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nixluva
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7/25/2007  2:51 PM
Posted by codeunknown:

With our perimeter shooting still pathetic, Zach's attention will likely come from the perimeter.

Our shooting isn't pathetic. I think we'll be just fine in terms of perimeter shooting. Smalls doubling won't likely effect Zach very much. But Doubling in general will be more difficult this year. You know that Steph and Jamal are still deadly if you aren't paying full attention to them. I think you just don't have any respect for this team. From your words it's clear that you don't realize the offensive skills this team has. Before the injuries we were one of the better offensive teams in the league. Even with all the problems we had with TO's and wasted possessions.
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misterearl
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7/25/2007  2:57 PM
Code - c'mon dude, if I wanted an "ideal player" in the team concept at center I woulda put in a take-out order for Bill Russell.

All I am suggesting is the Knicks frontcourt is a work-in-progress which no one knows how it will play as a unit.

At 24 years old, I simply wish that people would stop treating Eddy Curry as having some major deficiency that prevents him from adding any new wrinkles to his game in the context of a better supporting cast.

Constantly casting him in a negative light makes me wonder if Chris Dudley would be a more acceptable alternative.
once a knick always a knick
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  2:59 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by codeunknown:

With our perimeter shooting still pathetic, Zach's attention will likely come from the perimeter.

Our shooting isn't pathetic. I think we'll be just fine in terms of perimeter shooting. Smalls doubling won't likely effect Zach very much. But Doubling in general will be more difficult this year. You know that Steph and Jamal are still deadly if you aren't paying full attention to them. I think you just don't have any respect for this team. From your words it's clear that you don't realize the offensive skills this team has. Before the injuries we were one of the better offensive teams in the league. Even with all the problems we had with TO's and wasted possessions.

Luva', look, whether its my understanding or your lack thereof of this team is up for debate. But, why don't you go look at our 3 pt numbers last year before you decide hitch your lot with our shooting. Zach will help us this year but our shooting, which remains a major weakness, will continue to prevent us from taking advantage of double-teams.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
Bippity10
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7/25/2007  3:01 PM
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by Bippity10:

Curry should never be on the perimeter in any offense. 90% of his time will be in the paint so I'm not sure why his rebounding numbers would go down. If anything, if Zach is taking shots away his rebounding numbers should go up. He should benefit from the attention Zach gets, like David Lee and Balkman benefitted last year from the attention he got. At least on paper that's how it should work

The suggestion, Bip, was that Zach won't be played on the perimeter as Frye was. And, thus, he will be there to take more rebounds from Curry. Fewer minutes for Curry, which is also likely, would further reduce that total. While your schematic where Curry's man fails to box out because he cheats towards Randolph is certainly a factor, I'm also undecided on how large that influence will be. With our perimeter shooting still pathetic, Zach's attention will likely come from the perimeter.

So is it also being suggested that our 7-0 300 lb. athletic center will drop below 7 rebounds a game simply because Zach is here?
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BasketballJones
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7/25/2007  3:02 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Code - c'mon dude, if I wanted an "ideal player" in the team concept at center I woulda put in a take-out order for Bill Russell.

All I am suggesting is the Knicks frontcourt is a work-in-progress which no one knows how it will play as a unit.

At 24 years old, I simply wish that people would stop treating Eddy Curry as having some major deficiency that prevents him from adding any new wrinkles to his game in the context of a better supporting cast.

Constantly casting him in a negative light makes me wonder if Chris Dudley would be a more acceptable alternative.

Ah, those were the days!



https:// It's not so hard.
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  3:04 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Code - c'mon dude, if I wanted an "ideal player" in the team concept at center I woulda put in a take-out order for Bill Russell.

All I am suggesting is the Knicks frontcourt is a work-in-progress which no one knows how it will play as a unit.

At 24 years old, I simply wish that people would stop treating Eddy Curry as having some major deficiency that prevents him from adding any new wrinkles to his game in the context of a better supporting cast.

Constantly casting him in a negative light makes me wonder if Chris Dudley would be a more acceptable alternative.

Lets hope that Curry gets better. In his interest and ours.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  3:06 PM
Posted by Bippity10:
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by Bippity10:

Curry should never be on the perimeter in any offense. 90% of his time will be in the paint so I'm not sure why his rebounding numbers would go down. If anything, if Zach is taking shots away his rebounding numbers should go up. He should benefit from the attention Zach gets, like David Lee and Balkman benefitted last year from the attention he got. At least on paper that's how it should work

The suggestion, Bip, was that Zach won't be played on the perimeter as Frye was. And, thus, he will be there to take more rebounds from Curry. Fewer minutes for Curry, which is also likely, would further reduce that total. While your schematic where Curry's man fails to box out because he cheats towards Randolph is certainly a factor, I'm also undecided on how large that influence will be. With our perimeter shooting still pathetic, Zach's attention will likely come from the perimeter.

So is it also being suggested that our 7-0 300 lb. athletic center will drop below 7 rebounds a game simply because Zach is here?

Sure. Our 7 foot 300 pound behemoth has been below that before.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
misterearl
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7/25/2007  3:09 PM
BasketballJ - outstanding photo.

(Didn't Mase wear number 14?)

I also thought that edition of Knicks shorts worked better than the current design.

Dang, Dudley had one helluva wingspan.

but oh, those free throws were killin' me....

[Edited by - misterearl on 07-25-2007 3:09 PM]
once a knick always a knick
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  3:10 PM
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by Bippity10:
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by Bippity10:

Curry should never be on the perimeter in any offense. 90% of his time will be in the paint so I'm not sure why his rebounding numbers would go down. If anything, if Zach is taking shots away his rebounding numbers should go up. He should benefit from the attention Zach gets, like David Lee and Balkman benefitted last year from the attention he got. At least on paper that's how it should work

The suggestion, Bip, was that Zach won't be played on the perimeter as Frye was. And, thus, he will be there to take more rebounds from Curry. Fewer minutes for Curry, which is also likely, would further reduce that total. While your schematic where Curry's man fails to box out because he cheats towards Randolph is certainly a factor, I'm also undecided on how large that influence will be. With our perimeter shooting still pathetic, Zach's attention will likely come from the perimeter.

So is it also being suggested that our 7-0 300 lb. athletic center will drop below 7 rebounds a game simply because Zach is here?

Sure. Our 7 foot 300 pound behemoth has been below that before.

He was at an athletic 5 1/2 2 years ago.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
BasketballJones
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7/25/2007  3:13 PM
Posted by misterearl:

BasketballJ - outstanding photo.

(Didn't Mase wear number 14?)

I also thought that edition of Knicks shorts worked better than the current design.

Dang, Dudley had one helluva wingspan.

but oh, those free throws were killin' me....

[Edited by - misterearl on 07-25-2007 3:09 PM]





The majesty of Chris Dudley.
https:// It's not so hard.
nixluva
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7/25/2007  3:19 PM
Posted by codeunknown:

Luva', look, whether its my understanding or your lack thereof of this team is up for debate. But, why don't you go look at our 3 pt numbers last year before you decide hitch your lot with our shooting. Zach will help us this year but our shooting, which remains a major weakness, will continue to prevent us from taking advantage of double-teams.

Steph was at about 36% from 3, Q was at nearly 38% and Nate was at 39%. We need for Jamal and Mardy to improve. I just don't think we're gonna be a bad perimeter team this year.

I might add that this isn't the only option available to our Perimeter players. The drive is gonna play a large part in our attack as well. The attention that Zach and Curry will draw is gonna lead to lots of good looks and penetration. Let's not try to make this seem like a hopeless situation when it's clearly not. For much of the year we scored well, but we can be better than we were last year.

I'm looking for 2 things to happen. 1 is for the TO's to be trimmed. If we can get them down to 14-15 that would help. Just a bit more attention to better perimeter D will also help a lot. We have to hold teams to lower shooting % than we did last year. They killed us from 3 and we can't let that happen again.
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  4:39 PM
Posted by nixluva:


Let's not try to make this seem like a hopeless situation when it's clearly not. For much of the year we scored well, but we can be better than we were last year.

Who said anything about hopeless? There's hope. In fact, that all there is. It would serve you to argue the point at hand instead of getting on your soapbox everytime.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
Bippity10
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7/25/2007  4:44 PM
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by nixluva:


Let's not try to make this seem like a hopeless situation when it's clearly not. For much of the year we scored well, but we can be better than we were last year.

Who said anything about hopeless? There's hope. In fact, that all there is. It would serve you to argue the point at hand instead of getting on your soapbox everytime.

Amen brother
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nixluva
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7/25/2007  5:56 PM
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by nixluva:


Let's not try to make this seem like a hopeless situation when it's clearly not. For much of the year we scored well, but we can be better than we were last year.

Who said anything about hopeless? There's hope. In fact, that all there is. It would serve you to argue the point at hand instead of getting on your soapbox everytime.

I did argue the point. I posted stats and all you did was come back with this lame soapbox comment. You can keep that crap to yourself, cuz I don't wanna hear it.

We indeed need to improve on the perimeter, but we do have guys that can hit shots. We needed an even better option and I believe that player is coming in the way of Nichols, however, Steph at 36%, Q at about 38%, Nate at 39% is a decent start. There are no guarantees that these guys will hit for the same avg's, but they can do it. We need for Jamal to step up from outside and I believe he can. He's a much better shooter when he's set than when he's trying to shoot off the dribble. The more these guys shoot from deep, the better they'll be at it. The way this team is gonna play the inside out game, will lend itself to taking more 3's and I believe we'll be good enough to make that work. LB all but forbade 3's and to me that only serves to make a player uncomfortable in taking the shot. When it's a part of the offense and guys actually practice taking them as part of the offense, they'll be much more locked in come game time.

Last year when Steph started to really look for the 3, he was successful in hitting it. I think our guards will be much more aggressive in shooting from out there and it will be more of an integral part of the offense rather than just a bailout shot. It's clear that Isiah is looking to add more perimeter shooting from the way he drafted.

