you get a look like that. Last year he's making that shot every time.
Vmart
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1/3/2014  10:50 PM
This is the second time a Knicks player has shot the ball when it would have been wise to hold the ball and milk the clock.
holfresh
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1/3/2014  10:51 PM
VDesai wrote:
OasisBU wrote:
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

Yeah but he's a shooter. You always think you're gonna make your next shot. Especially when you get a look like that. Last year he's making that shot every time.

He can't take that shot at that time...JR was the guy that went nuts when Bargs did the same thing...
VDesai
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1/3/2014  10:53 PM
Vmart wrote:This is the second time a Knicks player has shot the ball when it would have been wise to hold the ball and milk the clock.

COMPLETELY different situation. If you are already winning the ball game, you hold the ball, milk the clock and make them foul you. When the game is tied you have to take the lead. JR had a wide open. You will not get a better look than that by running the clock down and playing one on one. You will get a much worse shot and reduce your probabability of winning. You make a wide open 3 there and you're playing from the lead and they probably won't catch.

I think you've gotta take that shot. More often than not coaches play for one tough shot down the stretch with some kind of an iso instead of trying to find a free shot in the flow of the offense, and they almost always end up with some difficult low percentage shot.
GustavBahler
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1/3/2014  10:53 PM
Until we have set plays with seconds left in the game that involve more than just giving the ball to Melo and everyone else just standing around looking at him, this is going to be the result more often than not. Pisses me off that a pro team can't do something that a JV squad knows how to do.
anrst
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1/3/2014  10:54 PM
JR is not a shooter.

If you don't ever make shots, you can't assume that role anymore.

take a seat, or go back to playing in china or wherever.
VDesai
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1/3/2014  10:54 PM
holfresh wrote:
VDesai wrote:
OasisBU wrote:
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

Yeah but he's a shooter. You always think you're gonna make your next shot. Especially when you get a look like that. Last year he's making that shot every time.

He can't take that shot at that time...JR was the guy that went nuts when Bargs did the same thing...


Totally different when you have the lead and the game is over vs. when the game is tied and you need to take the lead. This isn't the same situation at all.
ToddTT
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1/3/2014  10:55 PM
You don't take that shot.

Double when your name is JR and you've been struggling since last season.

Oh good lord... https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XkmGrX7O0lQ
VDesai
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1/3/2014  10:57 PM
Its a simple concept - wide open shots have a higher probability of going on. Its easier to play with the lead with <24 left than to take a low percentage iso shot which likely miss, after which you've gotta hang with a team for 5 mins on the road in OT. If I'm in that spot I want that shot every time because its not easy to get an open look in that situation while the game is tied.

If you've got a lead, sure, milk it. But if you need to take a lead you have to take an open shot!

In terms of not wanting JR to take it- well if you don't want him taking shots down the stretch than why have him on the floor at all?
Clean
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1/3/2014  10:58 PM
VDesai wrote:
holfresh wrote:
VDesai wrote:
OasisBU wrote:
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

Yeah but he's a shooter. You always think you're gonna make your next shot. Especially when you get a look like that. Last year he's making that shot every time.

He can't take that shot at that time...JR was the guy that went nuts when Bargs did the same thing...


Totally different when you have the lead and the game is over vs. when the game is tied and you need to take the lead. This isn't the same situation at all.

Worst case in not shooting the ball is overtime. Worst case in taking the shot JR did is we lose. I am failing to see your logic in why that was the right shot to take.
holfresh
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1/3/2014  10:59 PM
You can't give the other team a chance to win the game in regulation when u can prevent it...Simple..
CrushAlot
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1/3/2014  11:00 PM
VDesai wrote:Its a simple concept - wide open shots have a higher probability of going on. Its easier to play with the lead with <24 left than to take a low percentage iso shot which likely miss, after which you've gotta hang with a team for 5 mins on the road in OT. If I'm in that spot I want that shot every time because its not easy to get an open look in that situation while the game is tied.

If you've got a lead, sure, milk it. But if you need to take a lead you have to take an open shot!

In terms of not wanting JR to take it- well if you don't want him taking shots down the stretch than why have him on the floor at all?

The rockets were in the penalty. You run the clock down, try to draw a foul or hit a shot. Worse case scenario is o t

I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
VDesai
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1/3/2014  11:01 PM
Clean wrote:
VDesai wrote:
holfresh wrote:
VDesai wrote:
OasisBU wrote:
VDesai wrote:
anrst wrote:
VDesai wrote:Guys I really don't get all the hate on the JR shot. You can hold the ball and never get that wide open look. If you have a wide open look you take it so you can get the lead. Sorry, but I doubt we would've gotten a look that good after an ISO.

hold it for last shot ... best case you win... worst case it's ot

OR you have a wide open look at the basket which leaves you with the highest probability of taking the lead. More often than not you don't get a better look than that.

Agreed but he was 1-6 or something like that when he took the shot. He was ice cold. Not the time to be rolling the dice like that.

Yeah but he's a shooter. You always think you're gonna make your next shot. Especially when you get a look like that. Last year he's making that shot every time.

He can't take that shot at that time...JR was the guy that went nuts when Bargs did the same thing...


Totally different when you have the lead and the game is over vs. when the game is tied and you need to take the lead. This isn't the same situation at all.

Worst case in not shooting the ball is overtime. Worst case in taking the shot JR did is we lose. I am failing to see your logic in why that was the right shot to take.

What about the best case where you make the open shot - which is the highest percentage play.

This is simple- would you rather have an open 3 or would you rather burn off 13 seconds doing nothing and use the last 5 to go one on one and take a contested shot? Because the latter is what ends up happening most of the time, and most of the time that doesn't work. You spend your entire offense lookign for an open shot and when one presents itself like that you take it.

The highest probability of winning to me comes from getting an open shot and then defending the lead from 15 seconds rather than try the iso ball and have to win in overtime.

I don't hate the shot- I hate that he missed, but that was a friggin great look at the basket.
VDesai
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1/3/2014  11:02 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
VDesai wrote:Its a simple concept - wide open shots have a higher probability of going on. Its easier to play with the lead with <24 left than to take a low percentage iso shot which likely miss, after which you've gotta hang with a team for 5 mins on the road in OT. If I'm in that spot I want that shot every time because its not easy to get an open look in that situation while the game is tied.

If you've got a lead, sure, milk it. But if you need to take a lead you have to take an open shot!

In terms of not wanting JR to take it- well if you don't want him taking shots down the stretch than why have him on the floor at all?

The rockets were in the penalty. You run the clock down, try to draw a foul or hit a shot. Worse case scenario is o t

But having the ability to take an open shot greatly increases your probability of winning the game then and there. Why do I want to weight my probability to OT when I can win the ball game with an open look.
VDesai
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1/3/2014  11:03 PM
Anyway I can't make my argument any differently- I really don't hate that shot by JR. If he makes that open look- the way that he generally did last year, we would've have won this game without any doubt in my mind.
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