and it sucks. i'm full of negativity towards this team and the people running it. this is a complete 180 from last summer when i was pumped about a soon to be 47 win team winning the atlantic. uggh, there's nothing new to say here. we've all said it before but this just sucks.

the 2005 BITTER KNICKS CLUB

"i'm not only the president, but i'm also a client"

i'm pretty bitter too right now, but if Isiah has a great offseason, optimism will return to Knicksland i'm sure...i'm holding my breath to see what he does this summer...this is his last chance as far as i'm concerned...he better make it count.

I am bitter of the fact that Herb and Kurt are still around...I can take a year of losing, but I can't stand incompetance...Herb is imcompetant in my opinion...Kurt has damaged every chances that we had to develop a big man. Because of him Sweetney didn't get much burn at his natural position early on in the season. Nazr looked horrible because he was playing out of position...JB nor Bruno didn't get a chance to show whether or not they were worthy of the paycheck that they have collected...

Posted by fishmike:

I will wait until the draft is over. Even though that leaves out the FA period and who the next coach will be this draft will tell me everything I need to know about where Zeke is going. Its been well documented that he's done a HUGE amount of work researching this draft class. Lets see what happens in 35 days.

We havent had much to be enthusiastic about. MAybe Mo Taylor and Sweetney go on a diet this offseason. That might be out best shot at really improving the club.

Agreed. The main frustration that folx are feeling is having alot to do with the uncertainty of the draft, our new coach and free agency. If we can begin to answer one of them in a positive way ie. drafting some good young players, alot of the frustration will dissipate.

Fish! I agree with you a 100%. what franchise in this league that ever pulled such a stunt? none that I can remember. LA shut Kobe down once they have realized that they were out of the playoffs, and many other teams did the same...45 minutes the last 8 games for Marb and Kurt did it for me. I lost some respect for Isiah for allowing this to go on. As a result, I am very unsettle with any other moves that he may or may not make.

I am bitter because the team constantly screws the fans. I am tired of their BS and high and might it would be unethical to tank and the spirt of the game BS that the announcers, and the team throws the fans way. This team should have been tanking from the get go. As soon and JVG left the tank should have been on.

Another thing I am sick to death of their philosophy of playing the Vets over the young just plain sick of it. They say NYK fans are the most knowledgeible I have yet to see that. The team sucks and they pack the garden the team is ok and they pack the garden either way the true NYK fan can never really win with this team. The fan can't make the team suffer for their mistakes. We as fans need to take some blame for that too. Going to the garden when the team sucks is just plain wrong it would be better to show empty seats then go to the game. Who are you doing good for certainly not the fans overall. People say I'm going to the Garden to boo the team because they suck I would rather the fan save his money and show empty seats thats more a statement than booing. They are taking your money and you are booing.

Everyone says oh the Knicks didn't get the number one pick and we should all be upset that they didn't because they should have done a better job and tanked; but this team has yet to show they can develope any decent player through the draft. Even if they got the number one pick they would still play him behind KT, they will would never freaking throw a player from the start into the lineup. Have they ever done that. They haven't Pat Ewing was the last one to get run from the start of the season. From Begining to the end. I can see why they weren't compelled to get rookies into the starting lineup when they were winning. But now they suck and they still won't play young players. I am tired of the NYK vets if I see these freaking backup vets in the starting lineup I am going to puke. They aren't gonna get better they are peaked out role players that need to be surrounded by superstars to succeed. The problem is this team doesn't give the young players an enough chance to become a superstar instead they groomed to be role players. You look at these teams that played their young from the start and they will be better for it. this year Sixers Igudala got the start from day one they make the playoffs. Howard the number one pick got run from the begining and almost made the playoffs. They were worse than these teams but still didn't give Sweetney the start until the very end of the season. and Ariza in my opinion should have been going at it all season with 30 minutes of run.

Thats the main frustration about the Knicks is their inability to change their philosophy for the better of the franchise and focus on the long term prosperity of the team.

Posted by crzymdups:

Yeah, I think this team totally underestimates the fan base. Obviously, no one wants a Chicago situation where it took six years of winning 15 games to build a team, but Chicago gave up on so much youth, it's insane - Artest, Brand, Miller, etc.

I some fans would leave, but some fans would be ecstatic to watch Bynum develop.

I disagree.. I think the fans at the Garden would be impatient. I think they would never tolerate a Kwame type situation. I would say its safe to say most knowledgeable fans would be happy to see some type of rebuilding process involving young players but thats just us. People at the garden think Houston is the reason this team went to crap, nevermind the guys running the show. One good sign I did see was pre-Isiah a huge drop in ticket sales and no more sellouts. But then we got Marbury and everyone was happy again... right?

Look here, the secret to get us out of misery is as simple as 1,2, anc 3. Check this out, the Bulls should be the blue print to what we should do to regenerate a winning environment...First thing first, they drafted 3, yes I said it, 3 big men (Curry, Chandler and that one PF who is no longer with them) as a starting point. They gave those 3 guys ample amount of time to develop, and they turn around a year and two later and drafted a pretty good PG in Jay William (which didn't workout)to complement the bigs. They went through 2 good years of misery, but they made other moves to better their ball club. They traded a lot of bad contracts and drafted 3 hell of young guards to provide what Jay and Crawfford were unable to provide. The Wizz did the same thing...


As for N.Y., we are already on the right track with our guards. We have a superstar guard in Marb and 2 complementary players in Crawf and Ariza to support him, now all we need is two bigs a la (Curry and Chandler). We already have our Pfeizer in Sweetney, I don't know if that was his name, but he suffered a leg injury and he never recovered from it, and a chore of veteran players to drill and teach these young kids the NBA.

With those 3 picks, we can ultimately find a cure to our problem shor term. draft 2 (6'11 and 7')studds for now and hope that next year or the year after, we can either develop another super-star or draft one...

that is the proper logic to a decent rebuilding.. we are rebuilding while we still have a very competitive squad...

[Edited by - diderotn on 05/27/2005 08:15:25]

Posted by djsunyc:

hey, we are in the MINORITY. like fish said, target #1 is ALWAYS allan houston. the announcers speak for the masses. like when breen said kurt thomas should be considered all nba defense - we know better but alot of knicks fans LOVE kurt. no knock against him but we know what kurt really brings to the table.

i bet you 90% of the season ticket holders, the ones giving a STANDING OVATION The last game of the season, wouldn't tolerate the rebuild, or at the very least, wouldn't buy tickets during a rebuild.

they'll be happy about a trade for dampier or rasho b/c according to them, FINALLY, we'd have a center. it's sh t like that, that's feuling this organizational fire.

but at some point in time, whoever owns this team will have to SUCK IT UP and do it. we, the MINORITY, are the ones that are stuck here.

Well said.

Posted by gunsnewing:

Posted by Killa4luv:

Alot of the fans who go to the game are very casual fans who don't know much about the inner workings of basketball as a business. They would not wait for players to develop, they don't know what a salary cap is, what free agency is, and how the draft or trades work. You dont know how many people I hear say "they should just trade Houston" like that is even remotely possible.

Thats why alot of this happens, we want a good team, and Dolan wants those seats filled, and at times those interest conflict.

I know exactly what you're talking about! I deal with those people everyday at work! Those are the kind of Casual fans who pack the Garden. I would rather there only be 14,000 people in the stands. At least the Knicks would get the message!

guns, i gave up my season tickets after last year's debacle. problem is, there's thousands of people right behind me waiting in line.

Posted by djsunyc:

Posted by gunsnewing:

Posted by Killa4luv:

Alot of the fans who go to the game are very casual fans who don't know much about the inner workings of basketball as a business. They would not wait for players to develop, they don't know what a salary cap is, what free agency is, and how the draft or trades work. You dont know how many people I hear say "they should just trade Houston" like that is even remotely possible.

Thats why alot of this happens, we want a good team, and Dolan wants those seats filled, and at times those interest conflict.

I know exactly what you're talking about! I deal with those people everyday at work! Those are the kind of Casual fans who pack the Garden. I would rather there only be 14,000 people in the stands. At least the Knicks would get the message!

guns, i gave up my season tickets after last year's debacle. problem is, there's thousands of people right behind me waiting in line.

You are correct sir, why would anyone listen to one pissed off guy when there a thousands ready to take his place. If I was you guys I would become fans of other teams, Dolan is not selling the team anytime soon. It is like hating your job and your boss but everyone else in the office is satisfy with the job and the boss. Are you going to keep yelling at the other employees because they are cool with the situation or would just find another job.