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holfresh
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1/19/2013  4:29 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Durant is God!

52 points is 52 points but lets not act like Durant didn't shoot 13/31 from the field. That (13/31) is far from "god like".

Godlike performance down the stretch in a game where Dallas at home played their asses off


And 21 for 21 from the FT line! I think his performance is a great example of how misguided it is to give more weight to FG% than to true shooting%.

That would mean he probably took 41 FGs...How is that good from a team concept?


Behaviors that help your team win are good from a team concept unless you have a bizarre definition of team concept. Players usually score about 1.0 points per possession. (Don't confuse points per shot and points per possession.) So 52 on 41 shots is contributing 11.0 more points than you'd expect to get elsewhere.

If Melo takes 41 shots even in a winning effort, you would have a cow...


Bull$hit! I've given him credit for outstanding scoring efficiency this year. It's all the other measurable areas of the game that are disappointing.

Well true shooting clouds the 13-31 shooting...That's not good...But scores do this at times..


Right. His true shooting was great. His false shooting (field goal%) was mediocre.

Well call it what u want but he free throws saved what would have been a horrendous shooting night...And that's the truth...So u judge where the falsehood lies...


No, free throws saved what otherwise would have been an average night - 31 points on 31 possessions (or 1 point per possession).

Potentially minus his free throws he could have scored 71 points...With his free throws 92 pts...So 31 points out of a possible 71 is average and in your assessment good?


52 out of 92 is an outstanding %. Give it up already. If Melo had the same performance, you'd be ecstatic and calling any critic a hater.

Well it would depend on the flow of the game but I would say u are accurate in saying Ill be happy...But 13-31 is 13-31 not matter how hard u try to hide it...


I never tried to hide it. I readily acknowledged that his false shooting percentage was mediocre.
Melo has had less impressive but still good high volume nights that I've given him credit for.

Packaging his night in "true" shooting hides his real FG percentage..


If a player shoots 10 for 13 from the field but was 0 for 3 from the left side of the paint, is it ignoring the "real problem" of his left side paint scoring if you simply give him credit for going 10 for 13? Or is it justifiably ignoring unimportant info.?

I'm not trying to justify anything...U are trying to justify true shooting...FG percentage is FG percentage period...


And left paint percentage is left paint percentage. Period! If the above player didn't have that 10-10 from the other spots, it would have been a terrible game.

Show me the stat for left paint percentage..
AUTOADVERT
tkf
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1/19/2013  4:31 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Another key stat is Durant goes to the line 9 times a game. Melo right there at 8. But Durant is shooting 91% vs Melo's 82%


DURANT also shoots 52% from the field.. I mean this is a wing player that shots 52%!!!

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
3G4G
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1/19/2013  4:39 PM
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:The closest I can think of was the playoff game in his first year here where Melo had 42 points on 30 shots and I would call that a very good scoring night - nowhere near what Durant did yesterday but still very good.

The 17 boards and 10 assist in the same game was more important to me...

That is why I've always maintained no 1 metric is more important than the other especially when we're looking at MVPs/Max Player Value/System Ran etc etc...
holfresh
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1/19/2013  4:54 PM
3G4G wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:The closest I can think of was the playoff game in his first year here where Melo had 42 points on 30 shots and I would call that a very good scoring night - nowhere near what Durant did yesterday but still very good.

The 17 boards and 10 assist in the same game was more important to me...

That is why I've always maintained no 1 metric is more important than the other especially when we're looking at MVPs/Max Player Value/System Ran etc etc...

Defense is also so important and underrated because there aren't any good tracking stats out there...But it wins Championships...
NYKMentality
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1/19/2013  5:03 PM
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Durant is God!

52 points is 52 points but lets not act like Durant didn't shoot 13/31 from the field. That (13/31) is far from "god like".

Godlike performance down the stretch in a game where Dallas at home played their asses off


And 21 for 21 from the FT line! I think his performance is a great example of how misguided it is to give more weight to FG% than to true shooting%.

That would mean he probably took 41 FGs...How is that good from a team concept?


Behaviors that help your team win are good from a team concept unless you have a bizarre definition of team concept. Players usually score about 1.0 points per possession. (Don't confuse points per shot and points per possession.) So 52 on 41 shots is contributing 11.0 more points than you'd expect to get elsewhere.

If Melo takes 41 shots even in a winning effort, you would have a cow...

Exactly. And god forbid Melo only shot 13/31 from the field? Regardless of FT's... He'd be made out to be some type of "chucker" de to 13/31 lmao.
gunsnewing
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1/19/2013  5:10 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  5:11 PM
42% isn't terrible. Melo just went 8-25 the other day 32%. It happens. A lot of that had to do with Dallas physical defense on him
holfresh
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1/19/2013  5:21 PM
gunsnewing wrote:42% isn't terrible. Melo just went 8-25 the other day 32%. It happens. A lot of that had to do with Dallas physical defense on him

I'm not saying Durant didn't have an awesome game which he did ...All I'm saying is you look at the total picture...But Durant is playing like an MVP...
yellowboy90
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1/19/2013  5:27 PM
Man you guys are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
NYKMentality
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1/19/2013  5:41 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  5:43 PM
NYKBocker wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:All I know is, Jeremy Lin's Houston Rockets currently feature the longest losing streak in the NBA. 6 consecutive loses. Some elite PG this Jeremy Lin kid is. Has led his team to not only 6 consecutive loses but also a below average record of only 21-20. The 9th seed and falling.

This is why I don't take you too seriously. Did you check their schedule? Did you watch the games? Lin was not their problem. Harden is having a very tough time right now. You can say that maybe he hit a wall. Asik's hands got worse. Dude can't hit a layup or catch a simple pass. Their PFs are non-existent. Lin is not the reason they are losing right now. Lin and Parsons are the only ones playing well right now.

Right. Too funny.

Jeremy Lin is Houston's starting PG. A position of leadership and as of right now? He's failing as an NBA PG. Only 1 game above .500? Thank god for James Harden...

Only 9 points off an awful 4/12 shooting against the Hornets along with 5 turnovers was a big time reason why HOU lost by 9 points.

Only 7 points off a horrible 2/13 shooting against the 76ers was THE REASON why Houston lost by 7 points.

"Lin and Parsons are the only ones playing well right now". Too funny.

Long story short, as Houston's starting PG; Jeremy Lin is a HUGE reason why Houston is losing these ball games. 6 consecutive loses.

Not to mention how Rondo out performed Lin during Houston's loss to Boston and even a backup in Bledsoe (No CP3) out performed Jeremy Lin himself during Houston's loss to LAC...
Bonn1997
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1/19/2013  6:10 PM
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Durant is God!

52 points is 52 points but lets not act like Durant didn't shoot 13/31 from the field. That (13/31) is far from "god like".

Godlike performance down the stretch in a game where Dallas at home played their asses off


And 21 for 21 from the FT line! I think his performance is a great example of how misguided it is to give more weight to FG% than to true shooting%.

That would mean he probably took 41 FGs...How is that good from a team concept?


Behaviors that help your team win are good from a team concept unless you have a bizarre definition of team concept. Players usually score about 1.0 points per possession. (Don't confuse points per shot and points per possession.) So 52 on 41 shots is contributing 11.0 more points than you'd expect to get elsewhere.

If Melo takes 41 shots even in a winning effort, you would have a cow...


Bull$hit! I've given him credit for outstanding scoring efficiency this year. It's all the other measurable areas of the game that are disappointing.

Well true shooting clouds the 13-31 shooting...That's not good...But scores do this at times..


Right. His true shooting was great. His false shooting (field goal%) was mediocre.

Well call it what u want but he free throws saved what would have been a horrendous shooting night...And that's the truth...So u judge where the falsehood lies...


No, free throws saved what otherwise would have been an average night - 31 points on 31 possessions (or 1 point per possession).

Potentially minus his free throws he could have scored 71 points...With his free throws 92 pts...So 31 points out of a possible 71 is average and in your assessment good?


52 out of 92 is an outstanding %. Give it up already. If Melo had the same performance, you'd be ecstatic and calling any critic a hater.

Well it would depend on the flow of the game but I would say u are accurate in saying Ill be happy...But 13-31 is 13-31 not matter how hard u try to hide it...


I never tried to hide it. I readily acknowledged that his false shooting percentage was mediocre.
Melo has had less impressive but still good high volume nights that I've given him credit for.

Packaging his night in "true" shooting hides his real FG percentage..


If a player shoots 10 for 13 from the field but was 0 for 3 from the left side of the paint, is it ignoring the "real problem" of his left side paint scoring if you simply give him credit for going 10 for 13? Or is it justifiably ignoring unimportant info.?

I'm not trying to justify anything...U are trying to justify true shooting...FG percentage is FG percentage period...


And left paint percentage is left paint percentage. Period! If the above player didn't have that 10-10 from the other spots, it would have been a terrible game.

Show me the stat for left paint percentage..


Left paint % is a bad stat that isn't recorded. False shooting % is a bad stat that is recorded.
tkf
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1/19/2013  6:29 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  6:30 PM
NYKMentality wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:All I know is, Jeremy Lin's Houston Rockets currently feature the longest losing streak in the NBA. 6 consecutive loses. Some elite PG this Jeremy Lin kid is. Has led his team to not only 6 consecutive loses but also a below average record of only 21-20. The 9th seed and falling.

This is why I don't take you too seriously. Did you check their schedule? Did you watch the games? Lin was not their problem. Harden is having a very tough time right now. You can say that maybe he hit a wall. Asik's hands got worse. Dude can't hit a layup or catch a simple pass. Their PFs are non-existent. Lin is not the reason they are losing right now. Lin and Parsons are the only ones playing well right now.

Right. Too funny.

Jeremy Lin is Houston's starting PG. A position of leadership and as of right now? He's failing as an NBA PG. Only 1 game above .500? Thank god for James Harden...

Only 9 points off an awful 4/12 shooting against the Hornets along with 5 turnovers was a big time reason why HOU lost by 9 points.

Only 7 points off a horrible 2/13 shooting against the 76ers was THE REASON why Houston lost by 7 points.

"Lin and Parsons are the only ones playing well right now". Too funny.

Long story short, as Houston's starting PG; Jeremy Lin is a HUGE reason why Houston is losing these ball games. 6 consecutive loses.

Not to mention how Rondo out performed Lin during Houston's loss to Boston and even a backup in Bledsoe (No CP3) out performed Jeremy Lin himself during Houston's loss to LAC...


hey lin has flaws, young player, but make no mistake the rockets are 21-20 in part of him..you act as if that is a bad thing... is kyrie irving not good? what is his teams record? not understanding your logic here.. the rockets are exceeding expectations.. but hey one thing I can say about lin.. I like his mental toughness, he isn't easily rattled, not by physical play or trash talk... that counts for something... right?

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
holfresh
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1/19/2013  6:31 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
NYKMentality wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Durant is God!

52 points is 52 points but lets not act like Durant didn't shoot 13/31 from the field. That (13/31) is far from "god like".

Godlike performance down the stretch in a game where Dallas at home played their asses off


And 21 for 21 from the FT line! I think his performance is a great example of how misguided it is to give more weight to FG% than to true shooting%.

That would mean he probably took 41 FGs...How is that good from a team concept?


Behaviors that help your team win are good from a team concept unless you have a bizarre definition of team concept. Players usually score about 1.0 points per possession. (Don't confuse points per shot and points per possession.) So 52 on 41 shots is contributing 11.0 more points than you'd expect to get elsewhere.

If Melo takes 41 shots even in a winning effort, you would have a cow...


Bull$hit! I've given him credit for outstanding scoring efficiency this year. It's all the other measurable areas of the game that are disappointing.

Well true shooting clouds the 13-31 shooting...That's not good...But scores do this at times..


Right. His true shooting was great. His false shooting (field goal%) was mediocre.

Well call it what u want but he free throws saved what would have been a horrendous shooting night...And that's the truth...So u judge where the falsehood lies...


No, free throws saved what otherwise would have been an average night - 31 points on 31 possessions (or 1 point per possession).

Potentially minus his free throws he could have scored 71 points...With his free throws 92 pts...So 31 points out of a possible 71 is average and in your assessment good?


52 out of 92 is an outstanding %. Give it up already. If Melo had the same performance, you'd be ecstatic and calling any critic a hater.

Well it would depend on the flow of the game but I would say u are accurate in saying Ill be happy...But 13-31 is 13-31 not matter how hard u try to hide it...


I never tried to hide it. I readily acknowledged that his false shooting percentage was mediocre.
Melo has had less impressive but still good high volume nights that I've given him credit for.

Packaging his night in "true" shooting hides his real FG percentage..


If a player shoots 10 for 13 from the field but was 0 for 3 from the left side of the paint, is it ignoring the "real problem" of his left side paint scoring if you simply give him credit for going 10 for 13? Or is it justifiably ignoring unimportant info.?

I'm not trying to justify anything...U are trying to justify true shooting...FG percentage is FG percentage period...


And left paint percentage is left paint percentage. Period! If the above player didn't have that 10-10 from the other spots, it would have been a terrible game.

Show me the stat for left paint percentage..


Left paint % is a bad stat that isn't recorded. False shooting % is a bad stat that is recorded.

FG is a very important stat in my eye...FG is naked and can't be covered up with makeup stats that you are promoting...It is what it is and can't be changed by make ups in other areas of your game ...Ill call that important...
Bonn1997
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1/19/2013  7:12 PM
The point is that its arbitrary and illogical to care about any one contributor to the total more than the total - whether it's one contributor to true shooting % (like FG%) or one contributor to FG% (like left paint scoring).
knickscity
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1/19/2013  7:33 PM
The Rockets would be the worst team in the league without Harden, a testament to now that he hasn't been playing as good the team has been losing.

Lin isn't even the third best player on the team in efficiency, he's arguably their least efficient starter.
holfresh
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1/19/2013  7:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  7:50 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:The point is that its arbitrary and illogical to care about any one contributor to the total more than the total - whether it's one contributor to true shooting % (like FG%) or one contributor to FG% (like left paint scoring).

It's neither arbitrary nor illogical...Shaq was a tremendous scorer but a poor FT shooter...Teams game planed based on those stats..They game plan against DHow because of those very distinct numbers ...Lumping FT and FG together makes it arbitrary...
NYKMentality
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1/19/2013  8:13 PM
knickscity wrote:The Rockets would be the worst team in the league without Harden, a testament to now that he hasn't been playing as good the team has been losing.

Lin isn't even the third best player on the team in efficiency, he's arguably their least efficient starter.

Ding, Ding, Ding. Winner.

Let's not talk about not being the third best, when Lin is 9th on Houston's team in regards to Player Efficiency Rating at only 14.1. As I stated earlier, thank god for James Harden because if not for Harden himself? Jeremy Lin would be running a lottery NBA team.

A Player Efficiency Rating of only 14.1? That's Kurt Thomas for ya. Even Pablo's at 12.8 lol.
NYKMentality
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1/19/2013  8:28 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  8:29 PM
On a side note, we have some pretty good games on tonight. Hopefully the Spurs take care of Hawks while Memphis takes care of Chicago. Jeremy Lin's already off to an awful start. 1/5 from the field while Rockets are down by 9. Lin needs to stop shooting, he's already shooting his team out of the game and it's only the first quarter...
knickscity
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1/19/2013  8:35 PM
NYKMentality wrote:On a side note, we have some pretty good games on tonight. Hopefully the Spurs take care of Hawks while Memphis takes care of Chicago. Jeremy Lin's already off to an awful start. 1/5 from the field while Rockets are down by 9. Lin needs to stop shooting, he's already shooting his team out of the game and it's only the first quarter...

They've won quite a bit despite Lon pathetic shooting, especially from three.

But that Harden fella, once agin poor shooting, no wonder they are down.
Bonn1997
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1/19/2013  8:42 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2013  8:43 PM
NYKMentality wrote:
knickscity wrote:The Rockets would be the worst team in the league without Harden, a testament to now that he hasn't been playing as good the team has been losing.

Lin isn't even the third best player on the team in efficiency, he's arguably their least efficient starter.

Ding, Ding, Ding. Winner.

Let's not talk about not being the third best, when Lin is 9th on Houston's team in regards to Player Efficiency Rating at only 14.1. As I stated earlier, thank god for James Harden because if not for Harden himself? Jeremy Lin would be running a lottery NBA team.

A Player Efficiency Rating of only 14.1? That's Kurt Thomas for ya. Even Pablo's at 12.8 lol.


Who cares if they'd be really bad without Harden? They have him!
Anji
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1/19/2013  8:43 PM
Is Derrick Williams the worst number 2 pick ever??? He is awful.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
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