Once again I remind you that it's not the only option when playing inside out. Our guards will be able to penetrate at will as well. As an offense I think we'll be even more potent than last year.
Bonn1997
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7/25/2007  6:13 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Code - c'mon dude, if I wanted an "ideal player" in the team concept at center I woulda put in a take-out order for Bill Russell.
Dude, Bill Russell is over seventy. Actually, he probably would still out hustle Eddy. Point taken.
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  7:24 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by codeunknown:
Posted by nixluva:


Let's not try to make this seem like a hopeless situation when it's clearly not. For much of the year we scored well, but we can be better than we were last year.

Who said anything about hopeless? There's hope. In fact, that all there is. It would serve you to argue the point at hand instead of getting on your soapbox everytime.

I did argue the point. I posted stats and all you did was come back with this lame soapbox comment. You can keep that crap to yourself, cuz I don't wanna hear it.

Get used to it. It shouldn't bother you as much as the crap you post regularly. I'll do you the honor of ripping your propaganda apart here, but this will be the last time. Its up to you to be honest with yourself afterwards.

You made a miserable argument as usual. You posted last year's percentages of our 3 best shooters in an attempt to spin a positive outlook. Our team 3pt % is 34.6%. It ranks 23rd in the league. Thats the 25th percentile, for those statistically inclined. Nate, who shoots the highest percentage at 39%, will not be a big minute player due to very obvious flaws and likely will lose further playing time to Collins. Marbury is a 32.5% career 3 pt shooter. Q is a 35.5% career 3pt shooter whose injury concerns remain unresolved. Despite Marbury and Q overachieving last year relative to their careers, we still finished 23rd out of 30 teams. That inspires confidence in you? Even if you claim that a career average is skewed negatively due to player improvement, their averages over the last 4 years are 33.7% (Marbs) and 35.5% (Q) respectively. Those, again, are averages for 2 of our top 3 shooters.

Again, I wasn't ripping the youth and I wasn't ripping the team. You began crying over the slightest criticism, one as obvious as our team 3pt shooting. And then you brought up driving to the basket as if it was a weapon unheard off around the league. I suggest you read your posts more carefully.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
Solace
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7/25/2007  8:24 PM
^ pwned. Excellent post, Code. I've tried multiple times to relay similar information to nixluva, and he always brushes it off with his average jargon of, "I fully expect us to improve" -- as if this is a substitute for results. Or he goes on a tangent and starts talking about a different aspect as if they're related. I don't get him.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
misterearl
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7/25/2007  8:49 PM
Why can't a young bunch of talent that has yet to find its collective voice be expected to improve?

Why does a fan like nixluva, who supports his beloved team, need to be labelled as spouting "crap"?


sheesh

Why do some of you even bother with the Knicks if they cause so much heartburn, hopelessness and hostility?

What is the point of being so downright cowardly in July?

by the way, I almost forgot:

All AirTran Airways destinations are on sale.

Book your tickets by Wednesday, August 1, for travel through November 15, 2007 (travel to Grand Bahama Island must be completed by September 4; travel to Seattle must be completed by November 6, 2007). Our lowest sale fares are available for travel on Tuesdays and Wednesdays, and additional sale fares are available for travel on Mondays, Thursdays and Saturdays. These fares require a 14-day advance purchase and are not valid for travel on Fridays or Sundays.



[Edited by - misterearl on 07-25-2007 8:52 PM]
once a knick always a knick
Solace
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7/25/2007  8:57 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Why can't a young bunch of talent that has yet to find its collective voice be expected to improve?

Why does a fan like nixluva, who supports his beloved team, need to be labelled as spouting "crap"?

When you make a good point, you get credit. When your opinion is based on HEAVY speculation, you change the topic repeatedly, use misdirection and REFUSE to listen to valid points, you get insulted.

Honestly, I think everyone here likes Nix and thinks he's an intelligent guy. On the same token, I think we all wish it didn't take 30 posts per thread just to get some semblance than Nix and whoever aren't as far apart as it seems.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
codeunknown
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7/25/2007  9:04 PM
Posted by misterearl:

Why can't a young bunch of talent that has yet to find its collective voice be expected to improve?

Why does a fan like nixluva, who supports his beloved team, need to be labelled as spouting "crap"?


sheesh

Why do some of you even bother with the Knicks if they cause so much heartburn, hopelessness and hostility?

What is the point of being so downright cowardly in July?

by the way, I almost forgot:

All AirTran Airways destinations are on sale.

Book your tickets by Wednesday, August 1, for travel through November 15, 2007 (travel to Grand Bahama Island must be completed by September 4; travel to Seattle must be completed by November 6, 2007). Our lowest sale fares are available for travel on Tuesdays and Wednesdays, and additional sale fares are available for travel on Mondays, Thursdays and Saturdays. These fares require a 14-day advance purchase and are not valid for travel on Fridays or Sundays.



[Edited by - misterearl on 07-25-2007 8:52 PM]

I love when you write "sheesh" in your posts.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
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