Nothing he said was out of hate, or was hateful in tone. Dude is calling it like he sees it.

We are not the 1997 San Antonio Spurs. Not even close.

Splat wrote:

misterearl wrote:hate, despair and videotape highlights

jrodmc - sometimes you gotta cry to keep from laughing. We have witnessed Hall of Fame coaches, a Hall of Fame General Manager and a handful of players (who are playing significant rotational minutes) spin through the revolving door at The Garden of Good and Terrible on Seventh Avenue. Of course, our first round selection could be an exact replica of Kareem Abdul Jabbar and the free agents step in ready to enforce their will in the locker room from day one. Langston Galloway develops a "fall back baby" jumper and reminds old school followers of Dick Barnett.

It could happen.

Please do not confuse an unflinching critique for hate. Far from it. We desperately want Uncle Phil to get it right. Unfortunately, as Splat eloquently has explained, there is a reason why Lenny Wilkens, Larry Brown, Donnie Walsh and Glen Grunwald are no longer here. There is a reason why we have no front office continuity, and as a result we have more players wearing other uniforms than any NBA franchise.

It's not about starting over or big egos. They all have outsized egos. The issue is whether any self-respecting executive can work under James Dolan. Period. If $60M is not enough loot to hold Uncle Phil's attention in New York for five years, what happens next?

We all live in an Orange and Blue Submarine.

Earl, as you say, it is not that Phil was totally the wrong choice that is the whole problem here. The re-set button on poor managerial practices does not get activated every time a new GM or coach is hired. The institutional deficit Phil inherited was bad enough, but he brought his own baggage which has not helped one bit.

Big egos are not the issue. Everyone would love a superstar veteran in his prime and would not care if their outsized ego made them a despicable person on a personal level if that resulted in driving the team to achieve championship level results.

The reason focusing on character traits and personality defects matters so much is that when they override your strengths they pull you down. Frankly, I wouldn't have cared so much that Melo is a self-absorbed douchebag if he actually was a leader who got results. But he's merely a volume scorer and otherwise a crap basketball player.

All the gerbils running around yelling hater! can't deal with the psychological profiling, yet they still fail to correlate the results to the person.

Phil's baggage is hubris. I identified early on and I was spot on. He overestimates his influence on the coach and players. He thinks his "system" trumps good GM personnel skills. Phil is totally out of his league when it comes to cutting deals. He's truly a newb with an inflated sense of himself.

He brought this hubris and sold it to Dolan who loves spending on big splashes. No metrics, no analytics drive this organization, but ad hoc band-aid deals meant to appease the gullible public.

Phil's ego unto itself is not the issue. But his vanity negates the value of a powerful will. Vanity clouds personal self-evaluation and leads one to believe their abilities are greater than they actually are.

Phil drank his own kool-aid. His belief he would zen the organization into shape made him arrogant. He actually thought he could compromise himself with Dolan, collect the big check and still keep his integrity. He does not look good at this point.

When you do business with hustlers you either get hustled or become a hustler. Phil joined forces with Dolan because he was willing to turn a blind eye to the reality of the situation. He deluded himself into thinking he was a force that would reform this dysfunctional institution. That's hubris. And it is appallingly short-sighted for such a smart man.

It is why I say he sold out. He's too smart not to know it could turn into a complete clusterfuk getting into bed with Dolan, but he did it anyway. His vanity and greed overruled his better judgment. Phil should have never gotten involved. He is ill-equipped for the job and totally compromised himself.

This might be the most bipolar post in the history of the UK.

You know Nietchze went bstshit crazy writing ish like this, right?

Phil's ego's not the issue, but Phil's vanity and hubris is.
Big egos are not the issue, but focusing on character traits and personality defects are.
A post on pychological profiling from someone who can't deal with psychological profiling.

Dude, did you shread a theasaurus and mix it with the rocks in your crack pipe?

How did you come by all this insider information regarding the inner thoughtlife of Phil Jackson:

Phil joined forces with Dolan because he was willing to turn a blind eye to the reality of the situation.

Priceless.

I would love to see someone provide cogent comments on a mind reading exercise like this, Mr. Spock.

Splat wrote:

misterearl wrote:hate, despair and videotape highlights

jrodmc - sometimes you gotta cry to keep from laughing. We have witnessed Hall of Fame coaches, a Hall of Fame General Manager and a handful of players (who are playing significant rotational minutes) spin through the revolving door at The Garden of Good and Terrible on Seventh Avenue. Of course, our first round selection could be an exact replica of Kareem Abdul Jabbar and the free agents step in ready to enforce their will in the locker room from day one. Langston Galloway develops a "fall back baby" jumper and reminds old school followers of Dick Barnett.

It could happen.

Please do not confuse an unflinching critique for hate. Far from it. We desperately want Uncle Phil to get it right. Unfortunately, as Splat eloquently has explained, there is a reason why Lenny Wilkens, Larry Brown, Donnie Walsh and Glen Grunwald are no longer here. There is a reason why we have no front office continuity, and as a result we have more players wearing other uniforms than any NBA franchise.

It's not about starting over or big egos. They all have outsized egos. The issue is whether any self-respecting executive can work under James Dolan. Period. If $60M is not enough loot to hold Uncle Phil's attention in New York for five years, what happens next?

We all live in an Orange and Blue Submarine.

Earl, as you say, it is not that Phil was totally the wrong choice that is the whole problem here. The re-set button on poor managerial practices does not get activated every time a new GM or coach is hired. The institutional deficit Phil inherited was bad enough, but he brought his own baggage which has not helped one bit.

Big egos are not the issue. Everyone would love a superstar veteran in his prime and would not care if their outsized ego made them a despicable person on a personal level if that resulted in driving the team to achieve championship level results.

The reason focusing on character traits and personality defects matters so much is that when they override your strengths they pull you down. Frankly, I wouldn't have cared so much that Melo is a self-absorbed douchebag if he actually was a leader who got results. But he's merely a volume scorer and otherwise a crap basketball player.

All the gerbils running around yelling hater! can't deal with the psychological profiling, yet they still fail to correlate the results to the person.

Phil's baggage is hubris. I identified early on and I was spot on. He overestimates his influence on the coach and players. He thinks his "system" trumps good GM personnel skills. Phil is totally out of his league when it comes to cutting deals. He's truly a newb with an inflated sense of himself.

He brought this hubris and sold it to Dolan who loves spending on big splashes. No metrics, no analytics drive this organization, but ad hoc band-aid deals meant to appease the gullible public.

Phil's ego unto itself is not the issue. But his vanity negates the value of a powerful will. Vanity clouds personal self-evaluation and leads one to believe their abilities are greater than they actually are.

Phil drank his own kool-aid. His belief he would zen the organization into shape made him arrogant. He actually thought he could compromise himself with Dolan, collect the big check and still keep his integrity. He does not look good at this point.

When you do business with hustlers you either get hustled or become a hustler. Phil joined forces with Dolan because he was willing to turn a blind eye to the reality of the situation. He deluded himself into thinking he was a force that would reform this dysfunctional institution. That's hubris. And it is appallingly short-sighted for such a smart man.

It is why I say he sold out. He's too smart not to know it could turn into a complete clusterfuk getting into bed with Dolan, but he did it anyway. His vanity and greed overruled his better judgment. Phil should have never gotten involved. He is ill-equipped for the job and totally compromised himself.

I'm not a big Dolan fan, but he hired phil, he stayed out the way thus far. Phil came up with this lame ass roster not dolan, phil hired fisher not dolan, phil signed melo, not dolan, phil made these suspect trades not dolan.

I don't think it has anything to do with EGO, phil has a impressive resume, you wouldn't be going on a limb to think he was capable of the job.

Splat wrote:

BigRedDog wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:BigRed it seems you only crawl out of your hole to stalk me. I suggest you put me on ignore or crawl back into your hole

Don't flatter yourself. If I comment on your idiotic negative responses and you don't like it then thats too bad.

You're the biggest dummy here. You've never posted anything remotely engaging. Your bark is a pathetic yelp.

Splat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:
I'm not a big Dolan fan, but he hired phil, he stayed out the way thus far. Phil came up with this lame ass roster not dolan, phil hired fisher not dolan, phil signed melo, not dolan, phil made these suspect trades not dolan.

I don't think it has anything to do with EGO, phil has a impressive resume, you wouldn't be going on a limb to think he was capable of the job.

Well, we may not see the events the same, but one could understand why some would believe Phil could do a good job. However, it is also a very strong possibility many of the teams in the league would not want an older coach with no front office experience to take the reins. People invest their faith in whom they choose for different reasons. Some organizations would require capabilities Jackson clearly lacks.

100% agree with you and it was quite evident when they blew him off FOR MDA, the media was in uproar at the audacity for the lakers to even consider MDA over the 11 time (always had the best player in the league)championship coach. Their #1 reason for ditching him was the triangle, the players were not receptive of it, and i have proof

Lakers brass felt the Triangle was too structured, too similar to the failed Princeton-sytle offense experiment they went through with Brown. They also worried the Triangle would take too long to implement and the learning curve might be too steep for their current crop of players.

"Without going into great detail, some of our guys, I don't think would be very successful in the Triangle," Kupchak said. "Some of our newer players might take a long time to learn the Triangle."

knicks1248 wrote:

Splat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:
I'm not a big Dolan fan, but he hired phil, he stayed out the way thus far. Phil came up with this lame ass roster not dolan, phil hired fisher not dolan, phil signed melo, not dolan, phil made these suspect trades not dolan.

I don't think it has anything to do with EGO, phil has a impressive resume, you wouldn't be going on a limb to think he was capable of the job.

Well, we may not see the events the same, but one could understand why some would believe Phil could do a good job. However, it is also a very strong possibility many of the teams in the league would not want an older coach with no front office experience to take the reins. People invest their faith in whom they choose for different reasons. Some organizations would require capabilities Jackson clearly lacks.

100% agree with you and it was quite evident when they blew him off FOR MDA, the media was in uproar at the audacity for the lakers to even consider MDA over the 11 time (always had the best player in the league)championship coach. Their #1 reason for ditching him was the triangle, the players were not receptive of it, and i have proof

Lakers brass felt the Triangle was too structured, too similar to the failed Princeton-sytle offense experiment they went through with Brown. They also worried the Triangle would take too long to implement and the learning curve might be too steep for their current crop of players.

"Without going into great detail, some of our guys, I don't think would be very successful in the Triangle," Kupchak said. "Some of our newer players might take a long time to learn the Triangle."

the underlying problem is the erosion of basic skills and basketball fundamentals. this was brought on with the advent of the david stern era-- it just took a generation or so for the nba to be destroyed by it. and when you mix in guaranteed money, the corruption gets a big boost.

it's not the system that is the problem, it's clearly the players. that's why the spurs have enjoyed long-term success... they are able to acquire players that possess both the skills and the character to be folded into the system that the spurs have in place.

knicks1248 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Splat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:
I'm not a big Dolan fan, but he hired phil, he stayed out the way thus far. Phil came up with this lame ass roster not dolan, phil hired fisher not dolan, phil signed melo, not dolan, phil made these suspect trades not dolan.

I don't think it has anything to do with EGO, phil has a impressive resume, you wouldn't be going on a limb to think he was capable of the job.

Well, we may not see the events the same, but one could understand why some would believe Phil could do a good job. However, it is also a very strong possibility many of the teams in the league would not want an older coach with no front office experience to take the reins. People invest their faith in whom they choose for different reasons. Some organizations would require capabilities Jackson clearly lacks.

100% agree with you and it was quite evident when they blew him off FOR MDA, the media was in uproar at the audacity for the lakers to even consider MDA over the 11 time (always had the best player in the league)championship coach. Their #1 reason for ditching him was the triangle, the players were not receptive of it, and i have proof

Lakers brass felt the Triangle was too structured, too similar to the failed Princeton-sytle offense experiment they went through with Brown. They also worried the Triangle would take too long to implement and the learning curve might be too steep for their current crop of players.

"Without going into great detail, some of our guys, I don't think would be very successful in the Triangle," Kupchak said. "Some of our newer players might take a long time to learn the Triangle."

Boy your reading comprehension is lacking here mate. This doesnt say the players were not receptive, it says the current crop is too dumb to get it.

Anyway... there is only one, ONE reason why a guy who isnt a Knick fan comes on a Knick board to trash Phil and declare he will never succeed. So that person can run amok with the I TOLD YOU SO threads or the I PREDICTED THIS threads. If the Knicks do well we dont hear back. Imagine a life where finding such satisfaction on the internet actually matters to someone. Ouch... must be pretty bad.

weather their dumb, wild and young, no ones running it. It's going to be the same no matter who plays in it, it's a structured, half court, mid range game, that result in very few FT's, very few fast breaks, and thats just not todays game.

Players not being receptive to it, simply means they don't feel like it fits there game, just like JR, it doesn't make them dumb, not every player is licking their chops to play in a structured offense.

I would be excited as hell if you came to me the same time next year and proved me wrong about phil. I'm a knick fan, i want everybody to succeed who's associated with the franchise, but reality is reality, you can run from it, black and white all day.

If you make moves that result in failure, that's how you will be judge until proven different. You can't knock ppl for not having on the rosy glasses. If phil landed Pau gasol last off season at a discount, and still had this kind of a season. It would at least give me a sign that he's capable of bringing in quality FA no matter what.

If IT drafted a flop, you wouldn't discredit him because you seen him do better. Well i haven't seen pil do **** right as the knicks top brass, and he put together the worst roster in the history of the franchise, like some 50 odd years were talking here. Sorry for not being overly optimistic as you are

knicks1248 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Splat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:
I'm not a big Dolan fan, but he hired phil, he stayed out the way thus far. Phil came up with this lame ass roster not dolan, phil hired fisher not dolan, phil signed melo, not dolan, phil made these suspect trades not dolan.

I don't think it has anything to do with EGO, phil has a impressive resume, you wouldn't be going on a limb to think he was capable of the job.

Well, we may not see the events the same, but one could understand why some would believe Phil could do a good job. However, it is also a very strong possibility many of the teams in the league would not want an older coach with no front office experience to take the reins. People invest their faith in whom they choose for different reasons. Some organizations would require capabilities Jackson clearly lacks.

100% agree with you and it was quite evident when they blew him off FOR MDA, the media was in uproar at the audacity for the lakers to even consider MDA over the 11 time (always had the best player in the league)championship coach. Their #1 reason for ditching him was the triangle, the players were not receptive of it, and i have proof

Lakers brass felt the Triangle was too structured, too similar to the failed Princeton-sytle offense experiment they went through with Brown. They also worried the Triangle would take too long to implement and the learning curve might be too steep for their current crop of players.

"Without going into great detail, some of our guys, I don't think would be very successful in the Triangle," Kupchak said. "Some of our newer players might take a long time to learn the Triangle."

Boy your reading comprehension is lacking here mate. This doesnt say the players were not receptive, it says the current crop is too dumb to get it.

Anyway... there is only one, ONE reason why a guy who isnt a Knick fan comes on a Knick board to trash Phil and declare he will never succeed. So that person can run amok with the I TOLD YOU SO threads or the I PREDICTED THIS threads. If the Knicks do well we dont hear back. Imagine a life where finding such satisfaction on the internet actually matters to someone. Ouch... must be pretty bad.

weather their dumb, wild and young, no ones running it. It's going to be the same no matter who plays in it, it's a structured, half court, mid range game, that result in very few FT's, very few fast breaks, and thats just not todays game.

Players not being receptive to it, simply means they don't feel like it fits there game, just like JR, it doesn't make them dumb, not every player is licking their chops to play in a structured offense.

I would be excited as hell if you came to me the same time next year and proved me wrong about phil. I'm a knick fan, i want everybody to succeed who's associated with the franchise, but reality is reality, you can run from it, black and white all day.

If you make moves that result in failure, that's how you will be judge until proven different. You can't knock ppl for not having on the rosy glasses. If phil landed Pau gasol last off season at a discount, and still had this kind of a season. It would at least give me a sign that he's capable of bringing in quality FA no matter what.

If IT drafted a flop, you wouldn't discredit him because you seen him do better. Well i haven't seen pil do **** right as the knicks top brass, and he put together the worst roster in the history of the franchise, like some 50 odd years were talking here. Sorry for not being overly optimistic as you are

Thats a lot of money to eat even after a buyout if Dolan is going to wind up firing Phil & Derek ouch

Actually didn't Dolan win in court and Larry got nothing? I forget

knicks1248 wrote:weather their dumb, wild and young, no ones running it. It's going to be the same no matter who plays in it, it's a structured, half court, mid range game, that result in very few FT's, very few fast breaks, and thats just not todays game.

Players not being receptive to it, simply means they don't feel like it fits there game, just like JR, it doesn't make them dumb, not every player is licking their chops to play in a structured offense.

I would be excited as hell if you came to me the same time next year and proved me wrong about phil. I'm a knick fan, i want everybody to succeed who's associated with the franchise, but reality is reality, you can run from it, black and white all day.

If you make moves that result in failure, that's how you will be judge until proven different. You can't knock ppl for not having on the rosy glasses. If phil landed Pau gasol last off season at a discount, and still had this kind of a season. It would at least give me a sign that he's capable of bringing in quality FA no matter what.

If IT drafted a flop, you wouldn't discredit him because you seen him do better. Well i haven't seen pil do **** right as the knicks top brass, and he put together the worst roster in the history of the franchise, like some 50 odd years were talking here. Sorry for not being overly optimistic as you are

I really don't think good players are as worried about the Triangle as some fans and media are. When we draft players they will come in ready to learn and be happy to be in the NBA. They won't be worried about what system we're running. Free Agents that aren't getting the run or money they want will still come here, Triangle or not. All these players know is that Phil won a bunch of titles that they sat and watched on TV when they were young. I don't believe they have a bad opinion of Phil or the Triangle.

JR is an IDIOT and who cares what he thinks about anything? We want smart players who actually know how to play the game and a team game. We just watched the Spurs dismantle the Heat using a lot of team oriented tactics. Spacing, Ball and player movement. They pushed the ball when needed and got individual creativity from Kawhi, Parker and Manu. We don't currently have that level of talent, but if we did it would totally change the way the Triangle functions. Right now TALENT is the missing ingredient. But we can't have selfish and dumb players that aren't willing to learn how to run the system.

With regard to Pau Gasol we had nothing to offer. This summer will be different. We actually have money to spend and at that point everyone will be listening to what Phil has to say in terms of building a contender and how he sees them fitting into our plans. When you can actually offer a good contract it makes you much more able to sign players.

What Phil has done is do the franchise a favor by sticking to the system and forcing the players to prove they can be part of a team oriented system. Now we got rid of the players who clearly didn't fit and we can move forward bringing in players that can EXCEL playing in a team oriented system.

knicks1248 wrote:
Like I said after they resigned MELO, if this was a championship ready squad, he would have taken much much less.

when you have to use the word "force" in describing culture change,thats not good

"seeing my teammates succeed is someting I care about more than anything."

- Lebron James, (after breaking the record for assists by a forward)