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Isiah is officially coming back as a consultant
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sidsanders
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8/8/2010  11:38 PM
PresIke wrote:is it not crazy to after giving a person millions of dollars when they did a bad job to want more?

it isnt however given the context of the bad job, i would rather write the loss off then invest even more time/materials into a failed venture. folks assume the worst cuz thats what we have gotten for 10 years, heck even in the best of times (ewing era) we are closing in on 40 years with no title.

to even think a guy who pooped on the whole org with a lawsuit, horrible player transactions, etc would even be considered to come back in is nuts.

GO TEAM VENTURE!!!!!
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CrushAlot
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8/8/2010  11:53 PM
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
blkexec
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8/9/2010  12:01 AM
I have a feeling Isiah was hired to bring on players like Chris Paul and/or Deron Williams....

I'm sure CP has the upmost respect for Isiah. And I bet most FA's do.

Just having Isiah on board as a scout (which I said he should've been a long time ago)

Will help bring CP and Melo to the knicks.

Isiah and MDA is a Point Guards dream.....

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
KNICKSdom
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8/9/2010  12:35 AM
Now that Isiah is hired for the 2nd ungodly time, it is time for....

Knicks are happening and have a Unicorn.
TMS
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8/9/2010  2:02 AM
blkexec wrote:I have a feeling Isiah was hired to bring on players like Chris Paul and/or Deron Williams....

I'm sure CP has the upmost respect for Isiah. And I bet most FA's do.

Just having Isiah on board as a scout (which I said he should've been a long time ago)

Will help bring CP and Melo to the knicks.

Isiah and MDA is a Point Guards dream.....

i think Isiah has sold Dolan on that premise... that he'll be the guy to lure those bigname guys to NY... he's got Dolan completely sold.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Markji
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8/9/2010  6:09 AM
If I were a FA and Isiah was GM of a team, and Dolan the owner, that would be the last team I would want to play for. All of the basketball players know what has happened with the Knicks for the past 10 years. They are not stupid. When LeBron found out how much control Dolan and Isiah still had on the Knicks operations, he went elsewhere.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
misterearl
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8/9/2010  7:19 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/9/2010  9:19 AM
Markji - if you were a FA... and a franchise, owned by a corporate entity whose pockets were so deep that its checks were guaranteed NOT to bounce, offered you 100 million dollars to play basketball, you would sign a contract faster than I can say Ticky Burden.
once a knick always a knick
TheGame
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8/9/2010  8:35 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/9/2010  8:38 AM
eViL wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
eViL wrote:
PresIke wrote:you haven't even conceded the possibility isiah will npt be gm/prez...

that's the issue. it should be an absolute certainty that he will never hold that position. there should be no possibility whatsoever. and isiah is not the only person in the world that has scouting ability. you might think that everyone hates isiah because they're all racist, but that's not true. many of the folks here that are not fans of his are black. dikembe mutombo absolutely hated isiah thomas. dikembe "i'm practically a saint" ****ing mutombo hated him. c'mon son.

I don't think Don Chaney and Lenny Wilkins are very fond of him either.

exactly.

look, do i think isiah gets reamed harder by the mainstream media because of some underlying racial bias? probably.

could the fact that he has failed, catastrophically, on the biggest stage in the world, has managed to alienate multitudes of people, and has made bitter enemies everywhere he's gone have something to do with the venom? absolutely.

isola is doing us all a favor. the media is helping us right now. if they can rile enough people up, the opposition to this move could be strong enough to prevent what none of us want to see. that is, isiah holding a position of authority with the knicks again.

i'm not calling for the guy to die, or to be deprived of his chance to redeem himself, i just want the guy to stay away from my team. that's all. in fact, i think it would be a great story for him to find success in his post-basketball career. let it happen far away from the knicks please.

Riling people up is right. Isola has pretty much already proclaimed IT to be the next GM and is suggesting that Walsh step down now. I was only half-joking when I said IT will become GM. Honestly, I think Dolan likes IT and wants to give him a chance to redeem himself. I don't believe that Dolan has any intentions of making IT the GM because even he must realize that the backlash will be too strong.

Trust the Process
Bippity10
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8/9/2010  9:42 AM
blkexec wrote:I have a feeling Isiah was hired to bring on players like Chris Paul and/or Deron Williams....

I'm sure CP has the upmost respect for Isiah. And I bet most FA's do.

Just having Isiah on board as a scout (which I said he should've been a long time ago)

Will help bring CP and Melo to the knicks.

Isiah and MDA is a Point Guards dream.....

That's all well and good, but Walsh is running the operations here and if he does not want Isiah then you do not hire him. For years under Isiah we had turmoil and were on the front pages for everything but basketball. Finally fans are talking basketball because of the hard work of Walsh and now here we are back on the front pages for something else. This stuff is what creates a losing atmosphere and is what we are trying to eliminate. This nonsense is what also keeps free-agents away from NY by the way.

I just hope that people will like me
Markji
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8/9/2010  9:43 AM
misterearl wrote:Markji - if you were a FA... and a franchise, owned by a corporate entity whose pockets were so deep that its checks were guaranteed NOT to bounce, offered you 100 million dollars to play basketball, you would sign a contract faster than I can say Ticky Burden.

Not if other teams offered me something good as well. How much is 5 years of misery and one's career worth?

The Big 3 in Miami all took less in salary to play together and NOT play for the Knicks.

Carlos Beltran, when a FA, would have taken something like $20 million LESS to NOT play for the Mets and play for the YANKEES.

Again, I will repeat from other thread and previous post.....LeBron, according to a few sources was set to sign with the Knicks. He changed his mind the last day or day....when Isiah surfaced as being still with Dolan and then Dolan send Isiah to see LeBron. IMO, Isiah and Dolan scared LeBron away.

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
misterearl
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8/9/2010  9:44 AM
Markji - what "sources"?
once a knick always a knick
PresIke
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8/9/2010  9:51 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/9/2010  9:53 AM
earl, there was a report that conflicts itself (more on that in a sec), that came out about lebron's "team" wanting him to play for the knicks which was why the rumors started heating up that he would play for the knicks.

the story then went that lebron tells amar'e to "get ready" he's coming, but then decides to play with his friends, which was apparently what he wanted more and still makes no sense to me. how can he want to play for miami with his friends, and then honestly tell amar'e he's coming to the knicks?

either the story is filled with made up nonsense, or lebron lied to amar'e...maybe to create a smokescreen for his destination...who knows, or cares at this point, honestly?

then there is speculation that part of the reason he didn't want to come to ny was dolan or because walsh was in a wheelchair and is old...which of course now leads to more speculation that it was about isiah since he is supposedly involved in signing/recruiting free agents...

whatever, it's beyond silly and self-loathing to believe any of this stuff at this point.

lebron seemed to always want miami and his friends as most have suggested was the reality. end of story.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
PresIke
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8/9/2010  9:54 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/9/2010  9:55 AM
sidsanders wrote:
PresIke wrote:is it not crazy to after giving a person millions of dollars when they did a bad job to want more?

it isnt however given the context of the bad job, i would rather write the loss off then invest even more time/materials into a failed venture. folks assume the worst cuz thats what we have gotten for 10 years, heck even in the best of times (ewing era) we are closing in on 40 years with no title.

to even think a guy who pooped on the whole org with a lawsuit, horrible player transactions, etc would even be considered to come back in is nuts.

easy to say when you aren't the one shelling out millions of dollars for someone to do nothing.

look how they treated marbury, they played hardball with him, refusing to buy him out and dragging out the story, because of what he did to the organization too.

dolan seems to me to be someone who does not like feeling he has been taken advantage of...insecure.

Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
Markji
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8/9/2010  10:02 AM
misterearl wrote:Markji - what "sources"?
PresIke answered your question. Many conflicting sources.

And I said, "IMO". Just reading between the lines and adding up 1+1+1=?

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
loweyecue
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8/9/2010  10:24 AM
Bippity10 wrote:
blkexec wrote:I have a feeling Isiah was hired to bring on players like Chris Paul and/or Deron Williams....

I'm sure CP has the upmost respect for Isiah. And I bet most FA's do.

Just having Isiah on board as a scout (which I said he should've been a long time ago)

Will help bring CP and Melo to the knicks.

Isiah and MDA is a Point Guards dream.....

That's all well and good, but Walsh is running the operations here and if he does not want Isiah then you do not hire him. For years under Isiah we had turmoil and were on the front pages for everything but basketball. Finally fans are talking basketball because of the hard work of Walsh and now here we are back on the front pages for something else. This stuff is what creates a losing atmosphere and is what we are trying to eliminate. This nonsense is what also keeps free-agents away from NY by the way.

This.

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
Vmart
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8/9/2010  10:34 AM
Walsh signed the papers to OK the Isiah hiring. I don't see why that is a problem with most here. Leave Isiah alone and let him do his job.
PresIke
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8/9/2010  10:38 AM
uhhh...isiah was NEVER FIRED.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
smackeddog
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8/9/2010  10:58 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/9/2010  11:01 AM
eViL wrote:
look, do i think isiah gets reamed harder by the mainstream media because of some underlying racial bias? probably.

could the fact that he has failed, catastrophically, on the biggest stage in the world, has managed to alienate multitudes of people, and has made bitter enemies everywhere he's gone have something to do with the venom? absolutely.

completely agree- he did get bashed excessively by the media, I think due to a bit of racial bias (I still cringe every time I read about "his boyish smile"- FFS how can any journalist still write that racist crap and think it's okay, but at the same time he WAS a bad GM, in that he was completely incapable of establishing and following a plan, and could not build a TEAM that fitted together. Also he took big gambles that could not be gotten out of if they didn't work, and gave up trying to manage the salary cap or sign players to reasonable contracts.

I still think that Chris Mullin is very similar to him and is just as bad (the Dunleavy contract, the Troy Murphy contract etc etc- and he shares IT's strengths (good talent evaluater and drafter) but he doesn't get anywhere near the hate IT does by the media. What people overlooked in all this IT returning story is that Donnie wanted to make Chris Mullin our new GM- I would have cried if that had happened and I now find myself in the very unusual position of being both thankful to Dolan for blocking it and also bitterly resentful towards him for wanting to make IT GM instead.

Also Larry Bird is just as bad a GM as Michael Jordan (traded for the Dunleavy contract and the Troy Murphy contract, is a bad drafter has done NOTHING to improve the pacers since he got there) but seems to get no flack what so ever.

Sheesh- Thorne and Pritchard are available but our organisation is fighting it out between Chris Mullen and Isiah Thomas- I give up!
DurzoBlint
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8/9/2010  11:12 AM
TMS wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
TMS wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:I am not sure why people are debating Isiah's accomplishments during his time in NY. Isiah was not good at his job even if he didn't have all of the other issues that came along with him. The last two years of sucking @ss are because of Isiah. Not having a first round pick this year was because of Isiah. Isiah chased talent regardless of contract, character, the current roster needs, team chemistry, or the impact on the team down the road. He was a disaster without ever discussing all of the controversy that surrounded him while in NY. To excuse all of his failures because he picked Lee, Nate, Chandler and Ariza during his five year tenure is ridiculous.

we're not debating his accomplishments, we're debating his ability to spot young talent... his disastrous trades, off the court indiscretions & horrible FA signings are not up for debate... no one has excused his failures because he picked Lee, Nate, Chandler & Ariza.

He hits about 50% of the time in the draft and his ego impacted his success in this area also in my opinion. In my opinion the Balk pick was made to shock and show the world that Isiah was a draft expert. Also, I am quick to criticize the current coach and gm about only going for character guys in the draft but there is something to be said about considering character when taking on a player for a big contract. Isiah seemed to only be concerned with ability. He is flawed in many ways and his flaws far outweight any positives he has in evaluating talent. He is not a savant in this area. There are plenty of guys that can scout and identify talent that haven't been convicted of sexual harrassment, or attempted suicide, or embarassed and humiliated respected nba coaches, or destroyed the future of an nba team for many years, or are on tape being racially and gender insensitive, or used their position to be extremely vindictive and impact/destroy nba careers. I have posted in the past that this guy fits the profile of a sociopath. Since he left the Knicks he attempted to deny his pill overdose on his daughter. Minimally this guy is an incompetent narcissist, if not a true sociopath. There is nothing that he brings to the Knicks that negates all of the damage that he did to the franchise. Talking about him as a draft guru is ignoring all of the horrible things that he has done which should never be done. A lot of the damage Isiah did had nothing to do with basketball when he was with the Knicks.

i don't agree that Isiah was only concerned about talent... he picked Channing Frye with his highest pick as our GM, a boyscout if there ever was one... he picked David Lee & Wilson Chandler, both kids with great character.

of course he's flawed in many ways, who's arguing any different? what's the point in bringing up all the other stuff that's obvious in everyone's mind about his mistakes as our GM? no one wants to see this guy taking on any role on this franchise in a decision making role, but as a scout of talent i think he's got his uses... that's the only point being debated, at least by me.

^WHAT he said. It does have an eye for young talent, its guys that have already made it to the NBA he seems to have no clue about.

Let the guy consult,....you don't have to take his advise, no big deal. Maybe he's Dolan's illegimate son and this is just a bit of nepotism

the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
martin
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8/9/2010  11:32 AM
Vmart wrote:Walsh signed the papers to OK the Isiah hiring. I don't see why that is a problem with most here. Leave Isiah alone and let him do his job.

as far as I know this is absolutely not true. Did you make this up or read it somewhere? I have not read it anywhere.

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