[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

SI: Knicks DECLINE deal for Randolph!!! WOW!!!!
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 10 of 11 « First‹ Previous 8  9  10  11 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
MS
Posts: 27064
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/28/2004
Member: #724
7/14/2008  9:30 AM
But the only way to up the value of those players in order to move them is to trade zach in this deal, which will give curry confidence and mike will run him so he will be in shape and can be moved for something pretty reasonable
AUTOADVERT
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
7/14/2008  9:59 AM
Posted by MS:

But the only way to up the value of those players in order to move them is to trade zach in this deal, which will give curry confidence and mike will run him so he will be in shape and can be moved for something pretty reasonable

or keep zach and trade curry since zach is the better player.
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
7/14/2008  10:02 AM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by TheGame:
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense


Zach plays no defense, has a tendency to jack up shots, and is not going to be a factor on the fast break. I agree he has talent, but unless you see him as our long-term solution at the PF spot, we should trade him now. Getting Jordan and a 2nd round pick is more in return than what we gave up to get him IMO. Otherwise, you are taking the chance the new coach can up his trade value. Maybe you take that risk, but if it does not work out, we are going to be stuck with Zach for a couple more years. The Clippers are a unique opportunity because you have a team with cap space that has a specific need for a scoring PF. THere is no guarantee that opportunity is going to be there next year. Simply stated, I agree we should not give up Zach for nothing, but I think Jordan is a solid prospect at the center position and should at least provide us with a shot-blocker in 2-3 years. SO this moves builds our team for the future.
he didnt play defense last year but he has been better in the past. I would never say he's been a good man to man defender, but one thing he certainly does is rebound on both ends. He cleans the glass and that is certainly part of defending.

And yes.. he chucked last year, but there was virtually no offense run. When players had the ball in their hands they looked to shoot. That was pretty much every guy.

Zach is not a nice man, but he's not the anti christ either. He also bring some very high level skills to the table. He is an elite rebounder and has a great mid range game to compliment his post moves. IMO its utter folly to let this guy go for nothing without seeing what he can do for DAntoni.

Part of the reason we are in the position we are is because we always bought high and sold low. I am all for the wait and see w/ Zach. Wait until the Clippers swing and miss on every other bigman first.

Fish- I think the problem is that we have a crowded front court and Zach & Curry can't work together, no matter who the coach is.

I do think Zach, if the money wasn't an issue, would be a better fit for D'Antoni than Curry- he rebounds and can pass the ball much better and has the kind of range that would be devastating in an open, spaced floor attach like D'Antoni ran in Phoenix.
fishmike
Posts: 53902
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
7/14/2008  12:04 PM
Franco.. I am hardly excited about the prospect of having Zach as a Knick next year but what he brings is a very good fit for this team. He's a rebounding monster and clean the defensive glass and create good oportunities for outlet plays. While he isnt fast or an above the rim player he is exceptionally quick and if you get him the ball while his defender is out of position or trying to adjust he will score at will whether is drilling 18 footers or scoring under the basket.

Yes Curry and Zach dont fit together.. no doubt. I dont see how Curry fits at all. He's a lampost on defense and Tim Thomas is better rebounder. His ability to score around the basket is enticing but he's the guy I would be shopping. Diop just got 5 years and $30mm. Whats Curry's value?

Also.. I most definatly care about the cap. I just dont see wasting assets to get below it in time for 2010 as the best way to build this team. I personally would trade Zach for the Clipps 08 first rounder (unprotected). If they dont like that I keep him and wait. Let them sign Reggie Evans and deal with Baron passing to him.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Cookdcokehop
Posts: 22452
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 3/25/2005
Member: #880
USA
7/14/2008  12:13 PM
Eddy Curry & Lee for Clippers 2010 first rounder & DeAndre Jordan
Zach Randolph & Wally Sczerbiak & 2009 secound rounder

Rebuilding the right way

2008-09 Starting Line-up

Duhon
Crawford
Chandler
Gallinari
Jordan

We will be back in the lottery with this line-up but it gives our young core time to gel
MS
Posts: 27064
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/28/2004
Member: #724
7/14/2008  12:43 PM
The Clippers don't need Curry they need Zach.

