[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

The Official "Baby Can I Change My Mind?" "Man up" Renado Balkman/Confession Group
Author Thread
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  7:54 AM
JoeC - you so crazy

How can you tell whether a team has "maximized" a draft pick before the player has played a single NBA game?

.. or allowed at LEAST Two or three years to adjust, mature and develop?

C'mon.... step off the fantsy league high horse and get REAL.

How do you know if Channing Frye a.. how do you say?.... "maximized" draft pick?

Dang.


once a knick always a knick
AUTOADVERT
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  8:28 AM
Posted by misterearl:

JoeC - you so crazy

How can you tell whether a team has "maximized" a draft pick before the player has played a single NBA game?

.. or allowed at LEAST Two or three years to adjust, mature and develop?

C'mon.... step off the fantsy league high horse and get REAL.

How do you know if Channing Frye a.. how do you say?.... "maximized" draft pick?

Dang.

Bro, seriously, I am not criticizing the player! I am criticizing him being picked over 20 picks to early.

How do you not get the concept of getting the most out of the draft? Hindsight is 20/20 bro. Balkman can be the best player in the league and in 5 years you can look back and say, well how did he slip to 20? Well, at the time of the draft he was a raw, defensive only prospect that was a borderline mid second round talent.

Using SL or even NBA games to justify a pick months earlier when you didn't have that knowledge at the time is illogical.
Balkman was what he was seen as at the time of the draft. An athletic, hustle, energy, motor guy who was known as a very good college defensive player. At the time every team had that same knowledge, no team had the knowledge of how he would perform in the NBA SL(where he displayed a very quick first step on the wing on offense, yet he also showed he wasn't the sick defender he was in college in those games either).

You don't think Nowitzki or Pierce would have went #1 (in 1998) if GM's had knowledge of how they would play in the NBA? How Balkman performs in the NBA will never justify the pick (it will only justify Zeke's eye for talent).

About Frye-I didn't want him....I wanted Joey Graham and Deron Williams and Webster before I wanted him at that spot. He was projected to go as high as 7(the pick before us) or absolutely not fall past the Warriors at 9. Isiah also had 2 other picks. My preference would have been to move up-either to the mid-teens or the top 5.

I still think we may have been better off trading up and getting 1 very good player as opposed to two good players (this is relatively speaking of course) with our players situation being the way it is with so much youth we are having a hard time finding time to develop it.

At the time of the draft, Balkman was not projected as a first round pick and was barely considered a 2nd round pick at the time of the draft.

[Edited by - joec32033 on 07-18-2006 08:28 AM]
~You can't run from who you are.~
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  8:57 AM
Say WHAT?

>>How Balkman performs in the NBA will never justify the pick (it will only justify Zeke's eye for talent).

So, no matter WHAT Balkman does in the NBA will qualify his selection at 20?

Your view gets more myopic by the day. But its cool.

I could be dead wrong JoeC but it seems you're now resortsing to splitting hairs to conform ro some silly anti-Isiah Thomas/ anti-NYK leadership agenda. But thats just me.

>>I still think we may have been better off trading up and getting 1 very good player as opposed to two good players

We? Did you say "we"?

Who died an made you boss? "WE?"

It takes TWO to tango. How do you know trading UP wasn't explored. Doesn't it require a trading PARTNER?

Again, your speculation over what SHOULDA/ WOULDA been done if you were the GM in charge is simple fantasy league - trading card material at best.

At worst it reminds me of an infants tantrum.
Are you related to Mel Kiper Jr?

Who REALLY gives a rats butt where balkman was "projected"?

Wilma Rudolph had polio and was "projected" as a cripple.

Ray Charles was "projected" as a blind no-talent plagiarist.

Mike Piazza was "projected" as a far below average baseball player in his draft.

Japan was "projected" as never being able to compete with Detroit in building cars.

The US was "projected" as a high school team playing the invincible USSR Olympic hockey team in 1980

Muhammad Ali was "projected" to lose to Sonny Liston

That is why you play the game

Hello?






once a knick always a knick
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  9:42 AM
Say WHAT?

>>How Balkman performs in the NBA will never justify the pick (it will only justify Zeke's eye for talent).

So, no matter WHAT Balkman does in the NBA will qualify his selection at 20?

Your view gets more myopic by the day. But its cool.
At the time of the draft he was not even a first rounder. Like I said (and have been saying for 2 days, but since you apparently aren't actually reading my whole post), It qualifies Isiah's eye for talent. As I have always said, using present knowledge to justify past decisions is illogical. If Balkman becomes a great playerIt proves that Isiah has a great eye for talent. But the fact still remains at the time of the draft with the knowledge at hand, Balkman would have been available later.


>>I still think we may have been better off trading up and getting 1 very good player as opposed to two good players

We? Did you say "we"?

Who died an made you boss? "WE?"

Who's he one splitting hairs now?


It takes TWO to tango. How do you know trading UP wasn't explored. Doesn't it require a trading PARTNER?

Again, your speculation over what SHOULDA/ WOULDA been done if you were the GM in charge is simple fantasy league - trading card material at best.
Flip side-you are speculating that it was explored and we weren't able to do it. Don't try and thump my theory with your theory when we neither of us don't have proof.

At worst it reminds me of an infants tantrum.
Are you related to Mel Kiper Jr?
Once again down to the insults. Bro, I am interested in talking basketball, try to keep it civil.


Who REALLY gives a rats butt where balkman was "projected"?
Once again..I do...Where he was projected (2nd round) could have meant the difference of a draft of Marcus Williams and Balkman as opposed to Balkman and Collins.

Wilma Rudolph had polio and was "projected" as a cripple.

Ray Charles was "projected" as a blind no-talent plagiarist.

Mike Piazza was "projected" as a far below average baseball player in his draft.

Japan was "projected" as never being able to compete with Detroit in building cars.

The US was "projected" as a high school team playing the invincible USSR Olympic hockey team in 1980

Muhammad Ali was "projected" to lose to Sonny Liston

Didn't you just say this:
Don't Get Me Started With The Mixed Analogies
?

Anyway....Since the ONLY one that has any relevance(or relation) to this conversation is the Piazza analogy, I'll focus on that. Piazza was actually taken as a favor to his father in the 1988 draft. In the 62nd round at number 1390. http://www.baseball-reference.com/p/piazzmi01.shtml.
He wasn't even projected to be drafted.
The Dodgers drafted Eric Karros at 62.
http://www.thebaseballcube.com/teams/draft/los-angeles-dodgers-1988.shtml
What if they reached, took Piazza at 62 and lost out on drafting Karros?

Karros was the only other useful guy they got out of that draft on the list. So instead of Karros and Piazza, they get Piazza and a guy who probably deosn't cdevelop like Piazza did at 1390.

That is why you play the game
Absolutely. The point is to give your team the best chance to win when playing.

Hello?
I knew you weren't listening.
~You can't run from who you are.~
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  9:46 AM
>>What if they reached, took Piazza at 62 and lost out on drafting Karros?

What if the Germans never bombed Paerl Harbor?

I'm tired
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  9:46 AM
JoeC - you win
once a knick always a knick
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  9:47 AM
Posted by misterearl:

>>What if they reached, took Piazza at 62 and lost out on drafting Karros?

What if the Germans never bombed Paerl Harbor?

I'm tired

Please tell me you were joking. How can you go and steal a line from Animal House?

Either way totally different types of scenarios. Keep it to sports related please. The Dodgers reaching for Piazza, would directly lead to them not drafting Karros because he would have been taken soon after they passed on him.

[Edited by - joec32033 on 07-18-2006 09:50 AM]

[Edited by - joec32033 on 07-18-2006 09:54 AM]
~You can't run from who you are.~
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  9:50 AM
Posted by misterearl:

JoeC - you win

Don't go down without a fight!
~You can't run from who you are.~
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  10:06 AM
>>Don't go down without a fight!

I just need a GatorAde break.

It ain't over til its over

or until Jackie Butler signs with the Spurs

once a knick always a knick
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  10:12 AM
>>Don't go down without a fight!

I just need a GatorAde break.
Thank God! I was hoping you would.


It ain't over til its over

or until Jackie Butler signs with the Spurs
We gotta keep this up until Thursday?
~You can't run from who you are.~
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
7/18/2006  10:21 AM
We gotta keep this up until Thursday?

Hell nah, this thread will live LONG into the season.

maybe forEVA!
once a knick always a knick
joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/18/2006  10:28 AM
Posted by misterearl:

We gotta keep this up until Thursday?

Hell nah, this thread will live LONG into the season.

maybe forEVA!

I wa hoping you'd say that....
~You can't run from who you are.~
rvhoss
Posts: 24943
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/2/2004
Member: #777
Switzerland
7/18/2006  10:29 AM
whatever happened to the Kurt Thomas will be a stud thread competition? Was that ever decided?
all kool aid all the time.
The Official "Baby Can I Change My Mind?" "Man up" Renado Balkman/Confession Group

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy