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Where the heck is Hillary Clinton?
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DrAlphaeus
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10/12/2016  10:20 AM
Knickoftime wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Anyone who didn't know what they were getting into with D Trump had eyes closed. Look at my posts I know full well he is a narcissistic obnoxious boisterous person. I do not agree with some of the more aggressive outlandish stances but I do agree with half or partial types of agreements. The guy had cahones and vision-- just to extreme but those things get negotiated out. To vote for Hillary Clinton is voting to agree to accept a person who is obviously corrupt a fake of enormous magnitude a terrible choice as first female potus a person who has been in top level government for 30 years. I mean a Bush or a Clinton will have been President for most of the life we have lived. I think the US has gone in the wrong direction for a long time. We owe a lot of money I feel our military and morale is weak we have problems on multiple fronts I'm not a Donald Trump lover but I do not agree with having Hillary Clinton as president . I think I'm free to believe what I think is in the best interests of everyone even if the choice is fatally flawed

I don't think you know one iota of what Trump represents, what policies he has proposed, what meaningful things he could do for this country, what things he has done in the past.

I think you see a guys who is bullish on himself and tries to project an alpha male personality and you like it. That's it in a nutshell.

I don't think you have done any homework on what Hilary has done but have taken what you have seen on Fox or the like and taken that as fact. Very similar to Gun's Fact on Fox line.

It's the same reason you think Trump will win Connecticut.

BRIGGS, Hilary has not been in the top level of Gov't for 30 years, that's just the line Trump used in the last debate and which reverberated with you and you just repeated it. Trump marketing just sold you a bill of goods. Hilary has been a Senator and Secretary of State. Total of 12 years. Where do you get 30?

Stop being fooled so easily, you are better than that.

What don't I understand Martin?
I don't understand the cost that 20 mm illegal immigrants have on our health care system? Why should I pay taxes and not them?
I don't understand the peril the US is falling into with Russia and other countries by taking an antagonistic thought process to foreign affairs
I didn't see people stomping and burning the Us flag while they waived Mexican flags above it IN the US
I didn't see a rise in racial tensions the last 8 years?
I didn't see U S debt rise 12 trillion $ in the last 8 years.
I didn't see a rise in unlawful conduct in the US?
I guess no one noticed that your medical costs went way up yet your medical service went way down?
I guess no one notices the increase in drug consumption in the US?
I guess no one notices the lack of respect police have for the government and no one has noticed that Trump has close to a 100% backing of police endorsements in the Us?
No one has noticed the people in the uber cities got nothing from an African American President over the last 8 years
We should absolutely not have an open borders open immigration policy here. We need serious work in our own house. You go elect Hillary and watch her actions or should I say inactions

I won't challenge any of these points to focus on a particular topic.

For sale of discussion, let's assume for a second all these things are accurate.

Can you name a single, legitimate Trump policy that addresses any one of them?

You've rattled off a laundry list of fears Briggs, but while you could have easily itemized the proposed solutions, you did not.

Why not?

Why can't or won't you name a single Trump solution to any of these things?

I don't care what D Trumps views are on women nor do I give a fck what Hillary thinks of men. Any man here who hasn't referred to a women by the term past in their life is a self righteous bser. I'm not looking for this guy to date my daughter I'm looking for him to help create some foundational order lacking especially when it comes to our military and immigration policies .

I've never referred TO a woman by the word *****. That you think everyone like you has exemplifies the echo chamber in which so many Trump supporters live. It is a lack or empathy, or a lack of emotional intelligence that makes it difficult for them to comprehend that other people don't in fact, think exactly like them.

And that's still missing the point, entirely.

Do a lot of guys describe their sexual exploits in detail. Of course.

Do a lot of guys lie.brag about their sexual exploits to other guys. Of course.

But Trump wasn't describing or bragging about a sexual exploit. He was describing/bragging about sexual ASSAULT.

No, I've never done that and I've never heard it in my life. I've never wanted another guy to believe whether genuine or not that I committed sexual assault and could get away with it because of how more powerful I was than her.

And despite your claim that anyone who won't admit to this is a a self-righteous BSer, YOU won't either.

You won't confirm here in response that you in fact have committed sexual assault or have falsely bragged about it.

Or will you?

Trump describes fame-fueled sexual predator behavior after a surprisingly candid anecdote about failing to cuckold some dude. Wooing a married woman with furniture shopping. With the first cousin of Jeb and W Bush. It feels like some sad Donald Sterling ****.

what a time to be alive

Baba Booey 2016 — "It's Silly Season"
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holfresh
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10/12/2016  10:26 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/12/2016  10:35 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:Russia and the Syria Army(Assad) have been committing atrocities against civilians in Syria and continues to do so..Think tanks and former military people are saying war crimes have been and are being committed...Trump against his running mate, the US government and most Western governments have stated Russia and Syria actually fight ISIS...He is defending Putin and Assad..This is Iran's position as well...I'm speechless...

Did you know that the so called "moderates" that our govt. is supporting in this war are Al Qaeda?
Not a conspiracy theory, this is common knowledge.

No..I do know that any group you support against the regime have affiliates..Obama was mocked for only having 5 trained rebels on the ground in Syria up to a year ago...One of the groups they support is said to be affiliated with Al Qaeda...No option in that region is a good option...I don't think we have the luxury of not being involved in some manner...

Leaves a bad taste in my mouth. More importantly, Syria isn't worth a full blown war with Russia, which is exactly where we are headed. Syria and Russia were joined at the hip during the cold war and we were none the worse for wear. All these machinations are doing is putting us on a collision course with Russia, egged on mostly by people too old to care about the ramifications.

I think the US's focus there is to fight ISIS not Syria..Sure they(minus Trump) would like to see Assad be taken down but they were asking for Russia's help in fight ISIS...Bush and the Republicans who has a hard on for war created a vacuum when they took out Saddam..Like it or not we are responsible for a lot of what happens there, especially in Iraq...we jsut can't turn our backs...The Europeans won't step in although ISIS have declared war on their streets and neither will the other Arab countries...Jordan is the only country in the region doing the right thing...It's a complete mess but doing noting is not an option...

Vaccuum is right. What do you believe will happen if Assad is removed? The same thing that happened when Saddam was removed, thats how ISIS was created. ISIS has not been enough of a priority for this administration, in spite of the late "surge". The US and Europe are far more interested in Syria, the pipelines that run through it, than defeating ISIS. If the world was serious there would be a WWII like coalition effort to remove them.

That is a false statement...That coalition was formed going into Afghanistan then we essentially went solo into Iraq and the coalition then abandoned us in Afghanistan...

The US had every excuse to go into Syria when they used chemical weapons against civilians and didn't...

GustavBahler
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10/12/2016  10:51 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/12/2016  10:52 AM
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:Russia and the Syria Army(Assad) have been committing atrocities against civilians in Syria and continues to do so..Think tanks and former military people are saying war crimes have been and are being committed...Trump against his running mate, the US government and most Western governments have stated Russia and Syria actually fight ISIS...He is defending Putin and Assad..This is Iran's position as well...I'm speechless...

Did you know that the so called "moderates" that our govt. is supporting in this war are Al Qaeda?
Not a conspiracy theory, this is common knowledge.

No..I do know that any group you support against the regime have affiliates..Obama was mocked for only having 5 trained rebels on the ground in Syria up to a year ago...One of the groups they support is said to be affiliated with Al Qaeda...No option in that region is a good option...I don't think we have the luxury of not being involved in some manner...

Leaves a bad taste in my mouth. More importantly, Syria isn't worth a full blown war with Russia, which is exactly where we are headed. Syria and Russia were joined at the hip during the cold war and we were none the worse for wear. All these machinations are doing is putting us on a collision course with Russia, egged on mostly by people too old to care about the ramifications.

I think the US's focus there is to fight ISIS not Syria..Sure they(minus Trump) would like to see Assad be taken down but they were asking for Russia's help in fight ISIS...Bush and the Republicans who has a hard on for war created a vacuum when they took out Saddam..Like it or not we are responsible for a lot of what happens there, especially in Iraq...we jsut can't turn our backs...The Europeans won't step in although ISIS have declared war on their streets and neither will the other Arab countries...Jordan is the only country in the region doing the right thing...It's a complete mess but doing noting is not an option...

Vaccuum is right. What do you believe will happen if Assad is removed? The same thing that happened when Saddam was removed, thats how ISIS was created. ISIS has not been enough of a priority for this administration, in spite of the late "surge". The US and Europe are far more interested in Syria, the pipelines that run through it, than defeating ISIS. If the world was serious there would be a WWII like coalition effort to remove them.

That is a false statement...That coalition was formed going into Afghanistan then we essentially went solo into Iraq and the coalition then abandoned us in Afghanistan...

That was a coalition in name only, and for good reason. It was mostly an American effort. Most of the world knew that going into Iraq was a big mistake. We should have left Aghanistan as soon as Bin Laden fled the country. That is unless you really believe that we have a real chance of pacifying the country. Afghanistan is called "graveyard of empires" for good reason.

A real coalition would involve taking out ISIS with one big push, not piecemeal like they're doing now. Russia and the US have worked together at times vs ISIS, but those efforts have hit problems lately over.......Syria!

Its hard not to be moved over the death, destruction to life and property. Im glad that Syrian refugees are being allowed into the country. At the same time, our military involvement will only raise the body count, and possibly lead to war with Russia.

Hillary is a big time Russia hawk, her State Dept was caught on tape engineering the coup in the Ukraine, her policies added instability into the region, and now she wants to be president. Its not just Trump, people should not take her militarism lightly. She has been on board with every military adventure since entering govt. and she isn't finished.

Knickoftime
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10/12/2016  10:53 AM
DrAlphaeus wrote:Trump describes fame-fueled sexual predator behavior after a surprisingly candid anecdote about failing to cuckold some dude.

I wouldn't say that's a candid anecdote about failing. That's part of the pathology. He's telling Bush (O'Dell's co-anchor at the time) that his is the ballgame Trump is a player in. He's indirectly establishing that while he struck out that one time, this is the league he plays and more often than not scores in.

Of course he disparages her after the admission to take the edge of it.

John Oliver had a good segment about facist dictators around the globe that hold false, for-show elections. They all choose to announce they won 97% of the vote, almost uniformly. It's the same pathology. By acknowledging a small amount of failure, you think you're legitimizing your overall credibility.

holfresh
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10/12/2016  11:04 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/12/2016  11:07 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:Russia and the Syria Army(Assad) have been committing atrocities against civilians in Syria and continues to do so..Think tanks and former military people are saying war crimes have been and are being committed...Trump against his running mate, the US government and most Western governments have stated Russia and Syria actually fight ISIS...He is defending Putin and Assad..This is Iran's position as well...I'm speechless...

Did you know that the so called "moderates" that our govt. is supporting in this war are Al Qaeda?
Not a conspiracy theory, this is common knowledge.

No..I do know that any group you support against the regime have affiliates..Obama was mocked for only having 5 trained rebels on the ground in Syria up to a year ago...One of the groups they support is said to be affiliated with Al Qaeda...No option in that region is a good option...I don't think we have the luxury of not being involved in some manner...

Leaves a bad taste in my mouth. More importantly, Syria isn't worth a full blown war with Russia, which is exactly where we are headed. Syria and Russia were joined at the hip during the cold war and we were none the worse for wear. All these machinations are doing is putting us on a collision course with Russia, egged on mostly by people too old to care about the ramifications.

I think the US's focus there is to fight ISIS not Syria..Sure they(minus Trump) would like to see Assad be taken down but they were asking for Russia's help in fight ISIS...Bush and the Republicans who has a hard on for war created a vacuum when they took out Saddam..Like it or not we are responsible for a lot of what happens there, especially in Iraq...we jsut can't turn our backs...The Europeans won't step in although ISIS have declared war on their streets and neither will the other Arab countries...Jordan is the only country in the region doing the right thing...It's a complete mess but doing noting is not an option...

Vaccuum is right. What do you believe will happen if Assad is removed? The same thing that happened when Saddam was removed, thats how ISIS was created. ISIS has not been enough of a priority for this administration, in spite of the late "surge". The US and Europe are far more interested in Syria, the pipelines that run through it, than defeating ISIS. If the world was serious there would be a WWII like coalition effort to remove them.

That is a false statement...That coalition was formed going into Afghanistan then we essentially went solo into Iraq and the coalition then abandoned us in Afghanistan...

That was a coalition in name only, and for good reason. It was mostly an American effort. Most of the world knew that going into Iraq was a big mistake. We should have left Aghanistan as soon as Bin Laden fled the country. That is unless you really believe that we have a real chance of pacifying the country. Afghanistan is called "graveyard of empires" for good reason.

A real coalition would involve taking out ISIS with one big push, not piecemeal like they're doing now. Russia and the US have worked together at times vs ISIS, but those efforts have hit problems lately over.......Syria!

Its hard not to be moved over the death, destruction to life and property. Im glad that Syrian refugees are being allowed into the country. At the same time, our military involvement will only raise the body count, and possibly lead to war with Russia.

Hillary is a big time Russia hawk, her State Dept was caught on tape engineering the coup in the Ukraine, her policies added instability into the region, and now she wants to be president. Its not just Trump, people should not take her militarism lightly. She has been on board with every military adventure since entering govt. and she isn't finished.

Your idea of a government by pacifist in a dangerous world isn't realistic nor should it be...Russia has no interest helping the US do anything if you want to be real...The current problem the US is having with Russia/Syria is that they are bombing civilians and using chemical weapons, also bombing a relief convoy killing aid workers going to help the civilians...I not sure what your point is..You are trying to say the US have other motives which have not been proven...

GustavBahler
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10/12/2016  11:07 AM
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
holfresh wrote:Russia and the Syria Army(Assad) have been committing atrocities against civilians in Syria and continues to do so..Think tanks and former military people are saying war crimes have been and are being committed...Trump against his running mate, the US government and most Western governments have stated Russia and Syria actually fight ISIS...He is defending Putin and Assad..This is Iran's position as well...I'm speechless...

Did you know that the so called "moderates" that our govt. is supporting in this war are Al Qaeda?
Not a conspiracy theory, this is common knowledge.

No..I do know that any group you support against the regime have affiliates..Obama was mocked for only having 5 trained rebels on the ground in Syria up to a year ago...One of the groups they support is said to be affiliated with Al Qaeda...No option in that region is a good option...I don't think we have the luxury of not being involved in some manner...

Leaves a bad taste in my mouth. More importantly, Syria isn't worth a full blown war with Russia, which is exactly where we are headed. Syria and Russia were joined at the hip during the cold war and we were none the worse for wear. All these machinations are doing is putting us on a collision course with Russia, egged on mostly by people too old to care about the ramifications.

I think the US's focus there is to fight ISIS not Syria..Sure they(minus Trump) would like to see Assad be taken down but they were asking for Russia's help in fight ISIS...Bush and the Republicans who has a hard on for war created a vacuum when they took out Saddam..Like it or not we are responsible for a lot of what happens there, especially in Iraq...we jsut can't turn our backs...The Europeans won't step in although ISIS have declared war on their streets and neither will the other Arab countries...Jordan is the only country in the region doing the right thing...It's a complete mess but doing noting is not an option...

Vaccuum is right. What do you believe will happen if Assad is removed? The same thing that happened when Saddam was removed, thats how ISIS was created. ISIS has not been enough of a priority for this administration, in spite of the late "surge". The US and Europe are far more interested in Syria, the pipelines that run through it, than defeating ISIS. If the world was serious there would be a WWII like coalition effort to remove them.

That is a false statement...That coalition was formed going into Afghanistan then we essentially went solo into Iraq and the coalition then abandoned us in Afghanistan...

That was a coalition in name only, and for good reason. It was mostly an American effort. Most of the world knew that going into Iraq was a big mistake. We should have left Aghanistan as soon as Bin Laden fled the country. That is unless you really believe that we have a real chance of pacifying the country. Afghanistan is called "graveyard of empires" for good reason.

A real coalition would involve taking out ISIS with one big push, not piecemeal like they're doing now. Russia and the US have worked together at times vs ISIS, but those efforts have hit problems lately over.......Syria!

Its hard not to be moved over the death, destruction to life and property. Im glad that Syrian refugees are being allowed into the country. At the same time, our military involvement will only raise the body count, and possibly lead to war with Russia.

Hillary is a big time Russia hawk, her State Dept was caught on tape engineering the coup in the Ukraine, her policies added instability into the region, and now she wants to be president. Its not just Trump, people should not take her militarism lightly. She has been on board with every military adventure since entering govt. and she isn't finished.

Your idea of a government by pacifist in a dangerous world isn't realistic nor should it be...Russia has no interest helping the US do anything if you want to be real...The current problem the US is having with Russia/Syria is that they are bombing civilians and a relief convoy to help the civilians...I not sure what your point is..You are trying to say the US have other motives which have not been proven...

Not following you there Holfresh since Im advocating a world wide coalition to remove ISIS. Nothing passive about that. I believe that the US is using its military might recklessly, carelessly, not arguing that they shouldn't use it at all.

martin
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10/12/2016  11:09 AM
BRIGGS wrote:What don't I understand Martin?
I don't understand the cost that 20 mm illegal immigrants have on our health care system? Why should I pay taxes and not them?
I don't understand the peril the US is falling into with Russia and other countries by taking an antagonistic thought process to foreign affairs
I didn't see people stomping and burning the Us flag while they waived Mexican flags above it IN the US
I didn't see a rise in racial tensions the last 8 years?
I didn't see U S debt rise 12 trillion $ in the last 8 years.
I didn't see a rise in unlawful conduct in the US?
I guess no one noticed that your medical costs went way up yet your medical service went way down?
I guess no one notices the increase in drug consumption in the US?
I guess no one notices the lack of respect police have for the government and no one has noticed that Trump has close to a 100% backing of police endorsements in the Us?
No one has noticed the people in the uber cities got nothing from an African American President over the last 8 years
I don't care what D Trumps views are on women nor do I give a fck what Hillary thinks of men. Any man here who hasn't referred to a women by the term past in their life is a self righteous bser. I'm not looking for this guy to date my daughter I'm looking for him to help create some foundational order lacking especially when it comes to our military and immigration policies . We should absolutely not have an open borders open immigration policy here. We need serious work in our own house. You go elect Hillary and watch her actions or should I say inactions

Oh, well finally welcome to the thread. Are you interested in a policy discussion? I would join you wholeheartedly.

3 things we will need to try to go on:

1) What the current landscape of particular topic. Pick one: healthcare, immigration, taxes, whatever you want. Detail the problem, site some specific stats with sources.

2) Policy. General stance on what each of the candidates has on the topic. Site specific sources.

3) Plan. What each candidate will do over the next years or what the vision is to address topic. Site specific sources.

Please start.

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meloshouldgo
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10/12/2016  11:25 AM
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:NBC News/Wall Street Journal Poll conducted after the debate: Clinton 46, Trump 39, Johnson 7, Stein 2


I'm still stunned that 39% of the electorate would cast a vote for this man...And how about Garry Johnson who doesn't know Kim Jong-Un name in a question about who is the leader of North Korea...Wow, and he is still pulling 7% of the electorate...

You can make a generous assumption that of the 39%, 25% are pro Trump and 14% are anti HRC. That still leads to the inevitable conclusion that at least one out of every 4 eligible voters in this country is someone who would have to aspire to be a moron.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
DrAlphaeus
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10/12/2016  11:28 AM
Knickoftime wrote:
DrAlphaeus wrote:Trump describes fame-fueled sexual predator behavior after a surprisingly candid anecdote about failing to cuckold some dude.

I wouldn't say that's a candid anecdote about failing. That's part of the pathology. He's telling Bush (O'Dell's co-anchor at the time) that his is the ballgame Trump is a player in. He's indirectly establishing that while he struck out that one time, this is the league he plays and more often than not scores in.

Of course he disparages her after the admission to take the edge of it.

John Oliver had a good segment about facist dictators around the globe that hold false, for-show elections. They all choose to announce they won 97% of the vote, almost uniformly. It's the same pathology. By acknowledging a small amount of failure, you think you're legitimizing your overall credibility.

That's a deep take... I appreciate it and see your point. I guess Trump appearing to "confide" is just one part of the confidence game this guy plays with the likes of Billy Bush, and now the American electorate.

Ugh.

Baba Booey 2016 — "It's Silly Season"
martin
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10/12/2016  11:40 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
holfresh wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:NBC News/Wall Street Journal Poll conducted after the debate: Clinton 46, Trump 39, Johnson 7, Stein 2


I'm still stunned that 39% of the electorate would cast a vote for this man...And how about Garry Johnson who doesn't know Kim Jong-Un name in a question about who is the leader of North Korea...Wow, and he is still pulling 7% of the electorate...

You can make a generous assumption that of the 39%, 25% are pro Trump and 14% are anti HRC. That still leads to the inevitable conclusion that at least one out of every 4 eligible voters in this country is someone who would have to aspire to be a moron.

I would break it up or nuance it a bit more. Pro Trump, Anti-Hilary, Pro Republican, Anti-democrat.

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Nalod
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10/12/2016  11:54 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Anyone who didn't know what they were getting into with D Trump had eyes closed. Look at my posts I know full well he is a narcissistic obnoxious boisterous person. I do not agree with some of the more aggressive outlandish stances but I do agree with half or partial types of agreements. The guy had cahones and vision-- just to extreme but those things get negotiated out. To vote for Hillary Clinton is voting to agree to accept a person who is obviously corrupt a fake of enormous magnitude a terrible choice as first female potus a person who has been in top level government for 30 years. I mean a Bush or a Clinton will have been President for most of the life we have lived. I think the US has gone in the wrong direction for a long time. We owe a lot of money I feel our military and morale is weak we have problems on multiple fronts I'm not a Donald Trump lover but I do not agree with having Hillary Clinton as president . I think I'm free to believe what I think is in the best interests of everyone even if the choice is fatally flawed

I don't think you know one iota of what Trump represents, what policies he has proposed, what meaningful things he could do for this country, what things he has done in the past.

I think you see a guys who is bullish on himself and tries to project an alpha male personality and you like it. That's it in a nutshell.

I don't think you have done any homework on what Hilary has done but have taken what you have seen on Fox or the like and taken that as fact. Very similar to Gun's Fact on Fox line.

It's the same reason you think Trump will win Connecticut.

BRIGGS, Hilary has not been in the top level of Gov't for 30 years, that's just the line Trump used in the last debate and which reverberated with you and you just repeated it. Trump marketing just sold you a bill of goods. Hilary has been a Senator and Secretary of State. Total of 12 years. Where do you get 30?

Stop being fooled so easily, you are better than that.

What don't I understand Martin?
I don't understand the cost that 20 mm illegal immigrants have on our health care system? Why should I pay taxes and not them?
I don't understand the peril the US is falling into with Russia and other countries by taking an antagonistic thought process to foreign affairs
I didn't see people stomping and burning the Us flag while they waived Mexican flags above it IN the US
I didn't see a rise in racial tensions the last 8 years?
I didn't see U S debt rise 12 trillion $ in the last 8 years.
I didn't see a rise in unlawful conduct in the US?
I guess no one noticed that your medical costs went way up yet your medical service went way down?
I guess no one notices the increase in drug consumption in the US?
I guess no one notices the lack of respect police have for the government and no one has noticed that Trump has close to a 100% backing of police endorsements in the Us?
No one has noticed the people in the uber cities got nothing from an African American President over the last 8 years
I don't care what D Trumps views are on women nor do I give a fck what Hillary thinks of men. Any man here who hasn't referred to a women by the term past in their life is a self righteous bser. I'm not looking for this guy to date my daughter I'm looking for him to help create some foundational order lacking especially when it comes to our military and immigration policies . We should absolutely not have an open borders open immigration policy here. We need serious work in our own house. You go elect Hillary and watch her actions or should I say inactions

You didn't see muslims celebrating on rooftops when the towers fell either.
What was the economy condition exactly 8 years ago? How can we use that as a baseline? It was on the brink of something very bad happening.

Briggs,

I doubt you'll change your mind. The sleaze factor aside, there are some major fundamental issues I have.

1. Is generally construed he will have smart people around him to compensate for his lack of political experience. My fear is he won't listen, nor do I trust his ability to comprehend the task at hand. He speaks for a generation of frustrated people but his overconfidence tells me he is not prepared for the job. His team of Ailes, Rudy and others are not exactly the dream team.

2. http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/10/trump-constitution/503540/?utm_source=feed

I agree with you Briggs on the issue that the Reagan/Bush, Bush/Quale, Clinton/Gore, W./Chaney, and Obama/Biden is all in need of change. The problem is the system does not promote change. Citizens united empowers lobby groups and we have legions of minions in the house and senate who don't lead but instead pander to their constituents to maintain their employment as a so called public servant! With party money at stake to support them, they have to adhere to the party line. Pat McCrory, Gov. of North Carolina is a perfect example.

The Republican party has attracted the white uneducated voter who has not faired well in the economy. This manifests an ugly underbelly that reeks of entitlement because of race.

That said, if the republicans stayed away from "Christian values", which it encroaches on separation of church and state, and Abortion, what does it have to offer to attract voters? Does the Tea Party movement also have elements of racism? It did to me.
Entitlements are a very small portion of where our tax dollars go, so why did that have such great traction? Because a larger % of minorities use them?

Look at recent events the last few years in Kansas and Louisiana. Tho states that lowered tax rates on the very top end in hopes it would trickle down. The mainly white voting population and many of them on the government payroll for "handouts" voted for republicans as do many with similar demographics. Those states are in worse shape because of it.

I am disgusted with my State politics where HB2 in North Carolina is more important than issues such as rampid drug use in areas of low employment, low teacher pay has seen schools lose educators, and not attracting jobs where other states are winning them. State Government should be providing security, social assistance (drug counseling), education, public transportation (roads/Bridges) and stimulative investment to attract business. Instead by over reaching with HB2, it enters in transgender argument, discrimination in the workplace to eliminate workers right for protection, and wage control for the bigger cities!!! The aftermath has been huge decline in business!!!! This, like the Amendment ONE four years ago are to rally white conservative voters and get them to vote. This back fired 4 years ago, and might be the very thing that destroys McCrory!!!! This man had the election all to himself before.
Why do all this? In fact, federal gov. slaps this stuff down time and time again. We spend millions in legal fees to defend it!!!

I use the above as examples of what the republican party goes awry by trying to consolidate power but not effective stewardship. By focusing on consolidation of power it hurt our economy BIG TIME!!!

It is my conclusion that while the issues are many, Trump is far from the man able to deliver on much of what he says. The revolution must start at the local level and work its way up. Because nationwide we elect hacks like Rubio and Cruz who are empty legislators we end up with fewer and fewer good choices to elect from. A principled man like Kasich who lacks the charisma is overlooked while Trump succeeded with empty sugar calories.

Nalod is with "Her" because I can't be with "Him".

earthmansurfer
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10/12/2016  12:00 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:Yeah, things certainly looking down for Trump after that release of the recording.

I am just curious what you all think of the timing of the release to coincide with the wiki-leaks release?
I mean, there are some juicy emails (which I've only briefly scanned) in there and the only thing on the news is the P word from Trumps mouth, lol.
Even if you support Hillary, do you not want reports on these emails?

Another thing that worries me, the large social media website Reddit - look at the front page of r/politics. It is just not representative of that site.
For over a month now it is just pro Hillary. To the point of mods removing anything negative against her that rises to the front page. I did a post testing
and it was attacked immediately and then pulled for a laughable reason (as are most).
There is no way that 15 of 16 posts on the front page are pro Clinton, just not mathematically possible when you look at the breakdown.
Any posts regarding the email leaks that gain traction are removed for various reasons. With Trump, everything goes.

Since this is a Pepsi or Coke race to me anyway, I'm curious, is the above 2 things, just coincidence or are things really this bad?


Did the tape come out BEFORE the Assange release?

I know you love Assange, but it would seem that he has played himself out to some degree. Actually had to comment that he was not out to get Clinton...which tells me he sees his street cred taking a hit as it emerges that the Russians are handing him selected information.

Not impossible that Putin's people have doctored documents, either. If you know the source wants to put Trump in office, why wouldn't they take measures that go beyond the simple release of info?

There were some crazy things release by that Guccifer2.0 character...obvious fakes- who is to say that other changes have been made.

There are more tapes, by the way...one is said to be similar to...one much worse, than the one we saw.

The woman who Trump might have abused when she was 13, has also hired a well-known attorney, not the weaker one she originally had. Maybe the press finally covers this scandal.

Doubt if you support Trump...and Bernie is not going to replace Clinton, no matter what- are you one of the Berners who wants HRC destroyed and Trump elected so he destroys things and a 3rd party will rise from the ashes at some point?

Clinton is far from perfect, but she is infinitely more qualified than Trump for the job, this is not a debateable issue, and given his attempted stunt at the last debate, and his decision to run against Bill Clinton (who he supported during his problem years)and not HRC, it is quite evident that he is having some kind of breakdown (snort related?)as a candidate.

I thought it was the same day - Wikileaks and Trump video.

You know I love Assange? I see him and Snowden as many Americans polled have - as heros.

To me, it doesn't matter whether or not the Russians are handing Assange info. I'm purely concerned with the information and whether or not she (or Trump for that matter) broke the law.

Sure, they could have doctored things but at what point do we not look at the info? Because we have been at that point for a while now.

I'm sure Trump has said and done worse, as has Clinton, and may the lesser loser win, lol. It is hard to believe this is what the world gets to see regarding our presidential election.
Regarding qualifications, saying one is more qualified to me is a bit of a semantic argument as the deeper this election year goes, the more I feel like we are watching two puppets in action, but for whom?

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
Nalod
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10/12/2016  12:09 PM

Am I alone that I think its impossible to keep all extremist from happening on our soil and we might be doing a pretty good job of it? I mean, they are few and far between. We have had far more "Domestic" related deaths since 9/11. The flu, Pneumonia and floods kill more every year in this country.

The world has gone more to grant freedoms across borders and thus extreme radicals have been able to move freely.

The ottoman empire lasted nearly 6 centuries creating conflict.

Reform sects of Christian, Muslim and Jews all have a history of tolerance and can coexist. When you have orthodox factions, it becomes intolerable to each other.

Trump can't end this by simply applying force. While its not a political solution, the reality is you "kick the can down the road" and deal with it.

earthmansurfer
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10/12/2016  12:14 PM
martin wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:Yeah, things certainly looking down for Trump after that release of the recording.

I am just curious what you all think of the timing of the release to coincide with the wiki-leaks release?
I mean, there are some juicy emails (which I've only briefly scanned) in there and the only thing on the news is the P word from Trumps mouth, lol.
Even if you support Hillary, do you not want reports on these emails?

Another thing that worries me, the large social media website Reddit - look at the front page of r/politics. It is just not representative of that site.
For over a month now it is just pro Hillary. To the point of mods removing anything negative against her that rises to the front page. I did a post testing
and it was attacked immediately and then pulled for a laughable reason (as are most).
There is no way that 15 of 16 posts on the front page are pro Clinton, just not mathematically possible when you look at the breakdown.
Any posts regarding the email leaks that gain traction are removed for various reasons. With Trump, everything goes.

Since this is a Pepsi or Coke race to me anyway, I'm curious, is the above 2 things, just coincidence or are things really this bad?

When you have Hilary and Trump in a 2 person race, I am 110% behind Hilary. As a stand alone politician, I have my hesitations about her, but those hesitations are by no means even in the same universe as what most expect. Side note: I have a few friends who work in the State Department who have both worked closely with Hilary and semi-closely with her, so I have that perspective. The biggest feedback I got was that she was a hard working mutha ****a and a bad ass woman who has been molded by everything we have seen in the public with her own personality (i.e. her early civic duty work and the normal paranoia of being scrutinized waaaaaayyyy too much).

I would LOVE reports on those emails, but I also think they are waaaaaaayyyyyy overblown and amount to very little. I've tried to read as much as I can on the new dumps - reports on the emails, not actually readying the emails myself (just don't have the time) - and I can't even seem to find anything that is remotely interesting. There is no there there.

And it's been that way with other topics, Benghazi especially. Even the private email thing seems like a side note to me (a yellow flag versus a red flag). All of these are mere fishing expeditions that everyone against Hilary are pursuing because it is her and not founded on real suspicions of wrongdoing. If any other politician was put through the same type of scrutiny, they would fail miserably. Every one of them. If most any PERSON was put through that same scrutiny, both red and yellow flags would pop up all over the place.

As an example of this: The whole of the RNC during the George Bush presidency was on their own private email server. 22 MILLION emails were deleted from public record. These are not private emails between private citizens, there are public gov't records that were deleted. Over an 8 year timeframe. What did that amount to? Pretty much nada. Investigations? People in jail? What's going on?

Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice both used private emails for their gov't communication. So let's take Hilary's email use into that perspective.

What we are starting to see is the correction on the part of the media and other places that are righting a ship that has long gone off track.

I could see backing Hillary over Trump, as Walt said, she has the experience but we are comparing two apparently pretty corrupt individuals (I still fear a corrupt politician over a corrupt businessman). I am not shocked that she is hard working. Any person who wants this much power (Trump included), generally does all they can to get it, and since power corrupts, I'd imagine for all the wrong reasons. (Isn't there some kind of statistic regarding people in high positions of power e.g. CEO's and psychopathic behavior or something like that?) I wouldn't waste a stamp on an absentee ballot for either candidate. I'm just crossing my fingers that whoever gets in actually tries to do something for the people and not corporations.

Some of those emails are pretty damming and to not talk about them is sort of criminal, I mean it is news. Why can't they talk 50/50 about each candidate or close - I mean add some intelligence? Seems to be about companies, who own media conglomerates, creating public perception.

What does comparing anyone to George Bush get us? lol Seriously, because they didn't prosecute the former head of the CIA, that is supposed to give me some solice? These people, for the most part, don't go to jail. I mean Grandpa Bush was given a slap on the wrist for trading with the enemy (Hitler) during WWII. Let's compare what they do to what normal people like us get sent to prison for. But nothing new there.

I am curious to see where this election really does go, but what a let down (again). Remember when Obama talked about change before he got in office. Do you remember how long that lasted? It lasted till he basically selected his cabinet, Bush people and such, there was no change coming. This feels like a (poorly) scripted soap opera.

I do hope for the best, after all we are a world power and can really affect the world in a beautiful way. (e.g. ending war on cannabis/drugs). Slowly...

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
Knickoftime
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10/12/2016  12:15 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:Yeah, things certainly looking down for Trump after that release of the recording.

I am just curious what you all think of the timing of the release to coincide with the wiki-leaks release?
I mean, there are some juicy emails (which I've only briefly scanned) in there and the only thing on the news is the P word from Trumps mouth, lol.
Even if you support Hillary, do you not want reports on these emails?

Another thing that worries me, the large social media website Reddit - look at the front page of r/politics. It is just not representative of that site.
For over a month now it is just pro Hillary. To the point of mods removing anything negative against her that rises to the front page. I did a post testing
and it was attacked immediately and then pulled for a laughable reason (as are most).
There is no way that 15 of 16 posts on the front page are pro Clinton, just not mathematically possible when you look at the breakdown.
Any posts regarding the email leaks that gain traction are removed for various reasons. With Trump, everything goes.

Since this is a Pepsi or Coke race to me anyway, I'm curious, is the above 2 things, just coincidence or are things really this bad?


Did the tape come out BEFORE the Assange release?

I know you love Assange, but it would seem that he has played himself out to some degree. Actually had to comment that he was not out to get Clinton...which tells me he sees his street cred taking a hit as it emerges that the Russians are handing him selected information.

Not impossible that Putin's people have doctored documents, either. If you know the source wants to put Trump in office, why wouldn't they take measures that go beyond the simple release of info?

There were some crazy things release by that Guccifer2.0 character...obvious fakes- who is to say that other changes have been made.

There are more tapes, by the way...one is said to be similar to...one much worse, than the one we saw.

The woman who Trump might have abused when she was 13, has also hired a well-known attorney, not the weaker one she originally had. Maybe the press finally covers this scandal.

Doubt if you support Trump...and Bernie is not going to replace Clinton, no matter what- are you one of the Berners who wants HRC destroyed and Trump elected so he destroys things and a 3rd party will rise from the ashes at some point?

Clinton is far from perfect, but she is infinitely more qualified than Trump for the job, this is not a debateable issue, and given his attempted stunt at the last debate, and his decision to run against Bill Clinton (who he supported during his problem years)and not HRC, it is quite evident that he is having some kind of breakdown (snort related?)as a candidate.

I thought it was the same day - Wikileaks and Trump video.

You know I love Assange? I see him and Snowden as many Americans polled have - as heros.

To me, it doesn't matter whether or not the Russians are handing Assange info. I'm purely concerned with the information and whether or not she (or Trump for that matter) broke the law.

Sure, they could have doctored things but at what point do we not look at the info? Because we have been at that point for a while now.

I'm sure Trump has said and done worse, as has Clinton, and may the lesser loser win, lol. It is hard to believe this is what the world gets to see regarding our presidential election.
Regarding qualifications, saying one is more qualified to me is a bit of a semantic argument as the deeper this election year goes, the more I feel like we are watching two puppets in action, but for whom?

Gotta believe the extraterrestrials...

No?

holfresh
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10/12/2016  12:16 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:Yeah, things certainly looking down for Trump after that release of the recording.

I am just curious what you all think of the timing of the release to coincide with the wiki-leaks release?
I mean, there are some juicy emails (which I've only briefly scanned) in there and the only thing on the news is the P word from Trumps mouth, lol.
Even if you support Hillary, do you not want reports on these emails?

Another thing that worries me, the large social media website Reddit - look at the front page of r/politics. It is just not representative of that site.
For over a month now it is just pro Hillary. To the point of mods removing anything negative against her that rises to the front page. I did a post testing
and it was attacked immediately and then pulled for a laughable reason (as are most).
There is no way that 15 of 16 posts on the front page are pro Clinton, just not mathematically possible when you look at the breakdown.
Any posts regarding the email leaks that gain traction are removed for various reasons. With Trump, everything goes.

Since this is a Pepsi or Coke race to me anyway, I'm curious, is the above 2 things, just coincidence or are things really this bad?


Did the tape come out BEFORE the Assange release?

I know you love Assange, but it would seem that he has played himself out to some degree. Actually had to comment that he was not out to get Clinton...which tells me he sees his street cred taking a hit as it emerges that the Russians are handing him selected information.

Not impossible that Putin's people have doctored documents, either. If you know the source wants to put Trump in office, why wouldn't they take measures that go beyond the simple release of info?

There were some crazy things release by that Guccifer2.0 character...obvious fakes- who is to say that other changes have been made.

There are more tapes, by the way...one is said to be similar to...one much worse, than the one we saw.

The woman who Trump might have abused when she was 13, has also hired a well-known attorney, not the weaker one she originally had. Maybe the press finally covers this scandal.

Doubt if you support Trump...and Bernie is not going to replace Clinton, no matter what- are you one of the Berners who wants HRC destroyed and Trump elected so he destroys things and a 3rd party will rise from the ashes at some point?

Clinton is far from perfect, but she is infinitely more qualified than Trump for the job, this is not a debateable issue, and given his attempted stunt at the last debate, and his decision to run against Bill Clinton (who he supported during his problem years)and not HRC, it is quite evident that he is having some kind of breakdown (snort related?)as a candidate.

I thought it was the same day - Wikileaks and Trump video.

You know I love Assange? I see him and Snowden as many Americans polled have - as heros.

To me, it doesn't matter whether or not the Russians are handing Assange info. I'm purely concerned with the information and whether or not she (or Trump for that matter) broke the law.

Sure, they could have doctored things but at what point do we not look at the info? Because we have been at that point for a while now.

I'm sure Trump has said and done worse, as has Clinton, and may the lesser loser win, lol. It is hard to believe this is what the world gets to see regarding our presidential election.
Regarding qualifications, saying one is more qualified to me is a bit of a semantic argument as the deeper this election year goes, the more I feel like we are watching two puppets in action, but for whom?

Gotta believe the extraterrestrials...

No?

Masterful stroke....

earthmansurfer
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10/12/2016  12:20 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:I am just curious what you all think of the timing of the release to coincide with the wiki-leaks release?
I mean, there are some juicy emails (which I've only briefly scanned) in there and the only thing on the news is the P word from Trumps mouth, lol.
Even if you support Hillary, do you not want reports on these emails?

I'll give you an honest answer. Hillary Clinton is a very flawed candidate, and she should be subject to the laws of the land, now and after she's president. And if anything disqualifying comes out from the leaks (and I won't even get into the source of the leaks and Trump's off avoidance of it, but I'd think someone of your worldview would be highly interested), they'll get the attention they deserve.

But Trump is simply so all-encompassingly unqualified for the job, I do find understandable he's sucking up all the media oxygen at the moment.

And by taking the stance he is on the tapes, and by choosing to go to war with the party he represents, he's the chief-enabler of this.

It is difficult to take serious the notion of conspiracy to dominate the news discourse when it is HE who is leading the charge. As always, conspiracy theories all eventually collapse under the weight of their own logic.

On that note, again, the key when going down a rabbit hole is to go all the way through the rabbit hole.

There are two logical conclusions to reach if you prescribe to the theory the tapes were leaked specifically to combat the wiki leaks release.

One is, this will be the last big Clinton oppo story and the worst of the wiki leaks were already out, so the democrats/liberal media dropped their big bomb to take it off the table.

The other is in anticipation of more Clinton oppo stories over the remaining 4 weeks, democrats/liberals are sitting on a draw full of this stuff.

Is it possible the Post got the tape on the day for that reason and all we've learned about the days leading up to it are false

Possible, but what's the smoking gun there? That the campaign was prepared and strategic?

Hmmmm, okay...

And?

Another thing that worries me, the large social media website Reddit - look at the front page of r/politics. It is just not representative of that site.
For over a month now it is just pro Hillary. To the point of mods removing anything negative against her that rises to the front page. I did a post testing
and it was attacked immediately and then pulled for a laughable reason (as are most).
There is no way that 15 of 16 posts on the front page are pro Clinton, just not mathematically possible when you look at the breakdown.
Any posts regarding the email leaks that gain traction are removed for various reasons. With Trump, everything goes.

Since this is a Pepsi or Coke race to me anyway, I'm curious, is the above 2 things, just coincidence or are things really this bad?

Again, follow your own chain of logic.

Are you REALLY suggesting somehow anti-Clinton rhetoric is difficult to find? If you don't know where to look at the moment, I'd be happy to direct you to where you can find it.

But since it's there, what is the strategic benefit of some unknown entity stifling ONE source?

One needs to again, follow the chain of logic and look at the big picture or one just demonstrates their own confirmation bias.

Will be interesting (dare I say entertaining) to see what the "follow up" Pu$$y video gets us. lol

Reddit is the biggest social news site that I am aware of. I'm merely saying, it makes no sense to see the disparity of anti Trump / pro Hillary posts and on top of that the blatant modding going on there. I'm not shocked to hear about it. I'm sort of shocked to actually witness it.

Regarding your "stifling the source" question - well, if it is a big site (or TV channel) it is extremely effective propaganda to sway public opinion. Perhaps it is just designed to give a feeling of hopelessness on top of all else.

Thanks all you guys for taking the time to respond. I do hope, no matter who gets in, that we make it through this dark time in our history (not cutting on any one person, just the system). Well, I hope there are some benevolent aliens out there that are in the mood for sharing. :-)

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
holfresh
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10/12/2016  12:26 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/12/2016  12:31 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/12/opinion/campaign-stops/maureen-dowd-solving-the-riddle-of-the-slovenian-sphinx-and-the-*****-bow.html?action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=opinion-c-col-left-region&region=opinion-c-col-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region

by:Maureen Dowd

Solving the Riddle of the Slovenian Sphinx and the Pussy Bow


It was a relief to see Melania Trump at the St. Louis debate.

I was worried that the svelte Slovenian had gone into witness protection. Or that she was cloistered at a spa in the Swiss Alps.

Melania virtually disappeared after her Republican convention mishap purloining some Michelle Obama speech chunks. And then, after the invidious 2005 videotape of her husband and Billy Bush surfaced — with the bros bantering about groping women at a time when Melania was pregnant — there was talk that she and Donald would do a Bill and Hillary “60 Minutes”-type interview where she stood by her Cheez Doodle.

It wasn’t her style, and that idea got dropped. Melania did issue a statement calling her husband’s comments “offensive” but saying that he had her support and suggesting that everyone “focus on the important issues facing our nation and the world.”

Who knew that the important issue would be a ***** bow?

On Sunday night, Melania swept into the hall, smiled and shook hands with her counterpart, Bill Clinton. It was a classy contrast from no handshake by Hillary and Donald at the start and the tacky tableau concocted by Donald Trump, who sat three of the women who have accused Bill of sexual assault in the front row, after debate officials rejected seating them in the Trump family box.

The sultry former model was not wearing her usual bell-sleeved or puffy-sleeved ****tail dress in white or black. She blazed in a fuchsia blouse and matching slim pants. A pantsuit! But it was the bow on the Gucci silk crepe de Chine blouse that lit up the internet.

Cosmopolitan magazine breathlessly tweeted the debate news bulletin:

Then, as is the wont with the Donald, conspiracy theories bloomed around the globe. Some on Twitter thought it was the often-mute Melania’s way of screaming her disgust with her husband’s use of the word in a crude palaver on an open mic.

“In my fantasies,” Ashley Spencer tweeted:

Another tweet by Christen Clifford agreed that it was a sign of going rogue:

Lizabeth slyly tweeted:

Others thought the bow, echoing the word her husband used with such egregious abandon, was a way of sartorially standing by him and dissing his critics. The conservative website Breitbart, whose executive chairman, Steve Bannon, took a leave to serve as Trump’s C.E.O., proclaimed Melania’s ***** bow “amazing trolling.”

Even the Nobel Prize-winning columnist for The Times, Paul Krugman, weighed in on the *****-bow riot, tweeting:

Seeing the bow gave me acid flashbacks to the ’70s, when John T. Molloy wrote “Women’s Dress for Success,” advising aspiring career women to dress like men, in Oxford shirts, navy suits and floppy bow ties. I tried it once and gave the bow away, praying that women would not have to mimic men to get ahead.

As USA Today explained, the ***** bow got its name from the ones tied under kittens’ chins back in the ’30s. Then it became a staple in Molloy’s tips for climbing the ladder. Finally, decades later, it is repurposed as chic and flirty, the signature of Gucci’s creative director, Alessandro Michele.

It is so hip that the first lady has worn a *****-bow dress. (Sorry, Melania, Michelle got there first again.)

Even men, including Hamish Bowles and the gender-fluid “young Gucci millennials,” as fashionistas call them, got in on the act.

Sunday night, things got into a swivet, with the blouse selling out instantly on Net-a-Porter, which described it as “a chic way to elevate office or weekend looks.” (This echoed what happened at the Republican convention, when Ivanka wore a blush pink dress from her label and put it up for sale the morning after she gave her speech, selling it out almost immediately.) A Trump campaign spokesman had to make a statement, telling CBS that Melania’s choice of a ***** bow was “unintentional.”

As it happened, I knew someone who could solve the riddle of the Slovenian sphinx and the ***** bow: André Leon Talley, the sultan of style, someone so influential that Kim Kardashian dressed her daughter, North West, as André, complete with billowing black caftan, for Halloween.

André was the stylist for Melania’s gilded age 2005 wedding to Trump at Mar-a-Lago. The wedding was going on the cover of Vogue, so André, then an editor at large, attended with Anna Wintour. He flew to Paris with Melania to shop for her wedding dress and trousseau at the top couture houses. They visited Dior, Valentino and Chanel, and ultimately Melania chose a strapless Dior John Galliano gown estimated to cost $200,000.

“Melania is an extraordinary, articulate person,” André reports. “She’s charming. She’s extremely soignée and polished. Her manners are impeccable. She was very guarded, very private, but very gracious. She was polite to all the couturiers. She wasn’t walking in as an ‘I’m the future Mrs. Trump’ diva. Listen, she is the only woman in the world who stands and walks comfortably on four-and-a-half-inch stiletto heels. Her feet are trained. Her legs are a long drink of water. She’s very much like a high, super, superglamorous Stepford Wife. She was extraordinarily groomed. Groomed to a fastidious fault. Everywhere.”

Her dress, André recalls, was “quite a concoction.” André and Melania flew down to Palm Beach on the gilt-and-white-leather Trump jet with the faux French impressionist art. “The dress took eight hours to fit at a hotel in New York,” André said. “Madame Paulette, a couture dry cleaners on Second Avenue, sent down an entire team of four people to Mar-a-Lago to steam the dress and to take care of the dress. They took over a wing in the church. Extraordinary state-of-the-art steamers.”

I told André we needed to solve the mystery of the feline wife and the ***** bow. Was it a feminist signal, using a throwback style, to women upset by her husband’s reprehensible riff on the bus with Billy Bush? (Remember President Clinton sent Monica Lewinsky a signal on TV by wearing a Zegna tie she had given him?)

André thinks not. “I’m inclined to think that Melania is supportive of him,” he said. “I don’t think she’s a disrupter. If anything, it was a signal of support for him, using the mot du jour and taking it to the next level with fashion.”

He was more curious about her pick of the color fuchsia paired with Louboutin “So Kate” white stiletto pumps for St. Louis in October.

“Odd choice,” the fashion mandarin said. “Totally out of sync. Hillary’s pantsuit was more appropriate.”

Knickoftime
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10/12/2016  12:32 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/12/2016  12:35 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:Some of those emails are pretty damming and to not talk about them is sort of criminal, I mean it is news. Why can't they talk 50/50 about each candidate or close

There is a term for that. It's called false equivalency, and you do in fact this is phenomena play out every single day in the media you criticize.

To try to establish credibility, media constantly reminds us that "both sides are guilty", people explain away lies as "all politicians" lie. The media both consciously and subconsciously are tuned to looking for a middle ground. People consider the assumption that the election will return to being a horserace as some sort of intellectual reasonability.

What's Joe Scarborough argue that Trump will bounce back based on nothing other than a deep-seeded bias that a middle ground will be found

<iframe src='http://player.theplatform.com/p/7wvmTC/MSNBCEmbeddedOffSite?guid=n_mj_toptalk_161011' height='500' width='635' scrolling='no' border='no' ></iframe>
.

- I mean add some intelligence? Seems to be about companies, who own media conglomerates, creating public perception.

As always, this logic falls apart when it fails to consider the the big picture. The highest-rated cable news network talks about it ALL the time. There bias is clear and well-known.

I am curious to see where this election really does go, but what a let down (again). Remember when Obama talked about change before he got in office. Do you remember how long that lasted?

When did Obama promise he's appoint people he philosophically disagreed with to key posts. Obama has in fact been routinely criticized for NOT pushing a more liberal agenda and for trying to seek bi-partisanship.

The man faced both an obstructionist Republican congress and people like Trump trying to delegitimize his presidency.

What would you like him to have done to change the mind of people convinced he was a radical Muslim born in Kenya.

Reason with them?

Knickoftime
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10/12/2016  12:40 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:Regarding your "stifling the source" question - well, if it is a big site (or TV channel) it is extremely effective propaganda to sway public opinion. Perhaps it is just designed to give a feeling of hopelessness on top of all else.

So as opposed to individual commercial entity playing to a specific demographic for commercial gain, you're suggesting Fox News and MSNBC are in fact in cahoots in some sort of uniform long-game strategy of dividing people so much that it creates hopeless and apathy?

Where the heck is Hillary Clinton?

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