Zach is not a player that produces wins and he is getting max dollars, curry is 7 million less in the last year of his deal, zach for anything is the only way to turn this around.
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30259
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
7/14/2008  1:04 PM
Posted by izybx:
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by newyorknewyork:
Wasn't this explanation given in the reported Philly deal with Zach?

When the trade exception was brought up in the Philly deal. I didn't know the Knicks earned the exception because they took back less salary in the deal. I thought Philly just had a trade exception that they were willing to offer the knicks in the deal or something like that. I didn't understand the rules of the trade exception until I read someone say something to this nature on realgm.

BTW why the change in name Trueblue? Don't tell me you let the guys get to you to the point that you needed to change your screen name. You don't have to prove anything to anybody man nor do you have to care what anyone thinks bout you bro'ham.

Shh... You are not allowed to reveal secret identities. The mods could be watching.

LOL BUSTED!

I wasn't really trying to blow up his spot. He was in the 10,000 club and it would been a shame to throw that away.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
GKFv2
Posts: 26752
Alba Posts: 114
Joined: 1/16/2007
Member: #1259
USA
7/14/2008  1:05 PM
TB got banned. Good thing you blew his spot.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30259
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
7/14/2008  1:15 PM
Posted by GKFv2:

TB got banned. Good thing you blew his spot.

Ooooh, damn! I just thought he changed his name.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
EwingsGlass
Posts: 27733
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 4/29/2005
Member: #893
USA
7/14/2008  1:48 PM
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense

I wholeheartedly agree. I say test him at center. His ball movement is better than Curry's.
You know I gonna spin wit it
EwingsGlass
Posts: 27733
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 4/29/2005
Member: #893
USA
7/14/2008  1:50 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense

You don't care about the cap. So of course you're not interested in moving Zach. I also would call a $15 mil trade exemption "nothing." You could easily get a mid 1st round pick and a respectable role player out of that without affecting the cap in 2010/11. I do hear what you're saying, though. If we could get rid of Jamal and Eddy, I'd be less upset about keeping Zach.


[Edited by - bonn1997 on 07-14-2008 09:20 AM]

I'd rather move Jamal and Eddy. Or, better yet: Jamal, Jeffries and Eddy.
You know I gonna spin wit it
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
7/14/2008  1:52 PM
Posted by EwingsGlass:
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense

I wholeheartedly agree. I say test him at center. His ball movement is better than Curry's.

zach also was sent home on more than one occasion last season for reasons unknown. them indy strippers must be running some crazy sh t out there...
Ira
Posts: 24692
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 8/14/2001
Member: #91
7/14/2008  1:55 PM
I didn't see this posted, but this quote is from an online chat that Hahn held. It's relevant and makes sense.

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/blog/2008/07/live_chat_with_alan_hahn_2.html

"Lot of Z-Bo today at the top. Good lead off stuff. I understand the confusion as to why Donnie didn't take the Clippers offer (the more I hear, the more it sounds like they offered a second-round pick and nothing else...it would have been a total salary dump). So why did Donnie say no? Because it's July. One thing you grow to learn about DW is he's a pretty good card player. Doesn't show any expression and knows when to hold 'em and fold 'em and the rest of the song. I think he believes more than the ability to lose that contract he can get more for Zach, who is a 20-10 guy. Even in a bad year last season he had 17.8 and 10. He just gets numbers. I don't think this one is dead at all. Let's see what the Clippers do but they are one of the few teams the Knicks can deal with that won't make them take back salary. Stay tuned on that one."
MS
Posts: 27064
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/28/2004
Member: #724
7/14/2008  2:07 PM
Well I am sure Walsh knows what he is doing, but again. Let's say they offer big money to two way players, Iggy, Smith or Okafur and we lose the chance to trade Zach, his contract is only getting bigger, he can't defend and does put up numbers.

But we aren't going any where, Donnie wants to move Lee, Curry, Crawford. Starting Lee, giving Jefferies a few more minutes without Zach will improve everyones trade value.

Why not just run and gun see what happens, and let Mike increase everyone's value without zach slowing things down.

Curry, Jefferies
Chandler, Lee
Q, Gallo, Balkman
Crawford, Nate
Marbury, Crawford
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
7/14/2008  2:08 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by EwingsGlass:
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense

I wholeheartedly agree. I say test him at center. His ball movement is better than Curry's.

zach also was sent home on more than one occasion last season for reasons unknown. them indy strippers must be running some crazy sh t out there...

Naw, Z-BO is hosting parties this weekend sat the 19 at the Ugly Monkey across from the white castle. Get out the piss test on Sunday.



JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
NYKBocker
Posts: 38516
Alba Posts: 474
Joined: 1/14/2003
Member: #377
USA
7/14/2008  2:10 PM
Posted by Ira:

I didn't see this posted, but this quote is from an online chat that Hahn held. It's relevant and makes sense.

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/blog/2008/07/live_chat_with_alan_hahn_2.html

"Lot of Z-Bo today at the top. Good lead off stuff. I understand the confusion as to why Donnie didn't take the Clippers offer (the more I hear, the more it sounds like they offered a second-round pick and nothing else...it would have been a total salary dump). So why did Donnie say no? Because it's July. One thing you grow to learn about DW is he's a pretty good card player. Doesn't show any expression and knows when to hold 'em and fold 'em and the rest of the song. I think he believes more than the ability to lose that contract he can get more for Zach, who is a 20-10 guy. Even in a bad year last season he had 17.8 and 10. He just gets numbers. I don't think this one is dead at all. Let's see what the Clippers do but they are one of the few teams the Knicks can deal with that won't make them take back salary. Stay tuned on that one."

I think Donnie is playing this right. Clippers are desperate and being patient and getting a first rounder out of the Clips is not a bad thing. Worse case scenario ZBo is still here to pump up his value. The question is can he run-and-gun?
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
7/14/2008  2:13 PM
damn son...the party is gonna be off the chain, meters, and the house...

better get my cupid shuffle down...
Knicksfan
Posts: 33596
Alba Posts: 27
Joined: 7/5/2004
Member: #691
USA
7/15/2008  12:16 AM
So, when will this happen?

If the Knicks include Lee, is there a chance to get Gordon? Would you do it?
Knicks_Fan
EwingsGlass
Posts: 27733
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 4/29/2005
Member: #893
USA
7/15/2008  12:26 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by EwingsGlass:
Posted by fishmike:

Zach makes a lot of money.

Last year he was good for 18/10/46%. He was not a distraction. He did have problems with teammates. His biggest transgression was griping about the boos. If I am a new GM I not looking to drop a guy that gives me that kind of production for nothing. People here see Zach as just another Isiah appendage that needs to be surgically removed by any way possible. That just doesnt make sense

I wholeheartedly agree. I say test him at center. His ball movement is better than Curry's.

zach also was sent home on more than one occasion last season for reasons unknown. them indy strippers must be running some crazy sh t out there...

Sent home by whom? Isiah? So, now you respect his judgment? C'mon. Nobody respects anything about Isiah except when he is down on our own players.
You know I gonna spin wit it
TheGame
Posts: 26652
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/15/2006
Member: #1154
USA
7/15/2008  9:46 AM
Curry needs to stay for no other reason that he makes less money. Zach is paid too much at a position were we now have two prospects behind him who need playing time. I agree with Walsh not to give him up solely for a second round pick, but if the Clippers throw in Jordan, we have to pull the trigger on that move. Jordan at least will be a Diop-type defensive player even if he does not develop offensively.
Trust the Process
Page 10 of 11 « First‹ Previous 8  9  10  11 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
SI: Knicks DECLINE deal for Randolph!!! WOW!!!!
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy